Tim Estes: The Premise of Change

[Chateau d'If]

Several years ago Brother Estes wrote a book about standards called The Premise of Change. Does anyone know how I can get a copy of it?

[John 1:17]

Haven't heard of him in a while, where's Bro. Estes now?

[deltaguitar]

I think I have a copy somewhere but I think it is back in Arkansas.

[Digging4Truth]

My dad bought me a copy but I've never gotten around to reading it. I need to find it one day and see what it says.

[CC1]

My dad bought me a copy but I've never gotten around to reading it. I need to find it one day and see what it says.

I thought this book was something he had only published for his church and was not for sale? I would be interested in obtaining a copy and reading it myself.

[Justin]

Any validity to this?:

http://www.spiritualabuse.org/arkansasupc.html

Normally this site does not publish all the latest news reports concerning the United Pentecostal Church, its ministers or members. I am making an exception this time as it hit the papers that New Life Tabernacle Church in Siloam Springs, Arkansas has made the decision to no longer promote the dress and hair codes of the UPCI. This is not a small issue within the organization.

On Saturday, June 18, 2005, the Arkansas Democrat Gazette published an article titled, "Pentecostal Pastor Places Dress Code in Closet". The article cannot be viewed online without either subscribing to the paper or paying $1.95 to obtain a copy. Their web site is http://library.ardemgaz.com (the archive section) for anyone who wishes to do so.

The pastor is Tim Estes, a UPCI licensed minister, who states the church is still with the UPC but will leave if their remaining with them causes problems for the organization. He's already had negative reactions from some pastors he knows. The article notes that so far they have only lost about three members from the change and the number of visitors has increased.

According to the report, the pastor started looking into the teachings over three years ago and even wrote a book entitled, "The Premise of Change" (it wasn't made clear if this is available to the public but was read to the church board). He is quoted as stating that the "pat answers" he learned about the codes during five years in Bible college "did not align themselves with the Word of God in context."

[Justin]

Any validity to this?:

http://www.spiritualabuse.org/arkansasupc.html

Normally this site does not publish all the latest news reports concerning the United Pentecostal Church, its ministers or members. I am making an exception this time as it hit the papers that New Life Tabernacle Church in Siloam Springs, Arkansas has made the decision to no longer promote the dress and hair codes of the UPCI. This is not a small issue within the organization.

On Saturday, June 18, 2005, the Arkansas Democrat Gazette published an article titled, "Pentecostal Pastor Places Dress Code in Closet". The article cannot be viewed online without either subscribing to the paper or paying $1.95 to obtain a copy. Their web site is http://library.ardemgaz.com (the archive section) for anyone who wishes to do so.

The pastor is Tim Estes, a UPCI licensed minister, who states the church is still with the UPC but will leave if their remaining with them causes problems for the organization. He's already had negative reactions from some pastors he knows. The article notes that so far they have only lost about three members from the change and the number of visitors has increased.

According to the report, the pastor started looking into the teachings over three years ago and even wrote a book entitled, "The Premise of Change" (it wasn't made clear if this is available to the public but was read to the church board). He is quoted as stating that the "pat answers" he learned about the codes during five years in Bible college "did not align themselves with the Word of God in context."

http://nltss.blogspot.com/2010/10/legalism-in-every-religion.html

Tim Estes blog... I guess he did leave after all.

[Admin]

*Closing Thread For Admin Review*

Book reviews involve the author, and the author's state of mind and character is relevant to the review. Since that discussion can't be had here without avoiding certain aspects (even though those aspects may have legitimate bearing on the book review), the thread is closed.

It's important to note that, for Christians, the value of a conversation is not based on its validity alone. There are lots of legitimate reasons to have a conversation, but that doesn't mean the conversation is beneficial or edifying to the body of Christ.

In the secular world, a person can be ripped to shreds because of their past failures. That should not be the case in the church. If a person is living in unrepentant sin, that's one thing (although it still doesn't warrant gossip); if they have repented and been restored by the people in their lives who matter, it's quite another and the AFF doesn't need to be gossiping about it.