View Full Version : Is THIS a Sin?? ... Can it Ever Be?
I heard a bible teacher on the radio yesterday make a fairly convincing argument that anxiety can be a sin.
One of the reasons he gave was that it's rooted in unbelief ...
Not sure I entirely agree with his premise ... but thought I'd bring it up for discussion
What do you think? Is it? Can it ever be a sin?
freeatlast
06-14-2008, 06:54 PM
I anxsiously await some responses
Philippians 4:6 NIV •
Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God.
A sin????
Philippians 4:6 NIV •
Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God.
Are you saying this is a command?
To me personally, it is a command. I refuse to worry, be anxious, to whine to allow myself to truly believe.
To me personally, it is a command. I refuse to worry, be anxious, to whine to allow myself to truly believe.
So do you repent when you do get anxious?
What if you have an anxiety disorder?
So do you repent when you do get anxious?
What if you have an anxiety disorder?
Sometimes, I repent.
Daniellllllll..... :):) What if? What if? What if you jumped a fence and the barbed wire tore your pants off??? If'in is one of my least favorite expressions. olololllollol
rgcraig
06-14-2008, 07:20 PM
Is an anxiety disorder based on fear?
Praxeas
06-14-2008, 07:26 PM
I heard a bible teacher on the radio yesterday make a fairly convincing argument that anxiety can be a sin.
One of the reasons he gave was that it's rooted in unbelief ...
Not sure I entirely agree with his premise ... but thought I'd bring it up for discussion
What do you think? Is it? Can it ever be a sin?
I don't know but I would say sin, unrepented sin, but be the cause of it
Esther
06-14-2008, 07:30 PM
I heard a bible teacher on the radio yesterday make a fairly convincing argument that anxiety can be a sin.
One of the reasons he gave was that it's rooted in unbelief ...
Not sure I entirely agree with his premise ... but thought I'd bring it up for discussion
What do you think? Is it? Can it ever be a sin?
Hummm
Doubt is a sin, isn't it?
He could be right.
Are you anixous about this? :gaga
Praxeas
06-14-2008, 07:32 PM
Philippians 4:6 NIV •
Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God.
A sin????
I think it is a sin to use the NIV....but that's just me :toofunny
Praxeas
06-14-2008, 07:32 PM
Paul clearly details sins and the works of the flesh. Does he mention anxiety?
Paul clearly details sins and the works of the flesh. Does he mention anxiety?
He details all the works of the flesh .... ????
mizpeh
06-14-2008, 07:34 PM
Is an anxiety disorder based on fear?
Yes, fear which is lack of trust in God and unbelief. If we trust God, we have peace that He will work things out for us one way or another for our good. And being confident that God will do what He says He will do, we can praise Him even in the midst of troubles.
The Israelites in the wilderness did not believe God was going to bring them to the promised land because if they did, they would not have said some of the crazy things they did when they faced tests of their faith. They would not have wanted to turn back to Egypt.
Praxeas
06-14-2008, 07:35 PM
BTW a LOT of the bible is about edification. Paul instructs us HOW to live more victoriously. In this case he tells us when we are anxious about something to rather turn it into faith fulled prayer. Everything in the bible is not about condemning people but about LIFTING them up and helping them
:reactionI think it is a sin to use the NIV....but that's just me :toofunny
Prax:).... Praise the Lord, you are the book I look into to decide how I may have sinned,. :)NOT!
BTW a LOT of the bible is about edification. Paul instructs us HOW to live more victoriously. In this case he tells us when we are anxious about something to rather turn it into faith fulled prayer. Everything in the bible is not about condemning people but about LIFTING them up and helping them
Agreed ... sometimes it's not a direct command but rather encouragement.
Praxeas
06-14-2008, 07:37 PM
He details all the works of the flesh .... ????
He doesn't?
Praxeas
06-14-2008, 07:38 PM
:reaction
Prax:).... Praise the Lord, you are the book I look into to decide how I may have sinned,. :)
Behave or I just might throw the NIV at you :bliss
freeatlast
06-14-2008, 07:40 PM
I think it is a sin to use the NIV....but that's just me :toofunny
Paul NEVER EVER used an NIV bible !!!
RevDWW
06-14-2008, 07:40 PM
Perfect love casts out all fear. I'm sure there are fears that folks have that will be overcome as they mature in the Spirit. Shouldn't our fears(anxiety disorders) be relieved and overcome when we cast all our cares on Him, knowing He cares for us?
Old Paths
06-14-2008, 07:41 PM
To some folks, if anxiety were a sin, then God would be....
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a77/OldPath/full_prozac.jpg
chosenbyone
06-14-2008, 07:45 PM
Yes, fear which is lack of trust in God and unbelief. If we trust God, we have peace that He will work things out for us one way or another for our good. And being confident that God will do what He says He will do, we can praise Him even in the midst of troubles.
The Israelites in the wilderness did not believe God was going to bring them to the promised land because if they did, they would not have said some of the crazy things they did when they faced tests of their faith. They would not have wanted to turn back to Egypt.
Anxiety disorders could be genetic or could be caused by other physical ailments such as thyroid problems.
Anxiety disorders could be genetic or could be caused by other physical ailments such as thyroid problems.
So if it is genetic ... and it can be a sin ... can one be born a sinner?
Or this another discussion?
Nahum
06-14-2008, 07:51 PM
There is a world of difference between worry (anxiety) and concern.
There is a world of difference between worry (anxiety) and concern.
Agreed ... but is it a sin ... can it ever be sinful to be anxious?
Nahum
06-14-2008, 07:54 PM
Agreed ... but is it a sin ... can it ever be sinful to be anxious?
Yes, I think it can.
mizpeh
06-14-2008, 07:56 PM
Anxiety disorders could be genetic or could be caused by other physical ailments such as thyroid problems.
Or by an evil spirit of fear and doubt trying to cause unbelief to fester in our minds.
OneAccord
06-14-2008, 07:58 PM
Sometimes, I repent.
Daniellllllll..... :):) What if? What if? What if you jumped a fence and the barbed wire tore your pants off??? If'in is one of my least favorite expressions. olololllollol
Now that right there would be a cause for anxiety!
Anxiety disorders could be genetic or could be caused by other physical ailments such as thyroid problems.
Now, let me make this perfectly clear......not all. There are many, many, many genetic ailments which are caused by belief in receiving them... we believe we are going to receive these by thinking on the ailment and talking about it... Soooooooooooo what happens, these ailments come our way just like a bad dream.
Reference: Mark Chapter 5
Praxeas
06-14-2008, 07:59 PM
Paul NEVER EVER used an NIV bible !!!
Amen. IF the KJV was good enough for Paul and Silas.....
Mrs. LPW
06-14-2008, 07:59 PM
So if it is genetic ... and it can be a sin ... can one be born a sinner?
Or this another discussion?
One is born a sinner.
Ps 51:5
Another discussion most likely.
Or by an evil spirit of fear and doubt trying to cause unbelief to fester in our minds.
Is fear always an evil spirit ...?
Some are quoting 2 Timothy 1:7
but what does Paul mean by spirit?
In examining 2 Timothy 1:7, I think context and prior knowledge should give us which definition of the Greek word pneuma Paul is referring to ...
Surely it's not definition 1 ... and I dont think it's 2 or 3
For God has not given us a spirit of timidity, but of power and love and discipline.
ou gar edwken (5656) hmin o qeov pneuma deiliav, alla dunamewv kai agaphv kai swfronismou.
--------------------------------------
Pneuma
1. the third person of the triune God, the Holy Spirit, coequal, coeternal with the Father and the Son
1. sometimes referred to in a way which emphasises his personality and character (the \Holy\ Spirit)
2. sometimes referred to in a way which emphasises his work and power (the Spirit of \Truth\)
3. never referred to as a depersonalised force
2. the spirit, i.e. the vital principal by which the body is animated
1. the rational spirit, the power by which the human being feels, thinks, decides
2. the soul
3. a spirit, i.e. a simple essence, devoid of all or at least all grosser matter, and possessed of the power of knowing, desiring, deciding, and acting
1. a life giving spirit
2. a human soul that has left the body
3. a spirit higher than man but lower than God, i.e. an angel
1. used of demons, or evil spirits, who were conceived as inhabiting the bodies of men
2. the spiritual nature of Christ, higher than the highest angels and equal to God, the divine nature of Christ
4. the disposition or influence which fills and governs the soul of any one
1. the efficient source of any power, affection, emotion, desire, etc.
5. a movement of air (a gentle blast)
1. of the wind, hence the wind itself
2. breath of nostrils or mouth
-------------------------------------------------------
I think it has to be the fourth.
Praxeas
06-14-2008, 08:04 PM
Spirit often means disposition of mind
AbundantGrace
06-14-2008, 08:04 PM
I heard a bible teacher on the radio yesterday make a fairly convincing argument that anxiety can be a sin.
One of the reasons he gave was that it's rooted in unbelief ...
Not sure I entirely agree with his premise ... but thought I'd bring it up for discussion
What do you think? Is it? Can it ever be a sin?
This thread is making me anxious! :reaction:tissue:girlytantrum
Spirit often means disposition of mind
Right ... an emotion ...
Is anger ... sadness ... other negative emotions sinful too?
Paul did say ... be angry ... yet do not sin ...
OnTheFritz
06-14-2008, 08:08 PM
Anxiety disorders could be genetic or could be caused by other physical ailments such as thyroid problems.
Yeah, I believe it can be hereditary or chemical. I battle it. I think this is a complicated issue. Even with hereditary or chemical components, I believe that much of it is good old-fashioned fear and worry that is on a spiritual level. I struggle with my decision to rely on small doses of medication, but I am praying about it.
Mrs. LPW
06-14-2008, 08:08 PM
Lord I believe, help thou mine unbelief.
Mark 9:24
And like the father of the child, I say it with tears in my eyes when I'm casting my cares.
Hummm
Doubt is a sin, isn't it?
He could be right.
Are you anixous about this? :gaga
Is doubt a sin too?
I believe UNBELIEF is ...
Doubt is not necessarily unbelief
Praxeas
06-14-2008, 08:11 PM
Right ... an emotion ...
Is anger ... sadness ... other negative emotions sinful too?
Paul did say ... be angry ... yet do not sin ...
Yes though he does also seem to suggest that being quick to wrath is a symptom of the carnal mind.
2Co 12:20 For I fear that perhaps when I come I may find you not as I wish, and that you may find me not as you wish--that perhaps there may be quarreling, jealousy, anger, hostility, slander, gossip, conceit, and disorder.
2Co 12:21 I fear that when I come again my God may humble me before you, and I may have to mourn over many of those who sinned earlier and have not repented of the impurity, sexual immorality, and sensuality that they have practiced.
Gal 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality,
Gal 5:20 idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions,
Gal 5:21 envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
Eph 4:29 Let no corrupting talk come out of your mouths, but only such as is good for building up, as fits the occasion, that it may give grace to those who hear.
Eph 4:30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.
Eph 4:31 Let all bitterness and wrath and anger and clamor and slander be put away from you, along with all malice.
Eph 4:32 Be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, as God in Christ forgave you.
Col 3:7 In these you too once walked, when you were living in them.
Col 3:8 But now you must put them all away: anger, wrath, malice, slander, and obscene talk from your mouth.
Col 3:9 Do not lie to one another, seeing that you have put off the old self with its practices
Col 3:10 and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge after the image of its creator.
(Jas 1:19) Know this, my beloved brothers: let every person be quick to hear, slow to speak, slow to anger;
(Jas 1:20) for the anger of man does not produce the righteousness of God.
(Jas 1:21) Therefore put away all filthiness and rampant wickedness and receive with meekness the implanted word, which is able to save your souls.
(Jas 1:22) But be doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves.
mizpeh
06-14-2008, 08:12 PM
Is fear always an evil spirit ...?
No, not always.
chosenbyone
06-14-2008, 08:12 PM
So if it is genetic ... and it can be a sin ... can one be born a sinner?
Or this another discussion?
Like many things in life, the subject and causes of anxiety remains a gray area. Could anxiety be fear based and a sin? Yes. Could anxiety be related to a physical ailment and a sin? No.
chosenbyone
06-14-2008, 08:14 PM
Or by an evil spirit of fear and doubt trying to cause unbelief to fester in our minds.
No argument here. I just think that we cannot base an opinion on anxiety sufferers just on our own life experiences.
mizpeh
06-14-2008, 08:15 PM
Like many things in life, the subject and causes of anxiety remains a gray area. Could anxiety be fear based and a sin? Yes. Could anxiety be related to a physical ailment and a sin? No.
Thou wilt keep him in perfect peace whose mind is stayed upon thee for he trustest in thee.
OneAccord
06-14-2008, 08:15 PM
No, I don't think anxiety is a sin. Anxiety is a normal human response to things beyond our control. Our teenage son goes out, stays out later than normal... we get anxious. Normal reaction to a situation beyond our control. Being anxious isn't a sin... but how we react to that anxiety could very well be sin. Phil. 4:6 gives the proper response to anxiety. Prayer, Supplication, Thanksgiving. These are the Christians response to life's little (and not so little) anxieties. Everyone worries, and becomes anxious about something. If God somehow removed anxiety from us, then there would be no need for Peter to have written, "Casting all your cares upon Him, for He careth for you". With every anxious moment we encounter, God has provided the means for us to deal with that anxiety... its found right there in Phil 4:6.
I just went through several months of an anxiety crisis. Am I doing the right thing? Is her meds right? Doctors, hospitals, surgery, radiation, chemo. Endure months of that then come back and tell me whether anxiety is a sin or not. No, being concerned, being anxiuous, even being a little panicky, isn't a sin. Thats normal during stressful times and a person who doesn't get anxious at times just isn't normal in my opinion. Our anxieties ended when Lola and I sat down and prayerfully made the decision that ultimately determined her fate. It was a life and death situation to the fullest extent. I read 2Ch 16:12 to Lola And Asa in the thirty and ninth year of his reign was diseased in his feet, until his disease [was] exceeding [great]: yet in his disease he sought not to the LORD, but to the physicians. It was then that we responded appropriately to our anxieties. We decided to trust God with life rather than the doctors. And we trusted Him until she drew her last breath. And, I still trust Him... because trusting Him is the proper and only way to deal with anxiety. Anxiety is a normal human emotion... like happiness or anger. If you ain't got it...then you just ain't normal.
mizpeh
06-14-2008, 08:24 PM
No argument here. I just think that we cannot base an opinion on anxiety sufferers just on our own life experiences.
The battlefield is in our minds. Fearful thoughts trigger anxious feelings.
God is merciful. He takes pity on our weaknesses and helps us to overcome. Whatever the cause of the anxiety, as Christians, I don't believe we have to live in a state of constant anxiety or be controlled by anxiety.
I read a book about T W Barnes in which he was afflicted by an evil spirit of depression for six months. Interesting stuff.
whollyHis
06-14-2008, 09:42 PM
Perfect love casts out all fear. I'm sure there are fears that folks have that will be overcome as they mature in the Spirit. Shouldn't our fears(anxiety disorders) be relieved and overcome when we cast all our cares on Him, knowing He cares for us?
It doesn't say the bolded part above. Read it again.
"Perfect love casts out FEAR"...THAT is what it says. It never states that ALL fear will be cast out...
Just FYI.
Praxeas
06-14-2008, 09:45 PM
It doesn't say the bolded part above. Read it again.
"Perfect love casts out FEAR"...THAT is what it says. It never states that ALL fear will be cast out...
Just FYI.
I wonder though...what is the fear related to? Is it to someone living in fear that he might not be saved?
stmatthew
06-14-2008, 09:54 PM
Rom 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because [he eateth] not of faith: for whatsoever [is] not of faith is sin.
Praxeas
06-14-2008, 09:55 PM
Did Joie ever repent of NIV usage? :tic :toofunny :toofunny :toofunny
Kay B
06-14-2008, 10:19 PM
Many Veterans suffer from PTSD/PTSS. Is this a sin?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-traumatic_stress_disorder
Did Joie ever repent of NIV usage? :tic :toofunny :toofunny :toofunny
Oh yeahhhhhh! :blah I am much too occupied reading my NIV!
Prax... U would love it! You must get one!:girlytantrum
commonsense
06-14-2008, 10:42 PM
Why worry when you can pray
Trust Jesus he'll be your stay
Don't be a doubting Thomas
Rest fully on His promise ( my sister says While standing on his promise)
Why worry worry worry worry
When you can pray
Truthseeker
06-15-2008, 10:17 AM
I heard a bible teacher on the radio yesterday make a fairly convincing argument that anxiety can be a sin.
One of the reasons he gave was that it's rooted in unbelief ...
Not sure I entirely agree with his premise ... but thought I'd bring it up for discussion
What do you think? Is it? Can it ever be a sin?
Sure it's a sin because unbelief is sin. And in some cases a spirit at work.
Truthseeker
06-15-2008, 10:19 AM
Paul clearly details sins and the works of the flesh. Does he mention anxiety?
Does he mention cigarettes?
Michael The Disciple
06-15-2008, 11:04 AM
If fear and anxiety are one and the same:
8: But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. Rev. 21:8
One must overcome it if they wish to be saved.
OnTheFritz
06-15-2008, 12:21 PM
Sure it's a sin because unbelief is sin. And in some cases a spirit at work.
I think it can be, but this is a broad generalization. Anxiety is not always the same as unbelief.
RevDWW
06-15-2008, 12:52 PM
It doesn't say the bolded part above. Read it again.
"Perfect love casts out FEAR"...THAT is what it says. It never states that ALL fear will be cast out...
Just FYI.
1Jn 4:16 And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him.
1Jn 4:17 Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.
1Jn 4:18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.
1Jn 4:19 We love him, because he first loved us.
1Jn 4:20 If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?
1Jn 4:21 And this commandment have we from him, That he who loveth God love his brother also.
I believe the "all" is implied.
Truthseeker
06-15-2008, 04:08 PM
I think it can be, but this is a broad generalization. Anxiety is not always the same as unbelief.
OK define anxiety?
MissBrattified
06-15-2008, 04:32 PM
I have a hard time believing that any involuntary feeling or emotion could be called "sin."
:)
I think the Bible encourages us to trust in God, but I don't believe worry is a sin. It could be a symptom of not relying on God enough, and points to a hole in the Relationship that needs to be worked on.
Esther
06-15-2008, 05:16 PM
Is doubt a sin too?
I believe UNBELIEF is ...
Doubt is not necessarily unbelief
Sure it is!
I have a hard time believing that any involuntary feeling or emotion could be called "sin."
:)
I think the Bible encourages us to trust in God, but I don't believe worry is a sin. It could be a symptom of not relying on God enough, and points to a hole in the Relationship that needs to be worked on.
Would be great if my feelings and emotions were not voluntary.... I know I am allowing my feelings and emotions.:reaction
Was this sin?
Y0OYnBosRmQ
mizpeh
06-15-2008, 08:34 PM
Was this sin?
Y0OYnBosRmQ
Dan, by faith Jesus got over the anxiety He had exhibited in prayer in the garden. He didn't let the anxiety cripple His faith and cause Him to disobey the will of His Father through unbelief. He had the sentence of death in Himself and was resurrected just as He knew the OT scriptures said He would be.
Dan, by faith Jesus got over the anxiety He had exhibited in prayer in the garden. He didn't let the anxiety cripple His faith and cause Him to disobey the will of His Father through unbelief. He had the sentence of death in Himself and was resurrected just as the OT scriptures said He would be.
Agreed ... but some have said, even in this thread, that it is a sin... not just that it can be ...
If it is a sin then Jesus sinned.
RevDWW
06-15-2008, 09:06 PM
Was this sin?
Y0OYnBosRmQ
How could it be sin, if the Scripture says He knew no sin? IICor 5:21
Could it be that baseless fear or fear of the wrong thing is sin? Not all fear is evil nor is all faith righteous.
OnTheFritz
06-15-2008, 11:05 PM
OK define anxiety?
Definition:
1. feeling of worry: nervousness or agitation, often about something that is going to happen
2. something that worries somebody: a subject or concern that causes worry
3. strong wish to do something: the strong wish to do something, especially if the wish is unnecessarily or unhealthily strong
his anxiety to please
4. psychiatry extreme apprehension: a medical condition marked by intense apprehension or fear of real or imagined danger
----------------
And I will tell you this.... it is not necessarily a mental thing. I can completely rationalize something in the mind, and KNOW that there is nothing to worry about, yet still have feelings and symptoms of anxiety. I think unbelief is more of a conscious mental decision than an emotional response.
Truthseeker
06-16-2008, 06:23 AM
I have a hard time believing that any involuntary feeling or emotion could be called "sin."
:)
I think the Bible encourages us to trust in God, but I don't believe worry is a sin. It could be a symptom of not relying on God enough, and points to a hole in the Relationship that needs to be worked on.
Isn't worry a form of unbelief?
Sure it is!
Hummm
Doubt is a sin, isn't it?
He could be right.
Are you anixous about this? :gaga
Is doubt a sin too?
I believe UNBELIEF is ...
Doubt is not necessarily unbelief
Rom 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because [he eateth] not of faith: for whatsoever [is] not of faith is sin.
-----------------------------
From discussions at Synadelfos:
----------------------------
I submit that doubt is not the absence of hope - unbelief is. Hope leads us to the bridge to a place called faith.
Doubt .... means we're still open to the possibility of a miracle ... unbelief means we've closed up shop.
Let me explain.
You've been feeling really sick ... and You're sitting in the doctor's office and he's told you he has the results of your blood tests.
Which would you rather hear ....???
-------------------------------------------
Option A - Total Unbelief
Sir, or m'am ... we've looked at all the medical exams and you are going to die within 6 weeks. There is no hope.
or
Option B - Doubt .. Perhaps yes ... perhaps no
Sir ... we've looked at all the medical exams and it doesn't look good ... but there is a slight chance you can survive this ...
I'll take option B ... doubt ... it means there's still hope ...
Doubt is not the absence of faith ... it is a crossroads ... a choice to be made between unbelief or deeper faith.
The key is bringing our doubt to Jesus, our Hope. Bringing doubt and laying it down at the feet of the magnitude of our situation and allowing it to kill our hope will result in UNBELIEF.
Doubt is simply asking "What if".
Jesus can work w/ and around our doubt ... it's our unbelief that will condemn us.
------------------------------------------------------------------
Some Examples:
1. Jesus himself is our example of doubt. He struggled in the Garden of Gethsemane and on the cross he cried out, “My God, my God why have you forsaken me?”
He knew his mission was to die ... yet he asks if this cup could be passed ... is this not doubt?
Let's be continue to be honest about our doubts and to express them in the context of Christian community. Let's not be ashamed of our. Let's have the courage to share them with your sisters and brothers in the faith.
That's why the faith-based discussions we have on these forums are so vital. We have the chance to feed faith through the Word of God and our fellowship to one another. Faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the Word of God.
Many of us come from a culture where doubting is frowned upon ... asking faith based questions are stifled ... not being lock-step in what we believe is chastised.
Guess what?
--------------------------------------------------------------------
2. I've got doubts ... But like the man , in the book of Mark, who told Jesus just on the verge of a miraculous breakthrough .....
"I do believe; help me overcome my unbelief!"
Did Jesus stop in his tracks and say ... well if there's some doubt ... I can't give you what you want ... the deliverance of your demon-possessed son.
No ... he rewarded the measure of faith he did have.
Presbyterian minister, Frederick Buechner has a great definition of doubt: “Whether your faith is that there is a God or that there is not a God, if you don’t have any doubts, you are either kidding yourself, or asleep. Doubts are the ants in the pants of faith. They keep it awake and moving.
How many of us have doubted,at times that God will forgive us for the last thing we got mixed up in ... yet still ask for forgiveness. And yet he does ... despite our tinge of doubt.
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3. John the Baptist it seems doubted even for a brief moment that Jesus was the Christ, the Anointed One that was to come. John asked through his disciples "are you the One to come or should we expect someone else (Matthew 11:2)? Earlier he had emphatically declared that Christ was the One to come since he had seen the Spirit as a dove descend upon the Lord (John 1:33-34). There seems to be doubt in John's prison experience although he had declared "BEHOLD THE LAMB OF GOD ... WHO TAKES AWAY THE SINS ON MEN.
a) John knew Christ experientially. He lept in the womb. He saw the dove and heard the voice at the baptism. He publicly acknowledged his need of Christ.
b) However, in the lowest season of his life when he, a prophet of God, was falsely accused and imprisoned on the vengeful whim of an evil woman, he was filled with doubt. What had happened to the promise? Was he really the Christ or not?
c) The beauty of this passage is the response that Jesus had to John's doubt. He did not chastise him, rather he set the facts before him...again, without accusation. He also proceeded to publicly honor him and reinforce the reason for his calling.
Doubt does not set God against man, but rather "he was touched with the feelings of our infirmities, but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin..." Hebrews 4:15-16 Doubt sets us up to find answers, to find help in time of trouble, to find grace in time of need.
4. Consider the Old Testament. Judges 6:11-7:22
Remember the story of Gideon? How did the Lord respond to Gideon's doubt? He responded by providing for his need and his questions. God literally gave him the signs he requested: the supernaturally burnt offering, the angel face to face, the fleece (twice). The Lord also graciously allowed Gideon to fear and doubt when he was commanded to act: he allowed the surreptitious nighttime removal of the altar to Baal; he told Gideon to take his servant with him into the enemy camp (in case he was afraid and he was); he allowed him to overhear the dream which foretold his (Gideon's) victory.
Both of these recorded instances of man's doubt in the face of God's graciousness gives me hope the God will deal with me in the same manner. In my moments and seasons of doubt, he will and he has led me to find answers without condemnation. "For there is no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus..." Romans 8:1 Questions bring answers. "Seek and you shall find..."
Doubt is not a sin. It is a symptom in search of a diagnosis. Then the master surgeon can do his work in our lives.
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5. And it appears in context that some of the 11 disciples doubted His resurrection ... even when face to face w/ the Risen Lord and having worshipped Him.
Matthew 28 16-20
16 But the eleven disciples proceeded (P)to Galilee, to the mountain which Jesus had designated.
17 When they saw Him, they worshiped Him; but some were doubtful.
18 And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.
19" Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,
20 teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age."
Seems they doubted the Work of the Lamb in His Resurrection ... yet Jesus still commissions these doubt-filled men in the next few verses.
Notice Jesus meets the disciples on a mountain in Galilee where he had appointed to meet them. We can't necessarily infer that it was their first encounter w/ the Risen Lord since the Gospel narratives give various "conflicting" first appearances to the 11 disciples.
Matthew also tells us the rumors were circulating as to the disciples committing a fraud. The powers thay be paid soldiers to spread word that the disciples had stolen the body and that reports of the resurrection were false. The story of fraud was believed by many because Matthew says the rumor still persists when he wrote his Gospel.
The disciples meet Jesus ... and they worship him but some while worshipping .... DOUBT. We don't know why they doubted ... humans often can see things even in front of their own faces and still doubt ... or perhaps they had doubts because they knew that He would be leaving them soon ... NONETHELESS ... THEY ARE WORSHIPPING THE RISEN LORD W/ DOUBT.
What is Jesus reaction to this?????
Does he complain ... does he rebuke them? Does he ask for a time out?
He could've said ... "You guys have to be kidding me!!! I told you I would resurrect and you're seeing me w/ your own eyes and YOU STILL DOUBT!!!!"
No ... he persists to re-assure them ... telling them that ALL AUTHORITY HAD BEEN GIVEN TO HIM ... and that they had his authority to go ... make disciples, baptize and teach the Word.
6. Doubting Thomas
We ALL have a measure of faith, yet we also always, if you are HUMAN, wrestle with different levels or forms of doubt.
Thomas is given a bad rap for being a doubter, too. The term "DOUBTING THOMAS" has a negative connotation.
Simply because he asked "WHAT IF"??? Did Jesus condemn him because he needed to see to believe.
Thomas ....
He was open minded, in his doubt, that perhaps this was the Risen Lord. He just needed some proof. He was willing to believe something after examining the facts. A close minded person, unbeliever, would not even look at the facts or would just deny them.
Thomas was very much a believer even when he doubted. In a previous instance, Jesus has great admiration for Thomas.
The first story about Thomas we encounter is in chapter 11 of John. It is the story of Jesus’ raising Lazarus from the dead. Do you remember? Mary and Martha sent word to Jesus that their brother Lazarus was ill in Bethany. When Jesus got ready to go there the disciples threw a fit. They said, “Whoa Jesus. Don’t you remember the last time you were there you almost got stoned to death. And now you want us to go back there again. Jesus, don’t go there!”
Jesus told them flatly that Lazarus was no longer ill, but dead. Well if they were sort of thinking about risking their lives to go with Jesus to save a sick Lazarus, they sure weren’t going to risk their lives for a dead Lazarus.
In the midst of all this resistance, it is Thomas who speaks up and says to his fellow disciples, “Let us also go, that we may die with him.” To make such a statement required great faith in Jesus--and courage. Thomas was willing to lay down his life for Jesus. Why not call him Courageous Thomas instead of Doubting Thomas? Because of his courage, he and the disciples got to witness the miracle of Lazarus’ resurrection. Sort of makes you wonder why Thomas would have trouble with Jesus’ resurrection if he had witnessed the raising of Lazarus…. Yet he did.
What is Jesus reaction ???... definitely not the reaction we would have had w/ him ... or the disappointed religious stares we'd give him ...
There is no condemnation for his doubt rather Christ asks a fair question and acknowledges that Thomas DID BELIEVE.
All Jesus says:
Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here and see my hands, and bring your hand and put it into my side, and do not be unbelieving, but believe."
Thomas answered and said to him, "My Lord and my God!"
Jesus said to him, "Have you come to believe because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and have believed."
Thomas was honest about his doubt ... and when he brought his doubt to Jesus ... he's rewarded w/ the unprecedented honor of touching his side and his scarred hands. His doubt in the hands of the Master is transformed to faith in His Deity.
And yet the bible still tells us that w/o faith it is impossible to please God.
Please don't misconstrue my postings on this subject to be glorifying doubt (as one wouldn't glorify other emotions such as anger, depression)... I'm simply trying to define it ... and it's role in our life as believers. It can become hope and when we turn it over to Jesus .... he can place in us faith in Him... the conviction of things not seen .... the substance of things hoped for.
I just feel we don't see the benefit our having doubts .... and that we mistake doubt w/ unbelief.
Doubt still means there is a chance.
There are way too many Apostolics living this Spirit-filled walk w/ dour "GAME-FACE" expressions on their countenance trying to conceal their normal range of emotions as not to show their human frailties for fear of disapproval by their peers.
The truth is ... in our humanity we struggle w/ these things. Yet, the joy of the Lord is my strength ... in my weakness ... He is made strong.
God will not condemn us for our doubt and anxiety ... He simply asks, in his eternal Fatherly love, that we bring it to him .... casting our cares upon him.
We see the ultimate example of this when Jesus brings his doubts and anxieties in desperation to the Father at the Garden ... and even the cross.
Surely his doubt, anxiety, sadness, agony is not counted to him as sin ... since The Lamb was without sin or blemish.
Mark 16:16 (b) says .... but he that believes not (unbelief) shall be damned.
Aquila
01-15-2010, 10:53 AM
I don't think it is a sin. However, I do believe that it is spiritually unhealthy to be consumed with anxiety.
Jeffrey
01-15-2010, 10:58 AM
Unrepented sin can cause it, or continual distrust in Jesus -- can certainly lead to sin.
missourimary
01-15-2010, 11:43 AM
I've heard fear is sin, that due to verses like these:
1 John 4:18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.
Romans 8:15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
I disagree, but have heard the statement.
Timmy
01-15-2010, 11:51 AM
Oh, great. As if there aren't enough reasons to be afraid of God's wrath, now I have to worry about worrying!
:toofunny
Jeffrey
01-15-2010, 11:57 AM
Nothing to worry about at all. Just like the basketball player doesn't fret the rules and mechanics of the game. He just plays it. We just live it.
There are circumstances that cause anxiety, and it's important to know that's not God's will for us to have anxiety. It's not a "worry." It's a beautiful thing that He wants us to "cast all our cares upon Him."
You're on a roll lately.
missourimary
01-15-2010, 11:59 AM
I slipped right into that one... Pastor was saying something, and my response is (as figure of speech) "I'm afraid that..." Whew! I learned not to say that!!
Orthodoxy
01-15-2010, 12:18 PM
I believe anxiety is a sin....in fact, it is (unfortunately) one of my most besetting sins. Due to personal circumstances, I have been very prone to anxiety lately.
"Be anxious for nothing..." That sounds like a command to me. See also Matthew 6:25-34.
Simply because something may be hereditary or genetic, does not necessarily mean it is not sin. Some people may be more genetically prone to worry....or lust....or lose their temper....or murder. But that doesn't take them off the hook. We live in a cursed world, and our genetic temperaments are no exception.
To me personally, it is a command. I refuse to worry, be anxious, to whine to allow myself to truly believe.
There those who show others they are anxious and then their are those who lay in bed awake all night and are anxious. There are no others!
*AQuietPlace*
01-15-2010, 12:57 PM
"Be anxious for nothing..." That sounds like a command to me. See also Matthew 6:25-34.
I don't see that as a command. More of an encouragement.
Sister Alvear
01-15-2010, 01:02 PM
I don't see that as a command. More of an encouragement. amen!
I believe anxiety is a sin....in fact, it is (unfortunately) one of my most besetting sins. Due to personal circumstances, I have been very prone to anxiety lately.
"Be anxious for nothing..." That sounds like a command to me. See also Matthew 6:25-34.
Simply because something may be hereditary or genetic, does not necessarily mean it is not sin. Some people may be more genetically prone to worry....or lust....or lose their temper....or murder. But that doesn't take them off the hook. We live in a cursed world, and our genetic temperaments are no exception.
Make this note, 'Sin' is what will keep you out of the promise of heaven. Concepts such as what is in the book of Proverbs and scriptures such as what is being reviewed in this thread. They are designed for an example and for human growth, as one grows in their Christian experience it is a blessed thing to trust God. Having Anxiety and going through experiences that one needs to grow in faith and in their walk with God should not be considered Sin. We all know that to him that knoweth to good and doeth it not to him it is sin! Anxiety is a natural response and a human expression that gives us an outward and inward look at what we need to express to God in the time of trouble and need. If we literally never felt anxious many of us then would not need God.
missourimary
01-15-2010, 01:33 PM
There is a huge difference between the type of fear that says "I don't trust God" and the kind that says "stay away from the crumbly edge of that cliff", too.
AQP, Neck, very good posts! :thumbsup
KweenB
01-16-2010, 08:52 AM
Anxiety over a situation in your life IS NOT the same as an Anxiety Disorder. People with an Anxiety Disorder tend to catastrophize situations. It's not NORMAL worry. Some with Anxiety Disorder also experience the physical symptoms, but not the worry. Like the gut wrenching feeling in the stomach, shaking, sweating, etc.
Hoovie
01-16-2010, 05:15 PM
I wish I could say say I'm never anxious. I imagine anyone with a serious job has a load of anxiety from time to time. Being in business and working with the public can be stressful and the question often is not if it's there, but how much is there and whether I can effectively manage it.
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