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View Full Version : Glory to God or Glory to the Doctrine


Praxeas
06-25-2009, 06:13 PM
When God does a miracle through one of us (Oneness), how do we view that? Confirmation we have the truth? Do we just give God the glory or do we use it as a banner to proclaim we have the truth and everyone else does not?

Do you believe non OP's experience miracles from God?

Arphaxad
06-25-2009, 06:18 PM
When God does a miracle through one of us (Oneness), how do we view that? Confirmation we have the truth? Do we just give God the glory or do we use it as a banner to proclaim we have the truth and everyone else does not?

Do you believe non OP's experience miracles from God?

i don't know about we, but i give God all the glory.

non op's experience miracles from God.

:doggyrun

Praxeas
06-25-2009, 06:23 PM
Maybe I should change the title to "Do miracles confirm our doctrine?"

OnTheFritz
06-25-2009, 06:50 PM
Maybe I should change the title to "Do miracles confirm our doctrine?"

I think they cofirm that we are on the right track, but not that we are the only ones.

Sam
06-25-2009, 07:50 PM
Miracles do not confirm OP doctrine.
Miracles have been happening for centuries in response to faith.
These miracles happen in many different religious groups with a variety of doctrine.

Michael The Disciple
06-25-2009, 08:56 PM
Miracles can confirm true doctrine. They can also be a catylist for guiding us into more truth.

TJJJ
06-25-2009, 09:52 PM
When God does a miracle through one of us (Oneness), how do we view that? Confirmation we have the truth? Do we just give God the glory or do we use it as a banner to proclaim we have the truth and everyone else does not?

Do you believe non OP's experience miracles from God?

Excellent thread!

I do believe that miracles can fall upon a diverse kind of people, oneness and others as well! That confirms faith, not doctrine.

Sad to say, the more conservative the doctrine, the less they believe in the miraculous. I've seen it a lot in traveling.

Hoovie
06-25-2009, 10:08 PM
Miracles confirm that faith was preached perhaps - not sure how much more.

I believe miracles happen, but I am skeptical of all claims whether made by OP's or others.

TJJJ
06-25-2009, 10:22 PM
Miracles confirm that faith was preached perhaps - not sure how much more.

I believe miracles happen, but I am skeptical of all claims whether made by OP's or others.

Steve, you're not from Missouri are you? (Show me state)

crakjak
06-25-2009, 10:26 PM
When God does a miracle through one of us (Oneness), how do we view that? Confirmation we have the truth? Do we just give God the glory or do we use it as a banner to proclaim we have the truth and everyone else does not?

Do you believe non OP's experience miracles from God?

We should give glory to God, yes, both OP's and non OP's experience miracles, as God wills.

A.W. Bowman
06-25-2009, 10:35 PM
Matthew 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works [G1411]?

G1411 from 1410; force (literally or figuratively); specially, miraculous power (usually by implication, a miracle itself):--ability, abundance, meaning, might(-ily, -y, -y deed), (worker of) miracle(-s), power, strength, violence, mighty (wonderful) work.

Not to mention false teachers, prophets and even miracle working demons.

Miracles are to confirm the gospel, not doctrine. Signs follow "believers", not approved teaching. Too many have anchored their salvation to what they believe (doctrine) rather than in whom they believe (Jesus) - performance vs. faith, and being confident in one's self righteousness (spiritual pride) vs. spiritual relationship (walking humbly before God).

Those who look to signs, wonders, and miracles as proof of a spiritual truth will the among the first to fall for the great deception of the false prophet and coming antichrist. It's past time to leave the shows, performances, and glitz behind (not discarded, but put into their proper place and perspective) and get on with establishing a close, personal relationship with Christ, Himself!

The biggest hinderance to developing this kind of spiritual relationship rests with the church leadership. Those who spend more time making disciples of men unto them selves rather than they do for Jesus. This approach to "doing church" keeps the focus on men such as preachers, ministers, workers of signs and wonders, etc., resulting in the glorifying of God's agents rather than in glorifying God. I am of pastor so-n-so, and another is of preacher or teacher "reverend wonderful person" - carnal men one and all.

It is the attitude of "God is in this place, now if you want something from God, come to me (do as I say). I am the authorized intermediary between you and God."

Final note: Be careful of signs, wonders and miracles - like the sign of speaking in tongues, they can all be counterfeited. Rather, look for the fruit of the Spirit in a person when he/she is under great pressure/stress - and the signs, wonders and miracles that attend to him and/or to those about him. In such a demonstration of God's grace and provision one will find the confirmation of the true Spirit within.

------------

I am a firm believer in signs, wonders, and miracles. I have been both the recipient as well as an agent through which some of these events have occurred - but I do not put my trust in any of them, but in Jesus Christ alone.

OneAccord
06-26-2009, 06:00 AM
One of the biggest mistakes I have ever seen ministers, churches and/or organizations make is when they imply "miracles" somehow validate their ministry or doctrine. I'm reminded of men like A. A. Allen who built great ministries and promoted themselves through the purported miracles that took place in their ministries. Miracles, according to Jesus, validates one thing: Truth. Now, we often say "truth" and "doctrine" are one and the same. But thats not necessarily the case. Doctrine is, or at least is suppose to be, the vehicle thru which truth is conveyed.

In Mark 16, Jesus said certain signs will follow them that believe (truth). The narravtive goes on to say that the Word was confirmed by signs "following the believers". Miracles confirm, not a ministry, church or organization, but rather the Word of God. Miracles do not vindicate who is right or who is wrong. Miracles vindicate the Word. It proves the authenticity of the truth being spoken- no matter who is speaking that truth. A preacher may be preaching the truth regarding faith- God honors that preaching because in that area, the speaker is speaking truth. He may be "off" on other doctrinal areas, but when truth is spoken, God honors truth. Miracles do not necessarily "OPs" are correct in all areas of doctrine any more than a non OP is proven correct by the occurence of miracles in their services. God honors faith- whether that faith is exhibited by a conservative OP, or by a liberal trinitarian.

We would do well to remember Peters words in Acts 3:12: "Ye men of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why LOOK YE SO EARNESTLY ON US, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk?" The lame man walked, not by Peter, but through and by the Name of Jesus. Peter preached truth in Acts 2, and God confirmed that truth in Acts 3. And that truth isn't found only in 2:38. That is but a portion of the truth. I believe we fail to see great miracles in our midst because we attempt to share God's glory by implying OUR doctrine or OUR organization produced the miracle. This wan't the case with Peter. In Acts 3 he was clear as to Who perfoms the miraclous- Jesus. Gos doesn't heal to prove "us" ...He does so to prove HIM.

A.W. Bowman
06-26-2009, 07:38 AM
We would do well to remember Peters words in Acts 3:12: "Ye men of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why LOOK YE SO EARNESTLY ON US, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk?" ... Go[d] doesn't heal to prove "us" ...He does so to prove HIM.

Yes! Thanks for the rest of the post too!

*AQuietPlace*
06-26-2009, 08:34 AM
In my circles, I've never experienced that mindset. God is given the glory. I've also never heard it denied that other denominations receive miracles.