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SDG
04-11-2008, 11:21 AM
Any thoughts on the issue?

Can one be both at the same time?

Are some Apostolics already Amish?

:kickcan

Michael Phelps
04-11-2008, 11:22 AM
Any thoughts on the issue?

Can one be both at the same time?

Are some Apostolics already Amish?

:kickcan

I'm probably opening myself up to more criticism here, but I heard an ex-Apostolic comedienne once say, "When I was growing up, the only thing that separated us from the Amish was a light bulb and an automobile"!

SDG
04-11-2008, 11:25 AM
Has anyone ever seen a DOUR Amish woman?

scotty
04-11-2008, 11:25 AM
I'm probably opening myself up to more criticism here, but I heard an ex-Apostolic comedienne once say, "When I was growing up, the only thing that separated us from the Amish was a light bulb and an automobile"!


barely even that.....

the carrages have head and tail lights now


I could be both, apostolic and no hassles with modern technology

works for me, can you imagine the power behind your relationship with God....

SDG
04-11-2008, 11:26 AM
barely even that.....

the carrages have head and tail lights now


I could be both, apostolic and no hassles with modern technology

works for me, can you imagine the power behind your relationship with God....

So you think technology hinders your relationship w/ God?

seguidordejesus
04-11-2008, 11:30 AM
Sorry, didn't mean to offend you, Dan-o, you're still more apostolic than all of us :D

SDG
04-11-2008, 11:36 AM
Sorry, didn't mean to offend you, Dan-o, you're still more apostolic than all of us :D

It's takes a lot more than that, cabezon.

Sister Alvear
04-11-2008, 12:13 PM
Dan has turned Amish! ha...

SDG
04-11-2008, 12:17 PM
Dan has turned Amish! ha...

I'm sure it's just a stage, Sis.

Ferd
04-11-2008, 12:20 PM
I dont see why not. we have apostolics here that for all intense and purpose are barely methodist.

AmazingGrace
04-11-2008, 12:22 PM
I dont see why not. we have apostolics here that for all intense and purpose are barely methodist.

:ursofunny:ursofunny

scotty
04-11-2008, 12:22 PM
So you think technology hinders your relationship w/ God?


hinders ?? no

would it be better without it ? of course

so would everyones

SDG
04-11-2008, 12:23 PM
I dont see why not. we have apostolics here that for all intense and purpose are barely methodist.

Good observation, Ferdmeister.

For all intents and purposes there are Catholic and Mormon Apostolics too ... meeting in Cathedrals no less.

Michael Phelps
04-11-2008, 12:24 PM
I dont see why not. we have apostolics here that for all intense and purpose are barely methodist.

Just when things are settling down, you come along and :stirpot

Ferd
04-11-2008, 12:25 PM
Just when things are settling down, you come along and :stirpot

What? are you going to argue the point?

SDG
04-11-2008, 12:25 PM
Just when things are settling down, you come along and :stirpot

I'm glad someone realized that I'm the victim here of another attack.

:tissue

Michael Phelps
04-11-2008, 12:26 PM
What? are you going to argue the point?

I think I need to start spending my time on more fruitful pursuits!

Ferd
04-11-2008, 12:26 PM
I Am Not Attacking Daniel

SDG
04-11-2008, 12:28 PM
I Am Not Attacking Daniel

Can't a brutha just be Apostolic Amish?

Ferd
04-11-2008, 12:28 PM
I think I need to start spending my time on more fruitful pursuits!

You know Michael, I had a very good post yesterday that was quite balanced and it got very little attention.

yet stating a simple fact, that you can have Apostolics that are Amish and some that are barely even methodist gets all kinds of replies.

what gives?

Ferd
04-11-2008, 12:29 PM
Can't a brutha just be Apostolic Amish?

asked and answered! YES. (I suspect I would even call them brother)

i call you brother.

Michael Phelps
04-11-2008, 12:34 PM
You know Michael, I had a very good post yesterday that was quite balanced and it got very little attention.

yet stating a simple fact, that you can have Apostolics that are Amish and some that are barely even methodist gets all kinds of replies.

what gives?

Ferd,

Three things;

1.) We all have posts that are masterpieces, and are ignored;

2.) My comment about you stirring the pot was based on conversation on another thread about 1-steppers being nothing more than Methodists, and I was ribbing you about stirring the pot, because I thought you were making reference to that conversation;

3.) And, my statement about spending my time on more fruitful pursuits is born from something I've been feeling for a while. On this forum, and it's evidenced quite clearly on another thread here, we can spend hours arguing, getting angry with each other, etc on certain topics, and at the end of the day, we haven't changed anyone's mind, but we're just in a bad mood!

That's all.

SDG
04-11-2008, 12:36 PM
Ferd,

Three things;

1.) We all have posts that are masterpieces, and are ignored;

2.) My comment about you stirring the pot was based on conversation on another thread about 1-steppers being nothing more than Methodists, and I was ribbing you about stirring the pot, because I thought you were making reference to that conversation;

3.) And, my statement about spending my time on more fruitful pursuits is born from something I've been feeling for a while. On this forum, and it's evidenced quite clearly on another thread here, we can spend hours arguing, getting angry with each other, etc on certain topics, and at the end of the day, we haven't changed anyone's mind, but we're just in a bad mood!

That's all.

You will be court-martialed if you leave your post ... Come back here, Mikey.

SDG
04-11-2008, 12:38 PM
Not everyone has posts that are masterpieces ...

*runs 3rd search of Jekyll's postings*

Ferd
04-11-2008, 12:39 PM
Ferd,

Three things;

1.) We all have posts that are masterpieces, and are ignored;

2.) My comment about you stirring the pot was based on conversation on another thread about 1-steppers being nothing more than Methodists, and I was ribbing you about stirring the pot, because I thought you were making reference to that conversation;

3.) And, my statement about spending my time on more fruitful pursuits is born from something I've been feeling for a while. On this forum, and it's evidenced quite clearly on another thread here, we can spend hours arguing, getting angry with each other, etc on certain topics, and at the end of the day, we haven't changed anyone's mind, but we're just in a bad mood!

That's all.

1. True but this one was really good.
2. I was
3. spending time with me when I am stiring the pot is not waisted time. its FUN.

really i am just kidding around here.

Michael Phelps
04-11-2008, 12:39 PM
You will be court-martialed if you leave your post ... Come back here, Mikey.

I'm going AWOL.

Apostolics With Overabundance of Liberalism.

AmazingGrace
04-11-2008, 12:41 PM
1. True but this one was really good.
2. I was
3. spending time with me when I am stiring the pot is not waisted time. its FUN.

really i am just kidding around here.

Ferd!!!

You must remember that this line here must be added as a disclaimer in all your future posts... Just kidding Michael... :)

Hoovie
04-11-2008, 12:53 PM
So now you are trash'in my people?

Amish are not all bad. Count me in.

Ferd
04-11-2008, 01:00 PM
So now you are trash'in my people?

Amish are not all bad. Count me in.

See my above post. any Apostolic/Amish person will be considered my Brother (or sister as it were)

Hoovie
04-11-2008, 01:16 PM
:tissue thank you!:tissue:tissue:kickcan

Nahum
04-11-2008, 01:24 PM
Cloistered fellowships, a "manual" that is akin to the Ordnung, and a worship of "plain" and "separation?"


Yep.

Apostolics can be Amish.

Ferd
04-11-2008, 01:26 PM
Cloistered fellowships, a "manual" that is akin to the Ordnung, and a worship of "plain" and "separation?"


Yep.

Apostolics can be Amish.

AND I CALL THEM BROTHERS!

Nahum
04-11-2008, 01:27 PM
AND I CALL THEM BROTHERS!

Me too.


Most of 'em anyway.:friend

LaVonne
04-11-2008, 01:28 PM
Any thoughts on the issue?

Can one be both at the same time?

Are some Apostolics already Amish?

:kickcan

I think some already are! Where I'm from, the Pastor's wife considers her district the "Amish of UPC"....not exactly a compliment imho...

Digging4Truth
04-11-2008, 01:33 PM
I see a lot about the Amish (or possibly more so the Mennonites) way of life that has a lot of wisdom in it and builds on a simpler way of living that I, personally, have a yearning for within myself.

But... to answer the question posed by this thread I would have to know if being "Amish" requires any doctrinal stands that the typical oneness church goer could not , in good conscience, adhere to.

Without knowing whether any of these issues exist I would not have sufficient information to properly answer the question being posed.

From my current (and admittedly limited) understanding I have a great deal of respect for the Amish/Mennonite ways of life.

Timmy
04-11-2008, 01:37 PM
Where's Emma? We need her wisdom.

Sept5SavedTeen
04-11-2008, 02:19 PM
I would look at the word "Amish" and look at it's origins. The Amish were a group of people that broke away from the Mennonite Church (started by Menno Simms), over the issue of shunning and a few other disagreements and the man that headed the break from the Mennonite Church was named Jacob Amman. Therefore, those that followed Amman became the Amish. I am NOT a follower of Amman, therefore, I am not Amish, neither do I desire to be Amish.

I AM a follower of Christ, therefore I, like the saints in Antioch were first called, am a Christian. I am a Christian because I desire to be Christ-like.

My doctrine, is the same doctrine as what the Apostles taught and believed. My doctrine is that of the Apostles, therefore my doctrine is apostolic.

However, might I enjoy the handiwork of the Amish? Sure. I might also like there style of dress, and maybe even adopt it if I am trying to go and win them to the LORD. I have visited a Conservative Mennonite Church before, and when I go, I dress as much like them as possible, but they know who I am and what I believe, and they know that I dress like them only to not offend them and that I might be "as one of them, to win them."

So, visiting the Amish? Admiring their work? Admiring or learning about their customs, as long as they don't offend Biblical principles? Working with them on a farm? All fine things to do... But giving ourselves the name "Amish" makes us followers of Amman and NOT of Christ.

There is no such thing as an Apostolic-Amish Christian.

GOD BLESS!
Bro. Alex

Sept5SavedTeen
04-11-2008, 02:20 PM
I wrote that last post like such a Campellite... :lol

GOD BLESS!
Bro. Alex

freeatlast
04-11-2008, 02:53 PM
A storm has just knocked out our electricity....it's a miracle...I just became Amish

AmazingGrace
04-11-2008, 02:58 PM
A storm has just knocked out our electricity....it's a miracle...I just became Amish

We had 500,000 without electric yesterday morning and still about 100,000 here so Id say Dallas is experiencing a amish week too! And lots of places we could probably only get to via a horse.. no buggy tho... The tornados did a lot of damage here for sure!

freeatlast
04-11-2008, 03:04 PM
We had 500,000 without electric yesterday morning and still about 100,000 here so Id say Dallas is experiencing a amish week too! And lots of places we could probably only get to via a horse.. no buggy tho... The tornados did a lot of damage here for sure!

Sounds like an Amish Revival...hallelujah !!

I have heard us referd to many times as "The Electric Amish." :friend

scotty
04-11-2008, 03:07 PM
I thought we were Glorified Baptist !! :party

AmazingGrace
04-11-2008, 03:08 PM
Sounds like an Amish Revival...hallelujah !!

I have heard us referd to many times as "The Electric Amish." :friend

LOL... Did you ever read my story before about how we found our parsonage in OKC when we bought an old mennonite church there?

We got there and had almost remodeled the entire house and then as we were going from back to front one room at a time we found the front bedroom had even a larger closet than all the other 3 bdrms... and then went in it and it had cable hookups and internet modems and phone lines and everything hooked up strategically placed in this closet that had been turned into a large hidden office! LOL

freeatlast
04-11-2008, 03:10 PM
LOL... Did you ever read my story before about how we found our parsonage in OKC when we bought an old mennonite church there?

We got there and had almost remodeled the entire house and then as we were going from back to front one room at a time we found the front bedroom had even a larger closet than all the other 3 bdrms... and then went in it and it had cable hookups and internet modems and phone lines and everything hooked up strategically placed in this closet that had been turned into a large hidden office! LOL

I'd bet you could find some "offices" like those in some apostolic homes too AG

AmazingGrace
04-11-2008, 03:11 PM
I'd bet you could find some "offices" like those in some apostolic homes too AG

I am sure!

StillStanding
04-11-2008, 03:13 PM
I'd bet you could find some "offices" like those in some apostolic homes too AG

:lol

jaxfam6
04-11-2008, 05:41 PM
I dont see why not. we have apostolics here that for all intense and purpose are barely methodist.

:ursofunny

jaxfam6
04-11-2008, 05:45 PM
Not many Apostolics would like to give up their electic, cars, and store bought clothes, they just are not into all the pins it takes to be Amish.
Grew up in a community not to far from an Amish community and as much as I like them I would not want to live their life style.
Must be why most figure me to be Liberal.

DanielR
04-11-2008, 09:53 PM
So now you are trash'in my people?

Amish are not all bad. Count me in.

Is that all you had to say? Somehow when I saw this thread I invisioned you defending your people alot better than that.

I've always admired the Amish way of living very much and concidered taking on the lifestyle. It didn't happen but I did seriously think about it. It's quite an interesting way of life, and most days I think it would be better than how we live. Now if I could just figure out how to keep my technology that I like while getting rid of the technogoly that I don't want, I'd be alright. Come to think about, there really isn't that much technology that I like, I just use more than I like out of neccessity.

But can an Apostolic become Amish? I don't see why not, many are barely not Amish as it is anyway. Then of course there are the Amish that became Apostolic like Brother Steven Hoover.

Daniel

Hoovie
04-11-2008, 10:10 PM
Is that all you had to say? Somehow when I saw this thread I invisioned you defending your people alot better than that.

I've always admired the Amish way of living very much and concidered taking on the lifestyle. It didn't happen but I did seriously think about it. It's quite an interesting way of life, and most days I think it would be better than how we live. Now if I could just figure out how to keep my technology that I like while getting rid of the technogoly that I don't want, I'd be alright. Come to think about, there really isn't that much technology that I like, I just use more than I like out of neccessity.

But can an Apostolic become Amish? I don't see why not, many are barely not Amish as it is anyway. Then of course there are the Amish that became Apostolic like Brother Steven Hoover.

Daniel

LOL!

Brother, I just got back from the tax man! (A horrible experience)

So I am just catching up here.

Have you read this? http://www.ninetyandnine.com/Archives/20071029/testimony.htm

Hoovie
04-11-2008, 10:17 PM
I see a lot about the Amish (or possibly more so the Mennonites) way of life that has a lot of wisdom in it and builds on a simpler way of living that I, personally, have a yearning for within myself.

But... to answer the question posed by this thread I would have to know if being "Amish" requires any doctrinal stands that the typical oneness church goer could not , in good conscience, adhere to.

Without knowing whether any of these issues exist I would not have sufficient information to properly answer the question being posed.

From my current (and admittedly limited) understanding I have a great deal of respect for the Amish/Mennonite ways of life.

As do I brother. I guess one of the virtues that I was taught (as an Old Order Mennonite) was not to judge those who are less conservative than us. A conservative - even separated lifstyle need not go hand in hand with judgementalism.

Margies3
04-11-2008, 10:23 PM
Is that all you had to say? Somehow when I saw this thread I invisioned you defending your people alot better than that.

I've always admired the Amish way of living very much and concidered taking on the lifestyle. It didn't happen but I did seriously think about it. It's quite an interesting way of life, and most days I think it would be better than how we live. Now if I could just figure out how to keep my technology that I like while getting rid of the technogoly that I don't want, I'd be alright. Come to think about, there really isn't that much technology that I like, I just use more than I like out of neccessity.

But can an Apostolic become Amish? I don't see why not, many are barely not Amish as it is anyway. Then of course there are the Amish that became Apostolic like Brother Steven Hoover.

Daniel

Fascinating that when we are considering the Apostolics turning Amish the only thing we tend to see are the dress code similarities and so we say, "yes, sure they can".

We don't even seem to remember that the Amish are Trinitarian believers, that they don't even baptize by immersion, let alone in Jesus' name. And I'm not sure how they would feel about speaking in tongues. How about it Steven? Would they go for it?

The interesting thing is that because of the similarities in dress, we want to accept and be accepted by them. But we don't want to cut the same slack to other Trinitarian believers who don't have the same dress codes.

Ooooo boy! Am I in trouble now? Now that I've thrown in my :2cents and :stirpot just a little bit, I have to head for bed. Keith has solo and ensemble contest tomorrow morning early! (imagine that! On a SATURDAY!! Who ever scheduled something so stupidly as that!) Have a fun night, folks.

Hoovie
04-11-2008, 10:30 PM
Fascinating that when we are considering the Apostolics turning Amish the only thing we tend to see are the dress code similarities and so we say, "yes, sure they can".

We don't even seem to remember that the Amish are Trinitarian believers, that they don't even baptize by immersion, let alone in Jesus' name. And I'm not sure how they would feel about speaking in tongues. How about it Steven? Would they go for it?

The interesting thing is that because of the similarities in dress, we want to accept and be accepted by them. But we don't want to cut the same slack to other Trinitarian believers who don't have the same dress codes.

Ooooo boy! Am I in trouble now? Now that I've thrown in my :2cents and :stirpot just a little bit, I have to head for bed. Keith has solo and ensemble contest tomorrow morning early! (imagine that! On a SATURDAY!! Who ever scheduled something so stupidly as that!) Have a fun night, folks.

You bring up a very good point!

I have actually been wanting to explore this and perhaps even start a thread along those lines... (not so much the Amish aspect) ...

I think I will.

DanielR
04-11-2008, 10:36 PM
LOL!

Brother, I just got back from the tax man! (A horrible experience)

So I am just catching up here.

Have you read this? http://www.ninetyandnine.com/Archives/20071029/testimony.htm

I hadn't read that before, quite fascinating.

Daniel

Blaylock
04-12-2008, 09:20 AM
I understand that the origin of this thread was in jest but I would like to throw some light as well on it. We recently held the Amish Mennonite conference at our church here in Massillon. We had about 5 former Amish families there telling us about their conversion from Amish to Apostolic. It was wonderful to hear their stories. One man told of how he lost his house his job his family for truth. We had a young man there the following Sunday morning that recieved the Holy Ghost. There is a great yearning in the Amish Mennonite community for more of God.

Sept5SavedTeen
04-12-2008, 09:26 AM
I understand that the origin of this thread was in jest but I would like to throw some light as well on it. We recently held the Amish Mennonite conference at our church here in Massillon. We had about 5 former Amish families there telling us about their conversion from Amish to Apostolic. It was wonderful to hear their stories. One man told of how he lost his house his job his family for truth. We had a young man there the following Sunday morning that recieved the Holy Ghost. There is a great yearning in the Amish Mennonite community for more of God.

That's GREAT! Praise GOD!

GOD BLESS!
Bro. Alex

Sept5SavedTeen
04-12-2008, 09:28 AM
Bro. Hoover,

Could you perhaps enlighten us as to why the Amish and Mennonite don't baptize by immersion? Also, could you explain their justification of baptism by pouring?

GOD BLESS!
Bro. Alex

Hoovie
04-12-2008, 09:35 AM
Bro. Hoover,

Could you perhaps enlighten us as to why the Amish and Mennonite don't baptize by immersion? Also, could you explain their justification of baptism by pouring?

GOD BLESS!
Bro. Alex

I have had several discussions along these lines with church elders. Their response is that they can and have baptised by immersion if one is convinced that is most Biblical. (I have not seen it)

Obviously they believe it is scriptural and do have a few references.

The bigger problem is they promised allegience that occurs at baptism in the Amish and OOM churches. It is not only allegience to God, but also the "church". This is then used against them if they later leave - especially among the Amish.

Hoovie
04-12-2008, 09:38 AM
I understand that the origin of this thread was in jest but I would like to throw some light as well on it. We recently held the Amish Mennonite conference at our church here in Massillon. We had about 5 former Amish families there telling us about their conversion from Amish to Apostolic. It was wonderful to hear their stories. One man told of how he lost his house his job his family for truth. We had a young man there the following Sunday morning that recieved the Holy Ghost. There is a great yearning in the Amish Mennonite community for more of God.

That is wonderful.

It should also be noted that there are a number of Amish and a perhaps a few Mennonites that have remained with the ultra conservative lifestyle after being immersed IJN and recieving the Spirit evidenced by speaking in tongues.

Blaylock
04-12-2008, 10:17 AM
That is wonderful.

It should also be noted that there are a number of Amish and a perhaps a few Mennonites that have remained with the ultra conservative lifestyle after being immersed IJN and recieving the Spirit evidenced by speaking in tongues.

The Kings are one for example from Virginia.

ON the baptism...From what I have been told by former Amish is that their method of baptism is more for a confirmation into the church than a salvational issue.

History of the Anabaptist tell us that the sprinkling and infant baptism started as a way for the RCC to get more taxpayers paying taxes. What better way to get more taxes than to have them start at birth.

This is a tradition that they keep from their roots.

We also have a former Amish/Mennonite couple in our assembly. They are our Sunday School administrators.

Hoovie
04-12-2008, 10:30 AM
The Kings are one for example from Virginia.

ON the baptism...From what I have been told by former Amish is that their method of baptism is more for a confirmation into the church than a salvational issue.

History of the Anabaptist tell us that the sprinkling and infant baptism started as a way for the RCC to get more taxpayers paying taxes. What better way to get more taxes than to have them start at birth.

This is a tradition that they keep from their roots.

We also have a former Amish/Mennonite couple in our assembly. They are our Sunday School administrators.

Yes. I have met the King family and am thrilled what God is doing in their life.

Agreed - it is a tradition on the pouring/sprinkling question. And true, the baptism is seen as an initiation into church membership rather than salvation.

mfblume
04-12-2008, 11:41 AM
Any thoughts on the issue?

Can one be both at the same time?

Are some Apostolics already Amish?

:kickcan

I've often said this very thing.

The Amish were at one time totally in synch with the styles around them, when they started their movement. But they stayed that way. Had they started at an earlier time and remained in the manner of appearance that existed at that earlier time, their present manner of appearance would have been immodest to themselves in the era in which they ACTUALLY started.

Any group that sticks to the manner of appearance when they started their movement will become AMISH in appearance in a sort in a few decades.

Any group that does not change in appearance with the times, but still retain modesty, will become this way.

There was a time NO MEN wore pants. Had any group, with the tendency to remain in the form of dress the era in which they started manifested, started at the time before pants were introduced to men, they would not have accepted pants for men and felt they were immodest.

Instead of spanning a few decades of dress styles, we need to look across 6,000 years back to Adam.

Since we accepted the late comer of pants for men, and accepted the transition from robes, this has shown we have tolerated CHANGE IN THE PAST and included it into what we honestly consider to be modesty, but refuse to see change in the future. I think, Dan, you hit the nail on the head, as to why this has not continued since 1945.