Can Objects be possessed?

[Esther]

A question asked and debated for many years.

Many says no they can not.

Missionaries will tell you yes, they have seen it happen.

Now in my opinion I would say yes spirits can attach to objects.

Look at scripture.

One Paul anointed hankerchiefs that were sent out and many were healed.

Then look at Moses rod that turned into a snake and was used to cause many plaques. In fact afterwards Moses rob was called God's rob.

IF spirits can not be attached to objects then how were these things possible?

[SDG]

A question asked and debated for many years.

Many says no they can not.

Missionaries will tell you yes, they have seen it happen.

Now in my opinion I would say yes spirits can attach to objects.

Look at scripture.

One Paul anointed hankerchiefs that were sent out and many were healed.

Then look at Moses rod that turned into a snake and was used to cause many plaques. In fact afterwards Moses rob was called God's rob.

IF spirits can not be attached to objects then how were these things possible?

Well if hair can be magical ... why not?

[Esther]

Well if hair can be magical ... why not?

Behave! ;)

[Old Paths]

This begs the question...

Why would spirits even want to possess objects, when there's always willing human vessels open for their occupancy?

[Malvaro]

I'd share my thoughts.... but I already have once before on AFF....

[revrandy]

Only in the Movies....imo...

[Old Paths]

Only in the Movies....imo...



Now I wouldn't know.















































Hee heeeee


Couldn't resist.

[Felicity]

I don't think an inanimate object can be possessed. Period. :)

[AGAPE]

NO way....

[Esther]

This begs the question...

Why would spirits even want to possess objects, when there's always willing human vessels open for their occupancy?

I have heard in foreign countries this is a common thing.

As to why, they can reach unsuspecting folks with objects.

And as you say there are many willing or ignorant in opening themselves up for these things.

[Esther]

I don't think an inanimate object can be possessed. Period. :)

Then how did Paul send healing in a handkerchief?

[Esther]

I'd share my thoughts.... but I already have once before on AFF....

Repeat.

[Esther]

NO way....

Why?

[Felicity]

Then how did Paul send healing in a handkerchief?That was about the anointing of the oil of the Holy Spirit. The Spirit per se wasn't in the handkerchief but there was an anointing on the handkerchief.

LOL. That doesn't sound like a credible argument really but I think there's truth there somewhere. Somebody else can probably articulate what I'm trying to say better.

I haven't eaten or had coffee yet and my brain's still a little fuzzy. That's my excuse. :D

[Barb]

Then how did Paul send healing in a hankerchief?

He didn't...first, Paul didn't send anything. People around him took parts of his clothing and sent them to folks who couldn't be where the miracles were taking place.

Second, there is no more power in an object than there is in the oil used to anoint it.

By the same token, though men and women are anointed with the power of God, and some even have the gift of healing, the miracle is NOT in the vessel.

It is the faith of the one receiving it...the excellency of the power is of God and not of us or objects.

The handkerchief was an object of faith, imo...nothing more...

[Esther]

That was about the anointing of the oil of the Holy Spirit. The Spirit per se wasn't in the handkerchief but there was an anointing on the handkerchief.

LOL. That doesn't sound like a credible argument really but I think there's truth there somewhere. Somebody else can probably articulate what I'm trying to say better.

I haven't eaten or had coffee yet and my brain's still a little fuzzy. That's my excuse. :D

In or on the same thing applies your saying the spirit was with the object.

My point is that the enemy has always copied the things of God.

[Esther]

He didn't...first, Paul didn't send anything. People around him took parts of his clothing and sent them to folks who couldn't be where the miracles were taking place.

Second, there is no more power in an object than there is in the oil used to anoint it.

By the same token, though men and women are anointed with the power of God, and some even have the gift of healing, the miracle is NOT in the vessel.

It is the faith of the one receiving it...the excellency of the power is of God and not of us or objects.

The handkerchief was an object of faith, imo...nothing more...

Do you have a scripture to prove your point?

Thanks for responding.

[Trouvere]

I remember Brother Suber talking about a lady who had a huge gold medallion
on in a service and how the mother of the church ran out in the Holy Ghost and tore it from this big womans neck.The woman then received the Holy Ghost speaking in tongues.He said this woman was possessed by a spirit that
was housed in that medallion.Maybe Daniel can find out more about that.
Wierd huh?

[ReformedDave]

Then how did Paul send healing in a handkerchief?

Ask Peter Popoff.......or is that Poopoff....

[Esther]

Ask Peter Popoff.......or is that Poopoff....

And who would that be?

[HeavenlyOne]

Well if hair can be magical ... why not?

I think the college is going to be upset that I just spit all over their keyboard!!!

[Esther]

I remember Brother Suber talking about a lady who had a huge gold medallion
on in a service and how the mother of the church ran out in the Holy Ghost and tore it from this big womans neck.The woman then received the Holy Ghost speaking in tongues.He said this woman was possessed by a spirit that
was housed in that medallion.Maybe Daniel can find out more about that.
Wierd huh?

Heard a similiar thing from a missionary from Africa. The man had on a gold chain necklace and the man nearly drowned being baptized. They took the necklace off and were able to baptize him.

[Barb]

Do you have a scripture to prove your point?

Thanks for responding.

Which point?! I'm not sure how much longer I'm going to be online this afternoon as I am battling a headache, but I don't know which point you are asking about.

Scripture to prove there is no power in a handkerchief?! I have never seen one which proved there was.

If that were so, then it places an anointing on things...I don't see that...

If the healing is in the hand of the one praying, then the glory goes to him...I don't believe that AT ALL!!

[Trouvere]

Heard a similiar thing from a missionary from Africa. The man had on a gold chain necklace and the man nearly drowned being baptized. They took the necklace off and were able to baptize him.

Was it heavy??? haha...just kidding.

[ReformedDave]

And who would that be?

Google "Peter Popoff" Interesting.

[ReformedDave]

Heard a similiar thing from a missionary from Africa. The man had on a gold chain necklace and the man nearly drowned being baptized. They took the necklace off and were able to baptize him.

Must have been a heavy chain. Was his name "Mr. T"?

[Felicity]

Is there any proof in scripture of an inanimate object possessed by a demon which of course is what evil spirits are.

[Esther]

Which point?! I'm not sure how much longer I'm going to be online this afternoon as I am battling a headache, but I don't know which point you are asking about.

Scripture to prove there is no power in a handkerchief?! I have never seen one which proved there was.

If that were so, then it places an anointing on things...I don't see that...

If the healing is in the hand of the one praying, then the glory goes to him...I don't believe that AT ALL!!

I think I understand what you are saying. And I agree the power is God's power. However, I'm not convinced as yet, that His spirit can't reside with the item.

Not sure how to say what I am thinking on this.

[Esther]

Is there any proof in scripture of an inanimate object possessed by a demon which of course is what evil spirits are.

When I say possessed I am actually talking about attached. Possession means in control, and I don't know that they can be controled.

As I stated earlier satan tries to duplicate the things of God. That is why I used the examples of the handkerchiefs and Moses rod.

Even the Ark of the Covernant had power when taken into battle. Now we know the power was God, but yet they had to take the AOC with them.

[ReformedDave]

When I say possessed I am actually talking about attached. Possession means in control, and I don't know that they can be controled.

As I stated earlier satan tries to duplicate the things of God. That is why I used the examples of the handkerchiefs and Moses rod.

Even the Ark of the Covernant had power when taken into battle. Now we know the power was God, but yet they had to take the AOC with them.

In Scripture doesn't "possession" imply more than simply "control"?

[aquestioninggirl]

I read on another oneness forum were a woman said that she was in a car and her and her husband got into an argument and found out that their daughter had some heavy metal CD's in the car and they threw them out and all was better. They said that because their was an evil spirit in the heavy metal it had attached to them..... I do not believe at all this is possible.

[ReformedDave]

I read on another oneness forum were a woman said that she was in a car and her and her husband got into an argument and found out that their daughter had some heavy metal CD's in the car and they threw them out and all was better. They said that because their was an evil spirit in the heavy metal it had attached to them..... I do not believe at all this is possible.

Agreed!

[Felicity]

When I say possessed I am actually talking about attached. Possession means in control, and I don't know that they can be controled.

As I stated earlier satan tries to duplicate the things of God. That is why I used the examples of the handkerchiefs and Moses rod.

Even the Ark of the Covernant had power when taken into battle. Now we know the power was God, but yet they had to take the AOC with them.Moses' rod was moved on by the Spirit of God. A miracle took place where the rod became something that was living or at least appeared living and then became an inanimate object once again -- and all for the sake of an object lesson.

It wasn't about attachment or possession in my opinion.

:)

[Esther]

In Scripture doesn't "possession" imply more than simply "control"?

How so?

[Esther]

I read on another oneness forum were a woman said that she was in a car and her and her husband got into an argument and found out that their daughter had some heavy metal CD's in the car and they threw them out and all was better. They said that because their was an evil spirit in the heavy metal it had attached to them..... I do not believe at all this is possible.

I have heard an awful lot of testimonies to this fact to disqualify them.

JMO

[tamor]

So for the folks who do not believe that spirits can attach themselves to objects --

Would you allow things such as Oujia boards, magic 8 balls, tarot cards, etc in your home? Would you want items that had been used in satanic rituals around? Books on witchcraft? I mean, after all, they're just books....

Why or why not?

[ReformedDave]

How so?

The demoniac of the Gaderenes had thousands of demons living in him and controlling him. They had become part of his persona.

[Esther]

So for the folks who do not believe that spirits can attach themselves to objects --

Would you allow things such as Oujia boards, magic 8 balls, tarot cards, etc in your home? Would you want items that had been used in satanic rituals around? Books on witchcraft? I mean, after all, they're just books....

Why or why not?

Aw good point.

[ReformedDave]

I have heard an awful lot of testimonies to this fact to disqualify them.

JMO

In all fairness, someone's testimony doesn't make it true.

[Esther]

The demoniac of the Gaderenes had thousands of demons living in him and controlling him. They had become part of his persona.

Ok, I think I see where your going.

The man was still able to come to Jesus.

Man's will is still his strongest part.

[Felicity]

So for the folks who do not believe that spirits can attach themselves to objects --

Would you allow things such as Oujia boards, magic 8 balls, tarot cards, etc in your home? Would you want items that had been used in satanic rituals around? Books on witchcraft? I mean, after all, they're just books....

Why or why not?I wouldn't have them in my house but sitting on a shelf unused they're harmless in my opinion.

[ReformedDave]

So for the folks who do not believe that spirits can attach themselves to objects --

Would you allow things such as Oujia boards, magic 8 balls, tarot cards, etc in your home? Would you want items that had been used in satanic rituals around? Books on witchcraft? I mean, after all, they're just books....

Why or why not?

The danger is what they represent and teach. Having a Bible doesn't automatically bring God into one's life.

[Esther]

In all fairness, someone's testimony doesn't make it true.

But it does make you have to take a second look.

Kind of like you can say I don't believe speaking in tongues is for today, but the person that has spoken in tongues will tell you differently from their own experience.

[Esther]

The danger is what they represent and teach. Having a Bible doesn't automatically bring God into one's life.

True also.

[Felicity]

The danger is what they represent and teach. Having a Bible doesn't automatically bring God into one's life.Exactly.

[deltaguitar]

I read on another oneness forum were a woman said that she was in a car and her and her husband got into an argument and found out that their daughter had some heavy metal CD's in the car and they threw them out and all was better. They said that because their was an evil spirit in the heavy metal it had attached to them..... I do not believe at all this is possible.

Ha Ha Ha! I have heard this stuff before. :sshhh

I would love to have an excuse everytime I said something wrong to my wife. "Oh, honey look. Someone left and some "metal" music under the seat. See it wasn't me it was the devil that made me say that. Oh! There it is, it looks like it is having an effect on you as well."

Shoot! I would keep a few CDs around just in case.

:koolaid

[ReformedDave]

Ok, I think I see where your going.

The man was still able to come to Jesus.

Man's will is still his strongest part.

We're not told of why or how he came to Jesus. He could have just been running by.

[Esther]

We're not told of why or how he came to Jesus. He could have just been running by.

Now do you really believe that???

[ReformedDave]

But it does make you have to take a second look.

Kind of like you can say I don't believe speaking in tongues is for today, but the person that has spoken in tongues will tell you differently from their own experience.

I understand but I also know how unreliable an experience is. (Remember, I, too, use to claim that experience)

[ReformedDave]

Now do you really believe that???

What does scripture say about it?

[Felicity]

The other important thing to remember too is that Satan is not omnipotent. He doesn't have the power or the ability God does. He is limited. A lot of what he does is nothing more than counterfeit and effect.

Need to keep him in his proper place which is UNDER the feet of believers and certainly subject to the power of God.

[True Believer]

And who would that be?
This is Peter Popoff

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ol-K8-osGU

[Malvaro]

For a similiar AFF topic.... "places" having spirits....

http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/showthread.php?p=175948

[aquestioninggirl]

I have heard an awful lot of testimonies to this fact to disqualify them.

JMO

But your mind can play tricks on you big time.

[aquestioninggirl]

Ha Ha Ha! I have heard this stuff before. :sshhh

I would love to have an excuse everytime I said something wrong to my wife. "Oh, honey look. Someone left and some "metal" music under the seat. See it wasn't me it was the devil that made me say that. Oh! There it is, it looks like it is having an effect on you as well."

Shoot! I would keep a few CDs around just in case.

:koolaid

Exactly, LOL!!! I think it gives the Devil too much power which he does not have. QUESTION : Can a Barbie Doll get the Holy Ghost?

[Sheltiedad]

If Magic 8 balls are wrong, then dice should be also... all a Magic 8 ball is, is a die floating in colored water.

[aquestioninggirl]

If Magic 8 balls are wrong, then dice should be also... all a Magic 8 ball is, is a die floating in colored water.

OH NO!!! We should Boycott All Wendy's because my little boy got one in his KID MEAL!!!!!!!!!!! Wendy's is of the Devil...... I hope you don't like the Baconader!

[Sister Alvear]

All I can say is come to Brazil...and you will find a shocking truth.

[tamor]

All I can say is come to Brazil...and you will find a shocking truth.

I wondered how long it would take you to find this thread. :thumbsup

[RevDWW]

If the enemy can use it to deceive, then I would imagine he'd use an inanimate object.

[Esther]

All I can say is come to Brazil...and you will find a shocking truth.

I think you need to share some of these truths. :)

I will say this IF you have ever experience it you will believe it.

Talk to the folks that have.

[Felicity]

If the enemy can use it to deceive, then I would imagine he'd use an inanimate object.Sure, but that doesn't necessarily equate devil possession of an inanimate object. Objects can by "used" by the devil -- but possessed?

I'm open to convincing argument. :)

[Sister Alvear]

I agree used is the right word.

[RevDWW]

Sure, but that doesn't necessarily equate devil possession of an inanimate object. Objects can by "used" by the devil -- but possessed?

I'm open to convincing argument. :)

I guess we need to know your definition of possession?

Could it be a spirit inside the object, controling it's molecular makeup?

[aquestioninggirl]

Sure, but that doesn't necessarily equate devil possession of an inanimate object. Objects can by "used" by the devil -- but possessed?

I'm open to convincing argument. :)

I think the Devil might could use your mind and make you think things but that does not make the things you think true!

[Ferd]

I don’t give place to the devil. What is the point? He that is within me is greater than he that is in the world.

I did SEE this in Guyana. We were going to a place in Guyana called eyerie hall and on the road, we came to a place where the road went around this giant tree. East bound on one side west bound on the other, then past the tree, the road came back together.

I asked about that and I was told this was a sacred tree to the local voodoo religion. Obeo (sp) is the name of it. As the story goes, when the road was being built, the local shaman told the workers to leave the tree alone. They didn’t listen. First, when they tried to chop the tree down, the ax glanced off the tree, and cut the worker who was chopping it down. Next they used a chain saw and a guy lost a leg. Then they tried to bull doze it and the bulldozer flipped and crushed the worker. So they decided to leave the tree alone.

That happened as we were on our way to begin a work in this town eyerie hall (the spelling is very wrong). This area was the hot bed for voodoo in Guyana. That night the 6 of us stayed at this gentleman’s house. All night long I felt like I was under spiritual attack. The next morning, as we ate breakfast, every person in the group had prayed quietly all night long having felt the same oppressing spirits.

That night after reaching out all over that community, we had a service and there were 50 people that came. As we began to sing about the Blood of Jesus, we all felt a heavy oppression and by the end of the song service, several people had begun to manifest demonic position.

After the service, I had to return to Georgetown and the next morning as I was leaving the house, I felt impressed to pray. I am not claiming an audible voice, but I felt I needed to pray for my own physical protection. I returned to the house, and began to pray and after I eventually felt a release in the Holy Ghost, I got on my bicycle and started my trip over to the church. Half way to the church I was run over by a car.

The bike I was riding jumped several feet as it was a pretty hard hit but I didn’t loose control of the bicycle at all. God clearly saved my life in the midst of a spiritual battle that became a physical one. And it all started when we passed that tree that was sacred to voodoo.

I don’t know if that tree was possessed or not, nor do I care. However, it seems to me that in the spirit would Satan does care about the things that give him honor. Those people prayed at that tree to their false god. Satan liked that.

At the end of the week, we had a preaching point established and hungry people were seeking God.

[Esther]

Ferd, obvisously the evil spirits didn't want you to preach truth to these people.

I am so glad you heeded the Spirit to pray for your safety.

God is more than able to keep us in His hand. :)

[Malvaro]

Ferd, do you know the Aber family???

[Ferd]

Ferd, do you know the Aber family???

I left Guyana the week after Bro. Aber came to Guyana. I spent a very few days with him.

Great guy. Taught me something that has been the most important bible lesson I have ever seen.

[Esther]

I left Guyana the week after Bro. Aber came to Guyana. I spent a very few days with him.

Great guy. Taught me something that has been the most important bible lesson I have ever seen.

Are you sharing?

[Nahum]

We're not told of why or how he came to Jesus. He could have just been running by.

Yes we are. Read Mark 5:6

He saw Him, and then he ran to Him. There was a purpose involved.

[Ferd]

Are you sharing?

Often in fact.

I keep telling myself I am going to write a book. the skeleton is complete. it just needs fleshing out.

[chseeads]

There's been a few inanimate objects that I've had enough trouble with that I was almost persuaded they had the devil in em. :)

[Sister Alvear]

Devil worship is very feared in Brazil. Spells are cast on people...yes it really works. Witchdocters drink the blood of animals, bless and curse different objects depending on the reason.
I have felt the sinister powers of the dark evil one on many visits. I have seen objects that were used to curse people felt demonic activities around and about us as we bring light into this dark corner.

[Esther]

Devil worship is very feared in Brazil. Spells are cast on people...yes it really works. Witchdocters drink the blood of animals, bless and curse different objects depending on the reason.
I have felt the sinister powers of the dark evil one on many visits. I have seen objects that were used to curse people felt demonic activities around and about us as we bring light into this dark corner.

I have heard of this before as well.

When you go to countries like Haiti that is full of witchcraft makes us American's seem very ignorant in regards to the spirit realm.

Not that I want to know all their stuff, but doesn't the Bible say you perish for lack of knowledge?

Anyway, I think once you are aware of the existence of these things you know how to deal with them.

[pelathais]

A question asked and debated for many years.

Many says no they can not.

Missionaries will tell you yes, they have seen it happen.

Now in my opinion I would say yes spirits can attach to objects.

Look at scripture.

One Paul anointed hankerchiefs that were sent out and many were healed.

Then look at Moses rod that turned into a snake and was used to cause many plaques. In fact afterwards Moses rob was called God's rob.

IF spirits can not be attached to objects then how were these things possible?

So for the folks who do not believe that spirits can attach themselves to objects --

Would you allow things such as Oujia boards, magic 8 balls, tarot cards, etc in your home? Would you want items that had been used in satanic rituals around? Books on witchcraft? I mean, after all, they're just books....

Why or why not?
I'll avoid the obvious TIC comments about a 1969 Chevy I had back in the day, but at the time I was almost a believer in its demonic possession.

Tamor has a good question and others have answered like I would, except it might be helpful to add a thought about the role that symbols can play in the human mind and life. I don't think an object can be "possessed." You can check it for fingerprints and analyze it in all sorts of ways; but if there was a definitive "test" for the presence of spirits I think they'd all come up empty.

The object itself, however might trigger memories or thoughts and feelings in people that can be associated with spirits (here the object is being "used" like Sister Alvear and others said). While the thing is closed away someplace it can sit, its presence never even suspected. But let someone stumble upon it and they may open up the bowels of hell, so to speak.

I am somewhat hesitant still to pray with some people from some cultures- unless we can meet on my ground and under the circumstances of my choosing. I know that this discloses a weakness to some degree, but I have had experiences where I learned to plan ahead at times. My experience with Central American Indians is really spooky. People can come up with surprising things that the devil "uses" to create panic in the hearts of some and a loss of faith for others.

On a funny/bizarre note: I remember getting hit in the back of the head with an object that I'd rather not describe while out Christmas caroling once. For me, all thoughts of evangelism ended the moment I turned around. In the end, I wasn't hurt and it was just a "thing." Some people might laugh at that, but for me at the age I was, it was a spiritual attack as well as a gross insult.

With regard to the handkerchiefs (lit. "sweat rags") of Paul, these were "taken" from him by others and used. It doesn't appear to be the case that Paul himself sent out the handkerchiefs - Paul is passive in both verses (Acts 19:11-12). My interpretation is that the handkerchiefs (and aprons) were taken from Paul by other believers who took them to the sick and then God "wrought special miracles" attributable to Paul.

Idols offer an interesting example as well. Compare 1 Corinthians 8:4 with 1 Corinthians 10:20-21. On the one hand, the meat offered to an idol is offered to "nothing." On the other hand it is offered to "devils." Neither the meat nor the idol is different in either case. It's just what people attribute to these things; that's where the power is, in the hearts and minds of people. And greater is He that is in our hearts and minds than he that is in the hearts and minds of the world.

[Sheltiedad]

I believe that the placebo phenomenon can be applied for both positive and negative reactions to things.

I would even go so far that to say that if someone has been "prophesied" to about something bad happening that a lot of people are likely to self-fulfill that prophecy unconsciously. This goes for curses from witch doctors, etc. as well as things said over the pulpit about car wrecks, etc. (in any type of church).