Purpose of Christianity

[Dedicated Mind]

I've been reading some about gnostic christianity and the attainment of spiritual levels and self realization in Christ. It got me to thinking about what is the purpose of christianity. Is the purpose self realization or producing a Godly character with good works? Is that all there is to religion or is there something more? What is your opinion?

[Amanah]

I think the purpose of Christianity is to restore humanities' relationship with God so that we can be seated with him in heavenly places in this world and the world to come.

[Amanah]

I've been reading some about gnostic christianity and the attainment of spiritual levels and self realization in Christ. It got me to thinking about what is the purpose of christianity. Is the purpose self realization or producing a Godly character with good works? Is that all there is to religion or is there something more? What is your opinion?

Self realization typically means realizing that we are one with God, our soul is already "God"

Christianity teaches that man has a fallen nature and needs to be redeemed by receiving the Spirit of God

The first concept is deception, the second concept is redemption.

[Godsdrummer]

I've been reading some about gnostic christianity and the attainment of spiritual levels and self realization in Christ. It got me to thinking about what is the purpose of christianity. Is the purpose self realization or producing a Godly character with good works? Is that all there is to religion or is there something more? What is your opinion?

Now that is a good question, and put it that way made me stop and think, out side the box!!! You see 2000 years after the on set of Christianity we have to get out of the box, that is the only way to see what has become traditions and what is true relationship with God.

First one must realize that christianity was and out growth of the kingdom of God. Futher we speak of christianity as if it is a living being self propelled enity. Christianity is nothing, it has no purpose, can not do anything of itself, christianity is nothing more than another religion in a world that needs relationhip with God in the kingdom of God.

You make two statements which show forth the base thinking of religious thought.
Is the purpose self relization.
or the production of Godly character with Good works.

First religion/christianity may cause us to realize our faults, but that is where it must stop we cannot produce a Godly character on our own by good works. We can only become like God as we become closer to him in relationship with him.

[Dedicated Mind]

Self realization typically means realizing that we are one with God, our soul is already "God"

Christianity teaches that man has a fallen nature and needs to be redeemed by receiving the Spirit of God

The first concept is deception, the second concept is redemption.

Amanah, I don't disagree with your definitions of self realization, but I think there are some parallels between gnostic's attaining spiritual levels and Paul's growing to the fulness of the stature of christ. There are other weird gnostic doctrines like the spiritualization of Mary Magdalene and the divine feminine, but I am only searching for NT parallels.

I was just wondering if receiving the Holy Ghost, we can attain spirituality. It would not be our own spirit, but our spirit through the HG. What have you studied about self realization? You seem to know a good definition.

[Dedicated Mind]

I think the purpose of Christianity is to restore humanities' relationship with God so that we can be seated with him in heavenly places in this world and the world to come. I agree with your statement, but how does restoring relationship change us? Do we grow spiritually or do we change our character and produce good works? Maybe both, but how much can we grow?

[Dedicated Mind]

Now that is a good question, and put it that way made me stop and think, out side the box!!! You see 2000 years after the on set of Christianity we have to get out of the box, that is the only way to see what has become traditions and what is true relationship with God.

First one must realize that christianity was and out growth of the kingdom of God. Futher we speak of christianity as if it is a living being self propelled enity. Christianity is nothing, it has no purpose, can not do anything of itself, christianity is nothing more than another religion in a world that needs relationhip with God in the kingdom of God.

You make two statements which show forth the base thinking of religious thought.
Is the purpose self relization.
or the production of Godly character with Good works.

First religion/christianity may cause us to realize our faults, but that is where it must stop we cannot produce a Godly character on our own by good works. We can only become like God as we become closer to him in relationship with him.

GD, you make some profound points. What I would like to know is, assuming we have an acts 2:38 relationship with God, what next? Amanah is correct in her definition of self realization, that is similar to all new age religions, that it is becoming like God. So you think realizing our faults is the height of spiritual growth and anything after that is through relationship? If that is true, how far can relationship take us? Is the ultimate purpose to grow by loving God or good works by loving our neighbor or both? I know I'm repeating myself but I would like to know what does relationship produce in us?

[TGBTG]

I agree with your statement, but how does restoring relationship change us? Do we grow spiritually or do we change our character and produce good works? Maybe both, but how much can we grow?

God works in us as we yield to his Spirit, and as a result, we produce good works.

[Amanah]

Amanah, I don't disagree with your definitions of self realization, but I think there are some parallels between gnostic's attaining spiritual levels and Paul's growing to the fulness of the stature of christ. There are other weird gnostic doctrines like the spiritualization of Mary Magdalene and the divine feminine, but I am only searching for NT parallels.

I was just wondering if receiving the Holy Ghost, we can attain spirituality. It would not be our own spirit, but our spirit through the HG. What have you studied about self realization? You seem to know a good definition.

I have an English/Humanities degree from Rollin College.

I have read and studied Buddhist and Hindu literature quite extensively, along with Plato and the Christian Mystics. I would say that Gnosticism is a child of Platonism and Eastern religion, combined with "Christian" ideas.

Plato, Hinduism and others teach that there is a "world soul" and self realization is to ultimately understand that all things are one, we are one with the world soul, one with each other

Buddhism teaches that all things are one, the very air that you breath was breathed by someone before you. Through meditation, we come to realize the oneness of ourself with God and each other.

there is no separate self. each molecule of your body is regenerated every three years, where is your self? who are you?
are you your body? no, its constantly changing
are you your mind, your thoughts move in a constant stream
who are you?

so you find the divine through meditation, see below

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gnosticism

Gnosis (γνῶσις) refers to knowledge of the second kind. Therefore, in a religious context, to be 'Gnostic' should be understood as being reliant not on knowledge in a general sense, but as being specially receptive to mystical or esoteric experiences of direct participation with the divine. Indeed, in most Gnostic systems the sufficient cause of salvation is this 'knowledge of' ('acquaintance with') the divine. This is commonly identified with a process of inward 'knowing' or self-exploration, comparable to that encouraged by Plotinus (c. 205–270 AD).

[Amanah]

so that is not the same as being filled with the Holy Ghost. We don't find the Holy Ghost through meditation to experience union with the divine from within.

We repent, realize we are sinners and separate from God, and God fills us with the Holy Ghost, which was not in us before we started our spiritual journey

[Amanah]

I agree with your statement, but how does restoring relationship change us? Do we grow spiritually or do we change our character and produce good works? Maybe both, but how much can we grow?

We can become the conduit for the Holy Ghost. Through prayer and fasting and reading your bible, and intercessory prayer for souls, you can literally be Jesus to a lost and dying world. You can grow to the point that you can see the lame walk, and the blind see and the dead raised, and any mountian moved. Any thing that Jesus did, we can do if we yield to the Spirit of God.

Any thing that the Apostles did, you can do. You can walk in the power and demonstration of the Holy Ghost. You can have the mind of Christ. You can hear the voice of God, and be led of the Spirit.

[Amanah]

And that is much more exciting then sitting and meditating and withdrawing from the world into yourself.

[mfblume]

The purpose of Christianity is to allow God to get on with His original Plan to have a BRIDE and OFFSPRING -- a family. This is why He made man ALONE and then took from within man the material to make EVE. It is what He would do through the cross. Man would therefore rule the world and see in earth what is true in Heaven with God ruling Heaven. An image of God in earth. God thereby manifesting into the physical through mankind, as a wife bears children for her husband.

[Dedicated Mind]

The purpose of Christianity is to allow God to get on with His original Plan to have a BRIDE and OFFSPRING -- a family. This is why He made man ALONE and then took from within man the material to make EVE. It is what He would do through the cross. Man would therefore rule the world and see in earth what is true in Heaven with God ruling Heaven. An image of God in earth. God thereby manifesting into the physical through mankind, as a wife bears children for her husband.

interesting thought blume, but how does christianity transform us individually and in the present? how does your view differ from kingdom now doctrine? are you saying we are to rule in this present age? how about the antichrist ruling all nations?

[Godsdrummer]

GD, you make some profound points. What I would like to know is, assuming we have an acts 2:38 relationship with God, what next? Amanah is correct in her definition of self realization, that is similar to all new age religions, that it is becoming like God. So you think realizing our faults is the height of spiritual growth and anything after that is through relationship? If that is true, how far can relationship take us? Is the ultimate purpose to grow by loving God or good works by loving our neighbor or both? I know I'm repeating myself but I would like to know what does relationship produce in us?

Why do you take on a Acts 2:38 plan of salvation? There is no Acts 2:38 relationship with God. Acts 2:28 is nothing but steps man takes to fell justified in the face of realization he is a sinner. If one does not rest in the power of the holy ghost (let the holy ghost lead them) they are no better than any other religious organization. Falling back on the org. doctrines and traditions, never going on to true relationship with God. Resting in thier works of justification and not the blood of christ.

Realizing our faults is not the height of sprititual growth, it is only the beginning. The difference is not where you go from there, it is how!!! When one turns to following the doctrinal teaching of organized religion you do not let the spirit of God lead resting instead on works (self reliance on your own actions). On the other hand if one deepens his/her relationship with God questioning with self study of Gods word seeking him for answers, learning to hear his voice over mans. This is the true meaning of walking after the spirit and not after the flesh. The closer you get to God the more you become like him, this is a natural trait of relationship.

The ultimite purpose is growth by love of God, thereby we will love our nieghbor. They that know God will love because God is love.

We can become the conduit for the Holy Ghost. Through prayer and fasting and reading your bible, and intercessory prayer for souls, you can literally be Jesus to a lost and dying world. You can grow to the point that you can see the lame walk, and the blind see and the dead raised, and any mountian moved. Any thing that Jesus did, we can do if we yield to the Spirit of God.

Any thing that the Apostles did, you can do. You can walk in the power and demonstration of the Holy Ghost. You can have the mind of Christ. You can hear the voice of God, and be led of the Spirit.

Exactly Amanah, the problem in today's society is we don't walk in the power of God and demonstration of the holy ghost. We walk in that statuetes of whatever organization we become apart of there by loosing the conection of the spirit for the traditions, vain deciet, and phylosophy of man and not after Christ.

Note: we quote this passage to argue oneness and miss the whole point Paul is directing us to. Putting Christ first and not following the precepts of man.

The purpose of Christianity is to allow God to get on with His original Plan to have a BRIDE and OFFSPRING -- a family. This is why He made man ALONE and then took from within man the material to make EVE. It is what He would do through the cross. Man would therefore rule the world and see in earth what is true in Heaven with God ruling Heaven. An image of God in earth. God thereby manifesting into the physical through mankind, as a wife bears children for her husband.

Mike as I said in my original quote Christianity is mans idea of what God intended his kingdom to be. Other than that I agree with everything else you state. The purpose of the kingdom of God is to allow...

interesting thought blume, but how does christianity transform us individually and in the present? how does your view differ from kingdom now doctrine? are you saying we are to rule in this present age? how about the antichrist ruling all nations?

Dedicated mind that is one of the main problems with Christianity and religion thier man made doctrines and peoples acceptance of them without prayer and study and asking God to give them understanding. Your statement on anti christ ruling all nations is a man made idea built upon false pretences and twisting scripture to say what man wants it to say.

[Hoovie]

... is dinners on the ground???

[mfblume]

interesting thought blume, but how does christianity transform us individually and in the present? how does your view differ from kingdom now doctrine? are you saying we are to rule in this present age? how about the antichrist ruling all nations?

In the present we come into dominion spiritually alone. Not physically over taking positions as mayor, etc. Kingdom Now teaches that we take over the ARTS and the POLITICS and the EDUCATION system. That is not what I believe. That is carnal. I believe the KINGDOM is spiritual alone. Victory over devils and sin and sickness. that type of thing.

I do not believe in a future antichrist coming as dispensationalism teaches. I believe the beast (not antichrist, by the way) was Nero and Rome, and many antichrists exist today in the form of people who simply deny Jesus came in flesh. I do not know why people ever came to confuse the antichrist of 1 John 2 and 1 John 4 as the beast. But that is another discussion.

[Godsdrummer]

In the present we come into dominion spiritually alone. Not physically over taking positions as mayor, etc. Kingdom Now teaches that we take over the ARTS and the POLITICS and the EDUCATION system. That is not what I believe. That is carnal. I believe the KINGDOM is spiritual alone. Victory over devils and sin and sickness. that type of thing.

I do not believe in a future antichrist coming as dispensationalism teaches. I believe the beast (not antichrist, by the way) was Nero and Rome, and many antichrists exist today in the form of people who simply deny Jesus came in flesh. I do not know why people ever came to confuse the antichrist of 1 John 2 and 1 John 4 as the beast. But that is another discussion.

:thumbsup