Spanking, is it biblical?

[Truthseeker]

This is a shoot off from another thread, I just wanted to poll what others believe.

[DividedThigh]

of course it is, the non spankers cant just erase the plethora of scriptures from the ot, lol

[Sister Alvear]

spanking yes...beating no!

[Sister Alvear]

I don´t have a lot of time today but I think we should be balanced. Jesus taught us about balance. He rebukes those He loves...but He doesn´t leave them for dead...or half dead...lol..

[Digging4Truth]

I will have to watch this thread a while before answering.

My answer would have been yes for most of my life and I have used spanking in the raising of my children.

But I was a little surprised to find that old faithful "spare the rod, spoil the child" was not in scripture.

I would like to see how others feel about the "biblicalness" of the concept.

[Digging4Truth]

I don´t have a lot of time today but I think we should be balanced. Jesus taught us about balance. He rebukes those He loves...but He doesn´t leave them for dead...or half dead...lol..

Indeed...

I haven't spanked my children in a while. Of course they are good kids and don't find themselves in a position where they need one and they are all getting older now.

But... we do talk to them a lot about stuff. I am sure I am opening up myself for the rebuke of some on this forum but...

The last few times we found ourselves in a situation that would call for a spanking we began as we always do... that is... we began by discussing what was done... why we do not do that... where in the Bible it speaks to this action... and how those scriptures should affect our actions if we are Christians.

During the course of the discussion/Bible Study that precedes any further punishment there was a true sense of repentance in the room. I (calmly and systematically... not with anger or loud communication) demonstrated with scripture why this is against the nature and spirit of our God and my child broke down in repentance.

To me... there is no spanking that will fix what a true spirit of repentance will fix.

Now... some of you may call me gullible but I am not. My kids ALWAYS cry when they are about to get a spanking... but I have found that these sessions where we discuss and point out the reason why we don't do these things and the scriptures that show us God's nature coupled with the fact that our goal as Christians is to emulate that nature will, often, bring about a spirit of repentance in their own spirit.

I have not seen a repeat offense of any of these issues which I have dealt with in this fashion

[MissBrattified]

spanking yes...beating no!

Thank you!!! We agree. On the other thread, it sounded like leaving bruises and stripes was being heartily endorsed as appropriate discipline.

[Timmy]

of course it is, the non spankers cant just erase the plethora of scriptures from the ot, lol

Some don't even try. :whistle

[MissBrattified]

Indeed...

I haven't spanked my children in a while. Of course they are good kids and don't find themselves in a position where they need one and they are all getting older now.

But... we do talk to them a lot about stuff. I am sure I am opening up myself for the rebuke of some on this forum but...

The last few times we found ourselves in a situation that would call for a spanking we began as we always do... that is... we began by discussing what was done... why we do not do that... where in the Bible it speaks to this action... and how those scriptures should affect our actions if we are Christians.

During the course of the discussion/Bible Study that precedes any further punishment there was a true sense of repentance in the room. I (calmly and systematically... not with anger or loud communication) demonstrated with scripture why this is against the nature and spirit of our God and my child broke down in repentance.

To me... there is no spanking that will fix what a true spirit of repentance will fix.

Now... some of you may call me gullible but I am not. My kids ALWAYS cry when they are about to get a spanking... but I have found that these sessions where we discuss and point out the reason why we don't do these things and the scriptures that show us God's nature coupled with the fact that our goal as Christians is to emulate that nature will, often, bring about a spirit of repentance in their own spirit.

I have not seen a repeat offense of any of these issues which I have dealt with in this fashion

Good post.

Our kids also get more leniency when they are truthful the first time they are asked about something. Especially if they are obviously sorry about it. Now, that doesn't mean there aren't any consequences at all--if they've hurt someone else, they have to make it right. But if discipline is about bringing about repentance and a change in behavior, then there are many ways to get there other than, and often better than, spanking.

[Digging4Truth]

Could someone list some of these scriptures?

[Digging4Truth]

Good post.

Our kids also get more leniency when they are truthful the first time they are asked about something. Especially if they are obviously sorry about it. Now, that doesn't mean there aren't any consequences at all--if they've hurt someone else, they have to make it right. But if discipline is about bringing about repentance and a change in behavior, then there are many ways to get there other than, and often better than, spanking.

Yes ma'am...

And we all know that there is no hard and fast way that fits every situation. But a good parent knows what brings real change in their kids lives and pursues those avenues.

In my mind I am not there, necessarily, for the purpose of punishment. Punishment may well come into the pictures.... but I am there to bring change in their hearts and minds about what they just did.

[Pragmatist]

There are no scriptures for spanking and I'd like to know if anyone literally beats their child with a rod, because that's what the Bible says.

[Digging4Truth]

There are no scriptures for spanking and I'd like to know if anyone literally beats their child with a rod, because that's what the Bible says.

Could you list the scripture(s) you are speaking of?

[MissBrattified]

of course it is, the non spankers cant just erase the plethora of scriptures from the ot, lol

Plethora? That's something of an exaggeration. I can find a plethora of scriptures about parenting, and Christian principles that should guide them--but not a plethora about spanking.

The overall gist of scripture is to treat children fairly, to give them good things, to love them unconditionally, to be merciful and compassionate, and to treat the "little ones" with extra care. To bring them up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord.

Nurture - paideia...tutorage, that is, education or training; by implication disciplinary correction: - chastening, chastisement, instruction, nurture.

Admonition - nouthesia...calling attention to, that is, (by implication) mild rebuke or warning: - admonition.

The problem is often parents who don't pay attention to their kids until they're REALLY being bad--and then they spank the fire out of them. All well and good--but it would be better if you would supervise them more, and guide them on a more constant basis, instead of waiting until they really misbehave to set them back in line.

[Digging4Truth]

Plethora? That's something of an exaggeration. I can find a plethora of scriptures about parenting, and Christian principles that should guide them--but not a plethora about spanking.

The overall gist of scripture is to treat children fairly, to give them good things, to love them unconditionally, to be merciful and compassionate, and to treat the "little ones" with extra care. To bring them up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord.

Nurture - paideia...tutorage, that is, education or training; by implication disciplinary correction: - chastening, chastisement, instruction, nurture.

Admonition - nouthesia...calling attention to, that is, (by implication) mild rebuke or warning: - admonition.

Excellent...

The problem is often parents who don't pay attention to their kids until they're REALLY being bad--and then they spank the fire out of them. All well and good--but it would be better if you would supervise them more, and guide them on a more constant basis, instead of waiting until they really misbehave to set them back in line.

Now this is one of my pet peeves. I see parents who don't spank their kids because they did wrong... they spank them because their children made them angry and they are mad.

The child may have done the same thing a dozen times but THIS TIME... it made mama or daddy mad and WHAP!!!!

There must be consistency or nothing is learned. How is the kid to know what was wrong when you let them do it a dozen times and then exploded on them because you are in a bad mood right now?

[MissBrattified]

Could you list the scripture(s) you are speaking of?

Truthseeker brought up these:

Proverbs 20:30 "The blueness of a wound cleanseth away evil: so do stripes the inward parts of the belly."

Proverbs 23:13-14 "Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die...Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell."

I don't have a problem with 23:13...I agree with the principle--discipline is a necessary component of good parenting. Without it, children do not know where the boundaries are, and they will become confused, among other things. However, I don't think that OT values are necessarily NT values, and recommendations in Proverbs need to be tempered with NT mercy.

It does bother me, however, that Proverbs 20:30 was even brought into the conversation. Really? The blueness of a wound? Stripes? We do not need to be beating children to the point of bruising or bloody "stripes." Ever. Under any circumstances. It's barbaric and unchristian. Just my never-humble opinion, of course.

Blueness - chabbûrâh ...properly bound (with stripes), that is, a weal (or black and blue mark itself): - blueness, bruise, hurt, stripe, wound.

Stripes - makkâh...a blow (in 2Ch_2:10, of the flail); by implication a wound; figuratively carnage, also pestilence: - beaten, blow, plague, slaughter, smote, X sore, stripe, stroke, wound ([-ed]).

These are pretty stringent terms, and have no place in reference to parenting a child.

[Pragmatist]

Could you list the scripture(s) you are speaking of?

Proverbs 23:14
Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell


Proverbs 23:13
Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die

These are the scriptures that people use that IMO are misinterpreted. First of all Proverbs are not commandments. Second, the word rod can mean symbol of authority and beat can be interpreted as "the sun beat down on him." So I would take the above scriptures to mean your authority should be a continual presence in the life of your child.

[Ron]

Pro 22:15 Foolishness is bound in the heart of a child; but the rod of correction shall drive it far from him.

Yup, it is Biblical.
While I agree with spanking, it isn't administered every day in every way.
My kids were taught what would cause a spanking so they understand the parameters.

Now, some punishment can be a grounding or withholding privileges like video games & computer time.

We got through to them when they were young that listening to mom & dad was the best way.

I dread when they become teanagers!

[Pragmatist]

Excellent...



Now this is one of my pet peeves. I see parents who don't spank their kids because they did wrong... they spank them because their children made them angry and they are mad.

The child may have done the same thing a dozen times but THIS TIME... it made mama or daddy mad and WHAP!!!!

There must be consistency or nothing is learned. How is the kid to know what was wrong when you let them do it a dozen times and then exploded on them because you are in a bad mood right now?

And I see the above so often in church.

[Cindy]

There are no scriptures for spanking and I'd like to know if anyone literally beats their child with a rod, because that's what the Bible says.

I saw somewhere that the "rod" is actually what we would call a switch. And it does usually leave red marks, but does not bruise. BTW it was a Rabbi speaking.

[Ron]

I have seen it where parents didn't spank thier kids when they were young!
Thier kids are disasters.

I fault my mom for drinking, not being there, and for some of the loser boyfriends she brought home.
I do not fault her for the spankings I got even though she broke rulers & spoons on me!

[Digging4Truth]

Pro 22:15 Foolishness is bound in the heart of a child; but the rod of correction shall drive it far from him.

Yup, it is Biblical.
While I agree with spanking, it isn't administered every day in every way.
My kids were taught what would cause a spanking so they understand the parameters.

Now, some punishment can be a grounding or withholding privileges like video games & computer time.

We got through to them when they were young that listening to mom & dad was the best way.

I dread when they become teanagers!

Great post.

In the years when i spanked my children I would do my VERY best to make sure that, before spanking them on ANY offense, that I know for sure that I have taught them on the subject first.

If my child did something wrong I would stop and think... Have I sat down with them and taught them that this is wrong and why we believe it is wrong? If I haven't then I won't spank them on that offense. After teaching them... then... if they do it again... now we may be looking at a spanking.

When I do have to spank them I inform them that spanking is only for children who cannot change their behavior by hearing words alone. I will tell them "When you reach them point that you can make changes in your behavior simply because of hearing my words then spanking will be a thing of the past for you"

When it does come to spanking I can honestly tell them that we have discussed this before and I had pre-warned them that if they could not hear and heed my words then we would have to use another form of punishment.

As my children get older they hear and heed my words better and the spanking is something that we don't see happen much anymore.

Also... if I am angry... the spanking will have to wait. I do all I can to not spank in anger or while angry

[Digging4Truth]

I have seen it where parents didn't spank thier kids when they were young!
Thier kids are disasters.

Where there is no discipline & teaching the results are disastrous.

While I am not wholesale against spanking (I have spanked my own) I do not hold to any belief that spanking is a requirement for good children. Good discipling & teaching of children can go far.

But very few know how to really teach their children and mentor them.

[ILG]

Spanking is biblical, if it is done in love, and not in ager and if the child is really out of line of his own misbehavior.

[DividedThigh]

when i was first married moons ago, my brother in law and sister, a pastor by the way would not spank there kids, victims of dr spock, i think. When the kids got 6 and 8 and were out of control they decided to spank, it was too late, dt

[Pragmatist]

Not spanking does not equal permissive.

[Digging4Truth]

Not spanking does not equal permissive.

Agreed...

[DividedThigh]

i does not equal disciplined well behaved either, dt

[MissBrattified]

i does not equal disciplined well behaved either, dt

Of course not. There must be SOME discipline, or children will not behave. My only point is that spanking does not have to be the main component of that discipline, or even a component at all.

Consistency is WAY more important than methodology.

[Michael Phelps]

of course it is, the non spankers cant just erase the plethora of scriptures from the ot, lol

Just curious about this "plethora" of scriptures, DT........I only know of the one that speaks of sparing the rod.......

[nahkoe]

Not spanking does not equal permissive.

Exactly. There's still discipline and guidance and instruction and teaching and consequences (natural and imposed).

[Truthseeker]

http://www.christian-parents.net/Children/C101_Police_Officer.htm

[Sister Alvear]

There are many good Bible studies and books today...years ago all we older folks knew was to raise them with the Bible and the switch...ha..

[mfblume]

Proverbs 13:24 He that spareth his rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes.

Proverbs 22:15 Foolishness is bound in the heart of a child; but the rod of correction shall drive it far from him.

Proverbs 23:13-14 Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die. (14) Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell.

Proverbs 29:15 The rod and reproof give wisdom: but a child left to himself bringeth his mother to shame.

[rgcraig]

In light of the "wearing red" thread I'm going to refrain from posting what I keep thinking of when I see this title.

[MissBrattified]

Oh, no, Renda. :bolt

[Ron]

I know God definitely believes in spanking!
I have been out to the woodshed more than once with God!

Or am I the only one!

[rgcraig]

I know God definitely believes in spanking!
I have been out to the woodshed more than once with God!

Or am I the only one!

Yeah, that's what I meant.

[Pressing-On]

Yeah, that's what I meant.

I know. It's just a very spiritual matter, IMO. :whistle

[Ron]

Yeah, that's what I meant.

That I am the only one?:whistle

[Sister Alvear]

I think most of us has made that trip...woodshed = pain...