Teaching To Speak In Tongues

[Michael The Disciple]

I have often heard the complaint that certain groups (usually Charismatic) teach people how to speak in tongues. Have you seen this? What is involved?

[Mrs. LPW]

I have often heard the complaint that certain groups (usually Charismatic) teach people how to speak in tongues. Have you seen this? What is involved?

Haven't seen it myself.

[DividedThigh]

had a preacher doing a revival for my church years ago that i had to tell not to put his finger in someones mouth to make there tongue move, but not lately, i told him not to do it again, and obviously didnt have him back, lol, dt:blah

[HeavenlyOne]

I heard a pastor recently tell a kid 'lalalalalala..say that......lalalalala'.

He later reported that she'd received the Holy Ghost. I was floored.

[Baron1710]

had a preacher doing a revival for my church years ago that i had to tell not to put his finger in someones mouth to make there tongue move, but not lately, i told him not to do it again, and obviously didnt have him back, lol, dt:blah

If he had stuck his finger in my mouth I would have bitten him.

[DanielR]

If he had stuck his finger in my mouth I would have bitten him.

:boxingTasty, I was needing a snack anyway.:toofunny

[Cindy]

Speaking in tongues is a gift from God, how do you teach someone to do it?

[DividedThigh]

If he had stuck his finger in my mouth I would have bitten him.

i understand besides it being gross, i was kind about it, after church when no one else was around i just told him, dont do it here, again, lol he listened, lol,dt

[DividedThigh]

Speaking in tongues is a gift from God, how do you teach someone to do it?

thats just it sis, you dont, lol,dt

[Sam]

I heard a pastor recently tell a kid 'lalalalalala..say that......lalalalala'.

He later reported that she'd received the Holy Ghost. I was floored.

I've heard of "seekers" being told, "just say Jesus, Jesus, Jesus until you lose your tongue."

[Sam]

I heard a preacher over the radio who described how people were "taught" to speak with tongues. They were told to repeat the following until their tongue got tangled up and different words came out.

See my tie.
See my bowtie.
See me tie my tie.
See me tie my bowtie.

[DividedThigh]

I heard a preacher over the radio who described how people were "taught" to speak with tongues. They were told to repeat the following until their tongue got tangled up and different words came out.

See my tie.
See my bowtie.
See me tie my tie.
See me tie my bowtie.

well if you say that brother you are halfway there, lol, just kidding, lol,dt

[HeavenlyOne]

I've heard of "seekers" being told, "just say Jesus, Jesus, Jesus until you lose your tongue."

I remember as a child to be told to say that faster and faster.

I did, and guess what? I spoke in tongues! It worked!!

[LaVonne]

I heard a pastor recently tell a kid 'lalalalalala..say that......lalalalala'.

He later reported that she'd received the Holy Ghost. I was floored.
Yeah...our former pastor's wife in OR used to do that too...she probably still does...

[HADDOCK]

Have seen it in years past and still see it.

[HeavenlyOne]

Yeah...our former pastor's wife in OR used to do that too...she probably still does...

There is also a SS teacher in this church that does that. I saw her not long ago praying with a child, in his face going 'lalalalalalalalalalalala' and later reported that the boy received the Holy Ghost because she heard him do the same thing. The boy is 8 and has no clue what happened.

[DividedThigh]

so that means nothing happened, lol,dt

[HADDOCK]

some of this stuff is one of the problems I have with some of the Holy Ghost Rallies that have become such a hot item

[DividedThigh]

some of this stuff is one of the problems I have with some of the Holy Ghost Rallies that have become such a hot item

yup, no doubt true, seen that too, myself, not good, dt

[Jack Shephard]

I have a good friend that is very, very good at praying people through to the HG. He is UPC. When he prays with them he almost teaches them because he speaks in tongues and then says, 'it kinda sounds like that.' Now he might do that to ease there concerns, but I have seen him pray through alot of people and these people actually receive the HG cause they are in the spirit for a long while. The brain can learn the sounds and mimic them anyone that denies that is lying. So I am sure that at times people mimic what they hear, but for the most part I think that it is genuine.

[Praxeas]

I have often heard the complaint that certain groups (usually Charismatic) teach people how to speak in tongues. Have you seen this? What is involved?I think it can be intentional but often I think it is accidental.

I see a lot of times even in Pentecost a "believer" telling another seeker "just do it, just let it out" and then start speaking in tongues in that persons ear. If someone is in a suggestive state of mind they might be lead to believe they need to repeat what that person just said or try. I even see people supposedly filled going "hallelalalala lalalalalalalalalalala" just say it, just let it out. I think every Pentecostal church should take serious inventory in this area and teach better alter techniques.

Had an evangelist come and ask me about another brother if he had the Holy Ghost yet. I said that I think so but he said he got it in another church (one on the charismatics ones you were talking of) and that when he prays for others to receive the Spirit the above is what this person does....

Well the evangelist said to me almost verbatim that it does not matter how they get it as long as they get it... I was blown away and deeply saddened. There is a lot of performance emphasis on our ranks. If someone did not get the Holy Ghost for the first time we don't feel too hot. If someone is seeking we HAVE to have them get it right now and I fear that we are so primed to have something happen...anything...that even someone that did not really speak in tongues we will believe they did if someone shouts "He got it" and the slightest twinge of the lips. We expect miracle after miracle and I fear that we are so performance minded that we get in a Benny Hinn mentality where if bodies are hitting the floor because we pushed their forehead back, that that means something in the Spirit just happened when in reality it might have been our flesh.

The only true way to that kind of stuff...the real stuff...is hungry prayer and fasting and then having faith in a service. As facilitators our job is to teach them HOW to worship. How to seek after God with their heart...not to get them to let tongues out.

[Praxeas]

had a preacher doing a revival for my church years ago that i had to tell not to put his finger in someones mouth to make there tongue move, but not lately, i told him not to do it again, and obviously didnt have him back, lol, dt:blah
Oh gosh, that too. Don't get me started on the guys that wave their fingers infront of someone's mouth as if they are doing a spiritual operation to get that tongue to move. Or the guy that rubs his finger up and down someone's throat....

Then there are the back rubbers....as if that seeker is about to puke their guts out and need our comfort. If you come and rub my back Im gonna have a hard time focusing on God

[Glenda B]

I have often heard the complaint that certain groups (usually Charismatic) teach people how to speak in tongues. Have you seen this? What is involved?

We once had a visiting evangelist who spoke of a denomination of people using these words ( See My Tie, Tie My Tie ) over and over so as you could not understand what they were really saying after repeating that over and over.

" Praise God folks, He has now got the Holy Ghost." :bliss Thus convincing the one seeking that they had been filled.

[Praxeas]

I heard a pastor recently tell a kid 'lalalalalala..say that......lalalalala'.

He later reported that she'd received the Holy Ghost. I was floored.
I think this is near criminal in the Kingdom of God. However I might suggest that some are perhaps sincere though sincerely wrong in believing that by doing something like that they can make someone's faith rise and really receive the Spirit. That is still wrong but what if they don't receive it then and they believe they got the real deal with nothing happened at all? They might think we are all nuts like they told us and are all faking tongues.

[DividedThigh]

yep it really happened, back rubbers seen that , or the one on each side one saying hold on the other saying let go, lol,dt

[Praxeas]

There is also a SS teacher in this church that does that. I saw her not long ago praying with a child, in his face going 'lalalalalalalalalalalala' and later reported that the boy received the Holy Ghost because she heard him do the same thing. The boy is 8 and has no clue what happened.Really pathetic.

I'm serious. We need an international consensus and movement to fix this. I wonder how many ex-pentecostals never got the real deal

[POWERUP]

sellamyhonda, buymeakawasaki

Say it real fast and you want go out and buy a new bike.

[Praxeas]

some of this stuff is one of the problems I have with some of the Holy Ghost Rallies that have become such a hot item
Me too and again the problem is we are performance oriented. We can HAVE such a thing but it does not take a technique IMO it takes a genuine move of the Spirit and perhaps with good technique on how to get people that don't know better to worship God...

BTW I wonder how much the Gentiles, except Cornelius perhaps, worshiped...the bible just says the Spirit fell while Peter was speaking...not while they were worshiping

[HADDOCK]

economy auto.... but you have to emphasize e-CON-omyauto

[stmatthew]

I heard a pastor recently tell a kid 'lalalalalala..say that......lalalalala'.

He later reported that she'd received the Holy Ghost. I was floored.

I sat in a front bench and watched an ALJC preacher do this to a young girl. She was so confused because she did not believe she had received the Holy Ghost, and he kept telling her she had.

[Praxeas]

I sat in a front bench and watched an ALJC preacher do this to a young girl. She was so confused because she did not believe she had received the Holy Ghost, and he kept telling her she had.
Really sad. We really need to get all the OP groups together and make a bold statement about this

[stmatthew]

I also have an acquaintance that went to CLC is Stockton (about 5 - 6 years ago) that said during a service the leader just told everyone to start speaking in tongues. She said it was really weird, because many did. I never knew you could turn on tongues. I always thought they were "as the Spirit gave utterance".

[Praxeas]

I also have an acquaintance that went to CLC is Stockton (about 5 - 6 years ago) that said during a service the leader just told everyone to start speaking in tongues. She said it was really weird, because many did. I never knew you could turn on tongues. I always thought they were "as the Spirit gave utterance".
True it is as the Spirit gives utterance but all that means it is the Spirit that enables that. So maybe in that service the Spirit of God was moving but not everyone was speaking in tongues.

Paul said the spirit of the prophets are subject to the prophets

[HeavenlyOne]

I sat in a front bench and watched an ALJC preacher do this to a young girl. She was so confused because she did not believe she had received the Holy Ghost, and he kept telling her she had.

Matt, nice to see you posting. I was just thinking about you today. Hope all is well.

In regard to the thread, this is a sad state of affairs that has been going on for decades now. I know of a church where everyone sways...the more they sway, the more Holy Ghost they will receive...or so it seems.

No wonder we have people leaving the church in droves. They don't have a clue as to the reality of God because that 'feeling' they are searching for just isn't there, yet the preacher says they are saved.

[Pastor Keith]

I have often heard the complaint that certain groups (usually Charismatic) teach people how to speak in tongues. Have you seen this? What is involved?

Philip Dugas a son-in-law of the late AD Urshan told us that when AD Urshan would pray for some people who struggled receiving the Holy Spirit, he would have them repeat the word "ABBA" until they felt encouraged/faith to begin to pray in Tongues without help. He felt that it was a unfamiliar/Biblical address to God as Daddy, but it sounded close enough like Tongues and would often be the catlyst for someone receving liberty to speak out in tongues. I wouldn't say that it was teaching tongues, but I think it to a interesting approach.

[Pastor Keith]

I also have an acquaintance that went to CLC is Stockton (about 5 - 6 years ago) that said during a service the leader just told everyone to start speaking in tongues. She said it was really weird, because many did. I never knew you could turn on tongues. I always thought they were "as the Spirit gave utterance".

You might need to reread I Cor 14, the ability to release or pray in tongues for the believer is found in the human will.

[stmatthew]

You might need to reread I Cor 14, the ability to release or pray in tongues for the believer is found in the human will.

Maybe you should read verse 23, as it shows that it is wrong for a whole church to come together and speak in tongues.


I also disagree that I Cor 14 is stating that we can "at will" speak in tongues. If tongues come only from our human will and spirit, then the Holy Ghost is not needed. But the Holy Ghost is what gives utterance, not our human spirit.


Honestly, the more you folks talk about some of these old timers, the less respect I have for them.

[Rico]

sellamyhonda, buymeakawasaki

Say it real fast and you want go out and buy a new bike.

It's hockamahonda, sellasuzuki, don'tbuyachevy! :D

[Monkeyman]

You might need to reread I Cor 14, the ability to release or pray in tongues for the believer is found in the human will.In the last 2 churches I have attended, we have done this. I won't do it right now cuz' I am in Starbucks, but don't push me or I will!!!

[Pastor Keith]

Maybe you should read verse 23, as it shows that it is wrong for a whole church to come together and speak in tongues.


I also disagree that I Cor 14 is stating that we can "at will" speak in tongues. If tongues come only from our human will and spirit, then the Holy Ghost is not needed. But the Holy Ghost is what gives utterance, not our human spirit.


Honestly, the more you folks talk about some of these old timers, the less respect I have for them.

The apostle Paul described the will of the believer as key to the ability of the believer to have the ongoing ability to pray in tongues, he said "I will pray with my spirit and I will pray with my understanding also. I will sing with my spirit and I will sing with my understanding also." It is not a matter of emotion. It is a matter of the will. You can will to pray in your own language and you can will to pray in your heavenly language. Paul went on to say to the Christians in Corinth: The spirit of the prophet is subject to the prophet, therefore let all things be done decently and in order." You can start and you can stop. You are in control.


You are entitled to your opinion about the Old Timers, I have a lot of respect for them and feel that much of their perspective we have lost.

[POWERUP]

My bad Rico. I wasn't taught that indepth.

[ManOfWord]

Sadly, I had this happen to me before I received the HG on my own. It was at a youth rally and the evangelist and the pastor of the church tried to get me to repeat after them. People were rocking me back and forth etc. I was really ticked because I thought that this HG "thing" was supposed to be between me and God. I took great offense that someone thought they could "give" it to me or get me to speak in tongues. I thought it was about the HG and not ab out tongues. It really confused me being a 3 month old convert. I almost punched the preacher who grabbed me by the throat and was screaming in my ears! (seriously) I was saved, but I was only "freshly" saved. :D

I received the HG by myself with no one telling me what to do or what to say. If it's real, then no one has to "tell" you what to say.

[Hoovie]

I also have an acquaintance that went to CLC is Stockton (about 5 - 6 years ago) that said during a service the leader just told everyone to start speaking in tongues. She said it was really weird, because many did. I never knew you could turn on tongues. I always thought they were "as the Spirit gave utterance".

I witnessed this in a large meeting for the first time last year... I tried to join them for a minute or two... then opted to step out for a double espresso. I hope they were all blessed, because I know I was.

[Hoovie]

Really sad. We really need to get all the OP groups together and make a bold statement about this

It likely will not happen. There are various takes on this.

I am not sure that most "altar work" beyond the biblical "laying on of hands" isn't counter-productive.

[Pastor Keith]

I witnessed this in a large meeting for the first time last year... I tried to join them for a minute or two... then opted to step out for a double espresso. I hope they were all blessed, because I know I was.

My issue with this type of activity is not praying in tongues by choice, but doing it in a large meeting which I Cor. 14 reveals to be unprofitable and not wise. At some stage we need to move into prophesying as a sign of maturity.

[stmatthew]

The apostle Paul described the will of the believer as key to the ability of the believer to have the ongoing ability to pray in tongues, he said "I will pray with my spirit and I will pray with my understanding also. I will sing with my spirit and I will sing with my understanding also." It is not a matter of emotion. It is a matter of the will. You can will to pray in your own language and you can will to pray in your heavenly language. Paul went on to say to the Christians in Corinth: The spirit of the prophet is subject to the prophet, therefore let all things be done decently and in order." You can start and you can stop. You are in control.


You are entitled to your opinion about the Old Timers, I have a lot of respect for them and feel that much of their perspective we have lost.

Any "speaking in tongues" that is not THROUGH the Holy Ghost is not of God, and promotes humanism. I don't have time to discuss such an elementary thing with someone who should be well beyond this.

1Cr 14:38 But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.

[Hoovie]

Philip Dugas a son-in-law of the late AD Urshan told us that when AD Urshan would pray for some people who struggled receiving the Holy Spirit, he would have them repeat the word "ABBA" until they felt encouraged/faith to begin to pray in Tongues without help. He felt that it was a unfamiliar/Biblical address to God as Daddy, but it sounded close enough like Tongues and would often be the catlyst for someone receving liberty to speak out in tongues. I wouldn't say that it was teaching tongues, but I think it to a interesting approach.


BIZARRE!

[Praxeas]

The apostle Paul described the will of the believer as key to the ability of the believer to have the ongoing ability to pray in tongues, he said "I will pray with my spirit and I will pray with my understanding also. I will sing with my spirit and I will sing with my understanding also." It is not a matter of emotion. It is a matter of the will. You can will to pray in your own language and you can will to pray in your heavenly language. Paul went on to say to the Christians in Corinth: The spirit of the prophet is subject to the prophet, therefore let all things be done decently and in order." You can start and you can stop. You are in control.


You are entitled to your opinion about the Old Timers, I have a lot of respect for them and feel that much of their perspective we have lost.
Just to clarify. I don't think Keith is saying tongues is OF your while. Tongues is OF the Holy Spirit but it's YOUR will in allowing that to happen.

BTW I brought up the point of the spirit of the prophet etc....

[Hoovie]

My issue with this type of activity is not praying in tongues by choice, but doing it in a large meeting which I Cor. 14 reveals to be unprofitable and not wise. At some stage we need to move into prophesying as a sign of maturity.

Agreed, that was my first concern, not to mention the wierd feeling I get when someone orders one all to speak in tongues...

[Rico]

My bad Rico. I wasn't taught that indepth.

Hehehehe! Consider thyself edumacated! :bliss

[Pastor Keith]

Any "speaking in tongues" that is not THROUGH the Holy Ghost is not of God, and promotes humanism. I don't have time to discuss such an elementary thing with someone who should be well beyond this.

1Cr 14:38 But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.

Thanks for the compliment, but this is really elementary, after the being born again the human spirit that was once dead is now alive can communicate with the Living God who is spirit. Sorry you don't get it, I guess it revals much of your level of understanding as well.

[Pastor Keith]

BIZARRE!

Nevertheless true!

[Praxeas]

Thanks for the compliment, but this is really elementary, after the being born again the human spirit that was once dead is now alive can communicate with the Living God who is spirit. Sorry you don't get it, I guess it revals much of your level of understanding as well.
Keith is the source of these tongues the Holy Spirit or our own spirit? are you saying that the Holy Spirit enables our spirit to do these things?

[Pastor Keith]

Keith is the source of these tongues the Holy Spirit or our own spirit? are you saying that the Holy Spirit enables our spirit to do these things?

Yes, of course, but Paul identified the source of his praying as his spirit.

[Praxeas]

Yes, of course, but Paul identified the source of his praying as his spirit.
Right...how much of that is simply our control over what the Spirit enables? For example the prophets...WHen someone prophesies they are not automatons or puppets. They do it by the Spirit but they are in control as to when to release it., A person that has a message in tongues for the church can "opt" to not give it..not saying they should or that is ok to do, but I mean God does not take over completely. We allow HIM to speak through us or we relay what word HE has given to us. IF we are obedient we do it as He wills. But that still involves OUR will

[Pastor Keith]

Right...how much of that is simply our control over what the Spirit enables? For example the prophets...WHen someone prophesies they are not automatons or puppets. They do it by the Spirit but they are in control as to when to release it., A person that has a message in tongues for the church can "opt" to not give it..not saying they should or that is ok to do, but I mean God does not take over completely. We allow HIM to speak through us or we relay what word HE has given to us. IF we are obedient we do it as He wills. But that still involves OUR will

Yes, but spiritual gifts empowered by the Spirit is different than the ongoing ability for believer to pray in devotional tongues.

[Praxeas]

Yes, but spiritual gifts empowered by the Spirit is different than the ongoing ability for believer to pray in devotional tongues.
Right, but either way we are not forced to speak in tongues. We can allow it to happen or not allow it to happen. That really seems to imply there is some ability on our part. The ability may simply them be to utilize what God has given us through His Spirit. Im not sure if StMatt understood that

[Rico]

Since the initial experience, I have had it happen both ways, so I really don't see what y'all are arguing over.

[Pastor Keith]

Right, but either way we are not forced to speak in tongues. We can allow it to happen or not allow it to happen. That really seems to imply there is some ability on our part. The ability may simply them be to utilize what God has given us through His Spirit. Im not sure if StMatt understood that

No there is no forcing, but also there is really dearth of understanding that I don't need the choir, or someone leading me to shout, a overwhelming feeling or that special song to release me into a vital element of spiritual life, that is the ability for me to connect to God through devotional tongues. Often the obstacle for many if having to try and reproduce all the factors of their intial experience and anything lacking from that then it isn't genuine or really a God thing.

[shag]

Recently, I heard a man testifying of himself, and another buddy christian that were working around others that cussed a lot. They decided that every time they heard their co-workers start cussing, they would start speakin' in tongues(where they could be heard). I'm not sure exactly the motive, but they none the less did so. I'm not quite sure where I stand with that.

[Pastor Keith]

Recently, I heard a man testifying of himself, and another buddy christian that were working around others that cussed a lot. They decided that every time they heard their co-workers start cussing, they would start speakin' in tongues(where they could be heard). I'm not sure exactly the motive, but they none the less did so. I'm not quite sure where I stand with that.

I have often wanted to break singing a hymn but never tongues, I think that would be a example of casting pearls before swine.

[Elizabeth]

Recently, I heard a man testifying of himself, and another buddy christian that were working around others that cussed a lot. They decided that every time they heard their co-workers start cussing, they would start speakin' in tongues(where they could be heard). I'm not sure exactly the motive, but they none the less did so. I'm not quite sure where I stand with that.

This is so funny! I can not imagine doing this on the job and staying employed very long.

[DanielR]

Originally Posted by shag
Recently, I heard a man testifying of himself, and another buddy christian that were working around others that cussed a lot. They decided that every time they heard their co-workers start cussing, they would start speakin' in tongues(where they could be heard). I'm not sure exactly the motive, but they none the less did so. I'm not quite sure where I stand with that.
I have often wanted to break singing a hymn but never tongues, I think that would be a example of casting pearls before swine.

Both sound like casting pearls before swine, but I would say that singing a hymn would be less so than speaking in tongues.

[shag]

Recently, I heard a man testifying of himself, and another buddy christian that were working around others that cussed a lot. They decided that every time they heard their co-workers start cussing, they would start speakin' in tongues(where they could be heard). I'm not sure exactly the motive, but they none the less did so. I'm not quite sure where I stand with that.


1 Cor. 14:2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God:
(and fellow workers?)

[Bro-Larry]

Acts 2:4 says they did the speaking, the spirit gave them the words to say, it's just that simple. The miracle of glossolalia is not who is doing the speaking, but what is being said. The greater amount of your tongue speaking should be done in your own personal, private devotions.

[Sherri]

What I think is interesting on this thread is that it started out by saying this teaching to speak in tongues was in mostly Charismatic churches. Every example that I saw following that was in Oneness Pentecostal churches, not Charismatic! I've never seen this happen in any meetings that I've been in outside of UPC.

We call people to the front who want to receive the baptism of the Holy Spirit and then Eddie calmly explains it (no music being played). He tells them to repent, if they have not and then to raise their hands in surrender and ask the Holy Spirit to baptize them. Then we lay hands on them and MANY of them immediately begin speaking in a heavenly language. If we have any music playing at all at this point, it is soft and not hyped. We teach our people praying with them to just pray in tongues around them, not to speak to them in English. It's too confusing to try to listen to everyone and what they're telling you and still try to pray. I think we made it WAY too hard the way we were raised. We just tell these people that God wants to fill them and they believe it and they receive it.

On the other point, sometimes on Wed. nights, which are much more "Pentecostal" than Sundays, if we are all praying together in an intercessory mode, Eddie will ask everyone who prays in tongues to do so together. Those that don't just pray in English. It is very powerful and we have seen God do amazing things during those prayer times. Some are filled with the Holy Ghost right then, because they are surrounded by that anointing. It is very natural to speak in tongues anytime I want/need to, but that is not something that I knew I could do until after I left UPC. We were never taught that. It is totally natural for me to move from English to tongues, because I walk in the Spirit. It's not something that has to be worked up.

[ChTatum]

Several years ago, in Athens, GA, my aunt asked me to attend a house service where she said they "taught" people to speak in tongues.

Curiousity prompted me to go. They said they were part of a movement called the "Branch". After introductions were made, some singing without music, one of the leaders announced: " I am now going to give a message in tongues, and _________is going to interpret it for us."

Blew me out of the water. I do believe that my spirit would be in agreement with their spirit, and it didn't. There have been several times when I have witnessed people speaking in tongues, and it didn't feel right.

I told my aunt this was not something she needed to get mixed up in. Never heard of them since.

[Jack Shephard]

What I think is interesting on this thread is that it started out by saying this teaching to speak in tongues was in mostly Charismatic churches. Every example that I saw following that was in Oneness Pentecostal churches, not Charismatic! I've never seen this happen in any meetings that I've been in outside of UPC.

We call people to the front who want to receive the baptism of the Holy Spirit and then Eddie calmly explains it (no music being played). He tells them to repent, if they have not and then to raise their hands in surrender and ask the Holy Spirit to baptize them. Then we lay hands on them and MANY of them immediately begin speaking in a heavenly language. If we have any music playing at all at this point, it is soft and not hyped. We teach our people praying with them to just pray in tongues around them, not to speak to them in English. It's too confusing to try to listen to everyone and what they're telling you and still try to pray. I think we made it WAY too hard the way we were raised. We just tell these people that God wants to fill them and they believe it and they receive it.

On the other point, sometimes on Wed. nights, which are much more "Pentecostal" than Sundays, if we are all praying together in an intercessory mode, Eddie will ask everyone who prays in tongues to do so together. Those that don't just pray in English. It is very powerful and we have seen God do amazing things during those prayer times. Some are filled with the Holy Ghost right then, because they are surrounded by that anointing. It is very natural to speak in tongues anytime I want/need to, but that is not something that I knew I could do until after I left UPC. We were never taught that. It is totally natural for me to move from English to tongues, because I walk in the Spirit. It's not something that has to be worked up.

Great and beautiful post. This is the picture of God's church. When we are spirit-filled, spirit-led and spirit-driven we can move in and out of the HG or tongues as needed. I think that in the UPC and other OP orgs kinda teach that we are so full of flesh that we must go through this drawn out process just to break out in tongues again, like you were saying. It must become our second nature. Our nature must change because He has given us the 'power' to change!

[Thinking]

I have seen a UPC evangelist, who seems sincere, and is very successful--as far as the number of people who receive the Holy Ghost in his ministry--operate in this way: He calls the "seekers" to the front, leads them into repentance, then asks them if they have repented. He then tells them, "I'm going to lay hands on you, and you will receive the Holy Ghost. Don't speak in English. The Holy Ghost will speak through you in other tongues."

Many people receive the Holy Ghost in this way.

[Sherri]

I have seen a UPC evangelist, who seems sincere, and is very successful--as far as the number of people who receive the Holy Ghost in his ministry--operate in this way: He calls the "seekers" to the front, leads them into repentance, then asks them if they have repented. He then tells them, "I'm going to lay hands on you, and you will receive the Holy Ghost. Don't speak in English. The Holy Ghost will speak through you in other tongues."

Many people receive the Holy Ghost in this way.I'm glad to hear this. I don't think people have to be rubbed, spit on, shaken, etc. It's a very natural thing to receive the Holy Ghost once the temple is cleansed.

[Rico]

The Holy Ghost is not someone we get. He is someone we receive.

[Sherri]

The Holy Ghost is not someone we get. He is someone we receive.'Splain the difference, please.

[Cindy]

I don't understand why people think they need to SEEK a gift. That's like asking people to give you presents. It's kind of tacky.

[Joie]

I don't understand why people think they need to SEEK a gift. That's like asking people to give you presents. It's kind of tacky.
That's good! Bless you, Sis Cindy! :)

[Cindy]

That's good! Bless you, Sis Cindy! :)

Thank you my sweet friend.

[Sherri]

I don't understand why people think they need to SEEK a gift. That's like asking people to give you presents. It's kind of tacky.
In my church, we were taught to "tarry" for the Holy Ghost. I don't remember anyone receiving it easily, other than kids at youth camp. My aunt and uncle prayed for 18 years, I prayed for 7, and others somewhere in that range. I don't know why it was made to be so hard, but I get the feeling that if we had received it easily, they might have thought it wasn't the real thing. LOL!

[Hoovie]

In my church, we were taught to "tarry" for the Holy Ghost. I don't remember anyone receiving it easily, other than kids at youth camp. My aunt and uncle prayed for 18 years, I prayed for 7, and others somewhere in that range. I don't know why it was made to be so hard, but I get the feeling that if we had received it easily, they might have thought it wasn't the real thing. LOL!

In all fairness, this is almost a thing of the past in the UPC as well.

[Sam]

How did people receive the HGB (Holy Ghost Baptism) in the Book of Acts?

Example no. 1,
Sunday May 30, A.D. 30 in Jerusalem,
about 120 of the 500 members of the infant church (1 Cor. 15:6), were in the temple praising and blessing God (Luke 24:53). "Suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting ... and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost and began to speak with other tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance." Acts 2:1-4

Example no. 2,
winter AD 31/32 in Samaria
"Then laid they their hands on them and they received the Holy Ghost." Acts 8:5-18

Example no. 3.
soon after example no. 2, in the desert, possibly at Wadi el-Hesi north of Gaza
"...they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch and he baptized him. and when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord fell upon the eunuch..." Acts 8:26-40

Example no. 4
Jan 28, AD 32 (3 days after Saul's conversion) in Damascus
Ananias, a devout law-keeping Jewish believer went in put his hands on Saul and and told him, "Brother Saul, the Lord Jesus that appeared unto thee... hat sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight and be filled with the Holy Ghost." Acts 9:1-20

Example no. 5
AD 38 in Caesarea, 60 miles NW of Jerusalem
The Apostle Peter was preaching to a Roman Centurian named Cornelius plus some others who had gathered in the house, and "while Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them that heard the Word" Acts 10:34-48

Example no. 6
October AD 58 in Ephesus
Paul found about half a dozen Baptists who had not received the Holy Ghost Baptism. He preached Jesus, baptized them in Jesus' name and "when Paul his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them: and they spake with tongues and prophesied." Acts 19:1-7

That's all the examples I can think of right now where it speaks of people receiving what we Apostolic/Pentecostal/Charismatics call the Holy Ghost Baptism or the release of the Spirit. You may think of other examples like in Acts 13 on Paul's first missionary journey where it says that "the disciples were filled with joy, and with the Holy Ghost" (Acts 13:52) but doesn't give any description of how and when it happened.

So, the Holy Spirit filled or came upon, or fell upon people as:
they were worshiping and praising God;
they heard the Word;
he came up out of the water;
hands were laid upon them.

Notice: no word about grabbing and shaking, rubbing, shaking their chins, putting their hands into their mouths, spitting on them, or people hollering themselves hoarse. And notice also that some times it said they spoke with tongues and/or prophesied and some times tongues/prophecy are not mentioned (we all can, and do, read into that whatever we want)

[Sam]

In my church, we were taught to "tarry" for the Holy Ghost. I don't remember anyone receiving it easily, other than kids at youth camp. My aunt and uncle prayed for 18 years, I prayed for 7, and others somewhere in that range. I don't know why it was made to be so hard, but I get the feeling that if we had received it easily, they might have thought it wasn't the real thing. LOL!

No one was ever told to "tarry" (wait) for the HGB but those who were with Jesus in Acts chapter one just before He ascended. And they had to wait/tarry for 10 days until the feast day of Pentecost or Shav u 'ot before the promise of the Father was poured out by the Son of God.

[Sherri]

In all fairness, this is almost a thing of the past in the UPC as well.I'm really glad to hear this. I think we were given a lot of false teaching. I'm not talking about UPC as a whole, just where I grew up in my little church.

[mizpeh]

What I think is interesting on this thread is that it started out by saying this teaching to speak in tongues was in mostly Charismatic churches. Every example that I saw following that was in Oneness Pentecostal churches, not Charismatic! I've never seen this happen in any meetings that I've been in outside of UPC.

We call people to the front who want to receive the baptism of the Holy Spirit and then Eddie calmly explains it (no music being played). He tells them to repent, if they have not and then to raise their hands in surrender and ask the Holy Spirit to baptize them. Then we lay hands on them and MANY of them immediately begin speaking in a heavenly language. If we have any music playing at all at this point, it is soft and not hyped. We teach our people praying with them to just pray in tongues around them, not to speak to them in English. It's too confusing to try to listen to everyone and what they're telling you and still try to pray. I think we made it WAY too hard the way we were raised. We just tell these people that God wants to fill them and they believe it and they receive it.

On the other point, sometimes on Wed. nights, which are much more "Pentecostal" than Sundays, if we are all praying together in an intercessory mode, Eddie will ask everyone who prays in tongues to do so together. Those that don't just pray in English. It is very powerful and we have seen God do amazing things during those prayer times. Some are filled with the Holy Ghost right then, because they are surrounded by that anointing. It is very natural to speak in tongues anytime I want/need to, but that is not something that I knew I could do until after I left UPC. We were never taught that. It is totally natural for me to move from English to tongues, because I walk in the Spirit. It's not something that has to be worked up.

This is excellent instruction!

When the those at the altar are told to repent if they have not, does someone lead them in a sinner's prayer or what type of instruction is given to them on repentance?

[Praxeas]

I don't think we should teach someone HAS to tarry for it...then that becomes expected

[Hoovie]

I'm really glad to hear this. I think we were given a lot of false teaching. I'm not talking about UPC as a whole, just where I grew up in my little church.

I would not go so far as saying it all falls under "false teaching" - that comes with rather heavy implications - just that it is outside of biblical precedent.

The same can be said about telling people they should expect to speak in tongues, or other mood setting with music, prayer language etc...

[Cindy]

In my church, we were taught to "tarry" for the Holy Ghost. I don't remember anyone receiving it easily, other than kids at youth camp. My aunt and uncle prayed for 18 years, I prayed for 7, and others somewhere in that range. I don't know why it was made to be so hard, but I get the feeling that if we had received it easily, they might have thought it wasn't the real thing. LOL!

You sought the Holy Ghost or you sought speaking in tongues? They are not the same.

[Cindy]

I don't think we should teach someone HAS to tarry for it...then that becomes expected

We don't have to tarry, the apostles tarried until they received it. All we have to do now is repent and be baptized in Jesus Name to receive it. It's very plain and simple in the Bible.

[Praxeas]

We don't have to tarry, the apostles tarried until they received it. All we have to do now is repent and be baptized in Jesus Name to receive it. It's very plain and simple in the Bible.
I've seen a lot be baptized in Jesus name and supposedly repented....and still take a while to get it

[Cindy]

I've seen a lot be baptized in Jesus name and supposedly repented....and still take a while to get it

Yep, supposedly. Acts 2:38 does not say you will speak in tongues after you repent and are baptized in Jesus name, it says you shall receive the GIFT of the Holy Ghost. Although some do speak in tongues when they get the Holy Ghost. Does that mean if someone doesn't speak in tongues for a week, a month, or a year doesn't have the Holy Ghost?

[Praxeas]

Yep, supposedly. Acts 2:38 does not say you will speak in tongues after you repent and are baptized in Jesus name, it says you shall receive the GIFT of the Holy Ghost. Although some do speak in tongues when they get the Holy Ghost. Does that mean if someone doesn't speak in tongues for a week, a month, or a year doesn't have the Holy Ghost?
So are you saying that upon repentance and then baptism in Jesus name at that moment everyone is filled with the Spirit instantly?

[Cindy]

So are you saying that upon repentance and then baptism in Jesus name at that moment everyone is filled with the Spirit instantly?

I am saying that Acts 2:38 says you SHALL receive it after you repent and are baptized in Jesus name. I am not saying everyone does or doesn't. My point is I don't see why anyone has to seek a gift, it is freely given by our Father.

[Hoovie]

I am saying that Acts 2:38 says you SHALL receive it after you repent and are baptized in Jesus name. I am not saying everyone does or doesn't. My point is I don't see why anyone has to seek a gift, it is freely given by our Father.

Good point.

We recently had a visiting minister who said the tongues are not so much evidence of the Holy Spirit "coming in" but evidence of the "overflow" or fullfilling. I thought that was interesting.

[Sherri]

This is excellent instruction!

When the those at the altar are told to repent if they have not, does someone lead them in a sinner's prayer or what type of instruction is given to them on repentance?
He leads them in a prayer of repentance. But before anyone criticizes that, let me say that I've seen many of them with tears streaming down their faces as they pray that prayer. Some of them have no clue how to even pray, so they need instructing.

[Sherri]

I would not go so far as saying it all falls under "false teaching" - that comes with rather heavy implications - just that it is outside of biblical precedent.

The same can be said about telling people they should expect to speak in tongues, or other mood setting with music, prayer language etc...

Sorry if that sounded harsh; I didn't mean it that way. I just think that it was not right teaching. Is that better?

[Sherri]

You sought the Holy Ghost or you sought speaking in tongues? They are not the same.Well, I thought I was seeking the Holy Ghost, but of course knowing that tongues accompanies it, I was probably seeking tongues too. I would get so frustrated because I was doing everything I could possibly do to live right and serve God. I know I wore out the saints for years! LOL!

[Cindy]

He leads them in a prayer of repentance. But before anyone criticizes that, let me say that I've seen many of them with tears streaming down their faces as they pray that prayer. Some of them have no clue how to even pray, so they need instructing.

Jesus knew He had to teach people to pray. In reality not all people who are wanting to receive the Holy Ghost know how to pray about it unless someone teaches them. That is not the same as teaching them to speak in tongues. The Holy Ghost teaches us how to speak in tongues.

[Sherri]

Jesus knew He had to teach people to pray. In reality not all people who are wanting to receive the Holy Ghost know how to pray about it unless someone teaches them. That is not the same as teaching them to speak in tongues. The Holy Ghost teaches us how to speak in tongues.
Exactly. There has been quite a bit of criticism on here in the past over "praying the sinner's prayer", but it is actually quite effective if the people are sincere. After all, repentance just means a change of mind and change of direction. It doesn't necessarily mean a lot of emotion, although sometimes that accompanies it.

[Cindy]

Exactly. There has been quite a bit of criticism on here in the past over "praying the sinner's prayer", but it is actually quite effective if the people are sincere. After all, repentance just means a change of mind and change of direction. It doesn't necessarily mean a lot of emotion, although sometimes that accompanies it.

Yes, that is so true. One of my sons and his wife did just that. Turned from some hard sin and are living for God, in a Baptist church, they love the Word of God, have a great prayer life, and are teaching their children. I just pray for them to get the revalation of all truth, including baptism in Jesus name.

[Sherri]

Yes, that is so true. One of my sons and his wife did just that. Turned from some hard sin and are living for God, in a Baptist church, they love the Word of God, have a great prayer life, and are teaching their children. I just pray for them to get the revalation of all truth, including baptism in Jesus name.If you love them and acknowledge that they really have a walk with God where they are, they will be open to listening to more truth. People are turned off when they think others consider them "unsaved" in their walk with the Lord.

[Hoovie]

If you love them and acknowledge that they really have a walk with God where they are, they will be open to listening to more truth. People are turned off when they think others consider them "unsaved" in their walk with the Lord.

Bingo!

[commonsense]

Since I've been in Pentecost forevvveerr I've seen or heard lots of things. In the 50's I never saw or heard anything that I would considern unbiblical.
Altar calls were given for people to seek for the HG. I never witnessed any one "teaching" how to speak. I did see those trying to help someone receive by lifting their hands, screaming in their ear etc.

Personally, I was young, 11, and during a great camp meeting at Leisure Lake, WI just went forward (with others) during the annointed singing of the camp evangelist & wife. The power just came down! Several received the HG that night. The preacher never did get to preach. I confess I don't remember who it was. (July 22, 1960)

[commonsense]

Several years ago I attended some Women's Aglow services. They would ask everyone to pray in their prayer language. I wasn't comfortable with this since I didn't think you could just "turn a switch".
I did see good worship and ladies who loved God. It was interesting. Many of their methods were probably fine but since I was totally indoctrinated by the UPC and ABI as to worship style etc it was somewhat strange.

[Cindy]

If you love them and acknowledge that they really have a walk with God where they are, they will be open to listening to more truth. People are turned off when they think others consider them "unsaved" in their walk with the Lord.

I will be honest and say their lights outshine mine sometimes.
When my son was little he stood up in science class and told the teacher who was trying to teach evolution that she was wrong, he said God created the heavens and the earth. Just read the first chapter of Genesis in the Bible. He has always loved the Lord.

[Michael The Disciple]

So what I am hearing for the most part about receiving the Holy Spirit sounds much the same as taught by Charismatics. Not being critical just stating fact. So the Charismatics are not as far off as we hear.

Anyone on this thread receive the Holy Spirit with tongues following who was NOT TAUGHT ANYTHING about tongues?

[Sam]

So what I am hearing for the most part about receiving the Holy Spirit sounds much the same as taught by Charismatics. Not being critical just stating fact. So the Charismatics are not as far off as we hear.

Anyone on this thread receive the Holy Spirit with tongues following who was NOT TAUGHT ANYTHING about tongues?

I was taught that when I received the HGB (Holy Ghost Baptism) I would speak with tongues. I was not grabbed, pushed, shaken, etc. I was told to just worship and praise the Lord and wait for Him to fill me. I was not told to repeat certain words or sounds to "prime the pump." When I received the experience, I was kneeling at the altar after a Sunday night service. I had my hands raised and I was praising the Lord in a calm manner. Then I realized that what I was saying was not coming out in English. I just kept praising the Lord and it kept coming out in some type of language that I was unfamiliar with. I felt joy inside as I just continued praising God in this new "unknown" tongue. Later I realized that the Sunday I received the HGB was Pentecost Sunday. So, I guess that makes me Pentecostal, doesn't it?

[Jason B]

Really sad. We really need to get all the OP groups together and make a bold statement about this

prax,
you are so on target with this.
recently i have been teaching a bible study, and one of the people came to my house on a sunday afternoon, saying they wanted the holy ghost. now i had no music, no preacher, (to be honest i had to turn off the TV, i was relaxing after church).
anyhow i prayed for about 3 or 4 minutes, something along the lines of "Lord Jesus, deborah has come here seeking your Spirit, and I pray in your name that you would fill her as you poured out your Spirit in the book of acts."
The only thing I asked her to do was raise her hands, not to say anything. Though sometimes I will tell people to speak to God in english, as they pray for the holy ghost until the Spirit takes over.
Anyhow, she didn't speak in tongues, which at first, I was wondering and praying to God, because sometimes I don't understand.
Shortly thereafter I was made to understand that she had not repented, she tried to cook up a scheme to eat some bad food and try to sue the grocery store. She also quit the Bible study. (i guess i assumed when she wanted the holy ghost she had, I will be speaking to people about repentance BEFORE helping them pray for the Holy Ghost)

No this post is not really good news, but just truth.
We don't need to coach people to the Holy Ghost, we need to encourage people that if they are hungry God will fill them. I tell people, "I can pray for you, i can baptize you, but the baptism of the Spirit is something God has to do for you, i cannot give you the Holy Ghost, no matter how bad I want you to recieve it."

Anyway, in my ministry, I have sort of a policy now, I will pray for people to recieve the Holy ghost, but basically a simple prayer of faith and encouragement, and the rest is up to God. I don't see begging, "lalalal sellemahonda, rubbing throats, or any of that nonsense in acts. and if we are going to have an apostolic revival, we need God to move like He did in Acts. We want all the power, without commitment. I think you are absolutely right about overemphasis on an outward expression, to the point many people are told they recieve the Holy Ghost who never did.

[Praxeas]

I will be honest and say their lights outshine mine sometimes.
When my son was little he stood up in science class and told the teacher who was trying to teach evolution that she was wrong, he said God created the heavens and the earth. Just read the first chapter of Genesis in the Bible. He has always loved the Lord.
Don't tell that to folks like...J...well I better not name him...they believe in the tried and true ........ them to hell and scare the sin out of them method to create a sour bitter Fred Phelps like person that sounds like they hate everyone.

[nwlife]

Oh gosh, that too. Don't get me started on the guys that wave their fingers infront of someone's mouth as if they are doing a spiritual operation to get that tongue to move. Or the guy that rubs his finger up and down someone's throat....

Then there are the back rubbers....as if that seeker is about to puke their guts out and need our comfort. If you come and rub my back Im gonna have a hard time focusing on God

LOL! I remember some of those when i was a kid..One way to cure them was to take off spining like a top and bulldoze through them. First year I did it, it was fun watching them move. the 2nd year at camp, well, that year it was God moving. But looking back, the almighty ticklers still got out of the way when I would come to pray!:toofunny

Now days I usually just would look at them and tell them, I am not a scratching post!

[mizpeh]

He leads them in a prayer of repentance. But before anyone criticizes that, let me say that I've seen many of them with tears streaming down their faces as they pray that prayer. Some of them have no clue how to even pray, so they need instructing.I hope you're not surprised but I agree with you. Leading in a prayer of repentance opens the floodgates of emotions and thoughts that is going on in a heart that is under conviction.

[Timmy]

What would happen if you guys just followed Acts 2:38 absolutely literally? A sinner is to repent. A sinner is to be baptized. That's where the instruction stops, then God's response takes over, so just leave it there. No need to beg and plead for the HGB, tarry, weep, be surrounded at the altar by teachers or cheerleaders, and repeat as needed every week until the goal is achieved: tongues!

Seriously. Repent and be baptized. Your work is done. Now God will do His part (according to that scripture). The gift will be given. Whether tongues happen or not is up to the HG. Why work so hard at receiving a gift?

[Baron1710]

What would happen if you guys just followed Acts 2:38 absolutely literally? A sinner is to repent. A sinner is to be baptized. That's where the instruction stops, then God's response takes over, so just leave it there. No need to beg and plead for the HGB, tarry, weep, be surrounded at the altar by teachers or cheerleaders, and repeat as needed every week until the goal is achieved: tongues!

Seriously. Repent and be baptized. Your work is done. Now God will do His part (according to that scripture). The gift will be given. Whether tongues happen or not is up to the HG. Why work so hard at receiving a gift?

Come on now, we have all these years of Pentecostal tradition. Now you want us to line our tradition up with Scripture? Good grief man!!

[Sherri]

So what I am hearing for the most part about receiving the Holy Spirit sounds much the same as taught by Charismatics. Not being critical just stating fact. So the Charismatics are not as far off as we hear.

Anyone on this thread receive the Holy Spirit with tongues following who was NOT TAUGHT ANYTHING about tongues?
We see it happen all the time. Lots of people who come forward when Eddie teaches about the Holy Ghost have never heard of tongues until that day. He just tells them it WILL happen to them and not to be afraid of it or freaked out - that it's God's language. So they believe him.

[Admin]

Any "speaking in tongues" that is not THROUGH the Holy Ghost is not of God, and promotes humanism. I don't have time to discuss such an elementary thing with someone who should be well beyond this.

1Cr 14:38 But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.

Stmatthew,

Are you using scripture to call Keith ignorant?

[Cindy]

Stmatthew,

Are you using scripture to call Keith ignorant?

Wow. Slowly moving out of this thread.

[Cindy]

Don't tell that to folks like...J...well I better not name him...they believe in the tried and true ........ them to hell and scare the sin out of them method to create a sour bitter Fred Phelps like person that sounds like they hate everyone.

OH the devil really fought to keep them Prax, but the Baptist church they go to did wonderful things for them. Gave them a car, installed a new hot water heater when their's went out, did Bible studies with them, and just loved them.

[Timmy]

Wow. Slowly moving out of this thread.

But we're all ignorant. Just of different things! :winkgrin

[Cindy]

But we're all ignorant. Just of different things! :winkgrin

Yeah but that looked so OFFICIAL, I mean the STOP sign and all, kinda scares me..............:reaction

[Joelel]

I have often heard the complaint that certain groups (usually Charismatic) teach people how to speak in tongues. Have you seen this? What is involved?

Hi Michael,Not only do they teach people to speak in tongues but they also talk in tongues anytime they want. What they do is they all just start talking in tongues and tell them to speak what they think.I'm sure if you had people around speaking what they thought ,you could think up a bunch of tongue twisters too.

[Joelel]

Here is what Yahweh people teach.

http://www.teleiosministries.com/pdfs/Speaking_in_Tongues/zealous_to_prophesy.pdf

http://www.teleiosministries.com/

[Praxeas]

Here is what Yahweh people teach.

http://www.teleiosministries.com/pdfs/Speaking_in_Tongues/zealous_to_prophesy.pdf

http://www.teleiosministries.com/
And why does anyone need to know what they teach? Are you one of them?

[Joelel]

When I preach,I preach the word and some when filled with the Holy Ghost prophecy,some have dreams and visions,some speak in tongues.Yelp just as the word teaches.One night I laid hands on a man to be filled with the Holy Ghost and at that time he did nothing, then walking home the same night in the park he was caught into a trance and had a vision.Tongues is not the only sign that follows people who are filled.If we believe and preach the full truth,the full truth will happen Amen

Acts2:16: But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;
17: And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
18: And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:
19: And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:
20: The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:
21: And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

[Joelel]

http://www.teleiosministries.com/pdfs/Speaking_in_Tongues/speaking_in_tongues.pdf

[Joelel]

And why does anyone need to know what they teach? Are you one of them?

Nope,Thought maybe Michael might want to know.Don't read it if you don't want.

[Sherri]

So, Joelel, you don't believe that everyone who is filled with the Holy Ghost speaks in tongues??? I'm shocked!

[Hoovie]

Here is what Yahweh people teach.

http://www.teleiosministries.com/pdfs/Speaking_in_Tongues/zealous_to_prophesy.pdf

http://www.teleiosministries.com/

Just as a sidenote, the "Yahweh people" believe alot of unusual things and many do not agree with each other either.

[Rico]

Just as a sidenote, the "Yahweh people" believe alot of unusual things and many do not agree with each other either.

U said a mouthful there, Brudda. They can't even agree on how to spell Jesus' name.

[freeatlast]

Philip Dugas a son-in-law of the late AD Urshan told us that when AD Urshan would pray for some people who struggled receiving the Holy Spirit, he would have them repeat the word "ABBA" until they felt encouraged/faith to begin to pray in Tongues without help. He felt that it was a unfamiliar/Biblical address to God as Daddy, but it sounded close enough like Tongues and would often be the catlyst for someone receving liberty to speak out in tongues. I wouldn't say that it was teaching tongues, but I think it to a interesting approach.

Back when Icame into pentecost, evangelist Joe Duke was with us. Those who knew hi said he prayed thru hundreds.

He would stop a seeker and tell them to say "Waliduea". he would then tell them that menat Thank God in French.

He'd tell them to say it over and over and then with one hand on their head and the other hand holding their hand he'd begin to push their head back and forth.

He said repeating "Waliduea" helped them "get that double lick" on their tongue.

Joe Duke was an Ultra Con, involved in the formation of the AMF and a great faith preacher. BUT I can not condone what he did with his Waliduea instructions.

So glad that today, that I am a "one stepper". I don't have to worry if you spoke in tongues or got duped.

My faith rests firmly in the work of the cross, not in the works of my flesh.

[Hoovie]

Back when Icame into pentecost, evangelist Joe Duke was with us. Those who knew hi said he prayed thru hundreds.

He would stop a seeker and tell them to say "Waliduea". he would then tell them that menat Thank God in French.

He'd tell them to say it over and over and then with one hand on their head and the other hand holding their hand he'd begin to push their head back and forth.

He said repeating "Waliduea" helped them "get that double lick" on their tongue.

Joe Duke was an Ultra Con, involved in the formation of the AMF and a great faith preacher. BUT I can not condone what he did with his Waliduea instructions.

So glad that today, that I am a "one stepper". I don't have to worry if you spoke in tongues or got duped.

My faith rests firmly in the work of the cross, not in the works of my flesh.

Is wanting to puke a sign of anything? Cause I think I have that...

Just curious, does it really mean that in French?

[freeatlast]

Is wanting to puke a sign of anything? Cause I think I have that...

Just curious, does it really mean that in French?


I really don't know. That was in 1970..they had a lot of pentecostal wierd stuff going on their in Florida when i first became a Christian.

We had the "holy luagh" way before the Toronto blessing folks came about.

We had a thing where two brothers were going to shake hands...but everytime they almst joined hands they got "hit with the holy ghost" and just threw their hands up. the power was so great between them they could not join hands.

We actually had some real "holy rollers" that would throw themselves down and go rolling back and forth.

So much for "decently and in order"

[LordChocolate]

blah blah yada yada sho nuff tie ma tie shonda. Repeat and you got it

[Scott Hutchinson]

I have heard of people being told to say see my tie my tie and saying that till they pray through.
One time in church there was a brother who to tried to testify but he always burst in tongues.
Anyways the pastor's son said Momma who is Shelia Behold ?his mother said what are you talking about ? The boy replied Brother B is always talking about Shelia behold.

[mizpeh]

So glad that today, that I am a "one stepper". I don't have to worry if you spoke in tongues or got duped.

My faith rests firmly in the work of the cross, not in the works of my flesh.Tempted to say something but I'll pass this time. Hope you catch the big one! :)

[stmatthew]

Any "speaking in tongues" that is not THROUGH the Holy Ghost is not of God, and promotes humanism. I don't have time to discuss such an elementary thing with someone who should be well beyond this.

1Cr 14:38 But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.

Stmatthew,

Are you using scripture to call Keith ignorant?

The verse of scripture I posted does not specify anyone specifically. And the word "Ignorant" used in the verse is not calling someone stupid, but "wrong in their understanding". Here is the definition:



IGNORANT - (gr) agnoeō (äg-no-e'-ō)

verb

1) to be ignorant, not to know

2) not to understand, unknown

3) to err or sin through mistake, to be wrong


So IF there had been any implication, it was simply that I believe Keith was wrong in his belief.


:airplane

[Sherri]

Is wanting to puke a sign of anything? Cause I think I have that...

Just curious, does it really mean that in French?Well, since thank you is "merci" and God is "Dieu", I doubt it.

[Hoovie]

Is wanting to puke a sign of anything? Cause I think I have that...

Just curious, does it really mean that in French?


Well, since thank you is "merci" and God is "Dieu", I doubt it.

Yeah - I figured as much.

[Sam]

[QUOTE=Sherri;465357]

Yeah - I figured as much.

Joe Duke might not have been a scholar when it comes to romance languages.

[stmatthew]

Back when Icame into pentecost, evangelist Joe Duke was with us. Those who knew hi said he prayed thru hundreds.

He would stop a seeker and tell them to say "Waliduea". he would then tell them that menat Thank God in French.

He'd tell them to say it over and over and then with one hand on their head and the other hand holding their hand he'd begin to push their head back and forth.

He said repeating "Waliduea" helped them "get that double lick" on their tongue.

Joe Duke was an Ultra Con, involved in the formation of the AMF and a great faith preacher. BUT I can not condone what he did with his Waliduea instructions.

So glad that today, that I am a "one stepper". I don't have to worry if you spoke in tongues or got duped.

My faith rests firmly in the work of the cross, not in the works of my flesh.

I checked on this with some men that were around Joe Duke's ministry, and they say this "Waliduea" never happened.

[Sister Alvear]

Joe Duke...I knew him...

[PMBrown]

I received the Baptism of the Holy Ghost on a Thursday night in a UPC church in Tuscaloosa, AL when I was 10 years old. My brother and I had been baptised two days earlier in the revival. On this particular evening the Spirit was moving and many people were kneeling in prayer at the alter, standing and singing, or under the power of God near the front of the church, including my entire family. I was alone in the pew where our family sat standing with my hands raised simply quietly praising the Lord when I felt living joy course through my body. God suddenly became more real to me that he had ever had before. When I said "I love you Jesus" it came from the very depths my being, powered by the anointing of the Holy Spirit, and the surrounding world suddenly seemed to cease to exist. It was just me and God. I was vaguely aware that I was jumping up and down uncontrollably, and I jumped like a rabbit out of my pew, down the center aisle, and up to the front in the alter area with my eyes closed the whole way, shouting the entire time, tears down my cheeks. The next thing I know, I'm on my back on the carpet, vibrating under the power of God as if I had grabbed a hold of a live wire. The words "I love you Jesus" that I was still repeating began to take on a different character, my lips were stammering and I found I could not form the words properly, and I began to utter words in another tongue. I was on that floor lost in the Holy Ghost for over two hours.
I suppose the point for relating this, other than the sheer joy being able to share this wonderful experience with fellow Spirit-filled believers, is to simply speak of how God moved in a sovereign way in a ten-year-old's life. No one had to "pray me through". There was no tarrying at the alter in countless hours of toil. There was simply the open heart of a child to the touch of the Master, and He gloriously responded. I belive Sherri made a very important observation when she said "I don't remember anyone receiving it easily, other than kids at youth camp" (post #76 on this thread). For some reason children seem far easier to receive the Baptism of the Holy Ghost than us older folk. They haven't had the time to get conditioned into the mindset that they need to work for it. There's an openess and a faith there that gets results. According to my recollection, my experience was not the norm in our church. Most of the saints got it through a struggle of sweat and tears, yet I saw how truely easy it was to get the baptism of the Holy Ghost especially in the years since I left the UPC. It warms my heart to hear of the clear teaching and results that is evident in Sherri and her husband's church. If only more of us struggling would come simply trusting in His grace Divine, what a sovereign move of God we'd see!