View Full Version : Profiling
tstew
03-22-2012, 06:37 PM
Now that I'm traveling quite a bit, I've decided that I am not a fan at all. It would be very nice to be able to travel I 10 unmolested. That is all. :foottap
Praxeas
03-22-2012, 06:43 PM
Now that I'm traveling quite a bit, I've decided that I am not a fan at all. It would be very nice to be able to travel I 10 unmolested. That is all. :foottap
please explain
tstew
03-22-2012, 06:45 PM
Getting pulled over is getting pretty old, pretty fast. It's crazy.
Praxeas
03-22-2012, 07:00 PM
Do they ever give a reason? Is it the same cop each time?
Where is I-10?
tstew
03-22-2012, 07:12 PM
Different cops...different reasons. Each more absurd than the last. If I wasn't so frustrated by the time they pull me over, I would laugh at the reasons. I'm usually on I 10 through Texas, Louisiana, Miss, Alabama, and Florida.
On this trip, an officer literally tails me for 15 or 20 miles. That may not seem like a lot, but it is when you are driving it. He literally tails me while people are driving past us. People are looking at me like I'm already on Cops or something. It was getting to the point that I was about to just pull myself over.
Either way, he eventually lights me up and here is the "reason" this time:
He did it because "there are a lot of state troopers up ahead and and they are writing a lot of tickets." He said that while I was properly signaling whenever I changed lanes, in LA I had to make sure that I left my blinker on for the entire lane change (since it takes more than 2 seconds? Is it even possible to not leave it on for a lane change?). The nice officer just wanted to warn me that there were mean troopers ahead who wouldn't take kindly to this....oh, and by the way can I see your driver's license and rental agreement, where are you going, what do you do, and on and on...
I have had times when I was pulled over twice on the same trip.
Hoovie
03-22-2012, 07:42 PM
WOw stew! Sorry to hear this. Do you feel it is strictly your race at issue? What are they hoping to find? Are they just getting their jollies from harrassment?
Cindy
03-22-2012, 08:15 PM
Of course I 10 is a big drug corridor and everybody knows only black men have drugs in their vehicles.
AreYouReady?
03-22-2012, 09:13 PM
Different cops...different reasons. Each more absurd than the last. If I wasn't so frustrated by the time they pull me over, I would laugh at the reasons. I'm usually on I 10 through Texas, Louisiana, Miss, Alabama, and Florida.
On this trip, an officer literally tails me for 15 or 20 miles. That may not seem like a lot, but it is when you are driving it. He literally tails me while people are driving past us. People are looking at me like I'm already on Cops or something. It was getting to the point that I was about to just pull myself over.
Either way, he eventually lights me up and here is the "reason" this time:
He did it because "there are a lot of state troopers up ahead and and they are writing a lot of tickets." He said that while I was properly signaling whenever I changed lanes, in LA I had to make sure that I left my blinker on for the entire lane change (since it takes more than 2 seconds? Is it even possible to not leave it on for a lane change?). The nice officer just wanted to warn me that there were mean troopers ahead who wouldn't take kindly to this....oh, and by the way can I see your driver's license and rental agreement, where are you going, what do you do, and on and on...
I have had times when I was pulled over twice on the same trip.
It must be a southern thing. I was never stopped at a road block by police until I moved to the Southeast region. Road blocks to check licenses, registration and insurance are the normal down here.
Cindy
03-22-2012, 09:42 PM
Different cops...different reasons. Each more absurd than the last. If I wasn't so frustrated by the time they pull me over, I would laugh at the reasons. I'm usually on I 10 through Texas, Louisiana, Miss, Alabama, and Florida.
On this trip, an officer literally tails me for 15 or 20 miles. That may not seem like a lot, but it is when you are driving it. He literally tails me while people are driving past us. People are looking at me like I'm already on Cops or something. It was getting to the point that I was about to just pull myself over.
Either way, he eventually lights me up and here is the "reason" this time:
He did it because "there are a lot of state troopers up ahead and and they are writing a lot of tickets." He said that while I was properly signaling whenever I changed lanes, in LA I had to make sure that I left my blinker on for the entire lane change (since it takes more than 2 seconds? Is it even possible to not leave it on for a lane change?). The nice officer just wanted to warn me that there were mean troopers ahead who wouldn't take kindly to this....oh, and by the way can I see your driver's license and rental agreement, where are you going, what do you do, and on and on...
I have had times when I was pulled over twice on the same trip.
Yeah, his "no" reason to pull you over is your first clue. Bless his heart.
tstew
03-22-2012, 09:53 PM
WOw stew! Sorry to hear this. Do you feel it is strictly your race at issue? What are they hoping to find? Are they just getting their jollies from harrassment?
I would have to say that race is absolutely the overriding reason. I'm getting to the age where you can no longer even say that it is a combination of age and race. On this trip I was driving an Elantra... not some extravagant "drug car". I honestly cannot think of any other reason.
tstew
03-22-2012, 09:54 PM
It must be a southern thing. I was never stopped at a road block by police until I moved to the Southeast region. Road blocks to check licenses, registration and insurance are the normal down here.
To be honest, if it were a road block or something it wouldn't be as bad.
crakjak
03-22-2012, 10:04 PM
Now that I'm traveling quite a bit, I've decided that I am not a fan at all. It would be very nice to be able to travel I 10 unmolested. That is all. :foottap
That has got to be frustrating. Guess you have need of patience??? J/K
Hoovie
03-22-2012, 10:52 PM
I would have to say that race is absolutely the overriding reason. I'm getting to the age where you can no longer even say that it is a combination of age and race. On this trip I was driving an Elantra... not some extravagant "drug car". I honestly cannot think of any other reason.
What is their motive, do you think? What are they hoping to achieve?
tstew
03-22-2012, 11:13 PM
What is their motive, do you think? What are they hoping to achieve?
I couldnt say for sure, but I'm sure that it was not best served by tailing me. There could have been mass murderers in the cars speeding by us.
Truthseeker
03-23-2012, 12:46 AM
My wife was profiled in a tourist store at Carolina beach, man kept looking at her to see if she would steal somehting. I wish I would have caught on sooner so I could have some words of inspiration for him.
houston
03-23-2012, 12:57 AM
Man, Tes.
Take the spinners off the car and replace them with stock rims.
Titus2woman
03-23-2012, 07:28 AM
It's profiling and it's the south, period. I would be extremely surprised if you got it from Houston to Beaumont in Texas but after you hit the LA border you're sunk. We were in LA on a camping trip when someone knocked on the RV door at 2 am to tell us 'the coons have gone crazy and are killin' people and y'all need to vacate" my very Caucasian husband opened the door and stepped outside to not wake all of us.
I was still half asleep when he came back in and said 'Honey Racoons can kill chickens but not people they aren't big enough'. Me being from California and Don from Texas he translated the southern speak for me to say the fellow meant that there were racial problems in the area and we weren't safe. Since our family contains just about as many races as one can have we felt we'd probably be in trouble no matter which side showed up and packed our stuff up in the middle of the night and left.
They obviously pick their law enforcement folks from the same gene pools. So sorry.
Don't know how much time you spend in Texas but if you can get a CHL it's just about a free pass here with law enforcement. I've been stopped a few times, I hand over my DL and my CHL (which lets them know you've already been run seven ways to Sunday through the FBI) and they hand them back and say 'have a nice day ma'am'.
Savedbygrace!
03-23-2012, 07:30 AM
IH10 is terrible. I drive it every day in the Houston, TX area and my fuzzbuster is a must!
Timmy
03-23-2012, 07:35 AM
I would have to say that race is absolutely the overriding reason. I'm getting to the age where you can no longer even say that it is a combination of age and race. On this trip I was driving an Elantra... not some extravagant "drug car". I honestly cannot think of any other reason.
You sure it wasn't the "I HATE COPS" bumper sticker? :lol
Sorry, that was stupid. I'm with you: profiling is asinine, and needs to stop. Is there any hope? I dunno.
BTW, I live near a county in TX that is famous for its racist sheriff deputies. My son spent a night in their jail (possession), and man, he's got stories. They treated him OK, but there was nothing but cruelty for another fellow who was Mexican. It's a sad state of affairs.
Bro. Robbins
03-23-2012, 07:48 AM
Profiling in it's self, I have no issue with. It is a valid and proven mode of prevention of crime, just ask El Al Airlines, or the many interstate drug task force teams that make successful busts. HOWEVER, this like any other legitimate tool of crime prevention can be, and probably in your case, has been abused.
Believe me, if our country was stricken with a huge onslaught of missing little debbie cakes from convenient stores all across the the nation, and the top offenders were fat, bald, white guys..... well, then I would suspect that every time an officer sees me, I'm gonna get profiled.
We have to be honest about the statistics about interstate drug crimes, and the profile of that offender. Profiling is smart... Not when it's abused!!!! Let me make that point clear, so I'm not taken out of context, but when done properly, profiling is legitimate.
SIDEBAR: Our airlines should actually promote more profiling. Last time I checked it wasn't any 80 year Baptist old grannies, or 3 year old kids in wheelchairs that were trying to blow planes out of the sky. It's been middle eastern, Muslim, young men, that have traveled frequently to the middle east. We should be PROFILING here!!!!!
Sherri
03-23-2012, 08:39 AM
TStew--you are pretty scary looking. Heehee!!
Just kidding - I'm sorry for people's ignorance and I hope someday our country gets past this type of stuff. One of our campus pastors is Hispanic and he gets the same kind of treatment some places.
Different cops...different reasons. Each more absurd than the last. If I wasn't so frustrated by the time they pull me over, I would laugh at the reasons. I'm usually on I 10 through Texas, Louisiana, Miss, Alabama, and Florida.
On this trip, an officer literally tails me for 15 or 20 miles. That may not seem like a lot, but it is when you are driving it. He literally tails me while people are driving past us. People are looking at me like I'm already on Cops or something. It was getting to the point that I was about to just pull myself over.
Either way, he eventually lights me up and here is the "reason" this time:
He did it because "there are a lot of state troopers up ahead and and they are writing a lot of tickets." He said that while I was properly signaling whenever I changed lanes, in LA I had to make sure that I left my blinker on for the entire lane change (since it takes more than 2 seconds? Is it even possible to not leave it on for a lane change?). The nice officer just wanted to warn me that there were mean troopers ahead who wouldn't take kindly to this....oh, and by the way can I see your driver's license and rental agreement, where are you going, what do you do, and on and on...
I have had times when I was pulled over twice on the same trip.
was this in Louisiana?
ugh. im not happy with Louisiana police these days.
RandyWayne
03-23-2012, 09:03 AM
Did the cop look like this?
JW Pepper
http://www.mi6-hq.com/images/stills/lald_s_23_500.jpg
Or
http://site.icanvasart.com/amazon/1/508.jpg
Dedicated Mind
03-23-2012, 10:00 AM
filthy republicans
Pressing-On
03-23-2012, 10:10 AM
We were stopped one time. The officer said my husband was driving over the white line on the right side of the highway. We knew he wasn't because we would have heard the rumble strips, which are pretty loud.
He was checking to see if we were hauling any illegals. We were on US 59.
filthy republicans
you dont know much about louisiana do you?
Dedicated Mind
03-23-2012, 10:13 AM
you dont know much about louisiana do you?
are you suggesting that democrats profile? been to N.O. once
Savedbygrace!
03-23-2012, 10:28 AM
.....they obviously pick their law enforcement folks from the same gene pools. So sorry.
don't know how much time you spend in texas but if you can get a chl it's just about a free pass here with law enforcement. I've been stopped a few times, i hand over my dl and my chl (which lets them know you've already been run seven ways to sunday through the fbi) and they hand them back and say 'have a nice day ma'am'.
ditto!
Timmy
03-23-2012, 10:31 AM
"I wonder if anybody'd think I'd flipped,
if I went to L.A.,
via Omaha."
Dalton
03-23-2012, 10:41 AM
On this trip I was driving an Elantra...
http://www.zuguide.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/11/gran-torino-clint-eastwood.jpg
Was it this man?
seekerman
03-23-2012, 10:41 AM
Get a cam and start taping some of the stuff. There's absolutely no reason for such harassment, and that's what it is. The signal light thing is a joke and is one of the reasons folks are losing respect for law enforcement.
RandyWayne
03-23-2012, 10:45 AM
Why couldn't I ever be stopped by her?
http://www.shahinshah.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/lady-cop-18.jpg
Savedbygrace!
03-23-2012, 10:45 AM
you dont know much about louisiana do you?
:highfive
Esther
03-23-2012, 10:46 AM
are you suggesting that democrats profile? been to N.O. once
Are you suggesting they don't?
Timmy
03-23-2012, 10:46 AM
Different cops...different reasons. Each more absurd than the last. If I wasn't so frustrated by the time they pull me over, I would laugh at the reasons. I'm usually on I 10 through Texas, Louisiana, Miss, Alabama, and Florida.
On this trip, an officer literally tails me for 15 or 20 miles. That may not seem like a lot, but it is when you are driving it. He literally tails me while people are driving past us. People are looking at me like I'm already on Cops or something. It was getting to the point that I was about to just pull myself over.
Either way, he eventually lights me up and here is the "reason" this time:
He did it because "there are a lot of state troopers up ahead and and they are writing a lot of tickets." He said that while I was properly signaling whenever I changed lanes, in LA I had to make sure that I left my blinker on for the entire lane change (since it takes more than 2 seconds? Is it even possible to not leave it on for a lane change?). The nice officer just wanted to warn me that there were mean troopers ahead who wouldn't take kindly to this....oh, and by the way can I see your driver's license and rental agreement, where are you going, what do you do, and on and on...
I have had times when I was pulled over twice on the same trip.
Maybe he thought you were this guy and wanted your autograph, till he saw you up close. :heeheehee
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/9/92/BenSisko.jpg/250px-BenSisko.jpg
Dalton
03-23-2012, 10:48 AM
Maybe he thought you were this guy and wanted your autograph, till he saw you up close. :heeheehee
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/9/92/BenSisko.jpg/250px-BenSisko.jpg
thats uncanny......
RandyWayne
03-23-2012, 10:49 AM
thats uncanny......
Until you see that Stewie only has THREE pins on his collar.
Timmy
03-23-2012, 10:51 AM
Until you see that Stewie only has THREE pins on his collar.
:lol
Reminds me of a time I thought I saw a "violin spider", but it couldn't have been. The "violin" on its back had only three strings. :lol
Dalton
03-23-2012, 10:56 AM
:lol
Reminds me of a time I thought I saw a "violin spider", but it couldn't have been. The "violin" on its back had only three strings. :lol
that would be the famed mountain dulcimer spider... it bites you.... and you vomit up chia-pets for 3 hours. hour per string.... then suprisingly your hit with an intense LSD visual and its over.
http://www.jupitercreekmusic.com/sdu-06.jpg
Timmy
03-23-2012, 11:39 AM
that would be the famed mountain dulcimer spider... it bites you.... and you vomit up chia-pets for 3 hours. hour per string.... then suprisingly your hit with an intense LSD visual and its over.
http://www.jupitercreekmusic.com/sdu-06.jpg
So, it's happened to you, too! :lol
Dalton
03-23-2012, 11:43 AM
So, it's happened to you, too! :lol
I happen to be a mountain dulcimer spider farmer so its a daily activity. Gets fun after a while.
Especially when you hurl a scooby doo.
are you suggesting that democrats profile? been to N.O. once
no. I am suggesting that you spoke with utter ignorance of the political reality of louisiana.
AreYouReady?
03-23-2012, 01:11 PM
To be honest, if it were a road block or something it wouldn't be as bad.
I hear you brother. At least a road block would include everybody and nobody is made to feel like they are singled out because of gender or race.
I hear you brother. At least a road block would include everybody and nobody is made to feel like they are singled out because of gender or race.
yea because then everybody is made to feel like a criminal.
ugh
I fully believe Stew is being profiled. I believe it may be worse in La. than in most places and I do know that La. does road block "DUI Checks"
and it all makes me very mad at my home state that I love.
One of these days they are going to stop me at a DUI check and I will likely go to jail. Cuz when they ask me what I’m doing, I am going to respond
"standing on my head stacking BB's"
When they ask me where I am going I am going to tell them "to see Thor about a hammer"
When they ask me where I am coming from, I am going to tell them "from the part of the world that believes road blocks are an invasion of privacy, a violation the constitution and why in God’s name do they as police officers stand for such injustice".'
And Stew, if a cop gets behind you and starts tailing you. pull over and if he pulls in behind you just very politely tell him you were giving him the road and you had no idea he wanted to talk to you.
I was followed like that once. (I was acting suspicious driving 20 MPH in a 45...55...45..55...45 mph zone. This is just north out of Alexandria in Ball La.
it was late at night, cop gets in behind me and start tailgating me. I don’t do anything. he doesn’t go around me so I pulled over (legally). and when he came up to me, I asked him why he was tailgating me.
he said I was acting suspicious.
I told him his TOWN was suspicious with no less than 6 speed limit changes in a 2 mile stretch. I was really angry and not very polite but I was within the bounds of legal behavior... heehee...
it was an interesting and intense few minutes but he had no leg to stand on and I had broken no law so I didn’t go to jail...
La. has the worst highway/traffic behavior/law/law enforcement etc of any state I can name and it makes me very very mad.
Stew, I am sorry you are being treated that way.
Jermyn Davidson
03-23-2012, 01:55 PM
Different cops...different reasons. Each more absurd than the last. If I wasn't so frustrated by the time they pull me over, I would laugh at the reasons. I'm usually on I 10 through Texas, Louisiana, Miss, Alabama, and Florida.
On this trip, an officer literally tails me for 15 or 20 miles. That may not seem like a lot, but it is when you are driving it. He literally tails me while people are driving past us. People are looking at me like I'm already on Cops or something. It was getting to the point that I was about to just pull myself over.
Either way, he eventually lights me up and here is the "reason" this time:
He did it because "there are a lot of state troopers up ahead and and they are writing a lot of tickets." He said that while I was properly signaling whenever I changed lanes, in LA I had to make sure that I left my blinker on for the entire lane change (since it takes more than 2 seconds? Is it even possible to not leave it on for a lane change?). The nice officer just wanted to warn me that there were mean troopers ahead who wouldn't take kindly to this....oh, and by the way can I see your driver's license and rental agreement, where are you going, what do you do, and on and on...
I have had times when I was pulled over twice on the same trip.
I have had the same experiences on I-10 as well.
Before I moved to Mobile, AL a few years ago, I would travel between Orlando and Pascagoulah, using I-10.
Traveling through North Florida was always a bad experience. I was pulled over at least once every trip. I promise I am not exaggerating.
I didn't have much experience with the State Troopers in Alabama and Mississippi, but I've had several experiences with local cops in Mobile, AL, Pass Christian, MS, and 1 Trooper experience just west of Pascagoulah, MS.
tstew
03-23-2012, 03:28 PM
Well, at least some of the humorous responses here gave me a laugh out of the whole situation. Part of my frustration is that what this boils down too is a profile that is only race. If there were some other discernible things that I was actually doing that would make me fit some sort of profile, I may be able to understand or accept it better. I'm not driving some flashy car, wearing flashy clothes, wearing gold teeth and dreadlocks, acting nervous around the police, trying to avoid the police or any other behavioral thing they can point to. I'm a clean shaven (yeah, I finally got saved), balding, increasingly middle aged man, driving the speed limit in a reasonable car not acting uncomfortable about police presence.
I've been pulled over with my wife sitting next to me and my son in his car seat. By far, the most aggravating time was when we were on a long road trip and one woke my son up far sooner than he would have been waking up otherwise.
Titus2woman
03-23-2012, 03:32 PM
We were stopped one time. The officer said my husband was driving over the white line on the right side of the highway. We knew he wasn't because we would have heard the rumble strips, which are pretty loud.
He was checking to see if we were hauling any illegals. We were on US 59.
Rumble strips??? Are those what we call 'drunk bumps'?
tstew
03-23-2012, 03:36 PM
It's profiling and it's the south, period. I would be extremely surprised if you got it from Houston to Beaumont in Texas but after you hit the LA border you're sunk. We were in LA on a camping trip when someone knocked on the RV door at 2 am to tell us 'the coons have gone crazy and are killin' people and y'all need to vacate" my very Caucasian husband opened the door and stepped outside to not wake all of us.
I was still half asleep when he came back in and said 'Honey Racoons can kill chickens but not people they aren't big enough'. Me being from California and Don from Texas he translated the southern speak for me to say the fellow meant that there were racial problems in the area and we weren't safe. Since our family contains just about as many races as one can have we felt we'd probably be in trouble no matter which side showed up and packed our stuff up in the middle of the night and left.
They obviously pick their law enforcement folks from the same gene pools. So sorry.
Don't know how much time you spend in Texas but if you can get a CHL it's just about a free pass here with law enforcement. I've been stopped a few times, I hand over my DL and my CHL (which lets them know you've already been run seven ways to Sunday through the FBI) and they hand them back and say 'have a nice day ma'am'.
LOL. I'm not sure that would work for me. They would probably perceive it as a threat, start yelling "gun, gun!", reach for their weapons and escalate to a felony stop. :)
Titus2woman
03-23-2012, 03:37 PM
La. has the worst highway/traffic behavior/law/law enforcement etc of any state I can name and it makes me very very mad.
Nope... one of our police departments (several officers) and even the town mayor was just arrested for making illegal traffic stops... Yours might be bad but probably not the worst. ;)
AreYouReady?
03-23-2012, 05:39 PM
Not long ago a local deputy was caught profiling hispanics. He was stopping them and taking their money out of their wallets. Someone finally got brave enough to turn him in. He got a year in prison, a fine and has to pay them back.
I have been visibly aggravated for getting stopped for no reason before. It's hard to contain my annoyance. And, who isn't nervous when those bright blue lights are directly behind your auto? I know it's annoying to get stopped for nothing and get the third degree in a supposedly free country. Are we really as free as we think we are?
Pressing-On
03-23-2012, 05:57 PM
Rumble strips??? Are those what we call 'drunk bumps'?
Yea, probably so. Or "OH MY GOSH!! strips" before you crash. :toofunny
Praxeas
03-24-2012, 12:45 AM
Black kid got profiled in Florida....the dirt bag "Neighborhood Watch" moron thought he was suspicious..black kid with a hoodie...so he shot him
Titus2woman
03-24-2012, 03:32 AM
Black kid got profiled in Florida....the dirt bag "Neighborhood Watch" moron thought he was suspicious..black kid with a hoodie...so he shot him
That was one of the most shameful things I've ever heard. This person was looking for a reason to kill someone and should be under a jail somewhere, I pray that he does not get away with this horrible crime.
Titus2woman
03-24-2012, 03:50 AM
Profiling in it's self, I have no issue with. It is a valid and proven mode of prevention of crime, just ask El Al Airlines, or the many interstate drug task force teams that make successful busts. HOWEVER, this like any other legitimate tool of crime prevention can be, and probably in your case, has been abused.
Believe me, if our country was stricken with a huge onslaught of missing little debbie cakes from convenient stores all across the the nation, and the top offenders were fat, bald, white guys..... well, then I would suspect that every time an officer sees me, I'm gonna get profiled.
We have to be honest about the statistics about interstate drug crimes, and the profile of that offender. Profiling is smart... Not when it's abused!!!! Let me make that point clear, so I'm not taken out of context, but when done properly, profiling is legitimate.
SIDEBAR: Our airlines should actually promote more profiling. Last time I checked it wasn't any 80 year Baptist old grannies, or 3 year old kids in wheelchairs that were trying to blow planes out of the sky. It's been middle eastern, Muslim, young men, that have traveled frequently to the middle east. We should be PROFILING here!!!!!
Truly spoken like someone who has NEVER experienced any prejudice or injustice of any kind in his lifetime. You say you would expect to be unfairly treated if certain very unlikely circumstances came to pass but I have to wonder how your bravado would actually hold up. I'd be willing to bet that just once being thrown on the ground and having a 9mm stuck to the back of your head... or even just being cuffed and carried to the local cop-shop while your car was impounded and your wife and child left on the side of the road to find their own ride from a strange place and your big trash talk would evaporate like a wisp of steam from a hot cow patty on a cold morning.
When I travel and see people of middle eastern descent in airports I feel such compassion for them. How brave they must be to go somewhere knowing that all eyes are upon them and very few are friendly. I do my best to try to give them a reassuring smile or a friendly hello.
Some times when you post you seem the epitome of unchristian character. Maybe that is not your intention but I often find you abrasive in the way that only those with very limited life experience are to me. Good Lord man... try to think before you speak. Stew is much too much the gentleman to say it and maybe he does not even feel it but this post in this thread made me want to vomit. I took a while and reread it to be sure it was not just a knee jerk reaction... and it is not.
bbyrd009
03-25-2012, 11:51 AM
Ha, I wondered if that post might generate some criticism.
Having experienced professional profiling my whole life--I guess I fit the profile of a Zionist or something--let me just say that I agree with Bro Robbins, as strange as this might sound at first.
Also, that I am as white-bread as it comes, and I got pulled over in the I-10 corridor plenty of times myself. I think it is location more than race.
I would separate "pro" from "idiot" in profiling--if one just imagines what a pro would like to say; "Hey, hi. I just pulled you over because you happen to be traveling the most heavily used black (no pun intended) market corridor in the US; so I am essentially tasked with protecting you, or arresting you..."
Also that I moved from that area, largely for the reason in this thread's title.
tstew
03-25-2012, 02:36 PM
Ha, I wondered if that post might generate some criticism.
Having experienced professional profiling my whole life--I guess I fit the profile of a Zionist or something--let me just say that I agree with Bro Robbins, as strange as this might sound at first.
Also, that I am as white-bread as it comes, and I got pulled over in the I-10 corridor plenty of times myself. I think it is location more than race.
I would separate "pro" from "idiot" in profiling--if one just imagines what a pro would like to say; "Hey, hi. I just pulled you over because you happen to be traveling the most heavily used black (no pun intended) market corridor in the US; so I am essentially tasked with protecting you, or arresting you..."
Also that I moved from that area, largely for the reason in this thread's title.
Being blatantly tailed for miles and pulled over for no reason...no speeding, suspicious behavior, suspicious activity on the license plate (that I know was called in), questionable vehicle, or any other discernible reason is just an intrusion that I believe is wrong and not universal.
bbyrd009
03-25-2012, 05:58 PM
Hey, it's famous enough that there's a song about it, lol; I'm not disagreeing.
But you are up against a bunch of sensitive flash words in there in the I-10,
and I've been hearing this for...ever. Can't imagine what it's like to be DWL
(Driving While Latino) in there if I'm getting pulled over every other trip.
deltaguitar
03-25-2012, 08:33 PM
Being blatantly tailed for miles and pulled over for no reason...no speeding, suspicious behavior, suspicious activity on the license plate (that I know was called in), questionable vehicle, or any other discernible reason is just an intrusion that I believe is wrong and not universal.
Stew,
As a white guy who grew up in a majority black county and city I have been stopped many times and harassed by black cops. I was once even told that I "better watch what I was doing because they were jumpy and didn't want to have to pull our their gun" this was said while they were searching me with my hands on the hood of the car.
I have never been arrested and I have never been in any real trouble. My wife lived in a black neighborhood so when we were dating I was always traveling through.
I am the last to scream racism but I have experience my share of it. I have stories that I can tell that would blow your mind. People that are not from the ghetto just don't understand how racist many black people are towards white folks.
Now, I will say that this is still a small issue in the overall fabric of our country. Not everyone nor the majority is racist but you have people who are and they will never change. We are not a racist country but people do fear and still group people by stereotypes. White people are so beat down and have so much "white" guilt that they overcompensate in order not to look racist in many areas.
One story that is interesting to me, the town that I am from has a black mayor. Well, a little old lady was being robbed in walmart parking lot by a "black" guy and some people ran to her aid and stopped the guy. The mayor's quote was, "we need to wait for the police and stop having vigilantism in the streets". Another example was a marine who shot a black boy about 15 years old who was in his house, however, this time the man who shot was black and they didn't claim racism but there was a big uproar in the community because the kid was a kid who sang in the choir and a lot of people knew. The problem was this kids was robbing someones house in the middle of the night and yes he was probably a decent kid in school and everything but when you rob someones house in the middle of the night you are asking for it.
Jermyn Davidson
03-25-2012, 08:47 PM
Stew,
As a white guy who grew up in a majority black county and city I have been stopped many times and harassed by black cops. I was once even told that I "better watch what I was doing because they were jumpy and didn't want to have to pull our their gun" this was said while they were searching me with my hands on the hood of the car.
I have never been arrested and I have never been in any real trouble. My wife lived in a black neighborhood so when we were dating I was always traveling through.
I am the last to scream racism but I have experience my share of it. I have stories that I can tell that would blow your mind. People that are not from the ghetto just don't understand how racist many black people are towards white folks.
Now, I will say that this is still a small issue in the overall fabric of our country. Not everyone nor the majority is racist but you have people who are and they will never change. We are not a racist country but people do fear and still group people by stereotypes. White people are so beat down and have so much "white" guilt that they overcompensate in order not to look racist in many areas.
One story that is interesting to me, the town that I am from has a black mayor. Well, a little old lady was being robbed in walmart parking lot by a "black" guy and some people ran to her aid and stopped the guy. The mayor's quote was, "we need to wait for the police and stop having vigilantism in the streets". Another example was a marine who shot a black boy about 15 years old who was in his house, however, this time the man who shot was black and they didn't claim racism but there was a big uproar in the community because the kid was a kid who sang in the choir and a lot of people knew. The problem was this kids was robbing someones house in the middle of the night and yes he was probably a decent kid in school and everything but when you rob someones house in the middle of the night you are asking for it.
It has been my personal observation that "in the ghetto" if you are white and live in the ghetto, you are not subjected to harrassment and prejudice.
It's more of an outsider vs. insider mentality when it comes to the reality of
what goes on in the ghetto. The profiling I've experienced personally is very different from the ghetto.
deltaguitar
03-25-2012, 09:08 PM
It has been my personal observation that "in the ghetto" if you are white and live in the ghetto, you are not subjected to harrassment and prejudice.
It's more of an outsider vs. insider mentality when it comes to the reality of
what goes on in the ghetto. The profiling I've experienced personally is very different from the ghetto.
The thing that bothers me a little is that if I had been gunned down by the cops there would have been no protest and no outrage.
You are true about living in the ghetto but the problem is when you are driving through no one knows you five streets over.
Jermyn Davidson
03-25-2012, 09:11 PM
The thing that bothers me a little is that if I had been gunned down by the cops there would have been no protest and no outrage.
You are true about living in the ghetto but the problem is when you are driving through no one knows you five streets over.
Honestly, I think there would have been a bit more of an investigation at the local level, regardless of your jurisdiction, if in today's America, you were gunned down by a neighborhood watch guy.
Outrage, maybe not to the degree of what we are seeing-- but due diligence would have been the watchword for your investigation from the start and so the outrage would have been from your family and friends directed solely towards the perpetrator. In the Martin case, anger is not just limited towards his murderer-- but towards a murderer and a system that is allowing his murderer to be free tonight.
Profiling is nothing more than using data to prevent possible crimes. The downside is there is not much room for variables and mistakes could be made. Israel uses profiling quite well for self preservation.
bbyrd009
03-26-2012, 11:48 AM
Profiling is nothing more than using data to prevent possible crimes. The downside is there is not much room for variables and mistakes could be made. Israel uses profiling quite well for self preservation.
And quite professionally, I might add. They would laugh in your face at "presumed innocence" -- so ridiculous.
I guess one would just have to experience it, but it is quite refreshing to be presumed guilty in that setting, or for that matter on I-10, and it would vastly clarify the reality there:
"Hi. I just pulled you over because this alley is so thick with bad guys, we just assume everyone is guilty until we get a look at them, and after that we assume that only most people are guilty."
I know it is difficult, in a "democracy" especially, to assume the mantle of Grace, but if one just views the cop as a really vicious dog put there to protect one, who will gladly wag its tail at you once it has a sniff, this might provide some perspective here.
Well, at least some of the humorous responses here gave me a laugh out of the whole situation. Part of my frustration is that what this boils down too is a profile that is only race. If there were some other discernible things that I was actually doing that would make me fit some sort of profile, I may be able to understand or accept it better. I'm not driving some flashy car, wearing flashy clothes, wearing gold teeth and dreadlocks, acting nervous around the police, trying to avoid the police or any other behavioral thing they can point to. I'm a clean shaven (yeah, I finally got saved), balding, increasingly middle aged man, driving the speed limit in a reasonable car not acting uncomfortable about police presence.
I've been pulled over with my wife sitting next to me and my son in his car seat. By far, the most aggravating time was when we were on a long road trip and one woke my son up far sooner than he would have been waking up otherwise.
dude I dont even know what to say. do they always have some "reason"?
ive been stopped but only because I was speeding...doing something I wasnt supposed to be doing.
I think I would be documenting these stops and making videos of them. If I got stopped more than zero times by a policeman to just give me some information cuz he his a nice guy... and oh by the way where am I going and where did I come from, I would be irate. but that is easy to say on my part as I am white.
aegsm76
03-26-2012, 01:21 PM
I also travel a lot using rental cars.
And I get pulled over a lot.
I am up to 20+ consecutive pull overs, with out a ticket.
I am multi-racial, but look white, so for me, I think it is more of the rental car issue.
Timmy
03-26-2012, 01:35 PM
I also travel a lot using rental cars.
And I get pulled over a lot.
I am up to 20+ consecutive pull overs, with out a ticket.
I am multi-racial, but look white, so for me, I think it is more of the rental car issue.
I've rented a fair number of cars, and have been pulled over just once. (Going the wrong way on a one-way street! :lol)
Timmy
03-26-2012, 01:36 PM
I've rented a fair number of cars, and have been pulled over just once. (Going the wrong way on a one-way street! :lol)
Just once in a rental, that is! :)
KWSS1976
03-26-2012, 02:09 PM
Yea defintley rental car issues I was driving a box van rented with some work equipment in it and got pulled over before, they are just checking to make sure all is cool. I have no problem with it, I kind of like the fact they check can't never be too safe now days with all the crazies running around
Cindy
03-26-2012, 02:55 PM
Yeah, drug smugglers or terrorists.
Bro. Robbins
03-27-2012, 11:26 AM
Truly spoken like someone who has NEVER experienced any prejudice or injustice of any kind in his lifetime. You say you would expect to be unfairly treated if certain very unlikely circumstances came to pass but I have to wonder how your bravado would actually hold up. I'd be willing to bet that just once being thrown on the ground and having a 9mm stuck to the back of your head... or even just being cuffed and carried to the local cop-shop while your car was impounded and your wife and child left on the side of the road to find their own ride from a strange place and your big trash talk would evaporate like a wisp of steam from a hot cow patty on a cold morning.
When I travel and see people of middle eastern descent in airports I feel such compassion for them. How brave they must be to go somewhere knowing that all eyes are upon them and very few are friendly. I do my best to try to give them a reassuring smile or a friendly hello.
Some times when you post you seem the epitome of unchristian character. Maybe that is not your intention but I often find you abrasive in the way that only those with very limited life experience are to me. Good Lord man... try to think before you speak. Stew is much too much the gentleman to say it and maybe he does not even feel it but this post in this thread made me want to vomit. I took a while and reread it to be sure it was not just a knee jerk reaction... and it is not.
Actually, you have no idea Sister if I've ever experienced the ill side of being unjustly treated or prejudice in my life. You make assumptions with no evidence, and then because you disagree with my opinion (was under the assumption all opinion were welcome), instead of keeping the discussion civil and talking about the merits, or lack there of, of profiling, you'd rather resort to personally attacking me, and my character. You have no idea what personal experiences I've had, especially if I've been thrown on the ground by an officer and mistaken for having bad intentions while there for a good purpose. Actually I have.. but you'd rather assume and blast me, than to stay on topic and have an above board respectful discussion.
I still maintain my opinion, that profiling in itself isn't wrong but is a valid technique that should be used more. It is a technique that can be abused, and misapplied as all, but that's where instruction and correction is needed... so that the technique would be used appropriately, not done away with.
RandyWayne
03-27-2012, 11:46 AM
I've rented a fair number of cars, and have been pulled over just once. (Going the wrong way on a one-way street! :lol)
The cops don't even stop you for that around here (usually). You get a friendly letter in the mail a week or two after the act with a wonderful photo and a bill with the amount of your fine on it.
http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w113/RandyWayneD/Misc%20pics%20for%20posting%20on%20other%20sites/JimCarreyTrafficPhoto.jpg
MissBrattified
03-27-2012, 11:55 AM
There's a difference between profiling and prejudice. Profiling is using math and data to place some people in higher risk categories. Fair or not, it has legitimate uses IMO. Whether or not those uses are ETHICAL is another debate.
Prejudice is personal, it's biased, highly subjective and as varied as the number of belly buttons in the world. Having lived in deep south for a few years and having family that still lives there, I can say without hesitation that racism is still alive and kicking'. The ignorance and venom is still shocking. Living further north, I still encounter it, but not as frequently. I'm not surprised at all that tstew would be stopped more than your average [white] Joe. For no good reason at all.
However: I do have a nephew who gets pulled over nearly every time he travels I-10--and he's white. Of course, he gets pulled over for speeding, but my point is that the cops do seem to be pretty active on that stretch of interstate. I mind my P's and Q's when I'm driving it.
Titus2woman
03-27-2012, 12:53 PM
Actually, you have no idea Sister if I've ever experienced the ill side of being unjustly treated or prejudice in my life. You make assumptions with no evidence, and then because you disagree with my opinion (was under the assumption all opinion were welcome), instead of keeping the discussion civil and talking about the merits, or lack there of, of profiling, you'd rather resort to personally attacking me, and my character. You have no idea what personal experiences I've had, especially if I've been thrown on the ground by an officer and mistaken for having bad intentions while there for a good purpose. Actually I have.. but you'd rather assume and blast me, than to stay on topic and have an above board respectful discussion.
I still maintain my opinion, that profiling in itself isn't wrong but is a valid technique that should be used more. It is a technique that can be abused, and misapplied as all, but that's where instruction and correction is needed... so that the technique would be used appropriately, not done away with.
This thread was about one of our own being unfairly treated for no good reason... but you used it not to express sympathy, empathy or even just a 'got your back guy' but to go off on some rant about how profiling should be done MORE. I think that was insensitive and even a tiny bit cruel. If I were being abused by my husband and posted about it here, I would not want a post about how much better behaved women are in countries where husbands beat their wives included in my thread.
I maintain that it appears to me whenever you have a choice between being supportive of someone having a current problem or being an oppositional blowhard with unhelpful opinions, you go for what's behind door two.
So now don't go all whiny and stuff... I can not stand people who can dish it out but can't take it. Ugh! If you want to be a tough guy who believes in and speaks that ends justify the means then consider that my post was formatted with just that kind of thought stream.
tstew
03-27-2012, 01:09 PM
I also travel a lot using rental cars.
And I get pulled over a lot.
I am up to 20+ consecutive pull overs, with out a ticket.
I am multi-racial, but look white, so for me, I think it is more of the rental car issue.
I would have to disagree because more often than not I am driving 1 of our personal cars.
Titus2woman
03-27-2012, 01:13 PM
I would have to disagree because more often than not I am driving 1 of our personal cars.
My dear friend Mary (a white woman) lived in Jacksonville, FL and underwent monthly cancer treatments at MD Anderson in Houston for over three years. I do not recall that she was ever stopped, not one single time.
I have driven that stretch of I-10 myself at least 4 times delivering horses to Micanopy and never was stopped either.
Titus2woman
03-27-2012, 01:15 PM
The cops don't even stop you for that around here (usually). You get a friendly letter in the mail a week or two after the act with a wonderful photo and a bill with the amount of your fine on it.[/QUOTE]
How convienient. I bet everyone is greatful for that. :)
tstew
03-27-2012, 01:16 PM
Also remember where not just talking about being pulled over out of a speeding pack. I was not speeding and was litterly tailed for 20 miles and then pulled over for no reason... and it happens a whole lot. my son is not old enough to understand it now but how do I explain it to him
when he is? How is that going to affect the way he sees law enforcement?
Bro. Robbins
03-27-2012, 01:16 PM
And I still maintain that when ever you have a choice between being supportive of someone having a current problem or being an oppositional blowhard you go for what's behind door two.
This thread was about one of our own being unfairly treated for no good reason... but you used it not to express sympathy, empathy or even just a 'got your back guy' kind of comment but to go off on some rant about how profiling should be done MORE.
So now don't go all whiny and stuff... I can not stand people who can dish it out but can't take it. Ugh!
Being unfairly treated is a matter of opinion.... and I may or may not agree that he was treated unfairly. In addition, I stated that profiling sometimes can be abused... I wasn't there at any of the times this brother was pulled over, so I don't know if it was abused or not. And to come forward with a "got your back" type response would be disingenuous when I personally don't know what happened, I only know his side of the story, and overall I am in favor of profiling.
I was not responding to this brother's particular circumstances, as I wasn't there and only have one side of the story. Since the Thread was entitled "Profiling", then I was led to believe the discussion was of the loftier subject of Profiling overall... and my opinion is that overall I have no issue with profiling when done correctly, even if part of the component of the profiling is just dealing with race.
Your comment about dish and take it holds no water. I never once personally maligned anyone in this thread, but spoke to my beliefs about profiling. You were the one who made it personal, therefore you are comparing apples and oranges.
In the end, it would appear that there are times that you have appointed yourself as the opinion police, and that you decide what the appropriate response to certain threads are... and if those posting their opinions do not comply with what you think is the right opinion, then you lash out with your venom and vitriole in personal attacks of their character and even their walk with God. Dear Sister, I entered this thread to provide my opinion on profiling, and did so. If opposing opinions, expressed in an adult, and civil manner are not appropriate within this forum, then someone needs to update the guidelines for new users.
Titus2woman
03-27-2012, 01:22 PM
Being unfairly treated is a matter of opinion.... and I may or may not agree that he was treated unfairly. In addition, I stated that profiling sometimes can be abused... I wasn't there at any of the times this brother was pulled over, so I don't know if it was abused or not. And to come forward with a "got your back" type response would be disingenuous when I personally don't know what happened, I only know his side of the story, and overall I am in favor of profiling.
I was not responding to this brother's particular circumstances, as I wasn't there and only have one side of the story. Since the Thread was entitled "Profiling", then I was led to believe the discussion was of the loftier subject of Profiling overall... and my opinion is that overall I have no issue with profiling when done correctly, even if part of the component of the profiling is just dealing with race.
Your comment about dish and take it holds no water. I never once personally maligned anyone in this thread, but spoke to my beliefs about profiling. You were the one who made it personal, therefore you are comparing apples and oranges.
In the end, it would appear that there are times that you have appointed yourself as the opinion police, and that you decide what the appropriate response to certain threads are... and if those posting their opinions do not comply with what you think is the right opinion, then you lash out with your venom and vitriole in personal attacks of their character and even their walk with God. Dear Sister, I entered this thread to provide my opinion on profiling, and did so. If opposing opinions, expressed in an adult, and civil manner are not appropriate within this forum, then someone needs to update the guidelines for new users.
Good Lord you are as dry as a day old bisquit.
If you consider that I lashed out at you, you are mistaken. I meant what I said. I considered it before posting. It was not knee jerk at all and I am not sorry, even now.
I do not get paid to be unfailingly polite on internet message boards. I participate for my own enjoyment and to give an honest assesment when I feel it may help someone. And Bro. I think you need help.
That is all.
Oh and I see you quoted me before my edit which must have been going on simultaineously. Please see the revised post.
tstew
03-27-2012, 01:29 PM
I can assure you that there is no greater multi sided story. I was never speeding or breaking any laws and I was tailed for quite a distance and eventually pulled over with a half cocked reason. What I've discovered is that people are generally big fans of the sort of intrusion and profiling...until it affects them. I guess as long as you can live with it whenever they decide that fundamental christians or another group that you belong to are now a threat to the American way of life...
Titus2woman
03-27-2012, 01:33 PM
I can assure you that there is no greater multi sided story. I was never speeding or breaking any laws and I was tailed for quite a distance and eventually pulled over with a half cocked reason. What I've discovered is that people are generally big fans of the sort of intrusion and profiling...until it affects them. I guess as long as you can live with it whenever they decide that fundamental christians or another group that you belong to are now a threat to the American way of life...
First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.
RandyWayne
03-27-2012, 01:39 PM
First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.
I have heard variations of this with most have homosexuals right after or before the communists.
Titus2woman
03-27-2012, 01:51 PM
I have heard variations of this with most have homosexuals right after or before the communists.
Written by a German pastor during or shortly after WWII:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_they_came
Praxeas
03-27-2012, 04:08 PM
The only time I agree with profiling is if cops are looking for a suspect
Jermyn Davidson
03-27-2012, 08:29 PM
The only time I agree with profiling is if cops are looking for a suspect
That is a sensible approach to reality.
AreYouReady?
03-27-2012, 08:32 PM
We are all suspect until proven innocent these days. Just try to get out of Wal mart when the cashier forgets to turn off the electronic device at the cash register.
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