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bbyrd009
04-04-2012, 11:45 AM
Let me say right away that I disapprove of his approach. Too Hollywood for me. But "The Kingdom is Here" his latest newsletter (which I can't seem to convert to a webpage) reveals a little of this guy's powerful message.

This was my first exposure to preaching after Apo/Pent 101, after my "Timmy" period; my initial exposure to a Life-centric message, and I went and checked him out in situ a few years ago. Powerful stuff--might be better to read, as his earlier books on "the Kingdom" are very cogent. Awesome speaker tho, too.

Their site--which I don't feel reflects his ministry that well;
http://www.bfmmm.com/

Um, he has a Doctorate in some theo-babble category, which i would normally consider
in most to = "rendered moot."

bbyrd009
04-04-2012, 11:49 AM
"The Kingdom Is Here"
The biblical account recorded by Matthew states, “From that time on Jesus began to preach, ‘Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is near’” (Matt 4:17).

These are the first recorded words of Jesus. The phrase “that time” refers to the arrest of John the Baptist, a prophet whose mission was to announce the arrival of the King. Now the King Himself was on the scene, and He was announcing the arrival of the Kingdom. This was the only message Jesus preached. If you search all four of the New Testament Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John, you will find that Jesus always talked about the Kingdom. Everything He said and did related to the Kingdom and its arrival on earth.

Jesus said, “Repent” (which means to change your mind or adopt a new way of thinking), “for the kingdom of heaven is near” (which means, in effect, that it has arrived). In other words, Jesus was saying, “Change your way of thinking! The Kingdom of Heaven is here! I brought it with me!” When Jesus brought the Kingdom of Heaven to earth, He brought also the promise of restoring to mankind the dominion over the earth that Adam and Eve had lost in Eden. He brought back our rulership.

Before we could be fully restored to our Kingdom, however, the matter of our rebellion against God had to be dealt with. This rebellion is what the Bible calls sin, and it is universal in human nature, a legacy of Adam and Eve’s treason in Eden so long ago. Jesus’ death on the cross paid the price for our rebellion so that we could be restored to a right standing with God, our King, and be reinstalled in our original and rightful place as rulers of the earthly domain.

The “gospel” message—the “good news”—is more than the Cross. The Cross is the doorway that gets us back into the Kingdom. The Cross of Christ, therefore, is all about Kingdom restoration. It is about restoration of power and authority. It is about regaining rulership, not religion.

Our Father, the King of heaven, has given us the Kingdom. It is ours. Jesus Himself brought the Kingdom to us. It was His main purpose in coming to earth in human flesh. We receive the Kingdom through His death. The moment we turn from our rebellion against God and place our trust in Christ to salvage us from the consequences of that rebellion, we become naturalized citizens of the Kingdom of Heaven, with all the rights, benefits, and privileges that come with citizenship.

Jay
04-04-2012, 02:03 PM
I believe that this could be described as 'Kingdom Now' or 'Dominion' theology. I could launch a dissertation against it. However, this is prevalent in certain Charismatic circles.

mfblume
04-04-2012, 02:24 PM
I believe that this could be described as 'Kingdom Now' or 'Dominion' theology. I could launch a dissertation against it. However, this is prevalent in certain Charismatic circles.
No, it is not Kingdom Now that you are thinking about. It is entirely different. Kingdom Now teaches we take over the arts and industry and etc etc. They teach that we determine when Jesus comes by preaching the gospel to all nations. So when we get with it, and get it done, then Jesus will come. That is NOT what Munroe teaches. Munroe is on the money with what he teaches, IMHO.

Munroe's theme is that God gave man dominion on the earth and that is exactly what Jesus saved us to return to. And we rule NOW spiritually. Not carnally as "kingdom now" teaches.

Jay
04-04-2012, 03:13 PM
I see. I would likely describe it as a variation on that doctrine. I was not impressed with what I saw on their website which is what I based my comments on for the most part.

tv1a
04-04-2012, 08:29 PM
What do we do with dominion if we don't shape society into a Christ-like culture?

No, it is not Kingdom Now that you are thinking about. It is entirely different. Kingdom Now teaches we take over the arts and industry and etc etc. They teach that we determine when Jesus comes by preaching the gospel to all nations. So when we get with it, and get it done, then Jesus will come. That is NOT what Munroe teaches. Munroe is on the money with what he teaches, IMHO.

Munroe's theme is that God gave man dominion on the earth and that is exactly what Jesus saved us to return to. And we rule NOW spiritually. Not carnally as "kingdom now" teaches.

mfblume
04-04-2012, 09:55 PM
What do we do with dominion if we don't shape society into a Christ-like culture?

There is a difference between taking over political positions and the arts, etc., and simply ruling spiritually through faith and prayer to effect changes in those who do rule secularly.

bbyrd009
04-05-2012, 11:12 AM
Jay, you note the part I don't like, but he is not Kingdom Now, or charismatic.
What Blume said. his "Kingdom" books are def powerful.

Dalton
04-05-2012, 02:08 PM
John 18:36
Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

I may be reading it wrong but are you referring to earth as the kingdom now, or are you stating that the kingdom lives within christians?

Because if it is the latter, I can kind of see what he is saying but if it is the former, thats the farthest from the truth.

Why else would Jesus have said in Matthew 12:26
"And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand?"

I believe that the works of the kingdom of heaven are performed through us by what god gives us but as far as the kingdom being here? If it is... then that really doesn't give us anything to look forward to does it?

But more importantly, what does that really have to do with salvation? Shouldn't matter since he is going to destroy both of them anyway at the end.

2 peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

Because both being tainted with sin, and he will not allow it in the new kingdom.

Also, isn't this myles munroe guy the same guy who said god needs our permission to do work in the earth? Like even though god can do anything, he can only do it if you permit him to or something like that. Sounded heavily blasphemous. I understand that we are to judge and are made one with him but thats taking it a little far... or then again I may be way off again and thinking about someone else entirely... to whom I must say this..

"And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?"

And as far as the kingdom is now thing... thats a lot to discern from one verse.

(I just hate how he says its illegal for God in the benny hinn this is your day stuff. God could do it if he wanted to but he is a god of his own word and the only reason he didn't do those things he was saying he couldn't was because he was bound by his word. Not by man. We don't have any authority over him. It's just the choices we make in accordance to his will that he chooses to work with us.. I mean he could easily have us all destroyed in a second so it just seems too proud to me to be throwing words like illegal for god around like that cause im like... by whose authority?)

bbyrd009
04-05-2012, 03:05 PM
John 18:36
Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

I may be reading it wrong but are you referring to earth as the kingdom now, or are you stating that the kingdom lives within christians?

Because if it is the latter, I can kind of see what he is saying but if it is the former, thats the farthest from the truth.

Hmm; "the earth" is a domain; our reward. "The world" currently runs the earth, and "the Kingdom" is right beside, and will overcome the world; are my def's there.

Why else would Jesus have said in Matthew 12:26
"And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand?"

I believe that the works of the kingdom of heaven are performed through us by what god gives us but as far as the kingdom being here? If it is... then that really doesn't give us anything to look forward to does it?

But more importantly, what does that really have to do with salvation? Shouldn't matter since he is going to destroy both of them anyway at the end.

2 peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

Because both being tainted with sin, and he will not allow it in the new kingdom.

Well, but all this is "tomorrow, someday, what will be," and is not being addressed here. "The kingdom among you," now, is what is. being addressed.

Also, isn't this myles munroe guy the same guy who said god needs our permission to do work in the earth? Like even though god can do anything, he can only do it if you permit him to or something like that. Sounded heavily blasphemous. I understand that we are to judge and are made one with him but thats taking it a little far... or then again I may be way off again and thinking about someone else entirely... to whom I must say this..

"And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?"

Yes, he does say that, but does not refute that Scripture--I have heard him say this directly. Surely you are familiar with the doctrine of free will, and the power of the tongue, and prayer in Christ's name, etc., that does not negate or refute this verse, but rather develop a corollary, if you will.

Might be best rephrased "You can't stop God from doing what He will, even on earth; you also can't make God do anything here on earth--but you are responsible for earth, and the prayers of the righteous avail much. "If it be Your will" is further acknowledgement there. Doesn't mean we don't pray to God for anything, because He does whatever He wants, correct?

And as far as the kingdom is now thing... thats a lot to discern from one verse.
I'm really not familiar with "kiingdom now," but I know that this is a diff concept than Munroe's. His = yours. That kingdom that has no earthly head, that one may or may not have joined in yet, depending on your next decision.

(I just hate how he says its illegal for God in the benny hinn this is your day stuff. God could do it if he wanted to but he is a god of his own word and the only reason he didn't do those things he was saying he couldn't was because he was bound by his word. Not by man. We don't have any authority over him. It's just the choices we make in accordance to his will that he chooses to work with us.. I mean he could easily have us all destroyed in a second so it just seems too proud to me to be throwing words like illegal for god around like that cause im like... by whose authority?)

Hmm, well, I'd say that this concept is what is being acknowledged, above, by Munroe; as much as I hate to align him with Hinn. God has made promises that He will not break, and believers have the power to request God's intervention in areas that God would not otherwise interfere in, as that would be interference in free will, and a look around at the state of things confirms that God has not intervened, in things that you surely think He should intervene in? Not His job, and does not fit with His will, apparently.

Our job. To overcome. Not violently, but by coming together and refusing to stand for it, whatever "it" may be. Rapturists self-excluded, of course. Some redefine it "the march of human progress," I don't know. We are informed that we are going to fail miserably, if I read the Revelation right, until we consciously bring things to a head--satan would never do this, it would be fighting himself. All satan is worried about is Believers waking up to truth, and bringing things to a head, eliminating his "slow drip."