Is Zionism Christian ?

[Scott Hutchinson]

Is Zionism Christian or Compatible with New Testament Christianity ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RjnvQHWyLE&feature=related

[Scott Hutchinson]

Just for the record I am not AntiSemitic as God loves the people in Israel dearly,I pray people over there find true salvation through Jesus Christ.

The Lord loves all kindreds,races,tongues the same.

[mfblume]

Zionism technically is not Christian, but the question is whether or not Zionism is complementary to the Christian concept of Israel. Personally, I say no. Zionism is the secularization of Israel, rendering Israel's position in the middle east nothing to do with God's promises or God whatsoever. They secularized the term JEW to mean a race, when in reality it is certainly NOT a race according to Orthodox Jews. Some watered-down Judaists try to work with Zionism as though it is religious, just as many forms of Christians today will go along with many things that are inherently not Christian whatsoever, like Zionism (;)).

And Scott is right, antisemitism is evil. Paul said the Gospel was for Israel and Judah, and we simply got let in on it as Gentiles. The body of Christ is Jew and Gentile reconciled to God together by the cross. People who hate Jews better get out of the church, since the church's whole existence is one body made from Jew and Gentile!

[Digging4Truth]

Zionism technically is not Christian, but the question is whether or not Zionism is complementary to the Christian concept of Israel. Personally, I say no. Zionism is the secularization of Israel, rendering Israel's position in the middle east nothing to do with God's promises or God whatsoever. They secularized the term JEW to mean a race, when in reality it is certainly NOT a race according to Orthodox Jews. Some watered-down Judaists try to work with Zionism as though it is religious, just as many forms of Christians today will go along with many things that are inherently not Christian whatsoever, like Zionism (;)).

And Scott is right, antisemitism is evil. Paul said the Gospel was for Israel and Judah, and we simply got let in on it as Gentiles. The body of Christ is Jew and Gentile reconciled to God together by the cross. People who hate Jews better get out of the church, since the church's whole existence is one body made from Jew and Gentile!

Agreed.

[Scott Hutchinson]

This is from The Jewish Virtual Library.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Zionism/christianzionism.html

[mfblume]

Usually Christian Zionists make the mistake of thinking blessing Abraham to be blessed and cursing Abraham to be cursed is speaking about the people of nature Israel, when in reality only those of Israel in Christ are blessed.

God was speaking of CHRISTIANS -- both of Jewish and Gentile origin, who are the ones people should bless in order to be blessed. Jews still under law are under a curse, and in no way can be referring to those whom God said would give others a blessing if they should bless them.

Galatians 3:9-13 KJV So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham. (10) For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. (11) But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. (12) And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them. (13) Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Galatians 3:29 KJV And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.


Saying God referred to natural Israelites as a source of blessing is anti-New Testament. God was actually speaking of the church.

[Scott Hutchinson]

If I understand correctly Jesus was the seed of Abraham.All of those in Him are the children of Abraham by faith.So we couldn't under new covenant terms have two seeds of Abraham in covenant with The Lord,I wouldn't think. I understand both Jew and Gentile make up the one new man in Christ. All Israel is not Israel.
Did not Jesus tell some folks one time,even though they naturally were the seed of Abraham,they were of their father the devil because they did not do the works of Abraham.

[Scott Hutchinson]

All religions that deny the blood of Christ,and that He alone provides salvation are false.

[onefaith2]

If I understand correctly Jesus was the seed of Abraham.All of those in Him are the children of Abraham by faith.So we couldn't under new covenant terms have two seeds of Abraham in covenant with The Lord,I wouldn't think. I understand both Jew and Gentile make up the one new man in Christ. All Israel is not Israel.
Did not Jesus tell some folks one time,even though they naturally were the seed of Abraham,they were of their father the devil because they did not do the works of Abraham.

Zionists typically see the people of Israel retained certain promises because of their position in end time events such as all the armies gathered together to fight them, etc.

Preterism denies this because they believe that all happened in 70 AD. Futurist on the other hand have to acknowledge Israel is a brewing point for world scale war.

I think that is the stem of Zionism in the sense that the land of Israel plays a big part in the ultime scheme of Armageddon. Politically it seems the U.S. favors a form of Zionism as we definitely align ourselves with Israel. The only two countries seemingly that remain faithful to that country is England and the U.S.

[Scott Hutchinson]

There are alot of futurist and historicists who believe the church is the Israel of God.
The point is that unless someone is under the new covenant they are lost,there is no Jewish bride and Gentile church,only the church.
ACTS 2:38,39 for whosoever will.

[Scott Hutchinson]

Zionists believe they should rule the world because they feel they are Abraham's seed.

[Scott Hutchinson]

Please understand,I have no qualms about Israel existing as a country,but there is alot in the scripture to consider on a subject like this.

[mfblume]

Zionists typically see the people of Israel retained certain promises because of their position in end time events such as all the armies gathered together to fight them, etc.

Preterism denies this because they believe that all happened in 70 AD. Futurist on the other hand have to acknowledge Israel is a brewing point for world scale war.

I think that is the stem of Zionism in the sense that the land of Israel plays a big part in the ultime scheme of Armageddon. Politically it seems the U.S. favors a form of Zionism as we definitely align ourselves with Israel. The only two countries seemingly that remain faithful to that country is England and the U.S.

Partial preterists do not see all prophecy fulfilled in AD70. Please keep that in mind.

Also, Zionism is SECULAR not religious. People can FIT it in with their religion, but in and of itself it is not religious nor spiritual. Zionism claims that Jews are a race and that they deserve their own land for no more nor any less reasons than any other nationality. Technically Zionists DO NOT attribute that to spiritual reasons such as prophecies. Others who are religious MAY THINK that is a spiritual fulfillment of prophecy, but Zionism itself does not. They may TAKE ADVANTAGE of prophecies to further its secular ends, but Zionism is not religious itself.

Christian Zionists are obviously religious. But Zionism itself is not.

Seeking to have favour with Israel for religious reasons is error, I think, UNLESS we simply are being good Samaritans as we should to ANYONE ELSE. Again, the basis of religious reasons to be favourable towards Israel are ill founded and faulty interpretations of God telling Abraham that whoever blesses him will be blessed in return.

I think we should help Israel because they are the only ones there with democracy and that we should love the natural Jews just for the sake of them having been blessed in times past, but not to fulfill prophecies.

[Scott Hutchinson]

I hate what happened in WW2, it was horrible and so wicked ,the crimes committed against humanity.There is a difference between being Jewish and a Zionist.

[Scott Hutchinson]

There is a final resurrection yet to happen and a final judgement.

[mfblume]

I hate what happened in WW2, it was horrible and so wicked ,the crimes committed against humanity.There is a difference between being Jewish and a Zionist.

Amen. :thumbsup

Any nutcase that would condone the holocaust is simply evil.

[Scott Hutchinson]

I have daughters,and I can hardly watch the Diary Of Anne Frank without crying.
Another thing that gets my goat is that here in America we used some of those monsters as rocket scientists in the space program,shame shame.

Oscar Scheindler wasn't allowed to come here ,because he did have a membership in the Nazi party,which I understand he never supported he saved alot of people from death,he had to flee to Brazil or some place after the war.

[Scott Hutchinson]

The Lord died for all of these people both Jews And Arabs,and there are radicals on both sides.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lX18zUp6WPY&feature=related

[Praxeas]

The only thing compatible with Christianity IS Christianity. Zionism is not in anyway "christian"

[Scott Hutchinson]

The only thing compatible with Christianity IS Christianity. Zionism is not in anyway "christian"

Thank you.

[BroGary]

You can be anti-zionist without being anti-semetic.

There is way too much info to post it all here, but zionism is being used as a tool of the Luciferian NWO who want to set up the capital of the Antichrist one world government in Jerusalem.

The Luciferian NWO consists of both Jews and Gentiles, not all Jews are part of the NWO, the Torah Jews who reject the evil Talmud and Cabala are actually persecuted by their fellow Jews who are Luciferian Freemason NWO Cabala Jews.

Unfortunately the Jews that are in power in Israel are the Luciferian NWO Jews, just like the many presidents in the U.S. who have been high level Luciferian Freemasons also betraying our country into a global government. (the Talmud/Cabala Jews are like a modern day version of the Pharisees, and you know how harshly Jesus spoke against the Pharisees)

http://kenraggio.com/KRPN-DevilinNWO.htm

http://www.texemarrs.com/122010/they.htm

http://www.henrymakow.com/000447.html

http://www.henrymakow.com/the_banker_conspiracy.html

http://www.iamthewitness.com/books/Andrew.Carrington.Hitchcock/Synagogue.of.Satan/0740-1818.htm

http://www.scribd.com/doc/8099145/Carr-Pawns-in-the-Game-International-Conspiracy-Exposed-1958

[Scott Hutchinson]

Thanks for the info,BroGary.

[mfblume]

You can be anti-zionist without being anti-semetic.

Correct!

[BroGary]

Correct!

Also, I have heard that the NWO globalists try to take full advantage of quieting dissent to the zionist connection to the Luciferian NWO by automatically hollering "anti-semetic" against anyone who tries to expose the connection between zionism and the Luciferian NWO.

(the thing is, there have been, and are Jews who are anti-zionist and have tried to warn the public to some aspect of as to the true Luciferian globalist agenda of the zionists, including Henry Makow, Jack Bernstein, Henry H. Klein, Benjamin Freedman, and others)

.......people need to realize we are not anti-semetic - .....but we are anti-NWO..... and the Luciferian NWO are using zionism as a tool for their Luciferian one world government agenda.

(remembering that the Luciferian NWO consists of BOTH some Luciferian Jews AND some Luciferian Gentiles as well as many lower level unwitting pawns who have been duped into helping their agenda)

[BroGary]

Thanks for the info,BroGary.

No problem, there is so much info to research that fits together like the pieces of a jigsaw puzzle.

The Satanic "New Age" lie from the Garden of Eden - "ye shall be as gods" - evolved into the "Mystery Babylon" New Age beliefs, which is not really new but can followed from Nimrod, the tower of Babel and ancient Babylon down thru history and has adepts in various cultures, and yes, even includes some of the Jewish culture from where many Israelites adopted pagan Babylonian beliefs from their capitivity in Babylon and after generations of passing down those occult beliefs, now have modern day Freemason "pharisees" in control in Israel who follow the evil Talmud and Cabala. (there are also Khazarian (fake) "Jews" involved in the NWO in addition to the apostate Jews, but that could be another topic in itself)

In our age, Freemasonry seems the be main connecting group for the NWO, and it is the higher level Freemasons who are Luciferian, the lower levels are used as an unwitting cloak of benevolance for the evil at the top, and it is very interesting at how many high level leaders have been high level Freemasons, both in the U.S. and Israel, as well as other countries, even Arab and Islamic countries, these leaders put on a good outward show for the public, but behind the scenes are on the same basic page of manipulating the public into eventually accepting a one world government.

The history of MYSTERY BABYLON and the NEW WORLD ORDER

Here is an excellent source of info on the history of the NWO and how the "Mystery Babylon" belief system has continued thru to modern times, it has been cloaked with many cover groups to hide their real beliefs from the general public, but they are close to realizing their Luciferian New World Order (the antichrist one world government prophesied in the Bible)

Note: when listening to his broadcasts, keep in mind that he oftens reads research that shows the "Mystery Babylon" beliefs from the NWO's point of view, it may sound like he is saying it as if he believed that way, but occasionally he will remind his listeners that he is saying what THEY believe, NOT his own beliefs.

He did a lot of other shortwave radio broadcasts over the years (before the NWO had him killed) but these here focus on a series he did on the history of "Mystery Babylon" - a total of 42 broadcasts.

These first links have MP3 files you can download and listen to, there is another web site

(I included a couple of the links further below) where people have transcribed those broadcasts into written words for those who prefer to read rather than listen.

http://remnantradio.org/Archives/articles/William%20Cooper/Mystery%20Babylon/MB1.htm

http://remnantradio.org/Archives/articles/William%20Cooper/Mystery%20Babylon/MB2.htm

http://remnantradio.org/Archives/articles/William%20Cooper/Mystery%20Babylon/MB3.htm

http://remnantradio.org/Archives/articles/William%20Cooper/Mystery%20Babylon/MB4.htm

(a couple of the transcribed broadcasts, the others are available on the same site below)

http://deceivedworld.blogspot.com/2010/09/william-coopers-mystery-babylon-part-15.html

http://deceivedworld.blogspot.com/2010/09/william-coopers-mystery-babylon-part-13.html

[Scott Hutchinson]

What think ye of this ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fH3_WxtjZCc&feature=related

[Scott Hutchinson]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXCoGZjEI8w&feature=related