View Full Version : Pastor Steve Fender talks about TV Resolution at Kenneth Phillips Church
pentecostisalive
10-09-2007, 04:19 PM
I just found something interesting. Pastor Steve Fender (http://www.livingwaychurchsa.org/) preached at Promiseland Church and mentioned how that Anthony Mangun (he calls him a good friend) had swayed the conference floor in Tampa, FL.
There are couple interesting things.
1) He states that 30 years ago that God placed a vision for using TV in his and KP's heart, and it is the same vision that AM has. He attributes the results to Kenneth Phillips reverbrating influence.
2) He was present on the floor of GC. (I hope he didn't vote)
You can see this for yourself at:
mms://66.232.148.34/Oct1st-7743V.wmv (or http://www.promiselandchurch.net/content/view/112/167/)
If you start watching at 1 hr and 12 minutes in, you will see it.
The charismatics are rejoicing because we are coming their way. It is sad, especially when you look at these men and their churches, and realize that same mistakes they made, UPCI is also repeating.
pelathais
10-09-2007, 04:38 PM
I just found something interesting. Pastor Steve Fender (http://www.livingwaychurchsa.org/) preached at Promiseland Church and mentioned how that Anthony Mangun (he calls him a good friend) had swayed the conference floor in Tampa, FL.
There are couple interesting things.
1) He states that 30 years ago that God placed a vision for using TV in his and KP's heart, and it is the same vision that AM has. He attributes the results to Kenneth Phillips reverbrating influence.
2) He was present on the floor of GC. (I hope he didn't vote)
You can see this for yourself at:
mms://66.232.148.34/Oct1st-7743V.wmv (or http://www.promiselandchurch.net/content/view/112/167/)
If you start watching at 1 hr and 12 minutes in, you will see it.
The charismatics are rejoicing because we are coming their way. It is sad, especially when you look at these men and their churches, and realize that same mistakes they made, UPCI is also repeating.
What were those mistakes? KP is a more ardent proponent of Acts 2:38 salvation than some I know in the UPC. He'd probably be a good influence on strengthening some people's doctrine.
I should add as a disclaimer: I've never seen KP in TV not even in his recent primetime appearance baptizing in Jesus name in front of an audience of millions. Nor have I ever attended his church.
MissBrattified
10-09-2007, 04:39 PM
1. I wouldn't say that Bro. Kenneth Phillips has made a lot of mistakes to be wept over, and,
2. I would agree that he has probably had some influence with friends, including the Manguns.
3. He's a great soul-winner, and true to the Apostolic message, so I'm not about to criticize him and the mission he has accomplished.
4. I admire him for doing what he thinks is right for the purpose of spreading the Gospel, in spite of what an organization would prefer. A man that lives by his convictions, even when he lost friends over it.
There's nothing sad here.
I do think Bro. Fender exaggerated some of the things that were attributed to Bro. Phillips, and KP would be the first to take the humble side on that point, but that is typical grandiosity coming from a visiting minister toward the host pastor.
Straightline
10-09-2007, 04:40 PM
I just found something interesting. Pastor Steve Fender (http://www.livingwaychurchsa.org/) preached at Promiseland Church and mentioned how that Anthony Mangun (he calls him a good friend) had swayed the conference floor in Tampa, FL...
Truth be told, not only was AM's speech not impressive, and more "preaching" than anything else, he spoke out-of-turn, trying to talk about the resolution when the debate at hand was JMJ's amendment, which AM did NOT address.
I did not see any swaying; it appeared all came with made-up minds.
God's Plumbline is a
Straightline
pentecostisalive
10-09-2007, 04:42 PM
Truth be told, not only was AM's speech not impressive, and more "preaching" than anything else, he spoke out-of-turn, trying to talk about the resolution when the debate at hand was JMJ's amendment, which AM did NOT address.
I did not see any swaying; it appeared all came with made-up minds.
God's Plumbline is a
Straightline
I don't think that AM swayed the floor either, but I found it interesting that men that are not apart of the UPCI are saying that in a positive light.
MissBrattified
10-09-2007, 04:43 PM
I don't think that AM swayed the floor either, but I found it interesting that men that are not apart of the UPCI are saying that in a positive light.
It's just their perception of events, just like from your perspective it is "sad" that anyone would follow in the footsteps of Kenneth Phillips.
MissBrattified
10-09-2007, 04:45 PM
PIA, Bro. Phillips is a fine Christian, and all he cares about is winning souls and spreading the Gospel. I will never fault such a thing, and neither should you. If you've never met him, then you really don't know enough to speak of such a wonderful man.
Honestly, I object more to Bro. Fender in this video than I do anything else. Bro. Phillips is not the sort to "rejoice" because anyone is "coming his way."
1. I wouldn't say that Bro. Kenneth Phillips has made a lot of mistakes to be wept over, and,
2. I would agree that he has probably had some influence with friends, including the Manguns.
3. He's a great soul-winner, and true to the Apostolic message, so I'm not about to criticize him and the mission he has accomplished.
4. I admire him for doing what he thinks is right for the purpose of spreading the Gospel, in spite of what an organization would prefer. A man that lives by his convictions, even when he lost friends over it.
There's nothing sad here.
I do think Bro. Fender exaggerated some of the things that were attributed to Bro. Phillips, and KP would be the first to take the humble side on that point, but that is typical grandiosity coming from a visiting minister toward the host pastor.
Good post, Abi...as usual, right on target.
pentecostisalive
10-09-2007, 04:48 PM
PIA, Bro. Phillips is a fine Christian, and all he cares about is winning souls and spreading the Gospel. I will never fault such a thing, and neither should you. If you've never met him, then you really don't know enough to speak of such a wonderful man.
I don't know him personally, and he might be the most wonderful man on the face of the earth. Yet, we don't follow someone into false doctrine, no matter how nice he is. Nice doesn't mean "saved", nice doesn't mean "right".
There is more to the Bible than Acts 2:38 and though he believes that, he has thrown out of alot of the rest.
I am not tearing down the man personally, but what he believes and his doctrine is tainted, and watered down.
I don't know him personally, and he might be the most wonderful man on the face of the earth. Yet, we don't follow someone into false doctrine, no matter how nice he is.
There is more to the Bible than Acts 2:38 and though he believes that, he has thrown out of alot of the rest.
Are you an elder/pastor/preacher?!
MissBrattified
10-09-2007, 04:51 PM
I don't know him personally, and he might be the most wonderful man on the face of the earth. Yet, we don't follow someone into false doctrine, no matter how nice he is. Nice doesn't mean "saved", nice doesn't mean "right".
There is more to the Bible than Acts 2:38 and though he believes that, he has thrown out of alot of the rest.
I am not tearing down the man personally, but what he believes and his doctrine is tainted, and watered down.
Which parts? Standards?
pentecostisalive
10-09-2007, 04:51 PM
Are you an elder/pastor/preacher?!
I am a preacher and licensed with UPCI.
I am a preacher and licensed with UPCI.
Ahhhh...well I only asked because personally I would be very careful before suggesting that another elder is in false doctrine.
MissBrattified
10-09-2007, 04:57 PM
Honestly, I would rather err on the side of caution. Unless you get something straight from the horse's mouth, its best not to toss out accusations, EVEN (tic) against brethren that aren't part of The Organization.
StillStanding
10-09-2007, 04:57 PM
Kenneth Phillips is da bomb!!! :D
Honestly, I would rather err on the side of caution. Unless you get something straight from the horse's mouth, its best not to toss out accusations, EVEN (tic) against brethren that aren't part of The Organization.
Amen...
Jack Shephard
10-09-2007, 05:28 PM
Truth be told, not only was AM's speech not impressive, and more "preaching" than anything else, he spoke out-of-turn, trying to talk about the resolution when the debate at hand was JMJ's amendment, which AM did NOT address.
I did not see any swaying; it appeared all came with made-up minds.
God's Plumbline is a
Straightline
I don't think that AM swayed the floor either, but I found it interesting that men that are not apart of the UPCI are saying that in a positive light.
It is possible that AM did not make a difference on peoples opinions of how they would vote. I was not there so I do not know if AM made a difference, but I would find it hard to believe. He has the respect of alot of men in the movement I think he probably had something to do with why some people voted for it. I would agree that maybe his speech at GC may not have swayed people but the one he gave at BOTT may have.
rgcraig
10-09-2007, 05:42 PM
I don't know him personally, and he might be the most wonderful man on the face of the earth. Yet, we don't follow someone into false doctrine, no matter how nice he is. Nice doesn't mean "saved", nice doesn't mean "right".
There is more to the Bible than Acts 2:38 and though he believes that, he has thrown out of alot of the rest.
I am not tearing down the man personally, but what he believes and his doctrine is tainted, and watered down.
What has he thrown out?
pelathais
10-09-2007, 05:49 PM
I don't know him personally, and he might be the most wonderful man on the face of the earth. Yet, we don't follow someone into false doctrine, no matter how nice he is. Nice doesn't mean "saved", nice doesn't mean "right".
There is more to the Bible than Acts 2:38 and though he believes that, he has thrown out of alot of the rest.
I am not tearing down the man personally, but what he believes and his doctrine is tainted, and watered down.
How so? And I know we're generalizing a bit here, I don't know the guy either nor have I ever heard him preach on TV or in person. I have seen some clips people have posted and read statements that he made.
KP actually sounded like he was "stronger on the message" than some people I know in the UPC. He is very strong on the salvation doctrine. What is it that he's done that makes you say he's "watered down?"
Hoovie
10-09-2007, 06:06 PM
Sounded pretty good to me.
I would like to know more about Fender.
MissBrattified
10-09-2007, 06:07 PM
What has he thrown out?
I asked that 2...no answer yet. :D Standards? Maybe some...doctrine? Not that I'm aware of.
chaotic_resolve
10-09-2007, 06:10 PM
I'm going to take a guess that most of what Pentecost knows about KP comes from hearsay and not from actually knowing the man.
The more I learn of KP, the more I like the man. I was emailing with a friend of mine who's from TX . . . apparently men from Promiseland are very involved and help with the UPCI's "Church in a Day" program in that area. That says a lot about KP's integrity and character. For a man that's been consistently demeaned and looked down on by conservatives in general - he's not responded in kind, but in fact has been very generous to the organization years after being forced to leave.
Rhymis
10-09-2007, 06:15 PM
Finally a thread that even I cannot make more inane. :poetic
pelathais
10-09-2007, 06:19 PM
I'm going to take a guess that most of what Pentecost knows about KP comes from hearsay and not from actually knowing the man.
The more I learn of KP, the more I like the man. I was emailing with a friend of mine who's from TX . . . apparently men from Promiseland are very involved and help with the UPCI's "Church in a Day" program in that area. That says a lot about KP's integrity and character. For a man that's been consistently demeaned and looked down on by conservatives in general - he's not responded in kind, but in fact has been very generous to the organization years after being forced to leave.
As I said before, I really don't know the guy at all. I hope PentecostisAlive comes back. I'm curious about the mechanics involved in a case like KP's. Is he said to have "watered down" the doctrine simply because he left the UPC? Then can the same be said of those that are planning on leaving right now? Are they "watering down" the message?
What exactly does one do to be guilty of "watering down" the message?
COOPER
10-09-2007, 06:20 PM
I just found something interesting. Pastor Steve Fender (http://www.livingwaychurchsa.org/) preached at Promiseland Church and mentioned how that Anthony Mangun (he calls him a good friend) had swayed the conference floor in Tampa, FL.
There are couple interesting things.
1) He states that 30 years ago that God placed a vision for using TV in his and KP's heart, and it is the same vision that AM has. He attributes the results to Kenneth Phillips reverbrating influence.
2) He was present on the floor of GC. (I hope he didn't vote)
You can see this for yourself at:
mms://66.232.148.34/Oct1st-7743V.wmv (or http://www.promiselandchurch.net/content/view/112/167/)
If you start watching at 1 hr and 12 minutes in, you will see it.
The charismatics are rejoicing because we are coming their way. It is sad, especially when you look at these men and their churches, and realize that same mistakes they made, UPCI is also repeating.
This is a sad sas sad way of thinking.
What on earth is so bad about any one doing something different than what is traditional UPCI.UPC is training wheels for the new believer, but one day the wheels come off and UPC lets go and the child of God rides on by the leading of Gods Spirit.
:cc1
Jack Shephard
10-09-2007, 06:24 PM
I'm going to take a guess that most of what Pentecost knows about KP comes from hearsay and not from actually knowing the man.
The more I learn of KP, the more I like the man. I was emailing with a friend of mine who's from TX . . . apparently men from Promiseland are very involved and help with the UPCI's "Church in a Day" program in that area. That says a lot about KP's integrity and character. For a man that's been consistently demeaned and looked down on by conservatives in general - he's not responded in kind, but in fact has been very generous to the organization years after being forced to leave.
Give a :highfive
You are right CR. There are alot of people that form ideas of people based only on the hearsay of other people. They have an impression of someone that they have not ever met. The truth is that happens alot even beyond this situation.
pelathais
10-09-2007, 06:29 PM
Finally a thread that even I cannot make more inane. :poetic
You offer a criticism but nothing of substance. Isn't that the very definition of "inane?"
And you play the passive/aggressive game by implying that you're capable of being "inane- but just not as "inane" as everyone else. Again, that's inane.
Do you have anything of substance to share? Just asking.
COOPER
10-09-2007, 06:32 PM
You offer a criticism but nothing of substance. Isn't that the very definition of "inane?"
And you play the passive/aggressive game by implying that you're capable of being "inane- but just not as "inane" as everyone else. Again, that's inane.
Do you have anything of substance to share? Just asking.
:pirate
philjones
10-09-2007, 06:33 PM
You offer a criticism but nothing of substance. Isn't that the very definition of "inane?"
And you play the passive/aggressive game by implying that you're capable of being "inane- but just not as "inane" as everyone else. Again, that's inane.
Do you have anything of substance to share? Just asking.
Pel,
He is just a wascally wabbit.... His substance is actually greater, when he chooses not to be inane, than any other poster on this forum... even you and you are quite substantive.:)
COOPER
10-09-2007, 06:33 PM
What on earth is so bad about any one doing something different than what is traditional UPCI.
UPC is training wheels for the new believer, but one day the wheels come off and UPC lets go and the child of God rides on by the leading of Gods Spirit.
:cc1
Rhymis
10-09-2007, 06:33 PM
You offer a criticism but nothing of substance. Isn't that the very definition of "inane?"
And you play the passive/aggressive game by implying that you're capable of being "inane- but just not as "inane" as everyone else. Again, that's inane.
Do you have anything of substance to share? Just asking.
I have absolutely nothing of substance to add. I shall leave all the jewels of infinite value that others cherish for a lifetime -- to others.
Carry on. :offkey
pelathais
10-09-2007, 06:56 PM
I have absolutely nothing of substance to add. I shall leave all the jewels of infinite value that others cherish for a lifetime -- to others.
Carry on. :offkey
"The jewels?" The only "gem" you've offered was to impugn the integrity of a man you admit to never having met. When questioned about that you fold up like a cheap lawn chair. You couldn't even answer a direct question about the basis of your accusation.
And what you call "jewels?" Psalm 52:4
stmatthew
10-09-2007, 06:59 PM
As I said before, I really don't know the guy at all. I hope PentecostisAlive comes back. I'm curious about the mechanics involved in a case like KP's. Is he said to have "watered down" the doctrine simply because he left the UPC? Then can the same be said of those that are planning on leaving right now? Are they "watering down" the message?
What exactly does one do to be guilty of "watering down" the message?
I think that it has been expressed that since KP brings in trinitarian preachers into his pulpit, he is allowing those that are not saved to lead the flock. Strictly from a Water/Spirit believers view anyway.
rgcraig
10-09-2007, 07:01 PM
I asked that 2...no answer yet. :D Standards? Maybe some...doctrine? Not that I'm aware of.
The one thing that I'm aware that he threw out was intolerance.
Hoovie
10-09-2007, 07:09 PM
Anyone know anything about Fender? I thought he was a guitar.
Rhymis
10-09-2007, 07:13 PM
"The jewels?" The only "gem" you've offered was to impugn the integrity of a man you admit to never having met. When questioned about that you fold up like a cheap lawn chair. You couldn't even answer a direct question about the basis of your accusation.
And what you call "jewels?" Psalm 52:4
WHOA! Skull inspector...... I did none of the things you so bluntly accuse me of ....... Your head measurements are way off. I was not in reference of the man (and HOW do you know that I have never met him? -- {now you are not only a head feeler but also a mind reader). Desist from this erroneous assumption(s) and "lighten up dude."
There be more heads that you have yet to feel. So please stop calipering someone you know not.
Besides all that .... there is more. :reaction
Rhymis
10-09-2007, 07:16 PM
"The jewels?" The only "gem" you've offered was to impugn the integrity of a man you admit to never having met. When questioned about that you fold up like a cheap lawn chair. You couldn't even answer a direct question about the basis of your accusation.
And what you call "jewels?" Psalm 52:4
Head surveyor you misread my statement ...... I was saying, "I have NO substance to add -- I leave "substance" giving to those purveyors who can leave jewels of greatness to others. (like yourself).
SO .......
Rhymis
10-09-2007, 07:22 PM
"The jewels?" The only "gem" you've offered was to impugn the integrity of a man you admit to never having met. When questioned about that you fold up like a cheap lawn chair. You couldn't even answer a direct question about the basis of your accusation.
And what you call "jewels?" Psalm 52:4
WHERE did I make such an admittance? :nah
Are we hearing voices now? :pirate
pelathais
10-09-2007, 07:22 PM
WHOA! Skull inspector...... I did none of the things you so bluntly accuse me of ....... Your head measurements are way off. I was not in reference of the man (and HOW do you know that I have never met him? -- {now you are not only a head feeler but also a mind reader). Desist from this erroneous assumption(s) and "lighten up dude."
There be more heads that you have yet to feel. So please stop calipering someone you know not.
Besides all that .... there is more. :reaction
You are correct... I errored in conflating and confusing your persona with another. Please accept my apologies. :)
Rhymis
10-09-2007, 07:25 PM
You are correct... I errored in conflating and confusing your persona with another. Please accept my apologies. :)
And I was on a roll ..... and you go and apologize ....... kill joy.. :hypercoffee
Hoovie
10-09-2007, 07:26 PM
Any other public references made concerning res 4?
I wonder if secular or Christian media will run staories about it? I am glad there was no big "walk-out" from the floor - that would likely have generated bad press.
pelathais
10-09-2007, 07:30 PM
And I was on a roll ..... and you go and apologize ....... kill joy.. :hypercoffee
LOL. Sorry (again!). But I was wrong and needed your nudge to get me to review the thread and see where I had made the mix up.
I do the same thing in getting my kids mixed up sometimes... I think I'm loosing "it" (as if I ever had "it" to begin with). Of course, my children are not nearly so forgiving.
Rhymis
10-09-2007, 07:31 PM
WHERE did I make such an admittance? :nah
Are we hearing voices now? :pirate
BUT just so you will know -- I have met both men in question.
several times .......
and it was NOT on TV ...... :snapout
Rhymis
10-09-2007, 07:34 PM
WHERE did I make such an admittance? :nah
Are we hearing voices now? :pirate
LOL. Sorry (again!). But I was wrong and needed your nudge to get me to review the thread and see where I had made the mix up.
I do the same thing in getting my kids mixed up sometimes... I think I'm loosing "it" (as if I ever had "it" to begin with). Of course, my children are not nearly so forgiving.
Seems we have a bit in common ..... but you are still a bit behind .... because you only "Think" you are loosing it ........ I am at the convinced stage .........
:driving
Remeber the guy in the 1970's who sang I'll Be There, Before the Next Teardrop Falls?
Different guy....
Anyone know anything about Fender? I thought he was a guitar.
stmatthew
10-09-2007, 08:35 PM
Remeber the guy in the 1970's who sang I'll Be There, Before the Next Teardrop Falls?
Different guy....
You just hadta go there, didn't you???? :heeheehee
7x2GExMUMlo
joyful
10-09-2007, 09:08 PM
Anyone know anything about Fender?
I have been to both SF and KP's churches a few times each and just from those observations, I would not put SF in the same category as KP. The messages and altar calls that I heard at SF's church were very much along the lines of come say the sinners prayer and the holy ghost is an added gift you can get. That is not the case at KP's church which for the most part I have found still to be pretty strong at emphasizing repentance, baptism and Holy Ghost infilling. Although I did attend a youth event hosted by KP's church a few years ago where they were praying with the youth in a repeat the sinners prayer type manner, but that is not the norm of what I have seen there.
PentecostalAlive,
I understand from your perspective that is how you see things. However it is a shame your judgement is clouded in my opinon.
KP was my pastor for over 16 years and I can tell you that there is no bigger proponent of Acts 2:38 3 step salvation in the world.
What you guys don't like is that he did not uphold your cookie cutter extra biblical legalism nor the uncut hair doctrine for women, etc.
KP is not perfect by any stretch of the imagination and he would be the first one to tell you that. However he has worked tirelessly to spread the Acts 2 message. Today is his 68th birthday I believe and I will tell you that in my 48 years of being around Oneness Pentecost I do not know a single person who has devoted any more of their time and energy to the Acts 2 message.
"The jewels?" The only "gem" you've offered was to impugn the integrity of a man you admit to never having met. When questioned about that you fold up like a cheap lawn chair. You couldn't even answer a direct question about the basis of your accusation.
And what you call "jewels?" Psalm 52:4
Pel,
You need to recalibrate your calipers...
You mistook "didn't" for "couldn't."
tamor
10-10-2007, 06:13 AM
Sounded pretty good to me.
I would like to know more about Fender.
Bump for Stephen......
http://www.livingwaychurchsa.org/
Steve Epley
10-10-2007, 06:49 AM
I am not the least bit shocked some were impressed by what SF had to say. I wasn't impressed 30 years ago and least impressed today. To each his own.
timlan2057
10-10-2007, 07:25 AM
Steve and Becky Fender I believe were among the "ex-hippies" converted during Phillips' first big wave of growth in Austin in the early 70s.
Blair and Regina Adams were some others. Adrian Littlefield was making hay with his testimony of being shot by Charles Whitman at the University of Texas at the time.
I was just a kid and all these folks came to the senior youth camps in Louisiana when Phillips preached them in 1972 or 1973.
Hmm.
If Fender used to go on a weekend of drinking and taking drugs when he was a youngster before he got converted was it called a Fender Bender?
Steve Epley
10-10-2007, 07:28 AM
Becky has been much of his success.
Carpenter
10-10-2007, 08:08 AM
Truth be told, not only was AM's speech not impressive, and more "preaching" than anything else, he spoke out-of-turn, trying to talk about the resolution when the debate at hand was JMJ's amendment, which AM did NOT address.
I did not see any swaying; it appeared all came with made-up minds.
God's Plumbline is a
Straightline
The line of sight from the lense of the eye, to the lense of the TV screen is a
Straightline
:pirate
TRIPLE E
10-10-2007, 08:23 AM
I just found something interesting. Pastor Steve Fender (http://www.livingwaychurchsa.org/) preached at Promiseland Church and mentioned how that Anthony Mangun (he calls him a good friend) had swayed the conference floor in Tampa, FL.
There are couple interesting things.
1) He states that 30 years ago that God placed a vision for using TV in his and KP's heart, and it is the same vision that AM has. He attributes the results to Kenneth Phillips reverbrating influence.
2) He was present on the floor of GC. (I hope he didn't vote)
You can see this for yourself at:
mms://66.232.148.34/Oct1st-7743V.wmv (or http://www.promiselandchurch.net/content/view/112/167/)
If you start watching at 1 hr and 12 minutes in, you will see it.
The charismatics are rejoicing because we are coming their way. It is sad, especially when you look at these men and their churches, and realize that same mistakes they made, UPCI is also repeating.
Only listened to it for a few minutes,I thought our message was Jesus-Christ and Him crucified,but it sounds like he's preaching KP!
TRIPLE E
10-10-2007, 08:30 AM
Any other public references made concerning res 4?
I wonder if secular or Christian media will run staories about it? I am glad there was no big "walk-out" from the floor - that would likely have generated bad press.
We will probably see a write up about it in the next Charisma Magazine!
Only listened to it for a few minutes,I thought our message was Jesus-Christ and Him crucified,but it sounds like he's preaching KP!
I have not listened to the service but I was at Promiseland not long ago when this service was announced and it was to incorporate KP's birthday celebration so I am sure that is why you heard a lot about KP.
The church used to throw KP big "surprise" birthday parties and to pre-empt that I think he just started incorporating a little nod to his birthday in whatever service was the closest to it.
In this case when I was there a couple of weeks ago he said that Steve Fender was going to be one of the guys preaching his funeral and this service was an opportunity for him to practice!
I would hope that on any Pastor's birthday his congregation or peers would let him know how much they appreciate him and what he has done. I am sure that is what was going on here.
KP is not flashy nor does he seek attention, adoration, etc.
3E, I would suggest you watch / listen to other services from Promiseland and I think you would quickly retract your criticism.
ReformedDave
10-10-2007, 09:41 AM
Becky has been much of his success.
Kind of a Bro. Becky Fender..........:runhills
Steve and Becky Fender I believe were among the "ex-hippies" converted during Phillips' first big wave of growth in Austin in the early 70s.
Blair and Regina Adams were some others. Adrian Littlefield was making hay with his testimony of being shot by Charles Whitman at the University of Texas at the time.
I was just a kid and all these folks came to the senior youth camps in Louisiana when Phillips preached them in 1972 or 1973.
Hmm.
If Fender used to go on a weekend of drinking and taking drugs when he was a youngster before he got converted was it called a Fender Bender?
Good morning, Tim.
Becky Fender is the daughter of one of my dad's closest friends back through the years, and a man you probably know, David Varnado. The last I heard he was still living in the Lake Charles area.
Dad said that Steve Fender got in church in Illinois or somewhere up that way. He preached for us back in the seventies at Sandy Lake and was a powerful preacher.
Their close association with KP would have come later...
Good to see you back on...
Sarah
10-10-2007, 11:00 AM
Good morning, Tim.
Becky Fender is the daughter of one of my dad's closest friends back through the years, and a man you probably know, David Varnado. The last I heard he was still living in the Lake Charles area.
Dad said that Steve Fender got in church in Illinois or somewhere up that way. He preached for us back in the seventies at Sandy Lake and was a powerful preacher.
Their close association with KP would have come later...
Good to see you back on...
You confirmed what I was thinking about Becky, Josh.
Don't know about Steve.....he could have come from the "hippies".
timlan2057
10-10-2007, 12:42 PM
Good morning, Tim.
Becky Fender is the daughter of one of my dad's closest friends back through the years, and a man you probably know, David Varnado. The last I heard he was still living in the Lake Charles area.
Dad said that Steve Fender got in church in Illinois or somewhere up that way. He preached for us back in the seventies at Sandy Lake and was a powerful preacher.
Their close association with KP would have come later...
Good to see you back on...
I didn't realize she was a Varnado from Lake Charles.
Had I known at one time, I'd long forgotten.
If she's David's daughter, I guess she'd be A. D. Varnado's granddaughter.
My daughter worked in the kitchen at the junior camp, had to skip the senior camp for art academy and then was back for campmeeting.
David Varnado was her boss so I guess he's following his dad as head of the kitchen during the Louisiana camps.
My bad ... I thought they were some of KP's converts around the time the hippies were coming on board.
Grady Stebbins was another.
Elizabeth
10-10-2007, 12:46 PM
I listen to part of the message, in it SF made a statement about a man who became a successful preacher by imitating KP---Who was SF speaking about??
StillStanding
10-10-2007, 12:51 PM
I listen to part of the message, in it SF made a statement about a man who became a successful preacher by imitating KP---Who was SF speaking about??
He probably was speaking about himself! When he was first evangelizing he preached KP messages! :)
TRIPLE E
10-10-2007, 01:30 PM
I have not listened to the service but I was at Promiseland not long ago when this service was announced and it was to incorporate KP's birthday celebration so I am sure that is why you heard a lot about KP.
The church used to throw KP big "surprise" birthday parties and to pre-empt that I think he just started incorporating a little nod to his birthday in whatever service was the closest to it.
In this case when I was there a couple of weeks ago he said that Steve Fender was going to be one of the guys preaching his funeral and this service was an opportunity for him to practice!
I would hope that on any Pastor's birthday his congregation or peers would let him know how much they appreciate him and what he has done. I am sure that is what was going on here.
KP is not flashy nor does he seek attention, adoration, etc.
3E, I would suggest you watch / listen to other services from Promiseland and I think you would quickly retract your criticism.
I am not criticizing KP I was not enthused by all the rhetoric coming from SF though.
Elizabeth
10-10-2007, 01:39 PM
He probably was speaking about himself! When he was first evangelizing he preached KP messages! :)
You confirmed what I was suspecting, thats what he probably meant-he just never clarified that indeed it was him that was a lousy preacher before he stated imitating KP. :heeheehee
Whole Hearted
10-10-2007, 02:52 PM
I just found something interesting. Pastor Steve Fender (http://www.livingwaychurchsa.org/) preached at Promiseland Church and mentioned how that Anthony Mangun (he calls him a good friend) had swayed the conference floor in Tampa, FL.
There are couple interesting things.
1) He states that 30 years ago that God placed a vision for using TV in his and KP's heart, and it is the same vision that AM has. He attributes the results to Kenneth Phillips reverbrating influence.
2) He was present on the floor of GC. (I hope he didn't vote)
You can see this for yourself at:
mms://66.232.148.34/Oct1st-7743V.wmv (or http://www.promiselandchurch.net/content/view/112/167/)
If you start watching at 1 hr and 12 minutes in, you will see it.
The charismatics are rejoicing because we are coming their way. It is sad, especially when you look at these men and their churches, and realize that same mistakes they made, UPCI is also repeating.
True brother True
Whole Hearted
10-10-2007, 02:56 PM
I don't know him personally, and he might be the most wonderful man on the face of the earth. Yet, we don't follow someone into false doctrine, no matter how nice he is. Nice doesn't mean "saved", nice doesn't mean "right".
There is more to the Bible than Acts 2:38 and though he believes that, he has thrown out of alot of the rest.
I am not tearing down the man personally, but what he believes and his doctrine is tainted, and watered down.
AMEN BROTHER AMEN
PentecostalAlive,
I understand from your perspective that is how you see things. However it is a shame your judgement is clouded in my opinon.
KP was my pastor for over 16 years and I can tell you that there is no bigger proponent of Acts 2:38 3 step salvation in the world.
What you guys don't like is that he did not uphold your cookie cutter extra biblical legalism nor the uncut hair doctrine for women, etc.
KP is not perfect by any stretch of the imagination and he would be the first one to tell you that. However he has worked tirelessly to spread the Acts 2 message. Today is his 68th birthday I believe and I will tell you that in my 48 years of being around Oneness Pentecost I do not know a single person who has devoted any more of their time and energy to the Acts 2 message.
CC1, I used to watch KP's program back in the day, and though I wasn't saved, I thought it was great.
I remember one particular broadcast where he had a young woman testify...I can't remember her name, but she was the niece of Katharine Hepburn. She was a beautiful girl...blond hair I think...it's been a while ago now.
Anyway, she said that she witnessed to her Aunt Katharine and was told to NOT bring that subject up again.
Were you going there then and do you know anything about this?!
Esther
10-10-2007, 03:45 PM
I didn't realize she was a Varnado from Lake Charles.
Had I known at one time, I'd long forgotten.
If she's David's daughter, I guess she'd be A. D. Varnado's granddaughter.
My daughter worked in the kitchen at the junior camp, had to skip the senior camp for art academy and then was back for campmeeting.
David Varnado was her boss so I guess he's following his dad as head of the kitchen during the Louisiana camps.
My bad ... I thought they were some of KP's converts around the time the hippies were coming on board.
Grady Stebbins was another.
Becky Varnado was from Oil City, La, as I recall. :)
I saw her at the youth rally's. She had the longest curly ponytail of any girl I ever saw. :)
Don't forget that Becky Fender is Barbara Keller's sister (Barbara is Gary Kellor's wife).
CC1, I used to watch KP's program back in the day, and though I wasn't saved, I thought it was great.
I remember one particular broadcast where he had a young woman testify...I can't remember her name, but she was the niece of Katharine Hepburn. She was a beautiful girl...blond hair I think...it's been a while ago now.
Anyway, she said that she witnessed to her Aunt Katharine and was told to NOT bring that subject up again.
Were you going there then and do you know anything about this?!
Interesting. That sounds like it would have been before my time. I moved there in March 1983.
Interesting. That sounds like it would have been before my time. I moved there in March 1983.
Ahhh...well I'm trying to remember. It was some time in the early 70s if you know nothing about it.
Ahhh...well I'm trying to remember. It was some time in the early 70s if you know nothing about it.
So it is true that you are as old as dirt!!!!!!:hypercoffee
So it is true that you are as old as dirt!!!!!!:hypercoffee
Oh my...as soon as I saw you had posted again on this thread, I knew in my inner beings you had said that!!
We have walked together much too long, son...!! :thwak
philjones
10-10-2007, 07:34 PM
Good morning, Tim.
Becky Fender is the daughter of one of my dad's closest friends back through the years, and a man you probably know, David Varnado. The last I heard he was still living in the Lake Charles area.
Dad said that Steve Fender got in church in Illinois or somewhere up that way. He preached for us back in the seventies at Sandy Lake and was a powerful preacher.
Their close association with KP would have come later...
Good to see you back on...
David is indeed Becky's dad and David lives next door to my daughter and son-in-law in Moss Bluff, LA. His nephew, Jim Vanover goes to church with me. His sister is Sister Janet Trout in Delaware. Becky has a significant pedigree in Apostolic circles.
Some of you would be surprised at the UC roots that Steve and Becky had. He used to preach for many of the AMF brethren, including the late Charles Cooper in Pitkin, LA. Of course, as some have already indicated, Becky sang the revivals and Steve basically gave the altar calls.:)
Another couple that I thought of with the talk of Steve and Becky was Sharon and Paul Haygood... one key difference was that Paul could preach as well as Sharon could sing.:D
In the mid 70's era Becky Fender was my favorite singer. I remember at La. Campmeeting in either 73 or 74 I bought an album with a group comprised of Becky Fender and Bill and Renee Morris. I think it was titled "Rainbow" or something like that. Very contemporary for that era and I loved it. Bill Morris was Kenneth Phillips music director at the time.
A decade or two later Becky went through a phase of overdoing songs (phrasing, riffs, etc) that I did not enjoy but I think she recovered from that phase! She has an amazing voice. I have not heard her for years but I assume she still does.
In the mid 70's Becky Fender, Sharon Haygood, and Nancy Grandquist were probably the best female soloists in Oneness Pentecost.
philjones
10-10-2007, 08:00 PM
In the mid 70's era Becky Fender was my favorite singer. I remember at La. Campmeeting in either 73 or 74 I bought an album with a group comprised of Becky Fender and Bill and Renee Morris. I think it was titled "Rainbow" or something like that. Very contemporary for that era and I loved it. Bill Morris was Kenneth Phillips music director at the time.
A decade or two later Becky went through a phase of overdoing songs (phrasing, riffs, etc) that I did not enjoy but I think she recovered from that phase! She has an amazing voice. I have not heard her for years but I assume she still does.
In the mid 70's Becky Fender, Sharon Haygood, and Nancy Grandquist were probably the best female soloists in Oneness Pentecost.
In 1979 or 1980, while I was with AM in Plano, TX, I was privileged to jam with Nancy G, Landy E and a couple of other musicians at a concert in Fort Worth. It was before Bro. Hanby's indiscretions had been brought to light. We had a great time. I think at that time Nancy was in the throes of decisions regarding Apostolic traditions. She obviously made her decision and today is quite consistent with conservative Pentecost. AND, she can still SANG!:)
Blubayou
10-10-2007, 08:05 PM
In the mid 70's era Becky Fender was my favorite singer. I remember at La. Campmeeting in either 73 or 74 I bought an album with a group comprised of Becky Fender and Bill and Renee Morris. I think it was titled "Rainbow" or something like that. Very contemporary for that era and I loved it. Bill Morris was Kenneth Phillips music director at the time.
A decade or two later Becky went through a phase of overdoing songs (phrasing, riffs, etc) that I did not enjoy but I think she recovered from that phase! She has an amazing voice. I have not heard her for years but I assume she still does.
In the mid 70's Becky Fender, Sharon Haygood, and Nancy Grandquist were probably the best female soloists in Oneness Pentecost.
CC1- I agree with you. B. Fender does have a great voice. I always enjoyed her singing especially back in the day! I listened to B. Fender singing at the Promiseland service and noted that she still overdoes phrases. I remember the B. Morris era, I was just coming into Pentecost at the time. I had a connection to the Phillips church, and visited there a couple of times, in the 70's heyday.
stmatthew
10-10-2007, 09:15 PM
For the Becky Fender Fanclub
N1ROHlozRXE
crakjak
10-10-2007, 10:41 PM
Becky has been much of his success.
I believe most of us successful men could or should say that our wives is "much of our success." Wouldn't you agree, bro? Are maybe I should ask yo wifey, huh?:pirate
I didn't realize she was a Varnado from Lake Charles.
Had I known at one time, I'd long forgotten.
If she's David's daughter, I guess she'd be A. D. Varnado's granddaughter.
My daughter worked in the kitchen at the junior camp, had to skip the senior camp for art academy and then was back for campmeeting.
David Varnado was her boss so I guess he's following his dad as head of the kitchen during the Louisiana camps.
My bad ... I thought they were some of KP's converts around the time the hippies were coming on board.
Grady Stebbins was another.
Grady Stebbins...man, I had forgotten about him. He preached for us at Sandy Lake, too.
Seems I remember him playing a guitar and singing "Me and Jesus".
I was about seven years old then.
Steve Epley
10-11-2007, 09:34 AM
Steve Fender preached a service a the AMF conference at Little Rock years ago if I remember correctly.
Some friends visited him a few years back stayed for the entire service they did have folks repeat the sinner's prayer. SF had the guys to come into his office to visit and he kept them for hours talking about the old days. They said he seemed very lonely?
StillStanding
10-11-2007, 12:04 PM
My! My! Becky has sure changed since the last time I saw her! :eek:
I remember when her and Steve first got married, they preached us a revival and stayed at our home. Becky had bags of candy that she was constantly munching on, AND NEVER OFFERED ME A PIECE!! I would look at her eating that candy and my mouth would water! :D
Esther
10-12-2007, 01:40 PM
David is indeed Becky's dad and David lives next door to my daughter and son-in-law in Moss Bluff, LA. His nephew, Jim Vanover goes to church with me. His sister is Sister Janet Trout in Delaware. Becky has a significant pedigree in Apostolic circles.
Some of you would be surprised at the UC roots that Steve and Becky had. He used to preach for many of the AMF brethren, including the late Charles Cooper in Pitkin, LA. Of course, as some have already indicated, Becky sang the revivals and Steve basically gave the altar calls.:)
Another couple that I thought of with the talk of Steve and Becky was Sharon and Paul Haygood... one key difference was that Paul could preach as well as Sharon could sing.:D
If this is not the Becky Varando for Oil City, La. what was her name?
arlingreen
07-29-2011, 10:04 PM
Let's see...is this about TV or no TV? If so, why are those who "are the true believers" on this evil computer?
arlingreen, you do realize this is a four year old thread?
Sabby
07-30-2011, 08:52 PM
As I said before, I really don't know the guy at all. I hope PentecostisAlive comes back. I'm curious about the mechanics involved in a case like KP's. Is he said to have "watered down" the doctrine simply because he left the UPC? Then can the same be said of those that are planning on leaving right now? Are they "watering down" the message?
What exactly does one do to be guilty of "watering down" the message?
Pel, if you deviate from the party line of Acts 2:38 & Holiness (read standards) = salvation, then you are "watering down" the message. If you are not a three stepper, you are "watering down" the message. If you pursue grace (the REAL kind) as a lifestlye rather than life by guilt, then you are "watering down" the message. If you are not UPC, the you are "watering down" the message. It's the same old slime used for years...ad hominem attacks against people unknown to you but because of HEARSAY they are killed. No more than al quaeda christians, plain and simple.
What PIA forgets is that the "message" is not a verse, but rather the glory of the incarnation and resurrection of Jesus Christ which in effect extended grace for all who call upon His name to be saved...but I digress.
Sabby
07-30-2011, 09:00 PM
I was a UPC preacher for years and got tired of hearing fellow men of GOD being slimed over the interpretation of the application of the VERSE. It's inane.
Oneness Pentecostals SHOULD be fellowshipping one another REGARDLESS of their differences in opinions re: standards OR the verse.
It's interesting to me how UPC (predominantly white organization) brethren I have met make allowances in areas of standards in other oneness denominations (read: other races), but if you are WHITE you had better be clean shaven (if you are a man, that is! lol), and you had better not be caught wearing shorts, a swimming suit, a sleeveless t shirt, and heaven help the woman that cuts her hair or wears pantalones. It is revolting the amount of character assassination comes from my conservative "brethren" over standards. It really shows what spirit they are of...
Sabby
07-30-2011, 09:16 PM
I'll get off my soapbox after this.
The most pointed, mean-spirited, classless and toxic sniping on this forum have come from conservative apostolics.
Isn't it about time you discovered the JESUS of the bible?
I learned many years ago that being a Christian didn't mean trying to be good enough to "be one". Noone is good enough for that.
I also learned that GOD does NOT use guilt in the same way people do to manipulate us.
Finally; I served in the military, 7 years active, 21 in the reserve, retiring in the Army Reserve as a Command Sergeant Major. This doesn't make me better than anyone else, but I CAN speak to the military life. Living for GOD is not designed to be as hard as being in the military. The Code of Conduct can devastate you and a major violation can ruin your career. But we are not living under military rules (are you reading this, PIA?)Living in the military REQUIRES conformity, but in the Body of Christ we are all individuals placed their at God's pleasure (severally as He will).
With apologies to Gloria Eastridge, "God does not make cookie cutter Christians" (circa 1978)
I was a UPC preacher for years and got tired of hearing fellow men of GOD being slimed over the interpretation of the application of the VERSE. It's inane.
Oneness Pentecostals SHOULD be fellowshipping one another REGARDLESS of their differences in opinions re: standards OR the verse.
It's interesting to me how UPC (predominantly white organization) brethren I have met make allowances in areas of standards in other oneness denominations (read: other races), but if you are WHITE you had better be clean shaven (if you are a man, that is! lol), and you had better not be caught wearing shorts, a swimming suit, a sleeveless t shirt, and heaven help the woman that cuts her hair or wears pantalones. It is revolting the amount of character assassination comes from my conservative "brethren" over standards. It really shows what spirit they are of...
:thumbsup:thumbsup
I'll get off my soapbox after this.
The most pointed, mean-spirited, classless and toxic sniping on this forum have come from conservative apostolics.
Isn't it about time you discovered the JESUS of the bible?
I learned many years ago that being a Christian didn't mean trying to be good enough to "be one". Noone is good enough for that.
I also learned that GOD does NOT use guilt in the same way people do to manipulate us.
Finally; I served in the military, 7 years active, 21 in the reserve, retiring in the Army Reserve as a Command Sergeant Major. This doesn't make me better than anyone else, but I CAN speak to the military life. Living for GOD is not designed to be as hard as being in the military. The Code of Conduct can devastate you and a major violation can ruin your career. But we are not living under military rules (are you reading this, PIA?)Living in the military REQUIRES conformity, but in the Body of Christ we are all individuals placed their at God's pleasure (severally as He will).
With apologies to Gloria Eastridge, "God does not make cookie cutter Christians" (circa 1978)
:thumbsup:thumbsup
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