Post-Initial Ecstatic Utterances

[Hoovie]

I understand many Pentecostals look for tongues from new converts seeing it as a sign of the Holy Spirit's indwelling. But what about the impromptu outbursts of ecstatic utterance in church services?

Tongues... what really does it mean, or should it mean, when we hear tongues uttered? Often it is with great emphasis - even blasted through the microphone.

Do you value a statement more highly when it contains an explosive exclamation in tongues? Is it then spoken with greater credibility or veracity?

[freeatlast]

Nope

[nahkoe]

Do you value a statement more highly when it contains an explosive exclamation in tongues? Is it then spoken with greater credibility or veracity?

No. As a matter of fact, I tend to regard any such preaching with much caution and am more likely to dismiss it completely than sort out what's for real and what's not.

Is it spoken with greater credibility and veracity? Definitely. But that doesn't mean it actually should be.

[Hoovie]

No. As a matter of fact, I tend to regard any such preaching with much caution and am more likely to dismiss it completely than sort out what's for real and what's not.

Is it spoken with greater credibility and veracity? Definitely. But that doesn't mean it actually should be.

I guess one could say it is spoken as if it had greater credibility... by the tone and inflection, and of course the assumption that it is divine...

[Sam]

The way I understand chapters 12, 13, and 14 tongues are to be interpreted into a known language if spoken to a group of people. Tongues or a "prayer language" if not interpreted is to be used for private prayer and worship between an individual and his God.

Some times a person will rejoice in the Lord and speak a phrase or two or maybe a few words in tongues while testifying or preaching. Sis Nona Freeman does this. She will be teaching/preaching, then pause and say a few words in her prayer language, and then continue on with her message. Going strictly by the letter of 1 Corinthians this could be considered "out of order" but who is going to "correct" this old veteran of the cross, and what does it really hurt?

[A.W. Bowman]

I have found that although not obeyed in many churches, the following works very well for me.

1 Corinthians 14:18 I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all:
19 Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue.
20 Brethren, be not children in understanding: howbeit in malice be ye children, but in understanding be men.(men: Gr. perfect, or, of a ripe age)
21 In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me , saith the Lord .
22 Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe .
23 If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad? [Note: Not much help to your witness, is it?]
Now, this one I love:
24 But if all prophesy, and there come in one that believeth not, or one unlearned, he is convinced of all, he is judged of all:
25 And thus are the secrets of his heart made manifest; and so falling down on his face he will worship God, and report that God is in you of a truth.
26 How is it then, brethren when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine [teaching, sermon], hath a tongue [known or unknown], hath a revelation [insight], hath an interpretation [of an unknown tongue]. Let all things be done unto edifying. [Note: You will not find these things being practiced by the general congregation very often either.]
27 If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three , and that by course; and let one interpret .(two…: by two or three sentences separately)
28 But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.
29 Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge.
30 If any thing be revealed to another that sitteth by, let the first hold his peace.
31 For ye may all prophesy one by one, that all may learn, and all may be comforted .
32 And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets.
33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.(confusion: Gr. tumult, or, unquietness)

------------

One should wonder why we still follow after all of our religious traditions in our church services, rather than following these simple instructions to the assembled congregation. However, I can understand one common why not - because in such an assembly the pastor would have nothing to do.

[Sherri]

It doesn't bother me if someone does it while preaching, but I think sometimes it's almost like a "filler" between sentences. I think preaching should be done in English, because it's exhorting and people don't understand the tongues. JMHO. It's not something that's done in our church, mainly because Eddie is much more of a teacher style than preacher.

[PraiseHymn]

I personally dont feel it has any effect on the message because the person might just very well received a breakthrough from their own sermon. For instance, when I lead praise and worship, I'd say 98% of the time I exhort in English however when the power of God starts to fall during a song, I myself go off in tongues at times. I'm just getting mine (so to speak). The way I see it, with all the "pouring out" leaders do, you need to edify yourself (1 Corinthians 14:4) during your own preaching.

[Hoovie]

I personally dont feel it has any effect on the message because the person might just very well received a breakthrough from their own sermon. For instance, when I lead praise and worship, I'd say 98% of the time I exhort in English however when the power of God starts to fall during a song, I myself go off in tongues at times. I'm just getting mine (so to speak). The way I see it, with all the "pouring out" leaders do, you need to edify yourself (1 Corinthians 14:4) during your own preaching.

But is that really what Corinthians 14 is instructing us to do? Not saying one may not want to speak in tongues... but what we want and what God wants is not alwayas the same - including speaking in tongues...

Now there is a message I never heard preached! :nah

[Sept5SavedTeen]

My pastor doesn't speak in tongues while he is teaching or exhorting... If he did, it should get interpretted. We have two sisters who may give a message in tongues and it then gets interpretted. There is one sister, from a UPC assembly, who speaks in tongues sometimes sort of loudly during worship, but the LORD is working on her I guess... If I am speaking in the prayer language, then it is no louder than, perhaps someone standing right next to me might hear, but I'm not usually that loud about it, because I don't want to be a distraction.

-Bro. Alex

[Pressing-On]

I Cor 14 is showing the church, in Corinthians, that there are other operations in the Spirit. He is not, in any way, instructing anyone NOT to speak in tongues. If he was, he wouldn't have said, ".... He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself".

Paul goes on to show them there is more to edifying yourself, in the Spirit. God also wants to speak to the church.

I would be very unhappy with anyone in my church leadership or assembly to take a view much as I Th 5:19 admonishes against - quenching the spirit.

There are saints that need instruction on how to operate in and how to be sensitive to the operation and moving of the Spirit.

When the Word says, Romans 8:26 "Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered."

Sometimes we do this collectively and other times during our private prayer time. Other times, God wants to speak to his people through a particular vessel, for that moment.

Quench not the Spirit!

[Timmy]

Do some preachers substitute tongues for uh's and um's? ;)

[Sam]

Do some preachers substitute tongues for uh's and um's? ;)

probably.

some also use gasps and loud "uh"s after each phrase.

[Jermyn Davidson]

I don't think it to be the will of God for someone to speak in tongues into the microphone UNLESS they are convinced by God that the interpretation is forthcoming.

I think this practice takes away from the sermon on two fronts.

For one who has a knowledge of scripture, they know that the Bible lays the groundwork for public tongues and this practice fall outside of the Biblical groundwork established.

For the unsaved who has not been exposed to this before hand, they may just write it off as something weird or worse.

[Hoovie]

Please vote.

What? No takers for the first two options? I am surprised.

[RandyWayne]

I don't think it to be the will of God for someone to speak in tongues into the microphone UNLESS they are convinced by God that the interpretation is forthcoming.

I think this practice takes away from the sermon on two fronts.

For one who has a knowledge of scripture, they know that the Bible lays the groundwork for public tongues and this practice fall outside of the Biblical groundwork established.

For the unsaved who has not been exposed to this before hand, they may just write it off as something weird or worse.

When a traveling minister speaking in tongues into the mike, I always wonder if he does the same thing at the same time at every stop on his tour.

[berkeley]

Seriously, you guys do know that the gasps, the uhs and the ahs are because the preacher has built a momentum and is gasping for air????

[Hoovie]

Seriously, you guys do know that the gasps, the uhs and the ahs are because the preacher has built a momentum and is gasping for air????

sometimes and sometimes it's just habit. But that is a bit off topic...

[shag]

I dont feel that the apostles bounced in and out of tongues in the book of when preaching. If they did, its not recorded that I'm aware of.

Nowadays, I feel like many folks(in audience)in their mind kinda view it as "ya know God was really in that because of all that tongue talking...he cant hardly hold it back". I also believe that there are many preachers that throw in some tongues to sorta let the folks like I just described, know that the preached word they're receiving is a definate word of God, because the interuption of tongues in it.

That said, if I hear it a little tongues in the message, it doesnt really bother me because Im so use to it. But when its more than just a little, it has at times made me wonder if its neceesary at all. I think God can speak powerfully annointed without any tongues to prove it to be so.

I realize according to many preachers, the Spirit moves, and the tongues are just there. I dont wanna say anything negative of that being the case, I think it would be wrong of me since I've not been in that circumstance. But I'm only saying I believe some put it out there to convince listeners that Gods annointing is in it.

I cannot vote, because I have to vote for 3 and 4, not one or the other. :nah

[Hoovie]

But Shaggy, does scripture make room for a "little" tongue speaking while in public address to the assembly? Or is it prohibted in that venue unless interrupeted? Is it about personal preference or does Corinthians address this?

[mfblume]

Some preachers purposely speak in tongues when they are about to say something they want every one to consider as God-sent and nothing less. I disagree with that tactic.

[mfblume]

I don't think it to be the will of God for someone to speak in tongues into the microphone UNLESS they are convinced by God that the interpretation is forthcoming.

I think this practice takes away from the sermon on two fronts.

For one who has a knowledge of scripture, they know that the Bible lays the groundwork for public tongues and this practice fall outside of the Biblical groundwork established.

For the unsaved who has not been exposed to this before hand, they may just write it off as something weird or worse.

Amen. Man, you post a lot of good opinions.

1 Corinthians 14:18-23 KJV (18) I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all: (19) Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue. (20) Brethren, be not children in understanding: howbeit in malice be ye children, but in understanding be men. (21) In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord. (22) Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe. (23) If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?

[HopePreacher]

A couple of things we need to remember about 1 Corinthians 14; first, it was the early days of the church and people were just getting acquainted with folks speaking in tongues. On the day of Pentecost a bunch of people were speaking in tongues at one time; At Cornelius's house they all spoke in tongues as at the beginning. Were those folks out of order? I don't think so.

The rules laid down by Paul for the Corinthians was good common sense instructions in an environment where the Christian faith was new and speaking in tongues was a little understood phenomona.

I happen to believe that the rules he laid down, though they were specifically for that church, are good guidelines to follow. However, they are not laws hewn in stone.

[Esther]

I believe when the man of God is moved on mightly by the Holy Ghost it is only natural for him to speak in tongues lest he quinch the Spirit.

I think some folks make to much of every little thing. JMO

As to ministers actually doing this to make a point, I would have to wonder IF they are truly speaking in tongues. But the Bible talks about the discerning of spirits, I think that is lacking in today's church. Otherwise, these types of questions would not need to be asked. I am not saying that SH shouldn't ask the question, as it is obvisiously an area with some questions.

I could not respond to the poll, it was to vague for me.

I believe I should have a witness of the spirit if it is of God.

[Pressing-On]

I believe when the man of God is moved on mightly by the Holy Ghost it is only natural for him to speak in tongues lest he quench the Spirit.

I think some folks make to much of every little thing. JMO

As to ministers actually doing this to make a point, I would have to wonder IF they are truly speaking in tongues. But the Bible talks about the discerning of spirits, I think that is lacking in today's church. Otherwise, these types of questions would not need to be asked. I am not saying that SH shouldn't ask the question, as it is obviously an area with some questions.

I could not respond to the poll, it was to vague for me.

I believe I should have a witness of the spirit if it is of God.
We are on the same page! I like that!! :thumbsup

[Sam]

If what is said in tongues is not interpreted, the speaker should not continue to speak with tongues publicly but should speak to himself and to God. That is my understanding of what is taught in 1 Corinthians chapter 14. It is also the reason that an individual praying in tongues is said to be using a "devotional tongue" or to be using his "prayer language."

[Pressing-On]

If what is said in tongues is not interpreted, the speaker should not continue to speak with tongues publicly but should speak to himself and to God. That is my understanding of what is taught in 1 Corinthians chapter 14. It is also the reason that an individual praying in tongues is said to be using a "devotional tongue" or to be using his "prayer language."

Praying loudly in tongues, out of order and not following the tone nor the move of the Spirit during a service is what I believe Paul is speaking of.

You cannot randomly go off in tongues if that is not the tone set by the Spirit for that particular service. When the Spirit moves on you, you need to check yourself, feel after the move of God for that service to decide which way to go with it.

Are people on this thread suggesting that no one is to ever speak in tongues outside of tongues and interpretation in any given service?

[Sam]

When a traveling minister speaking in tongues into the mike, I always wonder if he does the same thing at the same time at every stop on his tour.

Someone on one of these forums told about a pastor who was looking at an evangelist's sermon notes. At one point there was a notation, "cry here." I think that revival session was cut short. I wonder if some ministers have a notation in their sermon notes that would say, "shout here" or "speak with tongues here" like that evangelist had a notation which said, "cry here."

[Sam]

[QUOTE=Pressing-On;766075
...
Are people on this thread suggesting that no one is to ever speak in tongues outside of tongues and interpretation in any given service?[/QUOTE]

I don't think so.

If a group of people are praying out loud all at the same time, a person could be praying in tongues and it would just blend in with the sound. This could be while people are standing in a service or could be in a prayer room setting or a group praying together at the altar. The key would be that nobody is trying to pray in a voice louder than the others in order to draw attention to himself.

If a person has hands laid on him/her to receive the Holy Ghost Baptism, it is expected that the person would speak with tongues. This would not need to be interpreted because the person receiving the experience would not be speaking to others. Also, the utterance in tongues might be understood by someone there like on the Day of Pentecost in Acts chapter 2.

The admonition to speak to himself and to God could be fulfilled any time a person is praying alone. One could spend some or all of his personal prayer time praying in his prayer language. In my opinion this would be "praying in the Spirit" and prayer in the person's known language would be "praying with the understanding." It is my opinion that the Apostle Paul prayed both ways and that is what he is referencing in 1 Corinthians chapter 14.

Also, there might be times of spontaneous ejaculation where people in an audience may say "Praise the Lord" or "hallelujah" or "thank You, Jesus" and some might speak a word or two in tongues.

Also, anytime a person is praying or interceding silently or inaudibly during a service or in a public setting, this could be in tongues because it would not be heard by people around them. This was the type praying Hannah was doing (ref 1 Samual chapter 1). Her lips were moving as she poured out her heart to God but her voice was inaudible. This could be done in a known language or in a prayer language.

[Pressing-On]

I don't think so.

If a group of people are praying out loud all at the same time, a person could be praying in tongues and it would just blend in with the sound. This could be while people are standing in a service or could be in a prayer room setting or a group praying together at the altar. The key would be that nobody is trying to pray in a voice louder than the others in order to draw attention to himself.

If a person has hands laid on him/her to receive the Holy Ghost Baptism, it is expected that the person would speak with tongues. This would not need to be interpreted because the person receiving the experience would not be speaking to others. Also, the utterance in tongues might be understood by someone there like on the Day of Pentecost in Acts chapter 2.

The admonition to speak to himself and to God could be fulfilled any time a person is praying alone. One could spend some or all of his personal prayer time praying in his prayer language. In my opinion this would be "praying in the Spirit" and prayer in the person's known language would be "praying with the understanding." It is my opinion that the Apostle Paul prayed both ways and that is what he is referencing in 1 Corinthians chapter 14.

Also, there might be times of spontaneous ejaculation where people in an audience may say "Praise the Lord" or "hallelujah" or "thank You, Jesus" and some might speak a word or two in tongues.
Thank you, Sam. Your post is very self-explanatory and I agree with - almost - every point.

I never agree with the term - prayer language. I am praying in tongues as the Spirit of God gives the utterance. It is not my language. Just a pet peeve that I have with this issue.

So, we are merely defining what is decent and in order? If that is the case, then I agree.

[Falla39]

When in Japan, we would be expecting to hear those there, speaking in Japanese.
If in China, we should be able to hear the Chinese language.
WHEN IN THE SPIRIT, should we not be hearing the LANGUAGE OF THE SPIRIT!
How else would you communicate? Communing with the Spirit!

Commune: verb
Communicate intimately with; be in a state of heightened, intimate receptivity

Falla39

[Hoovie]

Are people on this thread suggesting that no one is to ever speak in tongues outside of tongues and interpretation in any given service?

If you mean in public assembly then, yes, with three exceptions I believe that is exactly what Paul is saying.

The exceptions are:

1. If the tongue is interpreted
"If anyone speaks in a tongue, let there be two or at the most three, each in turn, and let one interpret."


2. The speaker is an unbeliever being converted and is receiving a sign
"Therefore tongues are for a sign, not to those who believe but to unbelievers"

3. One speaking in tongues so softly that only God and himself hears
"But if there is no interpreter, let him keep silent in church, and let him speak to himself and to God"

[Hoovie]

When in Japan, we would be expecting to hear those there, speaking in Japanese.
If in China, we should be able to hear the Chinese language.
WHEN IN THE SPIRIT, should we not be hearing the LANGUAGE OF THE SPIRIT!
How else would you communicate? Communing with the Spirit!

Commune: verb
Communicate intimately with; be in a state of heightened, intimate receptivity

Falla39


Are you able to vote? Which choice best fits your view?

I would say God communes directly in and through the hearts of men, and the absence of tongues does not mean one is not communing with God. Conversely (perhaps to a lesser degree) the presence of tongues does not guarantee one IS communing with God.

[Scott Hutchinson]

I think a Minister can refrain from speaking in tongues while preaching or teaching,and I think one should unless they are giving a message in tongues.

However in times around a altar I think speaking in tongues is ok,but people who burst out in tongues while preaching is going on is distracting.And then some folk get up to testify then go off in tongues,are out of order.While one is addressing a assembly,they should speak in a language that the congregation understands so the congregation can get the benefit of what is being communicated.

Everything should be done decently and in order.
There are instructions on the usage of tongues in a corporate worship service in the bible and I think we should heed them.
We should do things for the edification of the body of Christ.

[mfblume]

If you mean in public assembly then, yes, with three exceptions I believe that is exactly what Paul is saying.

The exceptions are:

1. If the tongue is interpreted
"If anyone speaks in a tongue, let there be two or at the most three, each in turn, and let one interpret."


2. The speaker is an unbeliever being converted and is receiving a sign
"Therefore tongues are for a sign, not to those who believe but to unbelievers"

3. One speaking in tongues so softly that only God and himself hears
"But if there is no interpreter, let him keep silent in church, and let him speak to himself and to God"

I agree totally. That is what the bible teaches.

[mfblume]

A couple of things we need to remember about 1 Corinthians 14; first, it was the early days of the church and people were just getting acquainted with folks speaking in tongues. On the day of Pentecost a bunch of people were speaking in tongues at one time; At Cornelius's house they all spoke in tongues as at the beginning. Were those folks out of order? I don't think so.

The rules laid down by Paul for the Corinthians was good common sense instructions in an environment where the Christian faith was new and speaking in tongues was a little understood phenomona.

I happen to believe that the rules he laid down, though they were specifically for that church, are good guidelines to follow. However, they are not laws hewn in stone.

I would not say they are laws in stone, but they still apply today. I have personally seen visitors really get flipped out by tongue talking in church. They did exactly what Paul tried to avoid -- thought everyone was mad.

I like what Sam said, though, too. If there is a lot of noise, a person could worship aloud in tongues and blend in and not be heard.

But the rule does apply. If we have a choice to speak in tongues and edify ourselves, or to prophesy and edify another, the option should always be to edify another.

[Pressing-On]

If you mean in public assembly then, yes, with three exceptions I believe that is exactly what Paul is saying.

The exceptions are:

1. If the tongue is interpreted
"If anyone speaks in a tongue, let there be two or at the most three, each in turn, and let one interpret."


2. The speaker is an unbeliever being converted and is receiving a sign
"Therefore tongues are for a sign, not to those who believe but to unbelievers"

3. One speaking in tongues so softly that only God and himself hears
"But if there is no interpreter, let him keep silent in church, and let him speak to himself and to God"

Stephen,
Paul lays a foundation at the beginning of chapter 14.

(2)For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

(3) But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort.

(4)He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.

The basis would be that we speak in tongues to edify ourselves, but to continue in that way does not edify the church. He wants us to pray to be used - also - in prophecy.

He goes on to say in verse (5) "I would that ye all spake with tongues but rather that ye prophesied:..."

He goes on to explain why prophesying is beneficial for the edication of the church. You've left off the foundation at the beginning of the chapter and based your interpretation on the middle part, IMO. I believe that is an erroneous view and a dangerous one to take. IMO, it bottles up a clean and free move of the Holy Ghost.

He solidifies his teaching to focus, also, on edifying the church with verses (18) I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all:

(19)Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue.

He, IMO, is saying, "Yes, I speak in tongues quite frequently, but it is not always about me. I need to also minister to the church body."

The only way we can view this chapter is by experience. We all know that if everyone spoke in tongues, every service, for two or three hours it would be totally chaos. That is Paul's point. He is laying out a foundation for this new and troubled church in Corinth. I think we need to keep that in mind when we are trying to interpret this chapter.

He goes on in verse 26 to speak of all the elements we have when we gather together: psalm (singing), doctrine (preaching), tongue, revelation, interpretation.

(26) How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.

He ends with this admonishment, in verses 39 and 40, which I think you need to take another look at, Stephen. He says very plainly, covet to prophesy, but do not forbid speaking in tongues. Do all of it decently and in order.

(39) Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues.

(40) Let all things be done decently and in order.

[Pressing-On]

I would not say they are laws in stone, but they still apply today. I have personally seen visitors really get flipped out by tongue talking in church. They did exactly what Paul tried to avoid -- thought everyone was mad.

I like what Sam said, though, too. If there is a lot of noise, a person could worship aloud in tongues and blend in and not be heard.

But the rule does apply. If we have a choice to speak in tongues and edify ourselves, or to prophesy and edify another, the option should always be to edify another.

Brother Blume,
Why would someone who felt moved on by the Spirit to prophesy weigh which they would rather do - speak in tongues or prophecy?

In my experience, when prophesy comes upon you, you move into it - without hesitation. Well, perhaps a little hesitation, in some cases, to try the Spirit or the mind of God, but NEVER to decide that perhaps I might just want to speak in tongues over prophesying.

Perhaps I misunderstand your comments.

[Scott Hutchinson]

You know it's is interesting how 1.COR.13 deals with love and it is sandwhiched between teachings on the gifts,because one should have true Christian love in order to have concern about using a spiritual gift for the edification of The Body Of Christ.

[Pressing-On]

You know it's is interesting how 1.COR.13 deals with love and it is sandwhiched between teachings on the gifts,because one should have true Christian love in order to have concern about using a spiritual gift for the edification of The Body Of Christ.
Maybe he knew that some lovely brother or sister, with their own agenda, would give tongues and interpretation for various selfish reasons - rebuke, etc.

I haven't personally experienced that, but have heard of it happening. I don't see how someone would fool around like that, but it has happened.

[Scott Hutchinson]

Some people give interpretations of tongues as rebukes,and they say things trying to get back at someone in the church,sad but true.

[Falla39]

When in Japan, we would be expecting to hear those there, speaking in Japanese.
If in China, we should be able to hear the Chinese language.
WHEN IN THE SPIRIT, should we not be hearing the LANGUAGE OF THE SPIRIT!
How else would you communicate? Communing with the Spirit!

Commune: verb
Communicate intimately with; be in a state of heightened, intimate receptivity

Falla39

Romans 8:26,27,

26Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

27And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.

I'm not sure some of us are on the same page. I guess I am primarily thinking about when we are "praying in the Spirit/Holy Ghost!

[Jermyn Davidson]

Amen. Man, you post a lot of good opinions.

1 Corinthians 14:18-23 KJV (18) I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all: (19) Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue. (20) Brethren, be not children in understanding: howbeit in malice be ye children, but in understanding be men. (21) In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord. (22) Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe. (23) If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?


Thank you-- though I don't think most would agree with your opinion on that!


Thank you-- though I don't think most would agree with your opinion on that! :)


Oh well!

[you] does not pay my bills anyway!!

[Hoovie]

Stephen,
Paul lays a foundation at the beginning of chapter 14.

The basis would be that we speak in tongues to edify ourselves, but to continue in that way does not edify the church. He wants us to pray to be used - also - in prophecy.

He goes on to say in verse (5) "I would that ye all spake with tongues but rather that ye prophesied:..."

He goes on to explain why prophesying is beneficial for the edication of the church.
I am with you to this point

You've left off the foundation at the beginning of the chapter and based your interpretation on the middle part, IMO.
No intent to leave anything out - I just let Paul say it.

I believe that is an erroneous view and a dangerous one to take. IMO, it bottles up a clean and free move of the Holy Ghost.

I have no clue what you mean here


He solidifies his teaching to focus, also, on edifying the church with verses (18) I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all:

He, IMO, is saying, "Yes, I speak in tongues quite frequently, but it is not always about me. I need to also minister to the church body."

I really think you misunderstood my post. I did not say that Paul did not speak in tongues a great deal.

The only way we can view this chapter is by experience. We all know that if everyone spoke in tongues, every service, for two or three hours it would be totally chaos. That is Paul's point. He is laying out a foundation for this new and troubled church in Corinth. I think we need to keep that in mind when we are trying to interpret this chapter.

The text does not mention everyone speaking in tongues for two or three hours, but rather "If anyone speaks in a tongue, let there be two or at the most three, each in turn, and let one interpret. 28 But if there is no interpreter, let him keep silent in church, and let him speak to himself and to God."

He goes on in verse 26 to speak of all the elements we have when we gather together: psalm (singing), doctrine (preaching), tongue, revelation, interpretation.


He ends with this admonishment, in verses 39 and 40, which I think you need to take another look at, Stephen. He says very plainly, covet to prophesy, but do not forbid speaking in tongues. Do all of it decently and in order.

Seems straightforward to me. I read this as admonition to covet prophesy in the church, while not forbidding the practice of speaking in tongues in the perimeters given above.


PO we both agree public tongues must occur with proper context. You have stated that if "...everyone spoke in tongues, every service, for two or three hours it would be totally chaos."

I am simply saying we should let the scriptures speak. "If anyone speaks in a tongue, let there be two or at the most three, each in turn, and let one interpret. 28 But if there is no interpreter, let him keep silent in church, and let him speak to himself and to God."

[SeekingOne]

I voted that it doesn't have any effect on the message, because there was not an option for it only meaning something if the message is interpreted. I have not read other people's responses yet, sorry if others said the same thing.

[Hoovie]

I voted that it doesn't have any effect on the message, because there was not an option for it only meaning something if the message is interpreted. I have not read other people's responses yet, sorry if others said the same thing.

I understand. The poll should be read in conjunction with the original starting post.

[Falla39]

Are you able to vote? Which choice best fits your view?

I would say God communes directly in and through the hearts of men, and the absence of tongues does not mean one is not communing with God. Conversely (perhaps to a lesser degree) the presence of tongues does not guarantee one IS communing with God.

Sorry, Bro. Hoover,

I wasn't on the same page with you! My bad!

My late father was stationed in Japan in WWII. He and some other fellow
soldiers visited a Methodist church in which the pastor spoke for approx.
30-45 min. in Japanese. Dad said for he and his friends, it was fruitless,
and boring as well, until the pastor's son came back with a Bible and said,
"My father preach this" and pointed to John 3:16! Dad said the son told
them more in those few words than the whole time his father spoke in
another language. Dad, later as a pastor himself, would use this example
to explain that there was an order to tongues, as in other things. God is
a God of order.

Building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost.
Jude 20. This is primarily what I was speaking of when I mentioned about
Japanese, Chinese, When in your prayer closet, pray in the Spirit/Holy Ghost.
When alone with God, in the closet of prayer, pray until HE comes and HE
will intercede for you in the language of the Spirit.

They that wait upon the LORD shall renew their strength. They shall mount
up with wings as eagles. They shall run and not be weary, they shall walk
and not faint.

Today lives are so full that it seems hard to wait. People are too busy to
wait. We miss a lot when we become impatient and don't wait.

Psalms 40:1,2
1 I waited patiently for the LORD; and he inclined unto me, and heard my cry.
2 He brought me up also out of an horrible pit, out of the miry clay, and set my
feet upon a rock, and established my goings.

Falla39

[shag]

But Shaggy, does scripture make room for a "little" tongue speaking while in public address to the assembly? Or is it prohibted in that venue unless interrupeted? Is it about personal preference or does Corinthians address this?


Steve,
Sorry I'm just now responding, hadnt had much time.

Anyway, in my neck of the woods, its my pastor that does the little bit of tongue talking during preaching, since he generally does ALL the teaching/preaching. I guess I have just become accustomed to hearing a little of it so often.

Point well taken on where Paul in the Corinthian letter, draws the line. At the same time however, I personally, don't really want my pastor, or whoever's giving the preaching, to feel like I'm ready to rebuke them if they "slip-up" and speak in tongues a little while "bringing the word"....Where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty, is what I'm sure he would tell me. I suppose I'm trying to give'm the benefit of the doubt. I do however feel he/they should(& do) realize the tongues should be "quenched" during preaching, as it DOES NOT edify anybody in any way in that circumstance.

Keeping things in balance, I think its possible for those like myself, in the assmbly, to be so "absolutely no slip-ups of speaking in tongues from the preachers, that I can become mindset like the pharisees adhering to the letter of the law, and miss the meat of the message given, because I'm bothered by a little tongues that shouda been withheld.


Again, I agree that Corinthians spells out that there shouldnt be tongues w/out any interpretation, during the preaching to the assembly, as there is NO PROFIT AT ALL to the assembly during such a happening. And I think the tongue interuption during the message can be controled w/out quenching what the Spirit is "feeding" to the assmbly.

[Hoovie]

Thanks Shag. I would not propose fining offenders :)

I believe it's a maturity issue, and that's the purpose of the scriptural guidelines.

Just think we need to act responsibly with the gifts we are given, and realize they are for the benefit of the body.

[Pressing-On]

PO we both agree public tongues must occur with proper context. You have stated that if "...everyone spoke in tongues, every service, for two or three hours it would be totally chaos."

I am simply saying we should let the scriptures speak. "If anyone speaks in a tongue, let there be two or at the most three, each in turn, and let one interpret. 28 But if there is no interpreter, let him keep silent in church, and let him speak to himself and to God."
You will notice, in the above verse, that Paul is saying it is okay to speak in tongues in church, just do that quietly and to yourself if you feel you don't have the tongues or the interpretation. That only means to NOT get elevated over the direction and tone of the service.

More toward the discussion:

Chapter 12 speaks of the gifts of the spirit, Chapter 13 having the love to operate them and Chapter 14 touches on decency and order in the operation of.

Paul begins Chapter 14:1 saying, "Follow after charity, and desire spiritual gifts, but rather that ye may prophesy."

One of the spiritual gifts in Chapter 12 is "divers kinds of tongues":

12:10 "To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:"

I believe we need to have an overview of what Paul is actually addressing. You are taking I Cor 14:19 "Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue", as the whole admonition of chapter 14 and I believe he is addressing more.

Clearly I Cor 14:23 bears out the problem: "If therefore the WHOLE church be come together into one place and ALL speak with tongues...."

Clearly, Paul is saying that it is not good for the WHOLE church to ALL be speaking in tongues at once. And no the text doesn't bear out the time factor, I only added the 2 or 3 hours because that is normal for most churches and I assume they spent some time together as well.

Sam did a very good job of lining out how the Spirit does operate in any given service, which is not out of order -
http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/showpost.php?p=766082&postcount=29

Again, I Cor 14: 26 "How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.

This verse (26) gives room for the Spirit to move, but he wants them to understand there is to be order.

I Cor 14:39 Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues. (40) Let all things be done decently and in order.

Verse 39, IMO, at the end of this teaching puts forth the directive that speaking in tongues is not to be forbidden as long as it's done decently and in order. If he was speaking of prophecy only, I don't believe he would have used that particular wording in that verse regarding tongues. He would be contradicting himself in I Cor 12:10 - divers kinds of tongues. He also wouldn't have included in I Cor 14:18 that he speaks in tongues more than them all. He goes so far as to thank God for it! If you try to squelch tongues to be used only in the church for prophecy, you will also squelch a free and individual flow of the Spirit. That, IMO, is not Paul's intent.

Aside from a person wanting to look more spiritual, I see another factor that could explain some of the instances when things do not appear decent and in order, therefore, having a feel of confusion. This is just my observation through the years.

I believe that when a person does not spend personal, private alone time with God, and misses the prayer room before church, as well, they carry burdens that the Spirit would have us lay down.

Obviously, there are times when some burdens are too heavy to unload in a short amount of time. But, overall, there are many burdens or problems we carry that God is able to unload from us if we just spent a little time alone with him. I don't believe it is of faith to carry these burdens into every service. We should come in rejoicing!

As a result, a person uses that time to engage with God when they should have done that before they entered the sanctuary. It can bring a heaviness on the congregation and take away some of the joy, which should have been there, collectively. We could, also, be directing our focus on this individual and miss the true direction God would have taken the church for that particular service. JMHO.

When we are in one mind and one accord - it produces peace, joy and unity. I am all for pray as the basis of everything we do, everything we are - first and foremost. We could turn the world upside down. I see less prayer than I did 23 years ago, that is sad.

[mfblume]

Brother Blume,
Why would someone who felt moved on by the Spirit to prophesy weigh which they would rather do - speak in tongues or prophecy?

This is just what Paul stated, first of all.

1 Corinthians 14:5 KJV I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.


Notice Paul stated he rather would see everyone prophesy and not all speak with tongues. So, if there is a "rather" involved, then that must mean we can concede and do so, ourselves. How? The way Paul treats the subject, whether people realize it or not, we can control what we do and what we do not do. That is really why he said this:

1 Corinthians 14:32-33 KJV (32) And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets. (33) For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.


The only reason he said this was because he did not want people to say they cannot help themselves after Paul told them they should not all speak in tongues out loud for everyone to hear.

Now, if what Paul says goes against what we've been led to believe, guess who is right and who is wrong? Paul is not wrong on this, we are. ;)

Then comes the question of how we can prophesy if we're being moved and feel to speak in tongues.

Watch this:

1 Corinthians 14:13 KJV (13) Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret.


Notice that interpretation of tongues is as much of a gift as tongues. And if Paul said we can pray in order to interpret, then we can pray to prophesy as well, rather than speak aloud in tongues. That is the only way his words about seeing us rather prophesy than speak aloud in tongues would make sense. In other words, Paul had the opinion that we should actually believe God and pray for us to prophesy if we are going to do anything in the service, rather than speak aloud in tongues.

In my experience, when prophesy comes upon you, you move into it - without hesitation.

This is probably the common traditional idea bout the issue. That is what we have been sort of "led" to think like. But for Paul to tell us

#1 - that not everyone should speak in tongues aloud, but rather edify someone else by prophesying, and

#2 - the Lord does not author confusion and the spirit of the prophet is subject to the prophet...

...then God wants us to use propriety and order when moving out. He is implying we have the ability to speak in tongues at will in the church. Now, we may FEEL to do so more at certain times than others, but in the end it actually is up to us to do so or not. And just because we feel to do so, it does not mean we should as though God has to be causing us to do so if we FEEL to do so.

Anyway, when the gift comes on someone to prophesy, we still need to use wisdom and do it at the proper moment. But for Paul to say that we can pray to interpret, then that obviously is involved in prophesying when there is a choice given as he indicated in verse 5. Praying for the gift to operate is something many have not considered, but there it is.

Well, perhaps a little hesitation, in some cases, to try the Spirit or the mind of God, but NEVER to decide that perhaps I might just want to speak in tongues over prophesying.

Perhaps I misunderstand your comments.

There is something about deciding that is indeed involved in all of this, according to verse 5, and verses 32-33 and verse 40. We may not have realized this, but Paul seems to be saying it is there to a degree, and we pray for this to occur. It's sort of like saying we should pray and believe God to move on us to prophesy rather than to seek to speak forth in tongues out loud.

[Pressing-On]

Brother Blume,

If you are speaking of volume, as you have used the term "outloud", than I agree. If you are saying that we will never speak in tongues during a given service for any reason than to prophecy or interpret, than I don't agree.

The scriptures don't, IMO, have an "either/or". The "rather" is for the sake of confusion in operation and control. "Rather" is also defined as "much the more". It doesn't mean in the place of.

Again, Paul's main point seems to rest on I Cor 14:23, IMO.

I Cor 14:23 "If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?"

This, IMO, is the whole issue - the WHOLE church ALL speaking loudly in tongues. He says that he would "rather": much the more - have them prophesy than utter tongues loudly throughout a service. I agree with him. That verse does not in any way, IMO, teach that tongues is never spoken in a congregation, save for, prophecy alone. For some to say that tongues is ONLY to be used for prophecy during a church gathering is erroneous, IMO.

I Cor 14:2 "For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries."

The above verse allows me to understand that there will be verbal utterances outside of prophecy and interpretation. As long as I know, from following after the Spirit, what it is that I am feeling. And, yes, it is a feeling or how else would we determine our mode of operation or the mind of God? Along with our distinct impression and thoughts, we also have a feel of it. As long as we are not blurting out louder than the tone of the service in the music, worship or speaker, then we are in order. I refer you back to Sam's post, which you also stated you agreed with.

I Cor 14:28 "But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God."

Again, this is not an inward silence. The person would simply not be blasting out loudly. The person next to him is going to hear something. Perhaps the person in front will hear something quietly as well. We are not speaking inaudible words, simply controlling our volume and intensity.

I have experienced the startling and confused feeling of someone blurting out who had no direction and no interpretation. That is what I believe Paul is speaking of. The person in charge of the service determines to yield to that or move on - subject to the prophet.

There is a difference in using tongues to edify yourself and edifying the church, as we know. Again, I believe the whole issue is the volume and the encouragement to pray that you will also have the gift of prophesy. But, I don't ever believe it is an either/or. It's only a "rather/much the more".

If you don't move into the instruction to pray that you can also interpret and only want to blast out tongues and never grow in the Spirit, that indicates a lack of wisdom and growth. BUT, it never means to stop speaking in tongues.

Paul ends with forbidding the speaking in tongues. Covet to prophesy, but don't forbid others to speak in tongues. From the instructions in I Cor 14, we know that he only wants order in all things.

I Cor 14 39 "Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues."

I would never discourage a person from speaking in tongues. I would prefer to teach them order, decency and growth.

[mfblume]

Brother Blume,

If you are speaking of volume, as you have used the term "outloud", than I agree. If you are saying that we will never speak in tongues during a given service for any reason than to prophecy or interpret, than I don't agree.

I said, aloud, meaning for everyone to hear. Also I already agreed with Sam that we can speak in tongues and not be heard but rather blend in with the other noise around.

[Pressing-On]

I said, aloud, meaning for everyone to hear. Also I already agreed with Sam that we can speak in tongues and not be heard but rather blend in with the other noise around.

I agree with not blurting out, but if you are blending in with the noise around - you are still being heard by those around you. It's not possible that NO ONE would hear you.

[Hoovie]

PO, I too made that exception.

3. One speaking in tongues so softly that only God and himself hears
"But if there is no interpreter, let him keep silent in church, and let him speak to himself and to God"

The volume test for uninterpreted tongues is whether unbelievers can hear them.

I practice this myself in public assembly.

[Timmy]

PO, I too made that exception.

3. One speaking in tongues so softly that only God and himself hears
"But if there is no interpreter, let him keep silent in church, and let him speak to himself and to God"

The volume test for uninterpreted tongues is whether unbelievers can hear them.

Can you be sure there isn't an unbeliever standing right by you? :hmmm

[Hoovie]

Can you be sure there isn't an unbeliever standing right by you? :hmmm

No. That is why one should pray quietly if they are praying in tongues without interpreter.

[Pressing-On]

PO, I too made that exception.

3. One speaking in tongues so softly that only God and himself hears
"But if there is no interpreter, let him keep silent in church, and let him speak to himself and to God"

The volume test for uninterpreted tongues is whether unbelievers can hear them.

I practice this myself in public assembly.
So, if an unbeliever sits next to you, they will never hear a single utterance from you? That sounds rather fantastic, Stephen.

[Timmy]

No. That is why one should pray quietly if they are praying in tongues without interpreter.

OK. Really, really quietly. :)

Or maybe "silent" means "silent"? Got Greek, anybody? ;)

[Hoovie]

So, if an unbeliever sits next to you, they will never hear a single utterance from you? That sounds rather fantastic, Stephen.

Correct.

[Hoovie]

OK. Really, really quietly. :)

Or maybe "silent" means "silent"? Got Greek, anybody? ;)

Yes, speaking to yourself and to God.

[Pressing-On]

How do we reconcile these two scriptures?

I Cor 14:14 "For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful."

Romans 8:26 "Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered."

[Pressing-On]

Yes, speaking to youself and to God.
So, not saying anything at all - just in your mind? No vocal utterance?

[Timmy]

How do we reconcile these two scriptures?

I Cor 14:14 "For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful."

Romans 8:26 "Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered."

Oh, that's easy, even for me! :lol They're not talking about the same thing. Romans isn't tongues. Can't be. Tongues can be uttered (exact opposite of what it says), and it's the Spirit praying (not you). 1 Cor is talking about a person's spirit praying, and Romans is talking about the Holy Spirit praying.

[Timmy]

So, not saying anything at all - just in your mind? No vocal utterance?

Voices in his head? :woot

[Hoovie]

How do we reconcile these two scriptures?

I Cor 14:14 "For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful."

Romans 8:26 "Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered."

Not sure what you are reconciling these to... speaking in tongues is a good thing and all may experience, as Paul stated "I thank my God I speak with tongues more than you all; yet in the church I would rather speak five words with my understanding, that I may teach others also, than ten thousand words in a tongue."

Church should not be a place we come together to speak in tongues. That is reserved for a prayer closet - not a public setting were unbelievers may be present.

[Pressing-On]

Voices in his head? :woot

Isn't there a song I want to reference? LOL!

[Hoovie]

So, not saying anything at all - just in your mind? No vocal utterance?

Perhaps just a whisper - it's OK - you are speaking to God after all. ;)

[Timmy]

Perhaps just a whisper - it's OK - you are speaking to God after all. ;)

OK. Just make sure nobody has one of these aimed at you:

http://www.pimall.com/nais/images/gibson-b.jpg

:toofunny

[Pressing-On]

Not sure what you are reconciling these to... speaking in tongues is a good thing and all may experience, as Paul stated "I thank my God I speak with tongues more than you all; yet in the church I would rather speak five words with my understanding, that I may teach others also, than ten thousand words in a tongue."

Church should not be a place we come together to speak in tongues. That is reserved for a prayer closet - not a public setting were unbelievers may be present.

I Cor 14:14 is saying I am praying in an unknown and my understanding is unfruitful. Romans says we know not what we pray but it helps our infirmities. I'm just wondering how we reconcile those scriptures?

I am wondering how we would not respond to this song in adoration and how we could not utter one word, cry, have stammering lips, speak in tongues or whatever. It all sounds rather fantastic.

Give thanks with a grateful heart, give thanks to the holy one
Give thanks because his given Jesus Christ His son
Give thanks with a grateful heart, give thanks to the holy one
Give thanks because his given Jesus Christ His son
And now let the weak say I am strong Let the poor say I am rich
Because of what the Lord has done for us
And now let the weak say I am strong Let the poor say I am rich
Because of what the Lord has done for us

Except for a continuous speaking in tongues or blurting out loudly, out of order, I don't see how you can bypass ever speaking in tongues or speaking so softly that a mouse could not hear you. That's incredible, Stephen. Just incredible.

[Pressing-On]

Perhaps just a whisper - it's OK - you are speaking to God after all. ;)

Incredible, Stephen. Incredible.

[Pressing-On]

Oh, that's easy, even for me! :lol They're not talking about the same thing. Romans isn't tongues. Can't be. Tongues can be uttered (exact opposite of what it says), and it's the Spirit praying (not you). 1 Cor is talking about a person's spirit praying, and Romans is talking about the Holy Spirit praying.

LOL! I don't know if you are serious, but I'm not seeing this.

[Pressing-On]

OK. Just make sure nobody has one of these aimed at you:

http://www.pimall.com/nais/images/gibson-b.jpg

:toofunny

:ursofunny

[Timmy]

LOL! I don't know if you are serious, but I'm not seeing this.

Actually am serious. Look at Romans. Consider the two things I mentioned: 1) it is the Holy Spirit (not us) praying for us (not through us). 2) He uses "groanings" which cannot be uttered. I really can't see how people connect this with tongues and some kind of "prayer language". ('Course, there's a lot of things I can't see! :heeheehee)

[Timmy]

Besides, the whole thing doesn't really make a lot of sense. God knows what we need, so He "prays" through us, speaking to Himself, in a language only He understands? And this works better than English? Why, because English is a "second" (umpteen zillionth, actually) language for Him, and He understands His native tongue better? :blink

[Hoovie]

I Cor 14:14 is saying I am praying in an unknown and my understanding is unfruitful. Romans says we know not what we pray but it helps our infirmities. I'm just wondering how we reconcile those scriptures?

I am wondering how we would not respond to this song in adoration and how we could not utter one word, cry, have stammering lips, speak in tongues or whatever. It all sounds rather fantastic.

Give thanks with a grateful heart, give thanks to the holy one
Give thanks because his given Jesus Christ His son
Give thanks with a grateful heart, give thanks to the holy one
Give thanks because his given Jesus Christ His son
And now let the weak say I am strong Let the poor say I am rich
Because of what the Lord has done for us
And now let the weak say I am strong Let the poor say I am rich
Because of what the Lord has done for us

Except for a continuous speaking in tongues or blurting out loudly, out of order, I don't see how you can bypass ever speaking in tongues or speaking so softly that a mouse could not hear you. That's incredible, Stephen. Just incredible.

Incredible, Stephen. Incredible.

What is incredible is that we have developed a church culture where our tradition of "worship" does not jive with scripture.

I cannot say that tongues is the natural progression of that song at all... I see no reason why it necessarily would be.

I also reject any notion that tongues are a higher, more acceptable or more perfect praise than praising God in the understood tongue.

It's our inner man worshipping without pretension that God really desires. Speaking in tongues does not prove that is occurring any more than praying in English would be proof.

[Hoovie]

OK. Just make sure nobody has one of these aimed at you:

http://www.pimall.com/nais/images/gibson-b.jpg

:toofunny


:thumbsup
Of course with that thing you could hear my belly sounds - that would be WRONG too!

[Timmy]

:lol

[Falla39]

Sorry, Bro. Hoover,

I wasn't on the same page with you! My bad!

My late father was stationed in Japan in WWII. He and some other fellow
soldiers visited a Methodist church in which the pastor spoke for approx.
30-45 min. in Japanese. Dad said for he and his friends, it was fruitless,
and boring as well, until the pastor's son came back with a Bible and said,
"My father preach this" and pointed to John 3:16! Dad said the son told
them more in those few words than the whole time his father spoke in
another language. Dad, later as a pastor himself, would use this example
to explain that there was an order to tongues, as in other things. God is
a God of order.

Building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost.
Jude 20. This is primarily what I was speaking of when I mentioned about
Japanese, Chinese, When in your prayer closet, pray in the Spirit/Holy Ghost.
When alone with God, in the closet of prayer, pray until HE comes and HE
will intercede for you in the language of the Spirit.

They that wait upon the LORD shall renew their strength. They shall mount
up with wings as eagles. They shall run and not be weary, they shall walk
and not faint.

Today lives are so full that it seems hard to wait. People are too busy to
wait. We miss a lot when we become impatient and don't wait.

Psalms 40:1,2
1 I waited patiently for the LORD; and he inclined unto me, and heard my cry.
2 He brought me up also out of an horrible pit, out of the miry clay, and set my
feet upon a rock, and established my goings.

Falla39

BUMP for Bro. Hoover!

[Hoovie]

Actually am serious. Look at Romans. Consider the two things I mentioned: 1) it is the Holy Spirit (not us) praying for us (not through us). 2) He uses "groanings" which cannot be uttered. I really can't see how people connect this with tongues and some kind of "prayer language". ('Course, there's a lot of things I can't see! :heeheehee)

You are not the only one that questions whether this is refering to sounds a believer makes while praying. Indeed, even if it is referring to the believer -it would be sounds that could NOT be uttered.

Sometimes those in prayer do groan and agonize no doubt, when seeking the face of God.

[Hoovie]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Falla39
Sorry, Bro. Hoover,

I wasn't on the same page with you! My bad!

My late father was stationed in Japan in WWII. He and some other fellow
soldiers visited a Methodist church in which the pastor spoke for approx.
30-45 min. in Japanese. Dad said for he and his friends, it was fruitless,
and boring as well, until the pastor's son came back with a Bible and said,
"My father preach this" and pointed to John 3:16! Dad said the son told
them more in those few words than the whole time his father spoke in
another language. Dad, later as a pastor himself, would use this example
to explain that there was an order to tongues, as in other things. God is
a God of order.

Building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost.
Jude 20. This is primarily what I was speaking of when I mentioned about
Japanese, Chinese, When in your prayer closet, pray in the Spirit/Holy Ghost.
When alone with God, in the closet of prayer, pray until HE comes and HE
will intercede for you in the language of the Spirit.
They that wait upon the LORD shall renew their strength. They shall mount
up with wings as eagles. They shall run and not be weary, they shall walk
and not faint.

Today lives are so full that it seems hard to wait. People are too busy to
wait. We miss a lot when we become impatient and don't wait.Psalms 40:1,2
1 I waited patiently for the LORD; and he inclined unto me, and heard my cry.
2 He brought me up also out of an horrible pit, out of the miry clay, and set my
feet upon a rock, and established my goings.

Falla39
------------------------------------------

Very good Sister. "God of order" That is a good example.

Indeed we need patience to allow God to speak into our hearts and lives in this fast world.

thank you

[Pressing-On]

What is incredible is that we have developed a church culture where our tradition of "worship" does not jive with scripture.

I cannot say that tongues is the natural progression of that song at all... I see no reason why it necessarily would be.

I also reject any notion that tongues are a higher, more acceptable or more perfect praise than praising God in the understood tongue.

It's our inner man worshiping without pretension that God really desires. Speaking in tongues does not prove that is occurring any more than praying in English would be proof.
I don't believe anyone here has implied that tongues was more acceptable or a more perfect form of praise, BUT when God's Spirit moves on you, it does take you higher. We can't deny that, being used in the gifts.

The whole subject of I Cor 14 is about speaking in tongues. He is directing them to use tongues decently and in order during the process. He isn't saying to NEVER do that.

Again, he says, "Forbid not to speak in tongues - do everything decent and in order."

When I see Paul using the word, "rather", he is saying "so much the more OR to a larger degree". He would rather see more prophesying than speaking in tongues ALL the time by Everyone. When he speaks of decency and order, that implies that tongues is being used in a way that does seem barbaric.

Simple worshiping in tongues and speaking - as God gives the utterance - is not going to be chaotic. So, I think I Cor 14 is handling a huge issue going on, being he used that they could be seen as barbaric. The people appear to be in need of direction on how to govern themselves under the unction of the Holy Ghost.

We all know that men's thoughts, ways and actions will inevitably be in variance with God's will, if we are not submitted and careful.

So, are you saying that you never have stammering lips during a song of praise or you don't feel the Spirit of God moving on you and you utter some words in tongues. I can't imagine how we can stop that and I don't see how you will be able to keep that to a whisper, although I don't advocate some loud display for effect, either.

I can imagine how we can control that and not make a spectacle of ourselves in an assembly.

And, BTW, I see what we do - largely - jive with scripture. I question some of the interpretation of it, especially this passage.

[Pressing-On]

Actually am serious. Look at Romans. Consider the two things I mentioned: 1) it is the Holy Spirit (not us) praying for us (not through us). 2) He uses "groanings" which cannot be uttered. I really can't see how people connect this with tongues and some kind of "prayer language". ('Course, there's a lot of things I can't see! :heeheehee)
I agree that groanings/sighing is not speaking in tongues. I have something else to think about and I'll respond later.

No, I don't need to think about the part in parenthesis. :toofunny

[Timmy]

:D

[Hoovie]

I don't believe anyone here has implied that tongues was more acceptable or a more perfect form of praise, BUT when God's Spirit moves on you, it does take you higher. We can't deny that, being used in the gifts.

The whole subject of I Cor 14 is about speaking in tongues. He is directing them to use tongues decently and in order during the process. He isn't saying to NEVER do that.

Again, he says, "Forbid not to speak in tongues - do everything decent and in order."

When I see Paul using the word, "rather", he is saying "so much the more OR to a larger degree". He would rather see more prophesying than speaking in tongues ALL the time by Everyone. When he speaks of decency and order, that implies that tongues is being used in a way that does seem barbaric.

Simple worshiping in tongues and speaking - as God gives the utterance - is not going to be chaotic. So, I think I Cor 14 is handling a huge issue going on, being he used that they could be seen as barbaric. The people appear to be in need of direction on how to govern themselves under the unction of the Holy Ghost.

We all know that men's thoughts, ways and actions will inevitably be in variance with God's will, if we are not submitted and careful.

So, are you saying that you never have stammering lips during a song of praise or you don't feel the Spirit of God moving on you and you utter some words in tongues. I can't imagine how we can stop that and I don't see how you will be able to keep that to a whisper, although I don't advocate some loud display for effect, either.

I can imagine how we can control that and not make a spectacle of ourselves in an assembly.

And, BTW, I see what we do - largely - jive with scripture. I question some of the interpretation of it, especially this passage.

When I started this thread I had not really intended on making this about what we personally experience or not, as far as sharing individual examples - but that is OK too. I realize how we "experience" what we discuss shapes our views to a degree.

Stammering lips - earlier on in my conversion to Pentecostal I had recieved teaching that the "stammering lips" is reference to specially quivering lips when one prays in the spirit. I no longer accept that interpretation and interestingly I no longer experience that phenomenon.

As to feeling the Spirit of God - yes I do. However, it is not always (or even generally) associated with an urge to speak in tongues.

Furthermore, I cannot honestly say the times I do speak with tongues are necessarily times of greater intimacy with God. I often experience closeness and oneness with God without speaking in tongues.

Also, I do not know that volume has anything to do with it, though a highly energized crowd is likely to be louder overall.

As to a worshipper controlling whether he speaks in tongues or not I believe that is generally his decision to verbalize it or not. I believe one may have an urge to pray "in the spirit" even when it is not the proper thing to do at that precise moment - especially aloud. Certainly, if it were not so, much of Corinthians 14 would be a moot point.

[Pressing-On]

When I started this thread I had not really intended on making this about what we personally experience or not, as far as sharing individual examples - but that is OK too. I realize how we "experience" what we discuss shapes our views to a degree.

Stammering lips - earlier on in my conversion to Pentecostal I had recieved teaching that the "stammering lips" is reference to specially quivering lips when one prays in the spirit. I no longer accept that interpretation and interestingly I no longer experience that phenomenon.

As to feeling the Spirit of God - yes I do. However, it is not always (or even generally) associated with an urge to speak in tongues.

Furthermore, I cannot honestly say the times I do speak with tongues are necessarily times of greater intimacy with God. I often experience closeness and oneness with God without speaking in tongues.

Also, I do not know that volume has anything to do with it, though a highly energized crowd is likely to be louder overall.

As to a worshipper controlling whether he speaks in tongues or not I believe that is generally his decision to verbalize it or not. I believe one may have an urge to pray "in the spirit" even when it is not the proper thing to do at that precise moment - especially aloud. Certainly, if it were not so, much of Corinthians 14 would be a moot point.
Wow, well, okay, I'm just going to leave this one alone, Stephen.

[Hoovie]

When I started this thread I had not really intended on making this about what we personally experience or not, as far as sharing individual examples - but that is OK too. I realize how we "experience" what we discuss shapes our views to a degree.

Stammering lips - earlier on in my conversion to Pentecostal I had received teaching that the "stammering lips" is reference to specially quivering lips when one prays in the spirit. I no longer accept that interpretation and interestingly I no longer experience that phenomenon.

As to feeling the Spirit of God - yes I do. However, it is not always (or even generally) associated with an urge to speak in tongues.

Furthermore, I cannot honestly say the times I do speak with tongues are necessarily times of greater intimacy with God. (meaning greater than times spent with God in prayer without speaking in tongues) I often experience closeness and oneness with God without speaking in tongues.

Also, I do not know that volume has anything to do with it, though a highly energized crowd is likely to be louder overall.

As to a worshiper controlling whether he speaks in tongues or not I believe that is generally his decision to verbalize it or not. I believe one may have an urge to pray "in the spirit" even when it is not the proper thing to do at that precise moment - especially aloud. Certainly, if it were not so, much of Corinthians 14 would be a moot point.

Wow, well, okay, I'm just going to leave this one alone, Stephen.

It's OK PO, I would rather you speak up and discuss it.

I am not easily offended - really!

Also see the added red edit for clarity on the one statement.

[Pressing-On]

It's OK PO, I would rather you speak up and discuss it.

I am not easily offended - really!

Also see the added red edit for clarity on the one statement.

I didn't really have anything to say, Stephen. I am just seeing why you view I Cor 14 like you do.

[Hoovie]

I didn't really have anything to say, Stephen. I am just seeing why you view I Cor 14 like you do.

OK, fine.

But, to satisfy my own curiosity, are your times of greater intimacy with God always marked with speaking in tongues?

[Pressing-On]

OK, fine.

But, to satisfy my own curiosity, are your times of greater intimacy with God always marked with speaking in tongues?

When I am lost in the spirit and it is just me and Him - I stand on mountains.

[Hoovie]

When I am lost in the spirit and it is just me and Him - I stand on mountains.

Sounds nice. Perhaps another topic for discussion.

[Pressing-On]

Sounds nice. Perhaps another topic for discussion.

Sure. I'm passionate about a lot things and definitely have my mind made up.

[RandyWayne]

When I am lost in the spirit and it is just me and Him - I stand on mountains.

Hush now, don't you cry
Wipe away the teardrop from your eye
You're lying safe in bed
It was all a bad dream
Spinning in your head
Your mind tricked you to feel the pain
Of someone close to you leaving the game of life
So here it is, another chance
Wide awake you face the day
Your dream is over... or has it just begun?

There's a place I like to hide
A doorway that I run through in the night
Relax child, you were there
But only didn't realize it and you were scared
It's a place where you will learn
To face your fears, retrace the years
And ride the whims of your mind
Commanding in another world
Suddenly you hear and see
This magic new dimension

I- will be watching over you
I- am gonna help you see it through
I- will protect you in the night
I- am smiling next to you, in Silent Lucidity

[spoken during solo]
(Visualize your dream)
(Record it in the present tense)
(Put it into a permanent form)
(If you persist in your efforts)
(You can achieve dream control)
(Dream control)
(How's that then, better?)
(Hug me)

If you open your mind for me
You won't rely on open eyes to see
The walls you built within
Come tumbling down, and a new world will begin
Living twice at once you learn
You're safe from the pain in the dream domain
A soul set free to fly
A round trip journey in your head
Master of illusion, can you realize
Your dream's alive, you can be the guide but...

I- will be watching over you
I- am gonna help to see it through
I- will protect you in the night
I- am smiling next to you....

[Pressing-On]

Step away from the computer, Randy and put down whatever it is you are drinking! :toofunny

[mfblume]

Sure. I'm passionate about a lot things and definitely have my mind made up.

I always try to stay away from having my mind made up. It indicates closed mindedness, sister. It is good to be persuaded, but to always realize we may be incorrect somewhere. I learned that the hard way. :)

[Pressing-On]

I always try to stay away from having my mind made up. It indicates closed mindedness, sister. It is good to be persuaded, but to always realize we may be incorrect somewhere. I learned that the hard way. :)

Let me be more plain - After all the posts on this thread - I have my mind made up on what I believe I Cor 14 is saying. :D

I would also like to add that I don't have my mind up about everything - just the things I have questioned and found MY answers for. Endtime issues are still on the table. :D

[mfblume]

Let me be more plain - After all the posts on this thread - I have my mind made up on what I believe I Cor 14 is saying. :D

I would also like to add that I don't have my mind up about everything - just the things I have questioned and found MY answers for. Endtime issues are still on the table. :D

I know what you mean, but even in 1 Cor 14, or prophecy, although I feel I have a good handle on it, I still do not allow myself to say I have my mind made up about it. I may be misisng something. But that's just me. lol

God bless, sister!

[Timmy]

Let me be more plain - After all the posts on this thread - I have my mind made up on what I believe I Cor 14 is saying. :D

I would also like to add that I don't have my mind up about everything - just the things I have questioned and found MY answers for. Endtime issues are still on the table. :D

What if some of those answers are wrong? Still want to cling to them, no matter what?

[Timmy]

Oh, lookie! A 'more credible' vote!

[mfblume]

Oh, lookie! A 'more credible' vote!

GHASP! What ware we coming to???!!! (But you predicted SOME would do that, huh?) :thumbsup

[Timmy]

GHASP! What ware we coming to???!!! (But you predicted SOME would do that, huh?) :thumbsup

Yep.

[mfblume]

Yep.

And preachers count on that when they preach and speak in tongues.

Shame shame.

[KWSS1976]

Hey Randy nice to know someone on here listens to Queensryche also...I have this as my ringtone on my phone..LOL

Hush now, don't you cry
Wipe away the teardrop from your eye
You're lying safe in bed
It was all a bad dream
Spinning in your head
Your mind tricked you to feel the pain
Of someone close to you leaving the game of life
So here it is, another chance
Wide awake you face the day
Your dream is over... or has it just begun?

There's a place I like to hide
A doorway that I run through in the night
Relax child, you were there
But only didn't realize it and you were scared
It's a place where you will learn
To face your fears, retrace the years
And ride the whims of your mind
Commanding in another world
Suddenly you hear and see
This magic new dimension

I- will be watching over you
I- am gonna help you see it through
I- will protect you in the night
I- am smiling next to you, in Silent Lucidity

[spoken during solo]
(Visualize your dream)
(Record it in the present tense)
(Put it into a permanent form)
(If you persist in your efforts)
(You can achieve dream control)
(Dream control)
(How's that then, better?)
(Hug me)

If you open your mind for me
You won't rely on open eyes to see
The walls you built within
Come tumbling down, and a new world will begin
Living twice at once you learn
You're safe from the pain in the dream domain
A soul set free to fly
A round trip journey in your head
Master of illusion, can you realize
Your dream's alive, you can be the guide but...

I- will be watching over you
I- am gonna help to see it through
I- will protect you in the night
I- am smiling next to you....


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_V92cqMgMAM

[Pressing-On]

I know what you mean, but even in 1 Cor 14, or prophecy, although I feel I have a good handle on it, I still do not allow myself to say I have my mind made up about it. I may be misisng something. But that's just me. lol

God bless, sister!

I agree with you that we should always keep in mind that we might be missing something. I view many of the posters, here, having that same opinion - no matter when and if we disagree.

Although, in a discussion like the one on this thread, I must put out that I am very decided about my view as opposed to any other. Nothing here has changed my mind, in other words.

I do feel I need to point out that YOU have very decided opinions and views on things that you believe which is very evident on any thread where you, TKBurk and Brother Epley are posting. ;)

I have more confidence in someone that has a decided view, after much study, who is also willing to change their view - if - any information put forth has any merit. So, I believe we do agree. :friend

[Pressing-On]

What if some of those answers are wrong? Still want to cling to them, no matter what?
If proved to be wrong, it is only logical to change your stance.

What I wouldn't do is change my view just because someone felt their argument was better, if they tried to intimidate me, or tried to bully me.

[Timmy]

If proved to be wrong, it is only logical to change your stance.

What I wouldn't do is change my view just because someone felt their argument was better, if they tried to intimidate me, or tried to bully me.

:thumbsup

[Pressing-On]

:thumbsup

Just wanted you to know that you can't bully me - TIM-MAY!!! :toofunny

[Timmy]

Just wanted you to know that you can't bully me - TIM-MAY!!! :toofunny

Oh, I know that. But I can still try! :ursofunny

[mfblume]

I agree with you that we should always keep in mind that we might be missing something. I view many of the posters, here, having that same opinion - no matter when and if we disagree.

Although, in a discussion like the one on this thread, I must put out that I am very decided about my view as opposed to any other. Nothing here has changed my mind, in other words.

I do feel I need to point out that YOU have very decided opinions and views on things that you believe which is very evident on any thread where you, TKBurk and Brother Epley are posting. ;)

I have more confidence in someone that has a decided view, after much study, who is also willing to change their view - if - any information put forth has any merit. So, I believe we do agree. :friend

I am indeed decided, but I always tag that along with a constant awareness I may have missed something. I just cannot bring myself to say I cannot be wrong. Anyway, noting that nothing yet changed your mind is a better explanation of why you said what you did. :)

[Pressing-On]

I am indeed decided, but I always tag that along with a constant awareness I may have missed something. I just cannot bring myself to say I cannot be wrong. Anyway, noting that nothing yet changed your mind is a better explanation of why you said what you did. :)
I appreciate that you called me on my wording. It certainly did appear that I had shut and locked the door. That was not my intention and I will be more careful in the future. :)

Anyway, noting that nothing yet changed your mind is a better explanation of why you said what you did. :)

Thank you - YES - that is exactly what I intended to convey. If what is written does not make me change my mind, then I stand with my view - solid. :D

We must be kindred spirits - because you are the same way!!! You know I had to add that!! :toofunny :bliss

[Jermyn Davidson]

back on page 5, I used a "trick" in my response to mfblume after he paid me a compliment-- but some folks did not understand that my response was a joke-- using internet trick I learned very recently.


after an email or two, I thought it appropriate to say that it was a joke and it was not meant to slam blume or offend anyone....


my sincerest apologies.


carry-on.

[Timmy]

back on page 5, I used a "trick" in my response to mfblume after he paid me a compliment-- but some folks did not understand that my response was a joke-- using internet trick I learned very recently.


after an email or two, I thought it appropriate to say that it was a joke and it was not meant to slam blume or offend anyone....


my sincerest apologies.


carry-on.

Was [you] confused, again???

[nahkoe]

back on page 5, I used a "trick" in my response to mfblume after he paid me a compliment-- but some folks did not understand that my response was a joke-- using internet trick I learned very recently.


after an email or two, I thought it appropriate to say that it was a joke and it was not meant to slam blume or offend anyone....


my sincerest apologies.


carry-on.

Was [you] confused, again???


Oh this is just funny!

I do admit you did a very good job with that Jermyn. lol It was very subtle.

[HopePreacher]

Was [you] confused, again???

I'm not comfused am I?

[Jermyn Davidson]

I'm not comfused am I?

apparently yes [you].

[you] is confused.

[Timmy]

I'm not comfused am I?

:laffatu Yes you are! :laffatu

[*AQuietPlace*]

One of these days I'm going to smack someone over that 'you' trick! ;) It's incredibly disconcerting. :lol

[HopePreacher]

OK - I'm confused, but what am I confused about?

The neatest thing about getting old, and feeling a little dementia, is that I get to hide my own Easter Eggs.

[GrowingPains]

Confused again?
Now, why the low blow?

Am pardon me, but I'm confused what you are accusing me of being confused about :)

Mind explaining? I mean, it is about me after all.

[Timmy]

OK - I'm confused, but what am I confused about?

The neatest thing about getting old, and feeling a little dementia, is that I get to hide my own Easter Eggs.

Oh, I know that feeling! And it's nice to be surprised by a movie's surprise ending, every time I re-watch it! :lol

Confused again?
Now, why the low blow?

Am pardon me, but I'm confused what you are accusing me of being confused about :)

Mind explaining? I mean, it is about me after all.

OK, I can't stand to see all the pain and suffering I've caused, anymore. ;) I must put an end to it! There's a little trick built in to this board that replaces [ you ] (only without the spaces, which I put in so the trick wouldn't "take") with the user ID of whoever is reading the post.

There. Feel better?

[GrowingPains]

Oh, I know that feeling! And it's nice to be surprised by a movie's surprise ending, every time I re-watch it! :lol



OK, I can't stand to see all the pain and suffering I've caused, anymore. ;) I must put an end to it! There's a little trick built in to this board that replaces [ you ] (only without the spaces, which I put in so the trick wouldn't "take") with the user ID of whoever is reading the post.

There. Feel better?

Nope, confused again :sad

[Falla39]

Was [you] confused, again???



Falla was NOT corn-fused! That's why I didn't respond. I remember
when we went through that a long time ago. I recognized the joke
and knew that J. Davidson did not usually talk like that to me. LOL!!
Falla may have been born AT night, but it wasn't last night!!:ursofunny

Hugs,

Falla39

[HopePreacher]

speaking of little tricks.... (I'll just hijack this thread a little further"

I was once preaching a series on the 10 commandments. When I got to Adultry I realized I had never preached a whole sermon on adutry before... In the middle of the sermon I stopped, looked slowly across the congregation of about 400 people and said, "God has given me a special gift. I can look across a congregation and tell who's been committing adultry." I then stood very quiet for about 10 seconds as I scanned the congregation. I couldn't believe how many people were counting their shoe laces.

Then I said, smiling, "I was just kidding, but now I know."

The good news is they didn't fire me... that week.

[GrowingPains]

Okay, I read page 5. Never remember seeing that comment! ha!

You're right, you pay your own bills, Mister!

[GrowingPains]

speaking of little tricks.... (i'll just hijack this thread a little further"

i was once preaching a series on the 10 commandments. When i got to adultry i realized i had never preached a whole sermon on adutry before... In the middle of the sermon i stopped, looked slowly across the congregation of about 400 people and said, "god has given me a special gift. I can look across a congregation and tell who's been committing adultry." i then stood very quiet for about 10 seconds as i scanned the congregation. I couldn't believe how many people were counting their shoe laces.

Then i said, smiling, "i was just kidding, but now i know."

the good news is they didn't fire me... That week.

roflol!

[Jermyn Davidson]

Oh this is just funny!

I do admit you did a very good job with that Jermyn. lol It was very subtle.

thanks a million!!!!

[Jermyn Davidson]

speaking of little tricks.... (I'll just hijack this thread a little further"

I was once preaching a series on the 10 commandments. When I got to Adultry I realized I had never preached a whole sermon on adutry before... In the middle of the sermon I stopped, looked slowly across the congregation of about 400 people and said, "God has given me a special gift. I can look across a congregation and tell who's been committing adultry." I then stood very quiet for about 10 seconds as I scanned the congregation. I couldn't believe how many people were counting their shoe laces.

Then I said, smiling, "I was just kidding, but now I know."

The good news is they didn't fire me... that week.


Now that's just too much!!! :)

[Jermyn Davidson]

Falla was NOT corn-fused! That's why I didn't respond. I remember
when we went through that a long time ago. I recognized the joke
and knew that J. Davidson did not usually talk like that to me. LOL!!
Falla may have been born AT night, but it wasn't last night!!:ursofunny

Hugs,

Falla39

Yes Ma'am, you are right!

[SeekingOne]

Was [you] confused, again???

Yes :ursofunny :smack I was confused AGAIN! :blush It happens with age, but I won't get confused again, at least not today. :nutso

[*AQuietPlace*]

Nope, confused again :sad
Everyone who is reading that is seeing their own user name. You see yours, I see mine. Make sense? :)

[Hoovie]

Would someone here please say what needs to be said in plain English so that the unlearned can say "Amen"?


;)

[*AQuietPlace*]

Would someone here please say what needs to be said in plain English so that the unlearned can say "Amen"?


;)
Go ahead, give the interpretation. :)

[mfblume]

Everyone who is reading that is seeing their own user name. You see yours, I see mine. Make sense? :)

That is so cool.

How is it done?

[mfblume]

Ok, I figured it out. [you] helped me. lololol

That is really cool!

I was trying to figure out how I, myself, figured into this, especially when Jermyn said I made a compliment about him and it appeared as though I did not pay his bills anyway. That was weird. lol

What you do is put square brackets around the word YOU, and it makes each person read their own username in its place.

I hope I was not supposed to not reveal this trick.

[Pressing-On]

Ok, I figured it out. [you] helped me. lololol

That is really cool!

:toofunny Always happy to oblige! :toofunny

[mfblume]

Now I know what happened the first time I saw this used and could not recall me being involved in the issue. lol I thought everyone was pretending to be me!!!! :D lol

[Pressing-On]

Now I know what happened to first time I saw this used and could not recall me being involved in the issue. lol I thought everyone was pretending to be me!!!! :D lol

The Mrs was rollling when I couldn't figure out what was going on - long time ago on NFCF! LOL!

[mfblume]

The Mrs was rollling when I couldn't figure out what was going on - long time ago on NFCF! LOL!

Ahhh. Ok. haha. That REALLY is funny.

[Timmy]

Whew, finally! [you] understands! :bliss

[GrowingPains]

Whew, finally! [you] understands! :bliss

:foottap