Has The UPCI Served It's Purpose.

[Garfield]

Has the UPCI served it's purpose and destined to fad into oblivion.
Will the Org. continue as a force in the church.

[ManOfWord]

Has the UPCI served it's purpose and destined to fad into oblivion.
Will the Org. continue as a force in the church.

What WILL happen is the same thing that is happening in the California District. Sides will continue to polarize and pull just like cell division until.................POP!...........there is a split. I won't guess how large it will be or which "side" will get the biggest piece. I think the division and breach is too great to repair. Not that God can't do that, I just think that His people are NOT willing to to do that.

I do NOT wish this to come to pass, I just don't see any way around it at this point.

[berkeley]

I agree with MOW.

[vrblackwell]

I believe the UPCI will always exist. However, I believe it's ministerial membership will decrease with time as some of the elders pass on. I believe in the future it will be a more loose nit organization. Ministers will fellowship both in, and out of the circle of the UPCI. The new generation realizes that there is a great big world beyond the parameters of the ORG.

It will still continue to serve it's purposes, just with less control. JMHO

[Neck]

Has the UPCI served it's purpose and destined to fad into oblivion.
Will the Org. continue as a force in the church.

Along came a new generation.

I personally believe it will exist with open factions in the organization.

Con-Libs-moderates.

Otherwise it will not be viable.

I see it in my local church already.

Nathan Eckstadt

[Garfield]

I believe the UPCI will always exist. However, I believe it's ministerial membership will decrease with time as some of the elders pass on. I believe in the future it will be a more loose nit organization. Ministers will fellowship both in, and out of the circle of the UPCI. The new generation realizes that there is a great big world beyond the parameters of the ORG.

It will still continue to serve it's purposes, just with less control. JMHO



Brother, what do you see the "purpose" of the UPC in say 20 years.

[vrblackwell]

Brother, what do you see the "purpose" of the UPC in say 20 years.

Lets face. Really and truly the purpose of its creation was to be able to spread the gospel around the world. At the time of it's creation, it was really impossible for individuals to do this on there own or even in small groups.

However, due to the technology of today one church of a decent size can spread the gospel around the world. However, the Org. has developed into many things. It is a place of fellowship and support. It is a place to purchase resources and to share ones resources.

It will always have a purpose. However, as I stated in an earlier post. A new generation is here. This generation is not afraid of the great big world that is out there. We will not crawl in our fox holes of safety. Just the opposite. We will take what we have to the world with confidence knowing that "Greater is He that is within us, then he that is within the world.

We will fellowship with others and I do believe a great revival of the Acts 2:38 message will be seen in these last days. I love the UPCI, I do believe that many changes are ahead. Some will be great. Some may not be so great. However, I do believe the Acts 2:38 message will be held to dearly.

[IAintMovin]

I sure hope it has not - it takes us all, but the UPCI is a force in reaching a lost world - does it need to be more effective - yes - is it a useless group - no.

[Ronzo]

No one who is In Christ is useless.

[IAintMovin]

No one who is In Christ is useless.
Agreed

[The Dean]

I sure hope it has not - it takes us all, but the UPCI is a force in reaching a lost world - does it need to be more effective - yes - is it a useless group - no.

I agree.

[Honk-a-Mon]

I agree.

hey i am not trying to be rude.........but who are you man........you part of the new team or something..........just wondered............

[The Dean]

hey i am not trying to be rude.........but who are you man........you part of the new team or something..........just wondered............

Let's say 'yes'.

[Honk-a-Mon]

cool...............

[The Dean]

And, by the way, I didn't mean 'yes' as in you are being rude. I meant 'yes' as in being part of the team. Good to meet you.

[IAintMovin]

And, by the way, I didn't mean 'yes' as in you are being rude. I meant 'yes' as in being part of the team. Good to meet you.

Running smooth I see, this is pretty cool, huh?

[The Dean]

Smooth as silk so far. Can't find a troublemaker anywhere. Yet. :heeheehee

[Sister Truth Seeker]

With each generation things change in the church like in all things...The UPCI is changing and I am sure it will survive regardless...there may be a split or there may not...I returned to the UPC after being out for two years because I was not comfortable in other church's. While I don't agree with all the standards, I live most of them and have great respect for those that do...but I do see things changing and that is not bad...I think it's changing for the better....

[Sister Truth Seeker]

Brother, what do you see the "purpose" of the UPC in say 20 years.The same as it is today! To teach and help souls find salvation...

[seguidordejesus]

Along came a new generation.

I personally believe it will exist with open factions in the organization.

Con-Libs-moderates.

Otherwise it will not be viable.

I see it in my local church already.

Nathan Eckstadt

How large is the church you attend?

[secretplace]

Has the UPCI served it's purpose and destined to fad into oblivion.
Will the Org. continue as a force in the church.

Is the world saved? I think not. No it has not served its purpose...until the rapture of the church.

[ManOfWord]

I wouldn't say that the org has served its purpose, but I would say its effectiveness, in many ways, and ability to relate to today's Mr. & Mrs unchurched is waning.

[secretplace]

I wouldn't say that the org has served its purpose, but I would say its effectiveness, in many ways, and ability to relate to today's Mr. & Mrs unchurched is waning.

With all due respect...I haven't a clue what you would base an opinion like that on.

[ManOfWord]

With all due respect...I haven't a clue what you would base an opinion like that on.


No disrespect taken. Pretty simple IMO,.......in most places the org would relate well.......if it were the 1950's, 1960's. I spent 20yrs in the org and have plenty of experience. I know that there are many congregations who are progressive, but the progressives are getting criticized more and more, and the more "exclusive" and "reclusive" the org gets, the less it draws the lost.

By progressive, I'm not talking about being soft on immorality and other such sins.

[Nahum]

It's not over - yet.

But its time for massive change. Resistance to progress has taken this train off the track for far too long. It's time for a revival of unity, and a freshness in our purpose.

[ManOfWord]

It's not over - yet.

But its time for massive change. Resistance to progress has taken this train off the track for far too long. It's time for a revival of unity, and a freshness in our purpose.

I wholeheartedly agree and pray that it happens, even though I am no longer a part of it. I hate to see anything that was once used by God go down the drain.

[Neck]

Has the UPCI served it's purpose and destined to fad into oblivion.
Will the Org. continue as a force in the church.

Read below. The Three rules read on January 21. 2002 in St. Louis.

Ask the question since this service has the Constituency shown energy?

I think not!

I think the UPCI has lost momentum.

Next came Honorary General Board Member (and Haney mentor) J.T. Pugh for the official charge. He called the First Couple forward and they faced the pulpit as if it were a wedding and they were the marriage couple. Reciting how Jesus proclaimed “Hear O Israel, the Lord our God is one Lord” (Mark 12:29), he noted that Oneness Pentecost is the only major religious breakthrough in the last 500 years.

He ticked off the Three Rules of Successful Organizations:

1. Organizations must have energy.
2. Energy comes from the constituency.
3. The Constituency won’t give it unless they are involved.

Bro. Pugh began his charge with, “Inspire us all in excellence, to grow tall and strong…lead us across the thresholds without fear. Spend yourself wisely and objectively to promote the collective cause…lead this worldwide cause…and we will follow you.”

Bro Urshan then respectfully disagreed with earlier speakers about the UPCI going to the next level. It won’t be the next level, Bro. Urshan insisted. “It’s gonna be an explosion…and we’re going to see the greatest one God revival this world has ever seen!”

Kenneth Haney, stated, "“It is imperative that we catch the vision."

Was the vision ever caught!

[Carpenter]

Read below. The Three rules read on January 21. 2002 in St. Louis.

Ask the question since this service has the Constituency shown energy?

I think not!

I think the UPCI has lost momentum.

Next came Honorary General Board Member (and Haney mentor) J.T. Pugh for the official charge. He called the First Couple forward and they faced the pulpit as if it were a wedding and they were the marriage couple. Reciting how Jesus proclaimed “Hear O Israel, the Lord our God is one Lord” (Mark 12:29), he noted that Oneness Pentecost is the only major religious breakthrough in the last 500 years.

He ticked off the Three Rules of Successful Organizations:

1. Organizations must have energy.
2. Energy comes from the constituency.
3. The Constituency won’t give it unless they are involved.

Bro. Pugh began his charge with, “Inspire us all in excellence, to grow tall and strong…lead us across the thresholds without fear. Spend yourself wisely and objectively to promote the collective cause…lead this worldwide cause…and we will follow you.”

Bro Urshan then respectfully disagreed with earlier speakers about the UPCI going to the next level. It won’t be the next level, Bro. Urshan insisted. “It’s gonna be an explosion…and we’re going to see the greatest one God revival this world has ever seen!”

Kenneth Haney, stated, "“It is imperative that we catch the vision."

Was the vision ever caught!


Wow, this is the whole argument encapsulated in one post. Thank you for writing this.

Urshan and the ministers of his generation have/had been saying exactly what he said for 30 years or more! Explosion? Greatest revival in the history of man? I guess it is good he didn't give a timeframe for all this to happen.

I think more time, energy and resources in the UPC are spent on simply making sure that people they have (The Constituency) continue to believe the tennants of the church (only one of which is doctrine).

In order to have true revival, you must be flexible, be open minded, and trust the saints to have their own walk with God. Unfortunately, to the UPC, they see this as nothing more than compromise. Change=Compromise to the UPC, and that is exactly why they only wage warfare inside a boxing/wrestling ring.

[vrblackwell]

Wow, this is the whole argument encapsulated in one post. Thank you for writing this.

Urshan and the ministers of his generation have/had been saying exactly what he said for 30 years or more! Explosion? Greatest revival in the history of man? I guess it is good he didn't give a timeframe for all this to happen.

I think more time, energy and resources in the UPC are spent on simply making sure that people they have (The Constituency) continue to believe the tennants of the church (only one of which is doctrine).

In order to have true revival, you must be flexible, be open minded, and trust the saints to have their own walk with God. Unfortunately, to the UPC, they see this as nothing more than compromise. Change=Compromise to the UPC, and that is exactly why they only wage warfare inside a boxing/wrestling ring.


Please don't put every member of the UPCI into one basket. Not even all of it's leaders. There are many that recognize this fact. However, you cannot turn a ship of this size over night. It takes time and patience, And while you are turning the ship, you do want to do your best to keep everyone onboard.

[Carpenter]

Please don't put every member of the UPCI into one basket. Not even all of it's leaders. There are many that recognize this fact. However, you cannot turn a ship of this size over night. It takes time and patience, And while you are turning the ship, you do want to do your best to keep everyone onboard.

Brother, the problem with this comment is that everyone ON the ship should be getting used to seeing the same scenery over and over and over again as the ship keeps turning and turning and turning... :D

I have to put the UPCI into one basket, because those dissenting appear to be the fringe exception and not the rule. General Conference has been General Conference for years. There are no landmarks occuring...and this could be considered the basket you are talking about.

[MrsMcD]

Has the UPCI served it's purpose and destined to fad into oblivion.
Will the Org. continue as a force in the church.


I hope the organization does continue. Yes, it has faults as most organizations but the good out ways the bad.

[Carpenter]

I hope the organization does continue. Yes, it has faults as most organizations but the good out ways the bad.

I agree to a reasonable extent that the good out-weighs the bad, however why on earth should folks be satisfied with something that could be as bad as 49% bad and 51% good?

It is too easy to ignore the bad and allow it to continue if there are a few things good going on that can help us to forget. This is quite possibly the main reason I consider myself ex-UPC.

[Neck]

Wow, this is the whole argument encapsulated in one post. Thank you for writing this.

Urshan and the ministers of his generation have/had been saying exactly what he said for 30 years or more! Explosion? Greatest revival in the history of man? I guess it is good he didn't give a timeframe for all this to happen.

I think more time, energy and resources in the UPC are spent on simply making sure that people they have (The Constituency) continue to believe the tennants of the church (only one of which is doctrine).

In order to have true revival, you must be flexible, be open minded, and trust the saints to have their own walk with God. Unfortunately, to the UPC, they see this as nothing more than compromise. Change=Compromise to the UPC, and that is exactly why they only wage warfare inside a boxing/wrestling ring.

Exactly, My UPCI ministerial friends need to get past the Bread! Did not Jesus say, Man does not live by Bread alone! But by everyword that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

We need more revelation, Than just what separates us from the Trinity believers!

It's like the Anthony Mangan comment.

I am for TV.

Wow Bro. Mangan God reveals this to u 31 years after we needed it.

My argument that Kenneth Phillips and Mark Hanby with the money and backing of the whole grass roots organization.

Could have been the network we call TBN and done right.

It was in those same years that they had a dream.

We all know the Doctrine.

Now we need a spoken word for the year 2007.

When will any of the men in the UPCI be innovators (To begin or introduce (something new).

Every idea I have seen in my entire life (43) years.

From bus ministry, Cell groups, sister churches, home missions, Home bible studies, college campus ministry, prison ministry, radio ministry.

Were all taken from other denominations as we saw them have church growth.

It sure would be awesome for the Apostalic movement, to think of themselves as not just Apostalic in our core beliefs.

But Apostalic in our outreach, outpouring and annointing.

Nathan Eckstadt

[Carpenter]

Exactly, My UPCI ministerial friends need to get past the Bread! Did not Jesus say, Man does not live by Bread alone! But by everyword that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

We need more revelation, Than just what separates us from the Trinity believers!

It's like the Anthony Mangan comment.

I am for TV.

Wow Bro. Mangan God reveals this to u 31 years after we needed it.

My argument that Kenneth Phillips and Mark Hanby with the money and backing of the whole grass roots organization.

Could have been the network we call TBN and done right.

It was in those same years that they had a dream.

We all know the Doctrine.

Now we need a spoken word for the year 2007.

When will any of the men in the UPCI be innovators (To begin or introduce (something new).

Every idea I have seen in my entire life (43) years.

From bus ministry, Cell groups, sister churches, home missions, Home bible studies, college campus ministry, prison ministry, radio ministry.

Were all taken from other denominations as we saw them have church growth.

It sure would be awesome for the Apostalic movement, to think of themselves as not just Apostalic in our core beliefs.

But Apostalic in our outreach, outpouring and annointing.

Nathan Eckstadt

Right. I think the Apostolic culture has fooled themselves into thinking they hold some elite position because their doctrine is truth and it is supposed to draw, the spirit they exude is supposed to draw, their separation is supposed to draw, GOD, WE ARE THE PEOPLE...YOUR ONLY PEOPLE!!!

The blunt realization after two-three generations of this thinking is hopefully beginning to dawn on some folks, that the UPC and even moreso, their constituency is in dire need of significance, despite their perceived elitism.

[Neck]

Please don't put every member of the UPCI into one basket. Not even all of it's leaders. There are many that recognize this fact. However, you cannot turn a ship of this size over night. It takes time and patience, And while you are turning the ship, you do want to do your best to keep everyone onboard.

I am sorry but is the leadership of the organization that sets the direction.

You are right many of the grass-roots ministers just follow the leader.

Patience has followed through:

Howard A Goss: 1941-1951

Arthur T Morgan: 1951-1967

Oliver F Fauss 1967-1968

Stanley M Chambers 1968-1977

Nathaniel A Urshan 1977-2002

Kenneth Haney 2002 - Present

There are what 6,000 plus ministers in the UPCI.

I would love for the records keepers to share with the general public how many ministers from say 1990 are still in the organization.

I would gather that much of the UPCI is a big turnover machine.

I am not a liscensed minister in the UPCI.

My father was and passed away at 43 in 1978.

Nathan Eckstadt

[BoredOutOfMyMind]

I would love for the records keepers to share with the general public how many ministers from say 1990 are still in the organization.

I would gather that much of the UPCI is a big turnover machine.

I am not a liscensed minister in the UPCI.

My father was and passed away at 43 in 1978.


Help me understand here- are you upset that your Father did not make sweeping changes in the time he was there, or are you upset at what you perceive as no change happenning now?

Do you have source for the 2002 article you referred to?

[vrblackwell]

I am sorry but is the leadership of the organization that sets the direction.

You are right many of the grass-roots ministers just follow the leader.

Patience has followed through:

Howard A Goss: 1941-1951

Arthur T Morgan: 1951-1967

Oliver F Fauss 1967-1968

Stanley M Chambers 1968-1977

Nathaniel A Urshan 1977-2002

Kenneth Haney 2002 - Present

There are what 6,000 plus ministers in the UPCI.

I would love for the records keepers to share with the general public how many ministers from say 1990 are still in the organization.

I would gather that much of the UPCI is a big turnover machine.

I am not a liscensed minister in the UPCI.

My father was and passed away at 43 in 1978.

Nathan Eckstadt


There is a big turn over of local licensed ministers. There are currently plans in the making to make it harder to receive your license.

[rrford]

Brother, the problem with this comment is that everyone ON the ship should be getting used to seeing the same scenery over and over and over again as the ship keeps turning and turning and turning... :D

I have to put the UPCI into one basket, because those dissenting appear to be the fringe exception and not the rule. General Conference has been General Conference for years. There are no landmarks occuring...and this could be considered the basket you are talking about.

"Except they hear a certain sound..."

People with a vision speak about it loudly and boldy. Visionaries do things about it loudly and boldly.

[rrford]

There is a big turn over of local licensed ministers. There are currently plans in the making to make it harder to receive your license.

Oh sure. Like giving a license to "music ministers."

For the most part licensing guidelines of any substance are left up to the individual District.

[Garfield]

And women preachers.

[rrford]

Right. I think the Apostolic culture has fooled themselves into thinking they hold some elite position because their doctrine is truth and it is supposed to draw, the spirit they exude is supposed to draw, their separation is supposed to draw, GOD, WE ARE THE PEOPLE...YOUR ONLY PEOPLE!!!

The blunt realization after two-three generations of this thinking is hopefully beginning to dawn on some folks, that the UPC and even moreso, their constituency is in dire need of significance, despite their perceived elitism.

Carp, more than anything they are in need of "a demonstration of the Holy Ghost and power."

Although you may not agree, I think if that were to actually happen the UPCI would see great revival without any program. JMHO.

[vrblackwell]

Oh sure. Like giving a license to "music ministers."

For the most part licensing guidelines of any substance are left up to the individual District.

There is something in the works about makin more requirements. I will try and find out more about it.

[Garfield]

Elitism. Like "Ye are MY people"?

[Neck]

Help me understand here- are you upset that your Father did not make sweeping changes in the time he was there, or are you upset at what you perceive as no change happenning now?

Do you have source for the 2002 article you referred to?

Here is the link to the article: http://www.ninetyandnine.com/Archives/20020121/cover.htm

I would just suggest that changes need to be made today for the organization to be relevant.

There were changes my Dad made in the UPCI in the 17 years (1961-1978) he was in the organization.

When he started teaching "Soul Sleep" vs going directly to heaven.

In the mid 1960's, maybe 5% of the organization understood or believed in it.

By the late 1970's and from his ability to teach it at all many of the UPCI bible colleges.

It has grown within the organization.

My Dad was for TV in the Mid 1970's.

We were at Mark Hanby's.

My Dad was the Dean of Theology at Hanby's Wideworld of Ministries.

We left Ft. Worth under the immense pressure from men in the UPCI on my Dad.

Mark Hanby told my mom at my Dad's funeral in March 1978.

He said John Eckstadt was a man of revelation and insight.

I witnessed Mark Hanby, Nathaniel Urshan talking at the funeral.

Mark Hanby with tear's in his eye's.

We can all talk as the years have poured on top of each other.

So many things could be different if men stopped trying to put out each fire that comes along.

With each fire put out there is no new message:

Nathan Eckstadt

[Garfield]

Just think where you COULD be if you hadn't left Ft. Worth.

[Neck]

Just think where you COULD be if you hadn't left Ft. Worth.

Not sure where that comment rest in your thoughts.

Many men were left behind by the organization that I witnessed as a boy.

My Dad drove us off in the sunset to Cincinnati, Ohio.

To fulfill a dream of his to pastor in Cincinnati, Ohio.

He had a close friend from Cincinnati named Frank F Curts who died in 1969.

Here is a link to one of the split off churches from Bro Curts.

Open the link it gives great history into Bro Curts.

http://www.firstap.org/history.shtml

See they had 900 members in Cincinnati in the late 1960's.

When Bro Curts in his 80's died from getting hit by a car.

The church split into groups.

As men tried to rally members to follow them.

Without direction Cincinnati for 5 decades has been the one of the hardest cities to pastor a UPCI church.

When my mom went to the cemetary to find a plot for my Dad.

There was a block for minister's but it had been listed as full for over 8 years.

Then they called and told her they found a double plot.

Where 2 could be buried.

It was listed as not open for years.

We choose the plots.

When we walked the gardens to my Dad's grave in March 1978.

Mark Hanby, Nathaniel Urshan, Wayne McClain, John Cupit, TW Barnes and some 150 plus other ministers.

We found Bro. Frank Curts burial 3 Graves to the right of my Dad.

We did not know he was buried there....

So one happy moment will be when they raise on the resurrection morning.

They are both facing the eastern sky and will be standing shoulder to shoulder as they meet Christ.

Nathan Eckstadt

[Carpenter]

Elitism. Like "Ye are MY people"?

Never turn your back on a man annointing his own head.

[Carpenter]

Carp, more than anything they are in need of "a demonstration of the Holy Ghost and power."

Although you may not agree, I think if that were to actually happen the UPCI would see great revival without any program. JMHO.

No, I do agree. The problem is that the UPC is soooo steeped in its own culture, it is sad that in the end it could be all they have left.

You and I have both experienced a prophesied, "Demonstration of the Holy Ghost and Power..." for decades, preacher upon preacher, revival upon revival, conference upon conference... What do you think is inhibiting this? I have a pretty good idea.

[ManOfWord]

My Dad drove us off in the sunset to Cincinnati, Ohio.

To fulfill a dream of his to pastor in Cincinnati, Ohio.

He had a close friend from Cincinnati named Frank F Curts who died in 1969.

Here is a link to one of the split off churches from Bro Curts.


Nathan Eckstadt

Nathan, Bro. Curts was a mentor to my pastor, G.D. Thompson who pastored in Ohio City, Van Wert and Columbus. He used to tell me numerous stories about Bro. Curts. He respected him highly, especially during his trying times.

Thank God for wonderful men!!!

[BoredOutOfMyMind]

Nathan, Bro. Curts was a mentor to my pastor, G.D. Thompson who pastored in Ohio City, Van Wert and Columbus. He used to tell me numerous stories about Bro. Curts. He respected him highly, especially during his trying times.

Thank God for wonderful men!!!

Can you imagine a choir dressed like this now?
I bet it WAS dapper for that time.

http://www.firstap.org/images/choir2.jpg

[rgcraig]

Looks like a couple of them didn't get the "wear a black suit" memo.

[Monkeyman]

Can you imagine a choir dressed like this now?
I bet it WAS dapper for that time.

http://www.firstap.org/images/choir2.jpg
No.:drawguns
Yes it was.:highfive

[MrRight]

No.:drawguns
Yes it was.:highfive

Talk about a platform standard! Gld we do not have to do that today!

[Monkeyman]

Talk about a platform standard! Gld we do not have to do that today!
I feel like asking them to please re-fill my drink and tipping them 20%!:tease

[MrRight]

I feel like asking them to please re-fill my drink and tipping them 20%!:tease

You mean, refill your glass wit the "kool-aid?"

[rrford]

No, I do agree. The problem is that the UPC is soooo steeped in its own culture, it is sad that in the end it could be all they have left.

You and I have both experienced a prophesied, "Demonstration of the Holy Ghost and Power..." for decades, preacher upon preacher, revival upon revival, conference upon conference... What do you think is inhibiting this? I have a pretty good idea.

Paradigms that folks get locked into. Perhaps I will repost the "Shifting Your Spiritual Paradigm" thread.

[ManOfWord]

Paradigms that folks get locked into. Perhaps I will repost the "Shifting Your Spiritual Paradigm" thread.

RR, that was a good thought provoking thread!

[rrford]

RR, that was a good thought provoking thread!

Just for fun, and in case we never see it again, I think I will repost it. :highfive

[Neck]

Nathan, Bro. Curts was a mentor to my pastor, G.D. Thompson who pastored in Ohio City, Van Wert and Columbus. He used to tell me numerous stories about Bro. Curts. He respected him highly, especially during his trying times.

Thank God for wonderful men!!!

That was nice to hear that good men. No matter their trials can be remembered for their Love of the Lord!

Nathan Eckstadt

[Neck]

No.:drawguns
Yes it was.:highfive

When I see a picture from this era.

I want to find out what the story ended up being for each person.

When you think back 50-60 years ago.

In a few decades what will folks be saying about all of us...

What will our stories be if God tarries.

Nathan Eckstadt

[Margies3]

Nathan, Bro. Curts was a mentor to my pastor, G.D. Thompson who pastored in Ohio City, Van Wert and Columbus. He used to tell me numerous stories about Bro. Curts. He respected him highly, especially during his trying times.

Thank God for wonderful men!!!

MOW, if your pastor was Bro Thompson, did you ever know the Schaffner's?

[Garfield]

Can you imagine a choir dressed like this now?
I bet it WAS dapper for that time.

http://www.firstap.org/images/choir2.jpg



Can you imagine how large this church was to have nearly 40 men in the choir?

[BoredOutOfMyMind]

Can you imagine how large this church was to have nearly 40 men in the choir?

Amazing observation indeed! We don't see all men's choirs at all now.

[rgcraig]

Can you imagine how large this church was to have nearly 40 men in the choir?
Are we sure it's a choir?

This could have been a conference and these are ministers in attendance.

[Garfield]

Are we sure it's a choir?

This could have been a conference and these are ministers in attendance.



Not enough diversity in neckwear for ministers. :)

[Whole Hearted]

I believe there will always be a UPC just as there is a Methodist org. But what will it be? If it continues the way it seems to be going it will be like the Methodist just a shell of it former self. I would like to see it stay true to what we started out to be, but that remains to be seen.

[Sister Truth Seeker]

Can you imagine how large this church was to have nearly 40 men in the choir?

If it is a choir...I would loved to have heard it...the one thing I have found in UPC an amazing bunch of truly talented and blessed singers, musicians..such God given talent...

[Sister Truth Seeker]

I believe there will always be a UPC just as there is a Methodist org. But what will it be? If it continues the way it seems to be going it will be like the Methodist just a shell of it former self. I would like to see it stay true to what we started out to be, but that remains to be seen.

It is not what it started out to be even now...it has changed over the years...I think that the UPC is learning to live in today without giving up the true values of importance...God first...TV will not destroy UPC..TV can not destroy what God has built!

[Advocate]

Has the UPCI served it's purpose and destined to fad into oblivion.
Will the Org. continue as a force in the church.

Do you drive a vehicle? Has that vehicle served its purpose?

Is there someone who takes vitimins, or has purchased special tools to help to accomplish a purpose? Have these things "served their purpose?"

Does someone work to provide income to pay bills, and supply the basic needs of life? Has this job served its purpose?

The UPC becomes a victim of excessive focus, sometimes. Were there some who assumed that God is restricted to use of the UPC? Were some supposing that what the UPC does or doesnt do will alter the chances of God doing His will?

Participation and contribution to the UPC, and its efforts is, and always has been voluntary. I have read many near hysterical reports of the evils of the UPC and likewise have sat amazed watching people who seem to want to climb to places of importance and power in the organization, not realizing what pressures and problems are waiting for them there. They truly do seem to be persuaded that the UPC has the eye and ear of God.

We need to be clear on a few matters, Apostolic people. If there is a good question, it is this: Is God even significantly aware of the UPC?

All organizations serve a purpose, and like the car you drive, or the vitimins you take, will continue to until the engine wears out, or the body perishes, or we run out of supply. With blessing, we will replenish the supply. We are aware of the purpose it serves. It is OUR responsibility to meet that need, not God's.

It is incumbent on us, as Christians, to organize, and to surrender our will to the Holy Ghost, who permeates through the great SINGLE body which is, the residency of the Lord God in this era. We must do this, somehow. If we can do it with the UPC, fine. But if not, we who are Christians will do this somehow. This is a day for more passion and love for our neighbor, not less. We are called to greater surrender of our personal ideosyncracies, not less, and the Holy Ghost is working in each of us who make a sincere profession of Christ.

Is this a body that is wider than the UPC? Absolutely. But hear this clearly and soberly: It is also a body that is narrower than the UPC. These words should not encourage those who advocate plurality of doctrine, or who reduce the Apostolic doctrine to incorporate easy believism, or a non-separated Christian life, without instruction and standard.

I fully expect to see many of those who call themselves "liberals" today, grow convicted over the need of greater separation from the world, as they see personal losses and corruption up face to face. They will become willing to stand up and get in between the weaker saints, and the world, and help them to see how to live a stronger life in Jesus. They will find a new passion and vitality that they have lacked, and privately sought for at this time.

I also expect to see many who are grousing about how backslidden the UPC is to sometime soon, look around, and notice that their attitudes stink, and that they are an inch away from being condemned of rejecting the influence and presence of the Spirit themselves, and become considerably more practical. Theur churches will revive, and explode when this happens.

The UPC is simply a way for people to accomplish one of the highest callings that the Christian has - to be ONE.

May the Lord bless them who devote themselves to the betterment of fellowship and care for one another through this 'carnal" vehicle.

May God HELP them who are persuaded that spirituality is power, influence, and money, and live to control and dominate this orgnaization, and also those who are fearful of others within. They need to turn their eyes to Jesus or suffer the consequences of a loss of their first estate.

I love the UPC. It is a great organization consisting of great Christians. I do not care for what it is becoming, in many respects.

The wounds of a friend, delivered by the ...

Advocate

[Garfield]

It is not what it started out to be even now...it has changed over the years...I think that the UPC is learning to live in today without giving up the true values of importance...God first...TV will not destroy UPC..TV can not destroy what God has built!



That's a thought. God built the UPC?

[Whole Hearted]

It is not what it started out to be even now...it has changed over the years...I think that the UPC is learning to live in today without giving up the true values of importance...God first...TV will not destroy UPC..TV can not destroy what God has built!

I see where they are giving up some values and trues.

[Felicity]

If the UPCI would truly serve it's PURPOSE it would remain strong and cohesive in my humble opinion.

[Charlie Brown]

I seem to remember a prophecy stating that the UPCI had seen its better days.

[Felicity]

I seem to remember a prophecy stating that the UPCI had seen its better days.I heard that too. That the best days were behind.

[Charlie Brown]

I heard that too. That the best days were behind.

In all honestly, though I hate to see it, I tend to agree with it.

[Whole Hearted]

I hate to say it, but it is probably true that the best days are behind.

[Felicity]

In all honestly, though I hate to see it, I tend to agree with it.The best days are behind but that doesn't mean that it can't retain the strength and effectiveness and cohesiveness (whatever is left) that it has now.

It hasn't been the same for a number of years already now. Even those within and those who still love the organization recognize this and the problems that exist. They know better than I.

[Carpenter]

Every single organization, movement, dispensation, government, group, etc. is subject to entropy.

If you take a look at the UPC from a structural perspective, it has been the same for its entire lifespan.

Just because a cornerstone was put into place in the 1940's doesn't mean you need to do everything like you did then so that the foundation will remain as strong.

[ManOfWord]

If the ministers in the UPCI would put away their "swords" and pick up their "towels" the org might once again see glorious days.

As long as they continue in their ministerial "assasinations" they haven't a "snowball's" chance. Case in point: The Western District. :D

[Garfield]

Some would rather die fighting for truth than give in to the world.

[Felicity]

I hate to say it, but it is probably true that the best days are behind.Hey bro. Can you explain this for me? Why do you say this? I was part of some of those best years so it's pertinent to me to understand your thinking here.

[ManOfWord]

Some would rather die fighting for truth than give in to the world.

Some would rather die fighting for ANYTHING...............and sometimes even truth! :D

[Praxeas]

Has the UPCI served it's purpose and destined to fad into oblivion.
Will the Org. continue as a force in the church.
it's not the UPCI that serves or does not serve it's purpose. It's the licensed membership that does or does not, for whatever reason.

The UPCI stands for UNITED Pentecostal Church Incorporated and it is anything but united anymore.

Here in the WD this is all too true. We have a group of churchs within the WD that don't fellowship with churches they consider to be compromising...what constitutes compromise? As little as wearing a wedding band and allowing video (not TV nor Hollywood movies....just plain video of any sort)

It's so bad that they have gone against the directives of the WD board to NOT start their own campmeeting....

I remember LS preached a message "There is no such thing as Arab unity"...

As long as the Muslims don't have a common enemy to unite against they kill each other. This seems to be the same thing happening. You watch. These same people, when attacking the "compromisers" becomes passe` will start attacking each other.

One pastor is ok with listening to country music. Another is ok with sleeves to the elbow. It's nuts. Yes it has been like this for a while now, but I don't think it was always as divided as it is now....was it?

When they put in "not contending for our own views to the disunity of the body" way back then...was it anything like it is now? Did they contend to the disunity of the body?

[ManOfWord]

it's not the UPCI that serves or does not serve it's purpose. It's the licensed membership that does or does not, for whatever reason.

The UPCI stands for UNITED Pentecostal Church Incorporated and it is anything but united anymore.

Here in the WD this is all too true. We have a group of churchs within the WD that don't fellowship with churches they consider to be compromising...what constitutes compromise? As little as wearing a wedding band and allowing video (not TV nor Hollywood movies....just plain video of any sort)

It's so bad that they have gone against the directives of the WD board to NOT start their own campmeeting....

I remember LS preached a message "There is no such thing as Arab unity"...

As long as the Muslims don't have a common enemy to unite against they kill each other. This seems to be the same thing happening. You watch. These same people, when attacking the "compromisers" becomes passe` will start attacking each other.

One pastor is ok with listening to country music. Another is ok with sleeves to the elbow. It's nuts. Yes it has been like this for a while now, but I don't think it was always as divided as it is now....was it?

When they put in "not contending for our own views to the disunity of the body" way back then...was it anything like it is now? Did they contend to the disunity of the body?


Don't get me started, Prax!!! When that was put in there, there were differences of opinion as to when a person was saved. Even at that, they didn't turn their swords on each other! They were genuine, God loving Christians then. That is why they made such an impact, and why theyr'e not now, IMO!

[Praxeas]

Don't get me started, Prax!!! When that was put in there, there were differences of opinion as to when a person was saved. Even at that, they didn't turn their swords on each other! They were genuine, God loving Christians then. That is why they made such an impact, and why theyr'e not now, IMO!
I agree. I wonder though...what difference does it make if a person says you don't have to be baptised in jesus name to be saved but if you are disobedient to doing that then you probably aren't saved to begin with?

I mean...if a church is full of people that are baptized in Jesus name and filld with the Holy Ghost then what problem is it if that church does not teach baptism absolutely saves you?

[Whole Hearted]

Hey bro. Can you explain this for me? Why do you say this? I was part of some of those best years so it's pertinent to me to understand your thinking here.


From what I see the UPC has gone down hill. Holiness is at an all time low, much of the preaching is shallow and vanilla. It's just not what it used to be.

[Praxeas]

From what I see the UPC has gone down hill. Holiness is at an all time low, much of the preaching is shallow and vanilla. It's just not what it used to be.
What kind of Holiness? Part of the problem as I see it is "Holiness" became synonymous with outward standards and not with a genuine change of heart. It becomes frustrating to people to be classified as Holy by outward appearances when we knew certain folks were just not as Holy as they appeared....full of lying, thieving, hypocrisy......

Outward Holiness would have so much more a profound meaning if we did not do that.

[Neck]

Can you imagine how large this church was to have nearly 40 men in the choir?

The church ran close to 900 in 1968. By late 1969 it was done and over. Split into 5 churches that all claim to be the original church.

Never be comfortable in what you do and have.

It could end the next day.

Nathan Eckstadt

[Neck]

Are we sure it's a choir?

This could have been a conference and these are ministers in attendance.

The Church ran almost 900 in 1968

[Praxeas]

The church ran close to 900 in 1968. By late 1969 it was done and over. Split into 5 churches that all claim to be the original church.

Never be comfortable in what you do and have.

It could end the next day.

Nathan Eckstadt
maybe that is God's doing.....the church all huddled around Jerusalem until the persecution came. Then they spread out. I don't think churches were ever meant to be large mega churches. I always felt they were supposed to start new, smaller works....train a man as a pastor....send him to other side of town with some families to start a new work

[Whole Hearted]

What kind of Holiness? Part of the problem as I see it is "Holiness" became synonymous with outward standards and not with a genuine change of heart. It becomes frustrating to people to be classified as Holy by outward appearances when we knew certain folks were just not as Holy as they appeared....full of lying, thieving, hypocrisy......

Outward Holiness would have so much more a profound meaning if we did not do that.

I don't disagree with you. I believe that it should all be preached, but I don't remember hearing much preaching about lying, cheating, hatred, envy, lust and so on either.

I believe that holiness is inward and outward.

[Neck]

Some would rather die fighting for truth than give in to the world.

If they die fighting it is because they are fighting only with each other.

To the rest of the Apostalic movement.

They are not longer a Heavy weight champ. It reminds me of Mike Tyson and Buster Douglas.

Tyson never regained his status and never looked the same.

Who was to blame. Tyson himself he just could not get over that folks and fighters found him no longer valid.

[Neck]

maybe that is God's doing.....the church all huddled around Jerusalem until the persecution came. Then they spread out. I don't think churches were ever meant to be large mega churches. I always felt they were supposed to start new, smaller works....train a man as a pastor....send him to other side of town with some families to start a new work

That might have been right in 1969. With the mega churches today, we better have some examples of Oneness churches. The standard for success today is much higher than in 1969.

[Felicity]

The UPCI hasn't served it's purpose until the Gospel has been preached to every nation, every tribe and every tongue. The initial purpose of the UPCI was ........

"The Whole Gospel To The Whole World"

That hasn't been accomplished yet far as I know. :thumbsup

[ManOfWord]

I agree. I wonder though...what difference does it make if a person says you don't have to be baptised in jesus name to be saved but if you are disobedient to doing that then you probably aren't saved to begin with?

I mean...if a church is full of people that are baptized in Jesus name and filld with the Holy Ghost then what problem is it if that church does not teach baptism absolutely saves you?

This is pretty much where we come down on the issue at NLC.

I don't see a problem with that at all. After all they are obeying the word.

Which is more important, being obedient or having the "proper" understanding of any particular doctrine?

[Praxeas]

This is pretty much where we come down on the issue at NLC.

I don't see a problem with that at all. After all they are obeying the word.

Which is more important, being obedient or having the "proper" understanding of any particular doctrine?
Yes and consider this....it always seems weird when the debate comes up over "baptism saves/does not save"...

I knew this guy that was ex-UPC who is now a Greek Orthodox....still speaks in tongues too. But he was saying this sort of stuff was always a western church thing and it was just foreign to them. And even though they insist baptism is essential for salvation they would never say someone is absolutely lost because they did not get baptized. They leave that up to the sovergnty of God....

But in the end....the issue I raise is this....never...not once EVER did ANYONE EVER in the entire bible question "Do I need to be baptized?"..."Why do I need to be baptized?"...."Is it essential Peter? Or can I hold off for a while till my family arrives".....

Never. They always obeyed immediately...no questions asked

[Neck]

The UPCI hasn't served it's purpose until the Gospel has been preached to every nation, every tribe and every tongue. The initial purpose of the UPCI was ........

"The Whole Gospel To The Whole World"

That hasn't been accomplished yet far as I know. :thumbsup

One way would be by TV...

[Felicity]

One way would be by TV...TV is a medium that is widely accessible in many parts of the world but certainly not all. Three problems come quickly to mind in regard to televangelism:

1. Most of the more remote areas of the world that haven't been touched yet by the Gospel don't even have Bibles written in their own language let alone television reception.

2. Language. Even if they did have access to television they wouldn't be able to understand what was being said because it wouldn't be in their own native tongues. I wonder if people understand that there are still many many vast parts of the planet where people speak languages very few people in the rest of the world understand.

3. Very slim possibility of follow-up even if people did turn their lives over to God as a result of televangelism

Jesus said, "Go!". That's still the best way!

[NLYP]

Smooth as silk so far. Can't find a troublemaker anywhere. Yet. :heeheehee

:tease :tease :tease :tease :tease

[The Dean]

:tease :tease :tease :tease :tease

Ah yes... let the games begin!

:sad













(Glad you are here, by the way!)

[Neck]

TV is a medium that is widely accessible in many parts of the world but certainly not all. Three problems come quickly to mind in regard to televangelism:

1. Most of the more remote areas of the world that haven't been touched yet by the Gospel don't even have Bibles written in their own language let alone television reception.

2. Language. Even if they did have access to television they wouldn't be able to understand what was being said because it wouldn't be in their own native tongues. I wonder if people understand that there are still many many vast parts of the planet where people speak languages very few people in the rest of the world understand.

3. Very slim possibility of follow-up even if people did turn their lives over to God as a result of televangelism

Jesus said, "Go!". That's still the best way!

Then tell me how 2 missionaries in each country can make a difference. Lets plan on the rapture around year 3500.

[Neck]

TV is a medium that is widely accessible in many parts of the world but certainly not all. Three problems come quickly to mind in regard to televangelism:

1. Most of the more remote areas of the world that haven't been touched yet by the Gospel don't even have Bibles written in their own language let alone television reception.

2. Language. Even if they did have access to television they wouldn't be able to understand what was being said because it wouldn't be in their own native tongues. I wonder if people understand that there are still many many vast parts of the planet where people speak languages very few people in the rest of the world understand.

3. Very slim possibility of follow-up even if people did turn their lives over to God as a result of televangelism

Jesus said, "Go!". That's still the best way!

Some of those grass huts in Africa were seen watching the superbowl with a TV that had a Global Satellite connected to it.

TV is more widespread than people know...

The issue if any with TV is many countries do not allow the progamming into the country.

[ManOfWord]

But in the end....the issue I raise is this....never...not once EVER did ANYONE EVER in the entire bible question "Do I need to be baptized?"..."Why do I need to be baptized?"...."Is it essential Peter? Or can I hold off for a while till my family arrives".....

Never. They always obeyed immediately...no questions asked


Which is exactly what I think they should do. I don't think it should be a matter for debate. Just obey. I think it that simple.

[Garfield]

The UPCI hasn't served it's purpose until the Gospel has been preached to every nation, every tribe and every tongue. The initial purpose of the UPCI was ........

"The Whole Gospel To The Whole World"

That hasn't been accomplished yet far as I know. :thumbsup

One way would be by TV...



TV the lazy person's answer to evangelism. Never mind personal accountability to go into all the world. Throw enough money at the "problem" and it sooths the conscience. If the church is on TV then I can go fishing or sit on my sofa, watch the soaps and feel good about all those poor lost people.

[Garfield]

TV is a medium that is widely accessible in many parts of the world but certainly not all. Three problems come quickly to mind in regard to televangelism:

1. Most of the more remote areas of the world that haven't been touched yet by the Gospel don't even have Bibles written in their own language let alone television reception.

2. Language. Even if they did have access to television they wouldn't be able to understand what was being said because it wouldn't be in their own native tongues. I wonder if people understand that there are still many many vast parts of the planet where people speak languages very few people in the rest of the world understand.

3. Very slim possibility of follow-up even if people did turn their lives over to God as a result of televangelism

Jesus said, "Go!". That's still the best way!


Makes sense to me.

[Felicity]

Some of those grass huts in Africa were seen watching the superbowl with a TV that had a Global Satellite connected to it.

TV is more widespread than people know...

The issue if any with TV is many countries do not allow the progamming into the country.I know how widespread television is. I'm just saying that there are still MANY areas of the world who don't have access and if they did it would still be a pretty ineffective way of sharing the Gospel.

I'm not saying television shouldn't be used. I'm just pointing out the fact that it's not THE answer.

I don't think people in North America understand that there are still so many people groups and areas of the world where the language is still not even understood. They don't understand or speak any of the understood languages of the world. Bibles are still not even available.

I didn't realize myself until I picked up a book a few years ago that explains this and lists scores of these kind of places and people groups and the huge need that there is still for PRAYER and intercession on behalf of the lost people of the world who haven't even had a witness yet of the Gospel or truth.

That's the awesome thing about prayer. You can walk right into some of these places through the avenue of prayer and the Holy Ghost and have a part in seeing LIGHT shine into the hearts of men and women. I know this is true through experience. There are places I will never visit in person that I've been to as a result of traveling there in prayer and in the Holy Ghost. :) And I've heard reports of how God has moved in some of those places.

If we can't GO we can PRAY! Prayer works! I wonder sometimes if people really really believe this. :dunno

PERSONAL EVANGELISM has always been and always will be the most effective way of presenting the Gospel.

[Whole Hearted]

TV the lazy person's answer to evangelism. Never mind personal accountability to go into all the world. Throw enough money at the "problem" and it sooths the conscience. If the church is on TV then I can go fishing or sit on my sofa, watch the soaps and feel good about all those poor lost people.

:ty

[ManOfWord]

TV the lazy person's answer to evangelism. Never mind personal accountability to go into all the world. Throw enough money at the "problem" and it sooths the conscience. If the church is on TV then I can go fishing or sit on my sofa, watch the soaps and feel good about all those poor lost people.

TV is NOT THE answer. It is a tool and needs to be utilized. It is part of going into all the world. There may be some who feel that throwing money at the evangelism problem solves it, but I have not met them.

Personally, I don't know anyone that thinks like you have put forth here. I guess when you paint with a broad brush, it doesn't matter.

[Ferd]

Which is exactly what I think they should do. I don't think it should be a matter for debate. Just obey. I think it that simple.

...with the qualification that if they dont, it wont jepordize their salvation... please add that part.... hee hee.

[Whole Hearted]

Maybe we need to take out ads in Playboy too.


There might be some sinners there.

[Ferd]

TV the lazy person's answer to evangelism. Never mind personal accountability to go into all the world. Throw enough money at the "problem" and it sooths the conscience. If the church is on TV then I can go fishing or sit on my sofa, watch the soaps and feel good about all those poor lost people.

yea and socket wrenches are the lazy mechanics way of removing a nut.

[Ferd]

Maybe we need to take out ads in Playboy too.

there is no rule against that.

[Whole Hearted]

there is no rule against that.

Oh well if there's not a rule against it let's do it. Wonder if the strip club would let us advertise there too?

[Garfield]

TV is NOT THE answer. It is a tool and needs to be utilized. It is part of going into all the world. There may be some who feel that throwing money at the evangelism problem solves it, but I have not met them.

Personally, I don't know anyone that thinks like you have put forth here. I guess when you paint with a broad brush, it doesn't matter.



Looks like we live in two different worlds, because that's exactly what I am seeing over here. And it would appear that your brush is just as broad as mine. :tease

[Garfield]

yea and socket wrenches are the lazy mechanics way of removing a nut.



Amazing! I see Acts 2:38 as the socket wrenches for the active mechanic's way of removing the nut.

[MrRight]

Maybe we need to take out ads in Playboy too.


There might be some sinners there.

As many baksliders and as there are reading it and smut on XXX sites and goin to strip clubs, maybe that woudn't be a bad idea. After all, you need to go wher they are.

[Garfield]

As many baksliders and as there are reading it and smut on XXX sites and goin to strip clubs, maybe that woudn't be a bad idea. After all, you need to go wher they are.




You go and I will wait here. :)

[Brother Price]

You know, I use to bash the UPC hard. This is what I have found out...

The UPCI did not self-destruct just because I was brash.
I was not invited to the GC to speak on how she is going to Hell.
I lost some really good fellowship.
I demeaned an Apostolic organization that was reaching the lost.
I became a nut job.

If the UPCI goes on TV, so what? Will this mean she will quit preaching Acts 2:38? No. We really need to quit fooling ourselves. Monitors are TVs and many saints have at least one in their home, and this includes the computer monitor that we read messages on.

How about this instead? How about we get real, and admit that the UPCI, ALJC, PAW, and these orgs are doing a good work. Just my thoughts.

[Nahum]

You know, I use to bash the UPC hard. This is what I have found out...

The UPCI did not self-destruct just because I was brash.
I was not invited to the GC to speak on how she is going to Hell.
I lost some really good fellowship.
I demeaned an Apostolic organization that was reaching the lost.
I became a nut job.

If the UPCI goes on TV, so what? Will this mean she will quit preaching Acts 2:38? No. We really need to quit fooling ourselves. Monitors are TVs and many saints have at least one in their home, and this includes the computer monitor that we read messages on.

How about this instead? How about we get real, and admit that the UPCI, ALJC, PAW, and these orgs are doing a good work. Just my thoughts.

I like you. Balanced, sincere, self-deprecating. Highly unusual on Apostolic forums. :ty

[Garfield]

You know, I use to bash the UPC hard. This is what I have found out...

The UPCI did not self-destruct just because I was brash.
I was not invited to the GC to speak on how she is going to Hell.
I lost some really good fellowship.
I demeaned an Apostolic organization that was reaching the lost.
I became a nut job.

If the UPCI goes on TV, so what? Will this mean she will quit preaching Acts 2:38? No. We really need to quit fooling ourselves. Monitors are TVs and many saints have at least one in their home, and this includes the computer monitor that we read messages on.

How about this instead? How about we get real, and admit that the UPCI, ALJC, PAW, and these orgs are doing a good work. Just my thoughts.


Maybe this will get you reinstated in the lost fellowship, but I doubt they will call you to speak at GC.

[Carpenter]

You know, I use to bash the UPC hard. This is what I have found out...

The UPCI did not self-destruct just because I was brash.
I was not invited to the GC to speak on how she is going to Hell.
I lost some really good fellowship.
I demeaned an Apostolic organization that was reaching the lost.
I became a nut job.

If the UPCI goes on TV, so what? Will this mean she will quit preaching Acts 2:38? No. We really need to quit fooling ourselves. Monitors are TVs and many saints have at least one in their home, and this includes the computer monitor that we read messages on.

How about this instead? How about we get real, and admit that the UPCI, ALJC, PAW, and these orgs are doing a good work. Just my thoughts.

If TV is the only thing that will cause SHE to quit preaching, the good old boys would have voted it in decades ago!

:ursofunny :slaphappy :lol :toofunny

[Brother Price]

If TV is the only thing that will cause SHE to quit preaching, the good old boys would have voted it in decades ago!

:ursofunny :slaphappy :lol :toofunny

:killinme :killinme :killinme

[ManOfWord]

Looks like we live in two different worlds, because that's exactly what I am seeing over here. And it would appear that your brush is just as broad as mine. :tease

And just "where" is over "here?"

[Neck]

bump from the past

[freeatlast]

Brother, what do you see the "purpose" of the UPC in say 20 years.

A rest home for ultra cons.

[TRFrance]

*sigh*
I see a lot of wishful thinking going on in some of these posts.

[Margies3]

Maybe this will get you reinstated in the lost fellowship, but I doubt they will call you to speak at GC.

Bet they won't invite him to join their Preacher's Only forum either. :stirpot

[James Griffin]

Interesting thread to resurrect.

Personally I believe the UPC's best days are ahead of it.

[pelathais]

Has the UPCI served it's purpose and destined to fad into oblivion.
Will the Org. continue as a force in the church.
The "Org. continue as a force in the church?"

"The Org." was a "force in the church?" I used to dream of helping in some small way to make that true, but I know of no time when it could really be said to have been "a force." Maybe a "footnote" or perhaps a "parallel stream" at times.

My viewpoint today is that "the Org." at its best, felt the powerful force of "the church..." But I don't really think the UPC has ever yet been "a force" impacting our larger society and helping to mold and shape the destiny of nations the way "the church" has.

[mizpeh]

The "Org. continue as a force in the church?"

"The Org." was a "force in the church?" I used to dream of helping in some small way to make that true, but I know of no time when it could really be said to have been "a force." Maybe a "footnote" or perhaps a "parallel stream" at times.

My viewpoint today is that "the Org." at its best, felt the powerful force of "the church..." But I don't really think the UPC has ever yet been "a force" impacting our larger society and helping to mold and shape the destiny of nations the way "the church" has.

The church is the body of Christ. The body of Christ are those who have been baptized by the Spirit and made to drink of the Spirit. 1 Cor 12:13.

Pelathais, who is "the church" you have in quotes? The RCC?

[TRFrance]

The "Org. continue as a force in the church?"

"The Org." was a "force in the church?" I used to dream of helping in some small way to make that true, but I know of no time when it could really be said to have been "a force." Maybe a "footnote" or perhaps a "parallel stream" at times.

My viewpoint today is that "the Org." at its best, felt the powerful force of "the church..." But I don't really think the UPC has ever yet been "a force" impacting our larger society and helping to mold and shape the destiny of nations the way "the church" has.

The UPCI has been used by God to lead millions (maybe tens of millions?)into the infilling of the Holy Ghost/baptism in Jesus' name since its inception 63 years ago. If you don't consider that a force, but rather "a footnote", I have to seriously question your knowledge and judgment concerning the UPCI's impact.

The church is the body of Christ. The body of Christ are those who have been baptized by the Spirit and made to drink of the Spirit. 1 Cor 12:13.

Pelathais, who is "the church" you have in quotes? The RCC?

I was wondering the same thing, Mizpeh. How exactly does he define the church? I define the church as those filled with His Spirit and baptized into His name, but Pelathais seems to define the church quite differently.

[James Griffin]

The "Org. continue as a force in the church?"

"The Org." was a "force in the church?" I used to dream of helping in some small way to make that true, but I know of no time when it could really be said to have been "a force." Maybe a "footnote" or perhaps a "parallel stream" at times.

My viewpoint today is that "the Org." at its best, felt the powerful force of "the church..." But I don't really think the UPC has ever yet been "a force" impacting our larger society and helping to mold and shape the destiny of nations the way "the church" has.

Lest anyone misinterpret what follows as UPCI bashing, I refer to my earlier quote saying I sincerely believe its best days are ahead.

I agree with what Pel said in the context I think was meant.

The UPCI is part of 'the church' as opposed to being THE CHURCH as so many of us were raised.

And his issue was specifically addressing being a force to society at large, and shaping the destiny of nations. No one is denying 10s of millions of individuals have been impacted. (And despite impressions sometimes given here, usually in a more positive way that not lol).

Historically it has also been very isolationist, interpreting spiritual separation to mean dropping out of society for fear of being contaminated by “the world”. So while reaching individuals we did not reach our culture.

Fortunately, the last 20 years or so have seen an unparalleled rise in Apostolic professionals. These men and women have the potential to change the environment “outside the church”.

The reason I have to keep using quotation marks is to pay homage to “our” lingo. Many have not yet grasp the church is not the four walls. It is the people. And they are still “the church” outside the four walls of where they choose to congregate.

The single greatest charge I would lay at the UPCI is that of squandered potential.

Being the quixotic person I am, I once again believe that is changing.

[SDG]

Viva Don Quixote!!!

Can I be Sancho ... menos la Panza?

[James Griffin]

Viva Don Quixote!!!

Can I be Sancho ... menos la Panza?

Sancho Flaco ye shall be!

[harleypreacher]

Has the UPCI served it's purpose and destined to fad into oblivion.
Will the Org. continue as a force in the church.

When the younger generation sees the UPC as a organization that has no purpose and will not join an organization that wants to control them and they find that they can reach their world without a manual or Articles of Faith, the UPC has served its purpose. The UPC needs to wake up with a new purpose or it will be a very small group in 20 years. I know a lot of 20 and 30 year old preachers that are refusing to join the UPC, young men who were raised in the UPC. That group will be the judge of the UPC serving its purpose, the next generation.

[Felicity]

I haven't read much of this thread so I'm just posting off the thread title..... "Has the UPCI Served It's Purpose?"

The answer is no. The purpose for the UPCI ever becoming a fact was "the whole Gospel to the whole world." That was and hopefully still is the main focus and the "raison d'etre" for its existence.

If it remains so, if sacrifice is encouraged and involved in seeing the cause fulfilled and if people will be committed to working together for the common purpose - namely "the whole gospel to the whole world" - then the favour and blessing of God will be regained and realized.

I feel that focus has been lost and we're seeing the reaping of that.

[Sister Alvear]

The UPC has not served it´s purpose...they are a powerful voice thoughtout the world...I am not UPC but am grateful to them for all they have done for thousands of missionaries...
Other groups also are reaching out...
My vision is diferent than the UPC however I have no stones to throw.

[Pressing-On]

I haven't read much of this thread so I'm just posting off the thread title..... "Has the UPCI Served It's Purpose?"

The answer is no. The purpose for the UPCI ever becoming a fact was "the whole Gospel to the whole world." That was and hopefully still is the main focus and the "raison d'etre" for its existence.

If it remains so, if sacrifice is encouraged and involved in seeing the cause fulfilled and if people will be committed to working together for the common purpose - namely "the whole gospel to the whole world" - then the favour and blessing of God will be regained and realized.

I feel that focus has been lost and we're seeing the reaping of that.

We that have gone through "many dangers, toils and snares" know that suffering brings strength. "When I am weak then am I strong."

If the UPC is finished then God is finished. I don't believe that one little bit!

Just my thoughts. :D

[Michael Phelps]

We that have gone through "many dangers, toils and snares" know that suffering brings strength. "When I am weak then am I strong."

If the UPC is finished then God is finished. I don't believe that one little bit!

Just my thoughts. :D

I should have learned my lesson on the other thread, and have no desire to fight with you, PO, but I really don't believe this statement........God is the same, organizations and efforts change from time to time.

[Pressing-On]

I should have learned my lesson on the other thread, and have no desire to fight with you, PO, but I really don't believe this statement........God is the same, organizations and efforts change from time to time.

That was a very stereotypical response, Michael! :ursofunny

Excuse me while I roll my eyes - the UPC is made up of spirit filled people - did you think God was going to draw the blinds?

And yes I know they change. I was certain you knew I meant that. Dorito!!!

[Pressing-On]

Where did you go, Dorito - er, I mean, Michael?!

Can we think a little further than just in front of our nose? For heaven's sake will God abandon the whole organization when His Spirit is still moving in our midst?

Of course not! We haven't lost our vision. Mistakes have to be made in order to correct.

:pullhair:pullhair:pullhair:pullhair:pullhair

[freeatlast]

We that have gone through "many dangers, toils and snares" know that suffering brings strength. "When I am weak then am I strong."

If the UPC is finished then God is finished. I don't believe that one little bit!

Just my thoughts. :D

PO : I hope I am misunderstanding your statement. God is so much bigger than a tiny organization that calls itself the UPCI.

Most of what we, the UPCI, spend our time fussing about and what little we really accomplish, is not even a blip on God's radar screen.

[Pressing-On]

PO : I hope I am misunderstanding your statement. God is so much bigger than a tiny organization that calls itself the UPCI.

Most of what we, the UPCI, spend our time fussing about and what little we really accomplish, is not even a blip on God's radar screen.

You know I understand this is a Forum, but really - who could not be sensible enough to understand I couldn't mean we are it and no more.

I am saying that - even - in the little radar blip the UPCI is important to God - His people are members. That doesn't mean we are the only thing that can bring salvation to the world, but we also have our part in the "church".

I have never thought UPCI was it. My goodness, I was raised Catholic and we thought we were the "church". Don't you think after 25 years of that I might have caught on to something? :D

Mutters in Spanish under her breath.

[rgcraig]

You know I understand this is a Forum, but really - who could not be sensible enough to understand I couldn't mean we are it and no more.

I am saying that - even - in the little radar blip the UPCI is important to God - His people are members. That doesn't mean we are the only thing that can bring salvation to the world, but we also have our part in the "church".

I have never thought UPCI was it. My goodness, I was raised Catholic and we thought we were the "church". Don't you think after 25 years of that I might have caught on to something? :D

You know all that and I think we know you mean all that, but if you take that highlighted in red all by itself......it reads like it reads.

I've figured it out. You type too fast and we read too slow.

[Pressing-On]

You know all that and I think we know you mean all that, but if you take that highlighted in red all by itself......it reads like it reads.

I've figured it out. You type too fast and we read too slow.
Renda,
We've all been posting for yearsssssss. I thought we knew where were all stood. I haven't seen anyone change. It's not that hard for me.

Michael thinks I'm stereotypical because I don't like his golf shorts. Wut? :ursofunny

[rgcraig]

Renda,
We've all been posting for yearsssssss. I thought we knew where were all stood. I haven't seen anyone change. It's not that hard for me.

Michael thinks I'm stereotypical because I don't like his golf shorts. Wut? :ursofunny

What? He wears golf shorts?

[Pressing-On]

What? He wears golf shorts?
I think so. Isn't that sickening?!!!!

:bliss:bliss:bliss

[LaVonne]

I haven't read much of this thread so I'm just posting off the thread title..... "Has the UPCI Served It's Purpose?"

The answer is no. The purpose for the UPCI ever becoming a fact was "the whole Gospel to the whole world." That was and hopefully still is the main focus and the "raison d'etre" for its existence.

If it remains so, if sacrifice is encouraged and involved in seeing the cause fulfilled and if people will be committed to working together for the common purpose - namely "the whole gospel to the whole world" - then the favour and blessing of God will be regained and realized.

I feel that focus has been lost and we're seeing the reaping of that.

Agreed!

[Michael Phelps]

That was a very stereotypical response, Michael! :ursofunny

Excuse me while I roll my eyes - the UPC is made up of spirit filled people - did you think God was going to draw the blinds?

And yes I know they change. I was certain you knew I meant that. Dorito!!!

No, seriously, I wanted to understand your statement.

I read it to mean that when the UPC is dissolved, God will stop working, but I hoped you didn't mean it that way.

[Michael Phelps]

Renda,
We've all been posting for yearsssssss. I thought we knew where were all stood. I haven't seen anyone change. It's not that hard for me.

Michael thinks I'm stereotypical because I don't like his golf shorts. Wut? :ursofunny

Lol, I'll be putting them on at 3:00 pm today, whoo hoo!

Seriously, PO, I think you type things and don't realize how they read to others.

But, that's just my "stereotypical" response, hehehe.

[rgcraig]

Well, I can't say anymore or I'll be taking up for freeatlast and Michael.

[Pressing-On]

You know all that and I think we know you mean all that, but if you take that highlighted in red all by itself......it reads like it reads.

I've figured it out. You type too fast and we read too slow.


I feel that focus has been lost and we're seeing the reaping of that.
Let me explain a little more of my point of view.

When the statement is made - "I feel the focus has been lost...."

Lost is a word of finality in my eyes. Something rises up in me and I want to scream - NO!

I started a small candle business a little over a year ago. I've talked about some things on a thread I started. No one could imagine the cost, time, experimenting and mistakes that go into this! I have actually cried more than once!

Jars orders coming in wrong, wax that mottles, label changes that aren't working, dyes that don't work in all waxes, fragrances that come in and are not what you ordered, too much additive locking up the scent, too little additive locking up the scent etc., etc.

But something in me rises up and I say - "NO, I WILL NOT GIVE UP. I WILL NOT QUIT!

Since I am a part of the UPCI, something inside of me says, "NO, WE ARE NOT LOST. WE WON'T GIVE UP. SOMEHOW, SOMEWAY, WE HAVE TO MAKE THIS WORK AND IT NEEDS TO WORK THE RIGHT WAY."

I want God to change us into what He has purposed. I want to look back and have that name still listed as UPCI! I want to win!

So, this is what is behind my thinking when we talk about these things. We have His Spirit - somehow God is going to make it work. And don't forget, I did say some things need to change. I see things changing and I'm glad for it.

I'm not giving up until God says - "Your time here is over." If He ever does that, I will start a thread and we can all rejoice! ;)

[Encryptus]

Lest anyone misinterpret what follows as UPCI bashing, I refer to my earlier quote saying I sincerely believe its best days are ahead.

I agree with what Pel said in the context I think was meant.

The UPCI is part of 'the church' as opposed to being THE CHURCH as so many of us were raised.

And his issue was specifically addressing being a force to society at large, and shaping the destiny of nations. No one is denying 10s of millions of individuals have been impacted. (And despite impressions sometimes given here, usually in a more positive way that not lol).

Historically it has also been very isolationist, interpreting spiritual separation to mean dropping out of society for fear of being contaminated by “the world”. So while reaching individuals we did not reach our culture.

Fortunately, the last 20 years or so have seen an unparalleled rise in Apostolic professionals. These men and women have the potential to change the environment “outside the church”.

The reason I have to keep using quotation marks is to pay homage to “our” lingo. Many have not yet grasp the church is not the four walls. It is the people. And they are still “the church” outside the four walls of where they choose to congregate.

The single greatest charge I would lay at the UPCI is that of squandered potential.

Being the quixotic person I am, I once again believe that is changing.

Good post.

[Hawkman]

I think the upc has focused more on getting people converted to the doctrine of salvation far mor than they have focused on people being converted to the god of salvation. I think the doctirne that united them has become their golden calf and is more improtant to them that god himself. that's what I think.

[Michael Phelps]

Let me explain a little more of my point of view.

When the statement is made - "I feel the focus has been lost...."

Lost is a word of finality in my eyes. Something rises up in me and I want to scream - NO!

I started a small candle business a little over a year ago. I've talked about some things on a thread I started. No one could imagine the cost, time, experimenting and mistakes that go into this! I have actually cried more than once!

Jars orders coming in wrong, wax that mottles, label changes that aren't working, dyes that don't work in all waxes, fragrances that come in and are not what you ordered, too much additive locking up the scent, too little additive locking up the scent etc., etc.

But something in me rises up and I say - "NO, I WILL NOT GIVE UP. I WILL NOT QUIT!

Since I am a part of the UPCI, something inside of me says, "NO, WE ARE NOT LOST. WE WON'T GIVE UP. SOMEHOW, SOMEWAY, WE HAVE TO MAKE THIS WORK AND IT NEEDS TO WORK THE RIGHT WAY."

I want God to change us into what He has purposed. I want to look back and have that name still listed as UPCI! I want to win!

So, this is what is behind my thinking when we talk about these things. We have His Spirit - somehow God is going to make it work. And don't forget, I did say some things need to change. I see things changing and I'm glad for it.

I'm not giving up until God says - "Your time here is over." If He ever does that, I will start a thread and we can all rejoice! ;)

It wasn't the "focus is lost" comment that raised my eyebrows, it was the "If the UPC is finished, God is finished" comment.

Just for the record.

[Pressing-On]

Lol, I'll be putting them on at 3:00 pm today, whoo hoo!

Seriously, PO, I think you type things and don't realize how they read to others.

But, that's just my "stereotypical" response, hehehe.

That's because you want to read them that way. It might work better for me if you ASK me what I mean like FreeatLast!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :smack

You'll notice that I didn't agree with you on a thread this morning. I responded to Sister Alvear and put out my thoughts. I could have come after you, but I didn't because I'm so stinking polite!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:bliss:bliss

[Hawkman]

Until Jesus takes center stage again and becomes more important to the upc than anythings else, they'll continue to be insignificant as far as world changers.

[Pressing-On]

It wasn't the "focus is lost" comment that raised my eyebrows, it was the "If the UPC is finished, God is finished" comment.

Just for the record.

Well, my response was to being "lost". So many posters around here give me the impression that they think we are the stupidest and most idiotic thing going.

I've been in services, and recently, where the Holy Ghost was so strong we couldn't move and could only cry.

We are not LOST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:tissue:tantrum:tissue:tantrum

[rgcraig]

That's because you want to read them that way. It might work better for me if you ASK me what I mean like FreeatLast!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :smack

You'll notice that I didn't agree with you on a thread this morning. I responded to Sister Alvear and put out my thoughts. I could have come after you, but I didn't because I'm so stinking polite!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:bliss:blissBwwahhhhaa~! You made me smack my leg and hurt my knee!
:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny

[Michael Phelps]

That's because you want to read them that way. It might work better for me if you ASK me what I mean like FreeatLast!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :smack

You'll notice that I didn't agree with you on a thread this morning. I responded to Sister Alvear and put out my thoughts. I could have come after you, but I didn't because I'm so stinking polite!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:bliss:bliss

I didn't notice..........let me go back and read.......which thread?

[rgcraig]

I didn't notice..........let me go back and read.......which thread?

Isn't fussing on one thread at a time enough?:laffatu

[Pressing-On]

Bwwahhhhaa~! You made me smack my leg and hurt my knee!
:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny

:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny

[Pressing-On]

I didn't notice..........let me go back and read.......which thread?

Forget it Michael. I'm taking a break. I'm going to Neverland with the Lost Boys and Tinkerbell.

:bliss

[rgcraig]

Forget it Michael. I'm taking a break. I'm going to Neverland with the Lost Boys and Tinkerbell.

:bliss

Can you do this without drugs?

[Michael Phelps]

Forget it Michael. I'm taking a break. I'm going to Neverland with the Lost Boys and Tinkerbell.

:bliss

For the record, you made a good point. Next time, I'll ask you what you meant, instead of assuming......point well taken!

[Felicity]

Well, my response was to being "lost". So many posters around here give me the impression that they think we are the stupidest and most idiotic thing going.

I've been in services, and recently, where the Holy Ghost was so strong we couldn't move and could only cry.

We are not LOST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:tissue:tantrum:tissue:tantrumOh my. All this drama. :)

You or the UPC being lost is a huge leap from my speaking of lost focus in regard to foreign missions. LOL. :)

I never said the UPC was lost. I never said you were lost. I never said vision was lost.

What I said that what was the main focus and main raison d'etre for the formation of the UPCI ... "the whole Gospel to the whole world" ... has been lost.

That doesn't mean that there isn't still a focus on Missions because there is, but it being the main focus or one of the main focuses as far as purpose for existence has certainly been effected and experienced loss.

[Pressing-On]

For the record, you made a good point. Next time, I'll ask you what you meant, instead of assuming......point well taken!

You didn't think of that yourself?!! :pullhair:pullhair

If I had to marry someone like you, on the honeymoon night, I would wait until you were in the bathroom, sneak out of the hotel room and catch a flight to ICELAND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :smack

:bliss

[rgcraig]

You didn't think of that yourself?!! :pullhair:pullhair

If I had to marry someone like you, on the honeymoon night, I would wait until you were in the bathroom, sneak out of the hotel room and catch a flight to ICELAND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :smack

:bliss
Instead you have a hubby that hates your dog. :ursofunny

[Encryptus]

You didn't think of that yourself?!! :pullhair:pullhair

If I had to marry someone like you, on the honeymoon night, I would wait until you were in the bathroom, sneak out of the hotel room and catch a flight to ICELAND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :smack

:bliss

Now that thar was COLD

[Pressing-On]

Instead you have a hubby that hates your dog. :ursofunny

:ursofunny:ursofunny

He is warming up to him. :ursofunny

[Pressing-On]

Now that thar was COLD
Iceland is cold! What can I say?

:bliss:bliss

[Sister Alvear]

Need some ice from Iceland here it sure is hot in Brazil...

[Pressing-On]

Need some ice from Iceland here it sure is hot in Brazil...
The ice is in the mail, sister!!!

:bliss:bliss

[Sister Alvear]

Thank you hope it doesn´t melt!

[Sister Alvear]

I love crushed ice...

[Pressing-On]

Thank you hope it doesn´t melt!

I love crushed ice...

LOL! We'll package it in some dry ice to keep it frozen. LOL!

[Sister Alvear]

what day can I look for it to arrive?

[rgcraig]

what day can I look for it to arrive?

When hell freezes over?

[Pressing-On]

what day can I look for it to arrive?
Too much work, sister. You better purchase it local. lol

[Pressing-On]

When hell freezes over?

I was going to say that. I'm glad it was you, though!

:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny

[rgcraig]

I was going to say that. I'm glad it was you, though!

:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny

Well, I figure that it was used in correct format, so it wasn't cussing.

[Sister Alvear]

here I have got 5 young people from the church in my office I am rying to get them to eat spicy nuts with me...here we thought you was sending the ice for our drinks...boy are we ever let down!

[Sister Alvear]

hell freezing over is doubtful down here...

[Pressing-On]

Well, I figure that it was used in correct format, so it wasn't cussing.

I was going to say Hades. I thought it might lighten it a little.

:ursofunny

[Pressing-On]

here I have got 5 young people from the church in my office I am rying to get them to eat spicy nuts with me...here we thought you was sending the ice for our drinks...boy are we ever let down!
We'll pray someone brings you some drinks.

hell freezing over is doubtful down here...
Yes, I would think so.

[Sister Alvear]

The kids are laughing...

[Sister Alvear]

the kids said tell you they want some condensed milk to pour over the ice....

[Sister Alvear]

Condensed milk is a treat down here.

[rgcraig]

the kids said tell you they want some condensed milk to pour over the ice....

LOL - - I LOVE eating condensed milk out of the can......make you sick, but ooooh so good!

[Pressing-On]

The kids are laughing...

the kids said tell you they want some condensed milk to pour over the ice....

Condensed milk is a treat down here.

Sister,
Isn't that really fattening?

[Pressing-On]

LOL - - I LOVE eating condensed milk out of the can......make you sick, but ooooh so good!
Lord, I'm getting sick thinking of it. It's it like rich and "yellow"? :ursofunny

[rgcraig]

Lord, I'm getting sick thinking of it. It's it like rich and "yellow"? :ursofunny

It shouldn't be yellow if it's fresh!

I love making lemon ice box pie - - some in the pie, some in my mouth!!!!

[Pressing-On]

It shouldn't be yellow if it's fresh!

I love making lemon ice box pie - - some in the pie, some in my mouth!!!!
Then it's tan or something. Am I thinking of Eagle Brand?

[rgcraig]

Then it's tan or something. Am I thinking of Eagle Brand?

That's what condensed milk is.......and it's a bit off white.

[freeatlast]

Well, I can't say anymore or I'll be taking up for freeatlast and Michael.

Would that be so bad ? :ursofunny

[Pressing-On]

That's what condensed milk is.......and it's a bit off white.
Okay, I have a can in the pantry. It's been there for two years. :ursofunny:ursofunny

[Pressing-On]

Would that be so bad ? :ursofunny

Thanks for asking me to explain myself! Just wanted you to know that I appreciate you for it!!!!!

[rgcraig]

Okay, I have a can in the pantry. It's been there for two years. :ursofunny:ursofunny

Well, then it would be tan or yellow. Throw it out.

[rgcraig]

Would that be so bad ? :ursofunny

Not at all and I would in a heartbeat!

[freeatlast]

Thanks for asking me to explain myself! Just wanted you to know that I appreciate you for it!!!!!

:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny

[Pressing-On]

Well, then it would be tan or yellow. Throw it out.
Okay, I'll see if my husband wants it first.

:ursofunny:ursofunny

[Pressing-On]

:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny

:bliss:bliss:bliss:bliss

Actually, I was serious! :ursofunny

[Encryptus]

Well, then it would be tan or yellow. Throw it out.

Funny, I have the same rule for underwear.

[rgcraig]

PO : I hope I am misunderstanding your statement. God is so much bigger than a tiny organization that calls itself the UPCI.

Most of what we, the UPCI, spend our time fussing about and what little we really accomplish, is not even a blip on God's radar screen.

No, seriously, I wanted to understand your statement.

I read it to mean that when the UPC is dissolved, God will stop working, but I hoped you didn't mean it that way.

Now, what's the difference? They both said almost the exact same thang!

[Sister Alvear]

Throw nothing away dear ones...

[Pressing-On]

Now, what's the difference? They both said almost the exact same thang!
The difference is - HE DIDN'T ASK ME FIRST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:pullhair

[freeatlast]

:bliss:bliss:bliss:bliss

Actually, I was serious! :ursofunny

That's the problem with trying to "know" what someone is saying on these forums.

You r post kinda looked like when the upc...scratch that IF the upc was thru God would be thru too.

Sorry I misread what you mistyped. :kickcan

[Pressing-On]

Funny, I have the same rule for underwear.

:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny

I scared my dog I laughed so loud!!!!

:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny

[Sister Alvear]

God doesn´t need the UPC or me or any of us...BUT we need HIM...ever so much.

[rgcraig]

That's the problem with trying to "know" what someone is saying on these forums.

You r post kinda looked like when the upc...scratch that IF the upc was thru God would be thru too.

Sorry I misread what you mistyped. :kickcan
:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny

[Pressing-On]

That's the problem with trying to "know" what someone is saying on these forums.

You r post kinda looked like when the upc...scratch that IF the upc was thru God would be thru too.

Sorry I misread what you mistyped. :kickcan

But, you asked me to clarify! Now you are my friend!!!! :friend

:ursofunny

[rgcraig]

But, you asked me to clarify! Now you are my friend!!!! :friend

:ursofunny

I didn't read where he asked you to clarify. I think you are picking on someone. :laffatu

[freeatlast]

I didn't read where he asked you to clarify. I think you are picking on someone. :laffatu

:tissue

[rgcraig]

:tissue

It's fun to rile her up :gaga

[freeatlast]

I'm getting outta here ..before I get clobbered good.


Play nice...I gotta go study for sunday.

[Pressing-On]

PO : I hope I am misunderstanding your statement. God is so much bigger than a tiny organization that calls itself the UPCI.

Most of what we, the UPCI, spend our time fussing about and what little we really accomplish, is not even a blip on God's radar screen.

I didn't read where he asked you to clarify. I think you are picking on someone. :laffatu

He said, "I hope I am misunderstanding you."

Michael misunderstands me all the time - on purpose!!!!!!! :smack

[Sister Alvear]

Well, I think the UPC might be saved if they try hard...ha....

[rgcraig]

I'm getting outta here ..before I get clobbered good.


Play nice...I gotta go study for sunday.

But, it's only Friday! :ursofunny

[Pressing-On]

It's fun to rile her up :gaga
:smack

[Pressing-On]

Well, I think the UPC might be saved if they try hard...ha....

Sister Alvear!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[rgcraig]

He said, "I hope I am misunderstanding you."

Michael misunderstands me all the time - on purpose!!!!!!! :smack

I give up! :tantrum

[Pressing-On]

I give up! :tantrum

:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny

[Sister Alvear]

years ago many of the UPC really thought they were the only ones...one told me they thought I might be saved outside the UPC if I really tryed hard...glad that thought is not there anymore...

[Pressing-On]

I should have learned my lesson on the other thread, and have no desire to fight with you, PO, but I really don't believe this statement........God is the same, organizations and efforts change from time to time.

PO : I hope I am misunderstanding your statement. God is so much bigger than a tiny organization that calls itself the UPCI.

Most of what we, the UPCI, spend our time fussing about and what little we really accomplish, is not even a blip on God's radar screen.

Don't you see the difference, Renda?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Pressing-On]

years ago many of the UPC really thought they were the only ones...one told me they thought I might be saved outside the UPC if I really tryed hard...glad that thought is not there anymore...

Thank you. You are right it is not! Well, some probably still think that. :ursofunny

Funny, it's usually home missions. I wonder why that is?

[rgcraig]

Don't you see the difference, Renda?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Can I really win with an answer here?

[Pressing-On]

Can I really win with an answer here?

Just say yes, but I know you won't. :D

[Elizabeth]

There is such variety of churches, and people in UPC. I think the mistake that I have fallen into is defining the whole thing buy the actions of just a few-

I think that there are mighty churches and people within the UPC that are fulfilling the purpose of which the UPC was formed to accomplish.

[Pressing-On]

There is such variety of churches, and people in UPC. I think the mistake that I have fallen into is defining the whole thing buy the actions of just a few-

I think that there are mighty churches and people within the UPC that are fulfilling the purpose of which the UPC was formed to accomplish.

POTD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


:yourock:yourock

[Sister Alvear]

Sister Alvear!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
just teasing....

[rgcraig]

Just say yes, but I know you won't. :D

I do see a difference in those two, BUT those aren't the two that I compared - those are saying the same thing and I KNOW you won't agree with that.:ursofunny

[Elizabeth]

Watching Renda and Pressing going back in forth is like watching a tennis match-it's moving that fast.

My neck is hurting!

[Pressing-On]

I do see a difference in those two, BUT those are the two that I compared - those are saying the same thing and I KNOW you won't agree with that.:ursofunny
How can you say you see a difference but they are the same?

Are you talking about the two that I posted? You know Micheal is just plain mean and grumpy!!!! :D

[Elizabeth]

POTD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


:yourock:yourock

Well thank you! But its true.

[Pressing-On]

just teasing....

Sister! I was hoping you were!!!!! :ursofunny

[Pressing-On]

Well thank you! But its true.

Yes, it certainly is and that has been my contention all along - because I know it to be true!!!!!

[rgcraig]

How can you say you see a difference but they are the same?

Are you talking about the two that I posted? You know Micheal is just plain mean and grumpy!!!! :D

I meant to say "aren't the two I compared"

[Pressing-On]

I meant to say "aren't the two I compared"

So you are saying that upon viewing the two posts that I presented, Michael was in the wrong, right? :D

[rgcraig]

So you are saying that upon viewing the two posts that I presented, Michael was in the wrong, right? :D

Not at all. There is no wrong. You are wanting him to word things differently for YOU. What he said wasn't wrong. :ursofunny

What do YOU have to say about the two that I compared - they were saying exactly the same thing.

[Pressing-On]

Not at all. There is no wrong. You are wanting him to word things differently for YOU. What he said wasn't wrong. :ursofunny

What do YOU have to say about the two that I compared - they were saying exactly the same thing.

:tantrum:tantrum:tantrum:tantrum:tantrum

Say Yes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:tantrum:tantrum:tantrum

:ursofunny

I'll have to go back and look at yours.

[rgcraig]

Watching Renda and Pressing going back in forth is like watching a tennis match-it's moving that fast.

My neck is hurting!

LOL.....I'm a bit like Ferd - I'm on painkillers!

[dizzyde]

Watching Renda and Pressing going back in forth is like watching a tennis match-it's moving that fast.

My neck is hurting!

Well, my head is hurting!!!! :toofunny :toofunny :toofunny

[StillStanding]

LOL.....I'm a bit like Ferd - I'm on painkillers!
I'm a new member of the PKS! (Pain Killer Society) :D

[Pressing-On]

Now, what's the difference? They both said almost the exact same thang!
http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/showpost.php?p=433111&postcount=204

Not at all. There is no wrong. You are wanting him to word things differently for YOU. What he said wasn't wrong. :ursofunny

What do YOU have to say about the two that I compared - they were saying exactly the same thing.
Because the quote you have referenced from Michael was a later post. That's the one he should have used first.

FreeAtlast was very clear in saying he hoped he had misunderstood me, which is saying, "You need to clarify", IMO.

And really, this is very creepy. It's like we are talking about Michael behind his back. :ursofunny

[Pressing-On]

LOL.....I'm a bit like Ferd - I'm on painkillers!

I'm a new member of the PKS! (Pain Killer Society) :D

:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny

[rgcraig]

I'm a new member of the PKS! (Pain Killer Society) :D

Good stuff!

Advice that was given to me was don't take it unless you're in pain so you won't get addicted. I'm like, well, how will I know if I'm not hurting anymore if I'm taking painkillers?

[Pressing-On]

Good stuff!

Advice that was given to me was don't take it unless you're in pain so you won't get addicted. I'm like, well, how will I know if I'm not hurting anymore if I'm taking painkillers?
:ursofunny:ursofunny:ursofunny

You could call Rush Limbaugh and ask him.

:ursofunny

[rgcraig]

http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/showpost.php?p=433111&postcount=204


Because the quote you have referenced from Michael was a later post. That's the one he should have used first.

FreeAtlast was very clear in saying he hoped he had misunderstood me, which is saying, "You need to clarify", IMO.

And really, this is very creepy. It's like we are talking about Michael behind his back. :ursofunny

And to think he's out on the golf course in shorts as we talk behind his back.

See......you are wanting Michael to post a certain way. Is he wrong? Nope, just not like you want him to post. Good luck changing that.

[Pressing-On]

And to think he's out on the golf course in shorts as we talk behind his back.

See......you are wanting Michael to post a certain way. Is he wrong? Nope, just not like you want him to post. Good luck changing that.

I'm was pretty well already resigned to knowing I can't change him. You know the old adage - "You can't teach an old dog new tricks."

:bliss:bliss

I'm logging out so you can go exercise your knee.

We better talk about him when he's here to defend when he's wrong and says he's right. :bliss

[rgcraig]

I'm was pretty well already resigned to knowing I can't change him. You know the old adage - "You can't teach an old dog new tricks."

:bliss:bliss

I'm logging out so you can go exercise your knee.

We better talk about him when he's here to defend when he's wrong and says he's right. :bliss

Yep, I need to practice walking down the hall without hobbling.