Something sad happened the other day

[Sister Alvear]

I was buying some things at Walmart and among the things I was buying was Knee High hose. As the lady was ringing up the things she looked at me and said, You know I used to be Pentecostal. I told her I was a missionary and even though there were people in our line she talked to me a few minutes. She mentioned the hose. She said that growing up the church (many of you would know both the church and the pastor she mentioned) we HAD to wear hose, she said...and the preacher was sooooooooooooo hard...I don't know if all she told me was true but I would imagine it is...she was soooooooooooooo bitter....I stood there wondering if her bitterness matched the preacher's hardness or vice versa...
I really left Walmart with tears over a soul that seemed (?) to have been driven away instead of wooed to God and His love...
Please do not say I am knocking standards for I am not...but I am wondering what kind of Christ do we offer to a lost world?

I have prayed much for tis girl and wish you folks would just mention in your prayers...the girl Sister Alvear met at Walmart...I will not mention names so please do not PM me about this...however her look and her wounded spirit seems to be with me...

OH, God please don't let me hurt the hurting...or kill the half dead....

[Sister Alvear]

Please do not turn this into a standards thread...we have enough of them...thanks...

[scotty]

My pastor delivered a sermon on this. He challenged us to list everything we are for. The world knows Pentecost by what they are against, can we witness to someone with a list of things we are for ?

[RandyWayne]

My pastor delivered a sermon on this. He challenged us to list everything we are for. The world knows Pentecost by what they are against, can we witness to someone with a list of things we are for ?

Mike Warnke had a line on one of his albums where he says "Well, we don't......" then rattles off about 30 things machine gun style.
"So what DO you do?",
"Why we just sit back and have a good time in the Lord. Amen. Hallelujah!".

What this lady said is exactly how I felt growing up -and I had it far easier being a guy!

[Sherri]

Please do not turn this into a standards thread...we have enough of them...thanks...Good luck with that. Ha!

[Sister Alvear]

Well. just wish kindness would be the law that governs us but I often fall so short....

[UnTraditional]

Momma Alvear, maybe you planted a seed of reconciliation into that woman's heart. People who are wounded in such a way are so because of the hardness of heart of those who hurt them many times. I will not make this a standards thread, except for the standard of His grace and mercy.

[Amanah]

Honestly, sometimes I think people dwell on things that were annoying and forget all the awesome things that happen/happened.

And Untraditional, your post is so tender that I think you must be really drawing close and walking close to the Lord these days.

[riverslivnwtr]

Good luck with that. Ha!

hello all, let me raise the only standard..it's not us at all it's Him....


Jesus said if he be lifted up, all men shall be drawn unto him...

We draw them by lifting up the only one who can reach all the standards..

His name is Jesus and he said that if we declare Him before men, he will declare us before his Father in Heaven , and before the holy angels...

I always get a thrill when I mention those words because my name is mentioned in heaven when Jesus is mentioned here in the earth by my tongue.. .... This is the only law I freely give to men...

it is a sword...
If we deny him, before men, then he will deny us before his Father and his holy angels....

when I tell someone did you know Jesus said this (which I mention above) I have put a responsibility of them to do the same..

I mean you can' argue with it..
Jesus said he will mention your name to his Father in heaven, when you do this and he will not mention you name when you don't... :smack

It gives me joy to say so today.. :heeheehee
I have lots more pleasures..
God bless you..,,,

[riverslivnwtr]

Sis, Alvear, I was first in tears when I read your post..but I quickly came out of it in my previous post..:happydance

[coadie]

Please do not turn this into a standards thread...we have enough of them...thanks...

You are fine. It is not about the standards. If you "peel the onion" and go deeper, it is something else. The first or even second item mention is not the issue,.
It is something else.

[Sister Alvear]

yes, it could be something else however it is easy to deeply hurt people...If our lives do not tell the story of Jesus then something is flawed in our experience....

My pastor is UC and I grew up in his church and NEVER one time did I ever know of anyone he hurt. Some people in my experience seem to think slapping people around is keeping them in order...My beef is not where you camp it is what SPIRIT drives you...

[hometown guy]

I was buying some things at Walmart and among the things I was buying was Knee High hose. As the lady was ringing up the things she looked at me and said, You know I used to be Pentecostal. I told her I was a missionary and even though there were people in our line she talked to me a few minutes. She mentioned the hose. She said that growing up the church (many of you would know both the church and the pastor she mentioned) we HAD to wear hose, she said...and the preacher was sooooooooooooo hard...I don't know if all she told me was true but I would imagine it is...she was soooooooooooooo bitter....I stood there wondering if her bitterness matched the preacher's hardness or vice versa...
I really left Walmart with tears over a soul that seemed (?) to have been driven away instead of wooed to God and His love...
Please do not say I am knocking standards for I am not...but I am wondering what kind of Christ do we offer to a lost world?

I have prayed much for tis girl and wish you folks would just mention in your prayers...the girl Sister Alvear met at Walmart...I will not mention names so please do not PM me about this...however her look and her wounded spirit seems to be with me...

OH, God please don't let me hurt the hurting...or kill the half dead....

Just curious why u would post this here where there are so many people with bitterness already toward churches that preach standards....

[Sister Alvear]

I don't think I will ever forget the look of hurt in that lady's eyes...I wanted to reach out and hug her...In fact I did tell her all of us are not the same....we may even LOOK alike but people's spirit's say a whole lot...

[riverslivnwtr]

You are fine. It is not about the standards. If you "peel the onion" and go deeper, it is something else. The first or even second item mention is not the issue,.
It is something else.


you start peeling me there'l be lots of tears..:laffatu

[Sister Alvear]

Just curious why u would post this here where there are so many people with bitterness already toward churches that preach standards....

Because most know we are not all alike....

[hometown guy]

Because most know we are not all alike....

With all do respect it would have been wiser just to say that she had been hurt by a preacher... The people on this form have a deep issue with standards... I feel this post can do more damage then anything else...they link all UC's with standards...

[Margies3]

With all do respect it would have been wiser just to say that she had been hurt by a preacher... The people on this form have a deep issue with standards... I feel this post can do more damage then anything else...they link all UC's with standards...

I disagree. I think the point is that we all - no matter whether we are strict standards people or if we are no standards people - we all need to be aware of the influence we have on those around us and the potential for being the source of someone's pain. We can believe however we choose. I know that Sis Alvear is UC. But I have never been offended by her stand because her approach is always with love. On the other hand, I've read some whose stand is more important to them than their love for people's souls. THOSE people offend me.

I grew up under some very UC pastors. That is not the life-style I am living now. But I was not HURT by any of my pastors. We may not agree and in fact, didn't agree often even when I sat under their teaching. But they reached out in LOVE, not in judgment.

I believe that what Sis Alvear wants us to walk away with here is to THINK about how we are reaching people. Don't drive them away with out judgments. Woooo them with our love. Right, Sis A? Love you, my twin!

[Sister Alvear]

I disagree. I think the point is that we all - no matter whether we are strict standards people or if we are no standards people - we all need to be aware of the influence we have on those around us and the potential for being the source of someone's pain. We can believe however we choose. I know that Sis Alvear is UC. But I have never been offended by her stand because her approach is always with love. On the other hand, I've read some whose stand is more important to them than their love for people's souls. THOSE people offend me.

I grew up under some very UC pastors. That is not the life-style I am living now. But I was not HURT by any of my pastors. We may not agree and in fact, didn't agree often even when I sat under their teaching. But they reached out in LOVE, not in judgment.

I believe that what Sis Alvear wants us to walk away with here is to THINK about how we are reaching people. Don't drive them away with out judgments. Woooo them with our love. Right, Sis A? Love you, my twin!

You are right my twin...win with love and don't drive the sinner away...

[Sister Alvear]

With all do respect it would have been wiser just to say that she had been hurt by a preacher... The people on this form have a deep issue with standards... I feel this post can do more damage then anything else...they link all UC's with standards...

Do you PERSONALLY know as many people on this forum as I do? I do not feel like my post will damage anyone but it was written to help us all whether UC or whatever reach out with kindness.
I have met other people in other camps that were mean spirited too...I said no matter where we camp we can be kind.



I was at a very liberal (if you want to use names) conference and the preacher made fun of UC's from beginning to the end of his sermon...so it is a warning to all of us.... try to be kind....
I felt so bad at that conference because I felt like the preacher was talking to me and my friend and even the ones over the conference came to me afterwards and told me they were sorry for what their guest speaker had said...

Whenever we make it a point to show how spiritual we think we are we have lost sight of the real reason why Jesus came...

Just about everyone here that has been here for anytime knows me and they know I would never try to harm the UC's or anyone else...

If the wounded soldier cannot feel our love and His healing virtue flow through us then what would even be our purpose of us even claiming to be followers of the ONE who said, Neither do I condemn thee go and sin no more?


Like I said I personally know lots of people here I do not think they are harmed because I asked prayer for a stranger I had met...

[Sherri]

I know your heart and I know you meant no harm. Anyone who has spent much time talking to you knows that your heart bleeds for souls of all kinds. Your passion for the lost is what draws me to you.

[RevDWW]

Well. just wish kindness would be the law that governs us but I often fall so short....

John's epistle exhorts us to LOVE and to act on our LOVE and to act with LOVE! God is LOVE.

Paul teaches us that LOVE is the greatest of all.
1Co 13:1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
1Co 13:2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
1Co 13:3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
1Co 13:4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
1Co 13:5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
1Co 13:7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
1Co 13:8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.
1Co 13:9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
1Co 13:10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.
1Co 13:11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
1Co 13:12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
1Co 13:13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.

[Sister Alvear]

I know your heart and I know you meant no harm. Anyone who has spent much time talking to you knows that your heart bleeds for souls of all kinds. Your passion for the lost is what draws me to you.

Thanks Sherri for such kind words. Did you see the pictures Fatima put on the picture thread of last Sunday's service? They said it was so awesome.

The year I spoke at Brother Holmes campmeeting that was my theme...A Passion....

Tonight we were in a wonderful service. Looking forward to Whitestone...

[aegsm76]

As one of the ultra-cons here, I know exactly what Sis Alvear is saying and I agree with her point.
It is the spirit that we bring that makes a difference.

[Sister Alvear]

As one of the ultra-cons here, I know exactly what Sis Alvear is saying and I agree with her point.
It is the spirit that we bring that makes a difference.


Our spirits reveal much about our real self...

[Sherri]

Thanks Sherri for such kind words. Did you see the pictures Fatima put on the picture thread of last Sunday's service? They said it was so awesome.

The year I spoke at Brother Holmes campmeeting that was my theme...A Passion....

Tonight we were in a wonderful service. Looking forward to Whitestone...
By the way, Paul will not be at Whitestone while you're there - I think he's out of the country. But his wife Jean will be (Hoovie's wife's aunt). You will love getting to know her.

[Sister Alvear]

Wow...can't wait...This trip has been the hardest trip...we are really feeling the miles...however the Lord has helped us along the journey. Love you.

[hometown guy]

When a backslider backslides, there is usually a lot deeper root than "standards", and it amazing how the fingers point 99% of the time to the pastor. What would be her definition of UC? Could it be this woman was drawn away and enticed by her OWN lust? Could she have just went to a more liberal church down the road, rather than walk off from GOD since God hasnt done anything to her but good? Amazing how its easy to judge how "hard" her former pastor is without knowing page 2 to the story...... always 2 sides to every story

Good post:thumbsup

[Sister Alvear]

yes, there are always 2 sides...

[Sister Alvear]

However the fact remains many lost wounded people could have been restored if someone would have had the grace to stoop...and that includes me too...

[Sister Alvear]

I was just asking prayer for a hurt person... who is to blame...I do not know...who can pray? We all can. It matters not what camp we claim to be in people get hurt...

[hometown guy]

The thing is that you made the focus on the " standards" and that's why you even made the point to say not to turn this into a "standards thread"............like I posted before, not a wise thing to do if you ever want to try to win these people back to truth

[Sister Alvear]

no, my post did not have a dual meaning...you may have read a dual meaning into it...

[Sister Alvear]

The fact remains many are drawn away and enticed by their OWN lust. You can only "stoop" so far, and then you get dirty yourself. In order to be restored, you have to first want restoration. You have been in the ministry long enough to know, the pastor always gets the blame and the backslider is always the wounded victim. Many pastors do all they can{wether uc or liberal}, yet they still get get egg on their face for not "stooping" or "being too hard". Grace is not a license to sin Sis.
I agree grace is NOT a license to sin...You sound awful cold and hard to me...I said at the beginning I did not want it to become a standards thread as some try to make it...
Yes, I know pastor's get blamed usually for everything...lol...however there was a different something about this person and I have been spending time in prayer for her...

[Sister Alvear]

Yes, I know what John said about being drawn away by their own lust...I also know what Jesus taught us by example. I am SURE I have failed many times and driven people away when I meant to draw them closer...we are all humans.

[Sister Alvear]

Whether you admit it or not, your post had a dual motive. I know how this works though, soon you will be the victim of this terrible "standard" thread. You knew what it was going to turn into, therefore you prefaced your statement by hoping it wouldn't turn into one. For me, its not really a "standard thread" though, I for one just think there is another side to the wounded standard abused wal-mart worker.

"She said that growing up the church (many of you would know both the church and the pastor she mentioned) we HAD to wear hose, she said...and the preacher was sooooooooooooo hard...I don't know if all she told me was true but I would imagine it is...she was soooooooooooooo bitter....I stood there wondering if her bitterness matched the preacher's hardness or vice versa..."


lol...and soon I will have a bikki on....

[Sister Alvear]

I do not think anything I could say for or against anything would change anyone's mind on this forum...most of us KNOW what we believe and for the most part we respect each other...If you wonder what we believe just come and visit in Brazil....

[Margies3]

The fact remains many are drawn away and enticed by their OWN lust. You can only "stoop" so far, and then you get dirty yourself. In order to be restored, you have to first want restoration. You have been in the ministry long enough to know, the pastor always gets the blame and the backslider is always the wounded victim. Many pastors do all they can{wether uc or liberal}, yet they still get get egg on their face for not "stooping" or "being too hard". Grace is not a license to sin Sis.

The thing is that you made the focus on the " standards" and that's why you even made the point to say not to turn this into a "standards thread"............like I posted before, not a wise thing to do if you ever want to try to win these people back to truth

Whether you admit it or not, your post had a dual motive. I know how this works though, soon you will be the victim of this terrible "standard" thread. You knew what it was going to turn into, therefore you prefaced your statement by hoping it wouldn't turn into one. For me, its not really a "standard thread" though, I for one just think there is another side to the wounded standard abused wal-mart worker.

"She said that growing up the church (many of you would know both the church and the pastor she mentioned) we HAD to wear hose, she said...and the preacher was sooooooooooooo hard...I don't know if all she told me was true but I would imagine it is...she was soooooooooooooo bitter....I stood there wondering if her bitterness matched the preacher's hardness or vice versa..."
Interesting...... I really do NOT see this as a thread about standards. What I hear is Sis Alvear's hear crying for a lost soul.

What's sad is that a couple of people can't seem to read even a thread like this - one reeking of love for lost souls - without cheapening it by trying to make it into yet another standards thread.

[Sister Alvear]

I said I only know what she said...but different from many that hold grudges and ramble on and on...I have felt a deep burden for this lady...

IF YOU REALLY know me...you would know my spirit...We have visited thousands of churches but no one that really knows me would assume I have a dual reason for posting...lol..

[Margies3]

"She said that growing up the church (many of you would know both the church and the pastor she mentioned) we HAD to wear hose, she said...and the preacher was sooooooooooooo hard...I don't know if all she told me was true but I would imagine it is...she was soooooooooooooo bitter....I stood there wondering if her bitterness matched the preacher's hardness or vice versa..."

yep, you can just feel the cry for a soul in this post...
I CAN feel the cry for a soul in this post! Sis Alvear met a person who was hurting deeply enough to reach out to a complete stranger. She was sensitive enough to her understand that the things she said, she said out of pain. I don't care whether there was more to the story or not. I don't know whether she had a pastor who was an ogre or whether her pastor was a kitten and she was just a rebellious person. The important thing is that she is hurting.

Sis Alvear asked us to do to two things: 1) pray for this girl and 2) be careful that we don't offend people. I don't think this is too much or too hard at all. The compassion that she feels for lost souls comes straight from the heart of God.

[ThePastorsCoach]

I wept when I read Sister Alvears post as I know in my UC life - I was way too hard on people and I so regret it. I know I hurt people with being so hard at times. I repented of it long ago but people hurt goes a long way.

Sister Alvear - it was a heart felt post and don't let any nut or devil try to stop you from requesting prayer for a backslider that a preacher hurt. I prayed for her AND the preacher that hurt her as soon as I read your request!

"Dual reason for posting" - How stupid & carnal can you get? Some of these guys need a check up from the neck up!

[houston]

I would reply to your pm, but its not letting me for some reason. I will post whatever I want whenever I want and abide by forum rules. Your name calling and tough guy attitude dont do anything for me. Might want to go back to prayer after calling me an idiot,stupid,coward,wimp, ect... And the title "SHUT UP" was very christian like of you too. Did you post that before or after your tears and prayer?

that closing line...

BWAHAHAHA

[Sister Alvear]

well...those that REALLY know me KNOW I would never on purpose try to hurt anyone...and I have felt a deep burden for this lady...
I tried to let her know in my own way that Jesus loves her and not all UC preachers are alike. My pastor is a prince of a man...of course in lifetime that he has and still is pastoring people have left...but I have never heard my pastor talk ill or hard to anyone...He is my earthly hero along with his sweet wife.

I will never ever no matter how long I live ever be what he is spiritually...His church is probably the most conservative church in his area...I honor and respect him highly.

My own sisters are backslidders out of his church but never have they spoken against him or his wife...in fact they keep in contact with them and always tell them they will never forget what they did for us girls when we were growing up.

I think you can be UC if that is what you want to call it and be like my pastor...I started going to his church when I was 7 or so and he and his wife were barely in their early 20's...I am 60 years old today...
I have stayed at their home for weeks and weeks, traveled with them, he was one of my teachers in school and I can honestly say I have NEVER seen him unkind even in the hardest situations...

[Sister Alvear]

no one has to be around me long to find out my pastor is my earthy hero...

[Sister Alvear]

Sorry...if I said something wrong....but when you know a pastor you usually know if a person is telling the truth or not...Forgive me....