When the Pharisees Accused Jesus of Being used by the Devil...

[Coonskinner]

Anybody recall that passage of Scripture?

You might be careful pronouncing folks "of the devil."

If by chance you were wrong about them...


Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

[Brother Price]

If someone says a lie, a lie is of the devil. If someone preaches false doctrine, that is of the devil. Those who are of a bad spirit, and are not saved are of the devil. But, they can get saved, can repent, and be of God.

[Coonskinner]

Thank you for a definitive answer, Brother Price.

[Brother Price]

Coonskinner, I have the utmost respect for you. Though, you do need a shave. :)

[Esther]

Anybody recall that passage of Scripture?

You might be careful pronouncing folks "of the devil."

If by chance you were wrong about them...


Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

I agree with you brother.

There is power in your words. :)

[Nahum]

I think there are spirits (attitudes) some folks exhibit that we can definitively say are of the devil. For instance......

1. All preachers are money-hungry, adulterous, control freaks.
2. All people should live under authoritarian bonds of legalism.
3. The UPC is the great whore of Babylon.
4. Its fun to attack my sister or brother when they are obviously hurting.

So, yeah, I believe in calling a spade a spade. Sometimes what people say originates from the pits of Hell. I have no idea why this thread was posted, but felt the need to respond.

[freeatlast]

Anybody recall that passage of Scripture?

You might be careful pronouncing folks "of the devil."

If by chance you were wrong about them...


Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Right Br Coonskinner. Very true.

A few weeks I started a thread that asked. " What is blasphemy'?

Adultery is pretty bad, and we all jump on those threads that mention homosexuals and beat them to death. Murderers and thieves get no mercy either.

BUT those who "judge their brother unworthy"...well they just get a free pass.

Cons judge lib's and vice versa every day with out a thought as to what their fate may be be if thay have judged wrongly.

What if the people, of the view that a women CAN cut her hair, are right.

Will God hold in contempt those who have imposed their view of scripture on women, causing some to fall. For many say she is UNHOLY.

Do we really want to "bet" our salvation on our interpretaiton of one passage, that has had so many interprtaions applied to it. A scripture as clear as muddy water at best.

Of all sins mentioned in the bible, the one we seem to not want to touch is this one of judging and blasphemy ( Callling something that is holy, unholy)

Course then we can go on to discuss gluttony once we get this one figured out. :heeheehee

[Digging4Truth]

Looks around.... admiring the scenery... wonders out loud...

Could someone tell me... is this a 2 way street?

[revrandy]

Right Br Coonskinner. Very true.

A few weeks I started a thread that asked. " What is blasphemy'?

Adultery is pretty bad, and we all jump on those threads that mention homosexuals and beat them to death. Murderers and thieves get no mercy either.

BUT those who "judge their brother unworthy"...well they just get a free pass.

Cons judge lib's and vice versa every day with out a thought as to what their fate may be be if thay have judged wrongly.

What if the people, of the view that a women CAN cut her hair, are right.

Will God hold in contempt those who have imposed their view of scripture on women, causing some to fall. For many say she is UNHOLY.

Do we really want to "bet" our salvation on our interpretaiton of one passage, that has had so many interprtaions applied to it. A scripture as clear as muddy water at best.

Of all sins mentioned in the bible, the one we seem to not want to touch is this one of judging and blasphemy ( Callling something that is holy, unholy)

Course then we can go on to discuss gluttony once we get this one figured out. :heeheehee

When it comes to scripture there is ONE interpretation but MANY applications...

[Nahum]

Looks around.... admiring the scenery... wonders out loud...

Could someone tell me... is this a 2 way street?

Be careful where you stand. You might get hit by a bus.

[revrandy]

What is the point of this thread???

Did I miss something??

[Nahum]

What is the point of this thread???

Did I miss something??


Ask Coonskinner. :dunno

[freeatlast]

What is the point of this thread???

Did I miss something??

Since when was a point a requirement of a thread? :killinme

[MissBrattified]

Anybody recall that passage of Scripture?

You might be careful pronouncing folks "of the devil."

If by chance you were wrong about them...


Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Thanks for saying this, CS. It amazes me that people have no fear when it comes to criticizing God's people.

[Chan]

If someone says a lie, a lie is of the devil. If someone preaches false doctrine, that is of the devil. Those who are of a bad spirit, and are not saved are of the devil. But, they can get saved, can repent, and be of God.So, if a person lies, it isn't because he chose to lie but because the devil made him do it? Since Jesus said "there is none good but God," how can any unsaved person have a "good" spirit? Are we humans not born with a sinful nature and with a heart (seat of emotions, core of one's being) that is "deceitful" above all things "and desperately wicked"?

When are we going to stop removing from humans their responsibility for their own words, actions, attitudes, and beliefs? When are we going to stop placing the blame anywhere except in the wickedness of our own nature?

[freeatlast]

Thanks for saying this, CS. It amazes me that people have no fear when it comes to criticizing God's people.

Some are quick to do it, because they feel they know that those they critisize are not God's people.

And therin lies the problem.

God help them if they are wrong.

[MissBrattified]

Some are quick to do it, because they feel they know that those they critisize are not God's people.

And therin lies the problem.

God help them if they are wrong.

You're right. Folks justify their criticism by assuring themselves inwardly that those they are criticizing are actually ungodly, Pharisees, or the like.

[SDG]

So, if a person lies, it isn't because he chose to lie but because the devil made him do it? Since Jesus said "there is none good but God," how can any unsaved person have a "good" spirit? Are we humans not born with a sinful nature and with a heart (seat of emotions, core of one's being) that is "deceitful" above all things "and desperately wicked"?

When are we going to stop removing from humans their responsibility for their own words, actions, attitudes, and beliefs? When are we going to stop placing the blame anywhere except in the wickedness of our own nature?

Chan ... I could not agree more. It's time we are held accountable.

[Annie]

So, if a person lies, it isn't because he chose to lie but because the devil made him do it? Since Jesus said "there is none good but God," how can any unsaved person have a "good" spirit? Are we humans not born with a sinful nature and with a heart (seat of emotions, core of one's being) that is "deceitful" above all things "and desperately wicked"?

When are we going to stop removing from humans their responsibility for their own words, actions, attitudes, and beliefs? When are we going to stop placing the blame anywhere except in the wickedness of our own nature?

It is my belief that folk give the devil far more credit for things than he deserves. Most of our problems stem from our own stinking flesh.

[MissBrattified]

So, if a person lies, it isn't because he chose to lie but because the devil made him do it? Since Jesus said "there is none good but God," how can any unsaved person have a "good" spirit? Are we humans not born with a sinful nature and with a heart (seat of emotions, core of one's being) that is "deceitful" above all things "and desperately wicked"?

When are we going to stop removing from humans their responsibility for their own words, actions, attitudes, and beliefs? When are we going to stop placing the blame anywhere except in the wickedness of our own nature?

Sin is a human condition. It always amazes me when people blame the devil for everything. The devil may tempt us, but ultimately we choose sin of our own accord.

Sometimes I think its easier for folks to blame the devil than to take responsibility for their own actions. e.g., "The Devil made me do it!"

[Nahum]

Baloney!

If someone tells me that I need to be tolerant of false doctrine, THEY are spouting off devlish doctrine.

When someone piles on a fellow Christian, absolutely knowing that person is already wounded, suffering, and bleeding, THEY are devlish.

I cannot stand injustice, and neither could Christ!!!!!

Would you guys quit being so ignorantly politically correct?!!!!!! PLEASE!!!!!!

That's the biggest problem in the church today. We are too big a pansies to call sin what it is. We ride the fence because we don't want to hurt someones precious little feelings.

What about when Jesus could turn to Simon and say "Get behind me, SATAN". Hello people!
Even he recognized the devils work in Simon's statement.

[Nahum]

It is my belief that folk give the devil far more credit for things than he deserves. Most of our problems stem from our own stinking flesh.

Malarkey!!

You are bringing secular humanism into the discussion. It's not always JUST our flesh. There IS a devil, and he and his minions work overtime to stir up our flesh against each other.

Don't deny his existence, and don't minimize his evil. He still tries very hard to use people to his advantage.

Are we really so blind? :beatdeadhorse

[MissBrattified]

I just think that people blame the devil when they ought to be acknowledging their own sinful state. It's a cop-out, in my opinion.

It has nothing to do with political correctness--it has to do with being a man and accepting responsibility for your flesh.

[SDG]

Baloney!

If someone tells me that I need to be tolerant of false doctrine, THEY are spouting off devlish doctrine.

When someone piles on a fellow Christian, absolutely knowing that person is already wounded, suffering, and bleeding, THEY are devlish.

I cannot stand injustice, and neither could Christ!!!!!

Would you guys quit being so ignorantly politically correct?!!!!!! PLEASE!!!!!!

That's the biggest problem in the church today. We are too big a pansies to call sin what it is. We ride the fence because we don't want to hurt someones precious little feelings.

The devil tempts our flesh to speak evil things to each other. That's why Jesus could turn to Simon and say "Get behind me, SATAN". Hello people!

I feel passion ... got something on your mind this morning ... PP?????

[MissBrattified]

Malarkey!!

You are bringing secular humanism into the discussion. It's not always JUST our flesh. There IS a devil, and he and his minions work overtime to stir up our flesh against each other.

Don't deny his existence, and don't minimize his evil. He still tries very hard to use people to his advantage.

Are we really so blind? :beatdeadhorse

Satan can't force us to sin; ultimately we choose sin. Of course there is a devil! There's also a hell! But I hate the cop-out that so many people have chosen that says "I'm not responsible for the sin I committed because it was the devil's fault!"

[SDG]

I think that both flesh ... and the principalities of this world play a factor ... but I'm not going to act like the devil is omnipresent or omniscient ...

[AGAPE]

Now, who did I say was of the devil????????????????????

[Annie]

Malarkey!!

You are bringing secular humanism into the discussion. It's not always JUST our flesh. There IS a devil, and he and his minions work overtime to stir up our flesh against each other.

Don't deny his existence, and don't minimize his evil. He still tries very hard to use people to his advantage.

Are we really so blind? :beatdeadhorse

Sir...you need to calm down- you are going into stroke range. I never said there was NO DEVIL. I never said it was ALWAYS just our flesh...I absolutely believe in satan, I see him at work, trying to cause grief and division on this forum 24/7.

God bless.

[Nahum]

I just think that people blame the devil when they ought to be acknowledging their own sinful state. It's a cop-out, in my opinion.

It has nothing to do with political correctness--it has to do with being a man and accepting responsibility for your flesh.

Humanism at its finest!

You want to minimize our enemy's influence, thereby stating all evil originates in the heart of a man. Do you deny the existence of the enemy of our soul? Do you deny that he and his ambassodors are at work continually. Do you deny that we are (apart from the Holy Ghost) influenced to say evil things?

[revrandy]

Maybe the Fact that Peter & Paul spending so much time in jail.. they were offending someone......

[Nahum]

I think that both flesh ... and the principalities of this world play a factor ... but I'm not going to act like the devil is omnipresent or omniscient ...

Who said he was? I just loathe it when people ignore the idea that anything supernatural could play apart in everyday life. This is false doctrine, and dare I say it? Of ........... oh never mind! :ranting

[SDG]

Who said he was? I just loathe it when people ignore the idea that anything supernatural could play apart in everyday life. This is false doctrine, and dare I say it? Of ........... oh never mind! :ranting

Without a doubt there is spiritual warfare all around us ... and it involves the Kingdom of God and Satan and his legions.

[Nahum]

Sir...you need to calm down- you are going into stroke range. I never said there was NO DEVIL. I never said it was ALWAYS just our flesh...I absolutely believe in satan, I see him at work, trying to cause grief and division on this forum 24/7.

God bless.

HAHAHA!!!! I am no where close to stroke range. This just bugs the fire out of me though. We are a selfish, self-centered church. We think we operate separate of any outside influences. How vain!?

[Esther]

Who said he was? I just loathe it when people ignore the idea that anything supernatural could play apart in everyday life. This is false doctrine, and dare I say it? Of ........... oh never mind! :ranting

I agree with you brother!!!

[Esther]

HAHAHA!!!! I am no where close to stroke range. This just bugs the fire out of me though. We are a selfish, self-centered church. We think we operate separate of any outside influences. How vain!?

Preach it!:ranting

[Annie]

I heard a pastor say once that he would rather deal with a church full of devils anyday, than a church full of folks that were not killing their flesh daily. He said, "You pray the devil OUT of folk- you can't pray their flesh OUT." *smile*


I completely understand what you are saying PP...and I do agree with you. My kids think I am TOO paranoid when it comes to fighting off the spirits from Hell. I don;t allow secular mags in my home- they are tools that satan will use to bring a spirit of Lust and Pride into my house, I believe...just a sample of how I try to combat Hell, and the works of satan in my life...

I hope we are 'okay'...???? I don't want to offend anyone...

[SDG]

*pulls up a chair* Well, I had my mini-stroke yesterday ... it's your turn buddy.

[Annie]

HAHAHA!!!! I am no where close to stroke range. This just bugs the fire out of me though. We are a selfish, self-centered church. We think we operate separate of any outside influences. How vain!?


Brother where in my post did I allude to this??? YOu are adding to my initial post...

[MissBrattified]

Humanism at its finest!

You want to minimize our enemy's influence, thereby stating all evil originates in the heart of a man.

Do you deny the existence of the enemy of our soul? Do you deny that he and his ambassodors are at work continually. Do you deny that we are (apart from the Holy Ghost) influenced to say evil things?

I think my previous posts make it obvious that I'm doing nothing of the sort. LOL!!! You put the key word in this post--"influenced"!

We can be tempted and influenced, but ultimately, according to God's Word:

Jam 1:13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
Jam 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
Jam 1:15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

[Nahum]

Do you people know how many times the devil has used "Christians" to hurt other Christians? How many times we play along with his diabolical schemes to destroy the church?

When someone maliciously attacks another person (especially a fellow-Christian) who is hurting, your very first response should be to fight against them. That is compassion in action.

We act like the devil when we kick a brother or sister who is bleeding, hurting, dazed and befuddled. It makes me soooooooooooooooo mad that the devil can play on the worst part of our humanity like that!

Wake up Church!

[Annie]

Apparently I have missed something in this thread...I am pulling out. This seems to be a more 'personal level' subject that I am clueless about. I would never kick a hurting saint while they were down- I've walked that road myself- not fun.

[Nahum]

I think my previous posts make it obvious that I'm doing nothing of the sort. LOL!!! You put the key word in this post--"influenced"!

We can be tempted and influenced, but ultimately, according to God's Word:

Jam 1:13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
Jam 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
Jam 1:15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

Can I ask you what entices him? Hmmmmmm? Who is the father of all lies?
What led to the fall of mankind? It was the one two punch of satan's lies, and man's lust.

You cannot leave out either one.

Here's the rub (presently). I recognize the work of the enemy in any situation that brings destruction in the life of a Christian. I believe the devil is very actively using the oldest military tactic in the book in the last day - divide and conquer.

We had better learn to love and defend each other. Love requires calling evil by its name. Evil wants to destroy those who are hurting.

My goodness people, some of us have more compassion for a pet than we do our own brother and sister! ARGGGGGGHHHHH!!!!

[MissBrattified]

Do you people know how many times the devil has used "Christians" to hurt other Christians? How many times we play along with his diabolical schemes to destroy the church?

When someone maliciously attacks another person (especially a fellow-Christian) who is hurting, your very first response should be to fight against them. That is compassion in action.

We act like the devil when we kick a brother or sister who is bleeding, hurting, dazed and befuddled. It makes me soooooooooooooooo mad that the devil can play on the worst part of our humanity like that!

Wake up Church!

PP, if you want to give the devil bunches of credit, be my guest. He's evil, but he's nowhere on God's level when it comes to power! He was just an angel, for goodness' sake--not the evil equivalent to God as he would like us to believe.

Look at the words you use--you are proving my point:

"act like the devil"
"we play along with his...schemes"

No one is denying Satan's existence, or his influence, but I DO deny that he has any measure of power that is in any way equivalent to God's power.

[MissBrattified]

Can I ask you what entices him? Hmmmmmm? Who is the father of all lies?
What led to the fall of mankind? It was the one two punch of satan's lies, and man's lust.

You cannot leave out either one.

Here's the rub (presently). I recognize the work of the enemy in any situation that brings destruction in the life of a Christian. I believe the devil is very actively using the oldest military tactic in the book in the last day - divide and conquer.

We had better learn to love and defend each other. Love requires calling evil by its name. Evil wants to destroy those who are hurting.

My goodness people, some of us have more compassion for a pet than we do our own brother and sister! ARGGGGGGHHHHH!!!!

I don't know what you're reacting to, but I don't think its the content of this thread, so why don't you start a thread that addresses what you're really concerned about?

You're talking about having compassion, and I'm talking about recognizing that we are responsible and accountable for our sins. I'm sure the topics could be threaded together in some way, but they are actually different topics.

[Nahum]

I don't know what you're reacting to, but I don't think its the content of this thread, so why don't you start a thread that addresses what you're really concerned about?

You're talking about having compassion, and I'm talking about recognizing that we are responsible and accountable for our sins. I'm sure the topics could be threaded together in some way, but they are actually different topics.

I'll walk away.

Hey, I don't have anything against anyone on this forum.
I just don't like the pile-on crud, from any side of any issue. Not saying you did, but its been a wild day already.

I do not believe the devil is all-powerful. I do not wish to give him any credit whatsoever. I just don't want us to be ignorant of his ways.

[MissBrattified]

I'll walk away.

Hey, I don't have anything against anyone on this forum.
I just don't like the pile-on crud, from any side of any issue. Not saying you did, but its been a wild day already.

I don't like assumptions and the knee-jerk reactions that follow. I'm not "piling on" anyone and I don't have a clue what you're talking about. :dunno

[J-Roc]

Baloney!

If someone tells me that I need to be tolerant of false doctrine, THEY are spouting off devlish doctrine.

When someone piles on a fellow Christian, absolutely knowing that person is already wounded, suffering, and bleeding, THEY are devlish.

I cannot stand injustice, and neither could Christ!!!!!

Would you guys quit being so ignorantly politically correct?!!!!!! PLEASE!!!!!!

That's the biggest problem in the church today. We are too big a pansies to call sin what it is. We ride the fence because we don't want to hurt someones precious little feelings.

What about when Jesus could turn to Simon and say "Get behind me, SATAN". Hello people!
Even he recognized the devils work in Simon's statement.


I endorse this statement! :highfive

[J-Roc]

I feel passion ... got something on your mind this morning ... PP?????


He is ashamed at seeing how Rhona is being treated...he sees this as an injustice and it makes his stomach turn!!

[Nahum]

He is ashamed at seeing how Rhona is being treated...he sees this as an injustice and it makes his stomach turn!!

Thanks for the effort, but please don't speak for me.

Truth is, I can't stand any of it, from any side. I have a horrible past experience that this stirred up. I cannot stand injustice.

[Chan]

Baloney!

If someone tells me that I need to be tolerant of false doctrine, THEY are spouting off devlish doctrine.

When someone piles on a fellow Christian, absolutely knowing that person is already wounded, suffering, and bleeding, THEY are devlish.

I cannot stand injustice, and neither could Christ!!!!!

Would you guys quit being so ignorantly politically correct?!!!!!! PLEASE!!!!!!

That's the biggest problem in the church today. We are too big a pansies to call sin what it is. We ride the fence because we don't want to hurt someones precious little feelings.

What about when Jesus could turn to Simon and say "Get behind me, SATAN". Hello people!
Even he recognized the devils work in Simon's statement.Yes, THEY are doing it, not the devil! It's their own choice to believe and promote deception. The Bible says that the serpent deceived Eve but it also shows God holding Eve responsible for letting the serpent deceive her.

Of course, I don't see what your post has to do with any of the last several posts in this thread.

[J-Roc]

Thanks for the effort, but please don't speak for me.

Truth is, I can't stand any of it, from any side. I have a horrible past experience that this stirred up. I cannot stand injustice.

Not so much trying to speak for you as I am trying to piggy-back on your statement about hurting those who are obviously hurting and bringing it to a specific...it made my stomach turn to see some of the posters here get on Rhona's case...their mission was accomplished...did that make them feel good? Shame on them.

[Chan]

Do you people know how many times the devil has used "Christians" to hurt other Christians? How many times we play along with his diabolical schemes to destroy the church?Notice that you said "we play along." This is not indicative of what seems to be your "the devil made me do it" theology.

When someone maliciously attacks another person (especially a fellow-Christian) who is hurting, your very first response should be to fight against them. That is compassion in action. Should that really be the first response? Do you have scripture to support that one. On these forums it's clear that "malicious attack" is a relative term and, more often than not, what one considers a malicious attack on a person is really nothing more than strong opposition to what a person says or believes. Posting strongly against what someone says or believes has nothing whatsoever to do with the person whose words/beliefs are being opposed. People need to learn how to separate the person from what the person says or believes: the person is not his or her words/beliefs.

We act like the devil when we kick a brother or sister who is bleeding, hurting, dazed and befuddled. It makes me soooooooooooooooo mad that the devil can play on the worst part of our humanity like that!

Wake up Church!No, we act according to our sinful nature that we inherited from Adam.

[J-Roc]

Truth is, I can't stand any of it, from any side. I have a horrible past experience that this stirred up. I cannot stand injustice.


I'm in your corner rooting you on...I, too, cannot stand injustice.


Speak up for those who cannot speak for themselves;
ensure justice for those being crushed.
Yes, speak up for the poor and helpless,
and see that they get justice. (Proverbs 31)

[Coonskinner]

Not so much trying to speak for you as I am trying to piggy-back on your statement about hurting those who are obviously hurting and bringing it to a specific...it made my stomach turn to see some of the posters here get on Rhona's case...their mission was accomplished...did that make them feel good? Shame on them.

Mission?

You don't have a clue.

Say a bunch of erroneous stuff on a message board, and someone will challenge you on it.

Simple as that.

Please do a little research and show me where I have tortured anybody.

Pathetic.

[J-Roc]

Mission?

You don't have a clue.

Say a bunch of erroneous stuff on a message board, and someone will challenge you on it.

Simple as that.

Please do a little research and show me where I have tortured anybody.

Pathetic.


You know very well that the motive for her starting that "Dear Rhona" thread was to be a beacon of hope and healing to anyone in the community that was looking to find good ideas and words of encouragement. The motive of the thread was obvious and so it did not need anyone policing over it. For those that can do without her advice, they can simply move on to the next thread. There are many threads set up with the motive to strike up a debate, bring out the swords and the guns or whatever and that is fine...but this was not one of them.

If anyone had a sincere desire to question any particular advice, then it could have been done in a civil and unaggressive manner. Instead, the thugs came in with their daggers and knives and machetes with the sole purpose of cutting deep into her emotions like wimps. And since the theme on AFF the past 3 days have been about analyzing people's personality trait, here is my analysis...these thugs that picked on Rhona are the same clowns who were bullied in school and were made fun of and now are taking a vengeance and looking for retribution. Yeah...a silly analysis, but I figured I'd plug it in. :tease

BTW, I don't remember who said what in her post and don't know if you were one of them, I just know that there was a collectivity and not just one individual.

Yes, pathetic is the word that came to my mind too when I saw these cowards doing what they did on her thread.

[SDG]

J ... it's Rhoni.

[Coonskinner]

You know very well that the motive for her starting that "Dear Rhona" thread was to be a beacon of hope and healing to anyone in the community that was looking to find good ideas and words of encouragement. The motive of the thread was obvious and so it did not need anyone policing over it. For those that can do without her advice, they can simply move on to the next thread. There are many threads set up with the motive to strike up a debate, bring out the swords and the guns or whatever and that is fine...but this was not one of them.

If anyone had a sincere desire to question any particular advice, then it could have been done in a civil and unaggressive manner. Instead, the thugs came in with their daggers and knives and machetes with the sole purpose of cutting deep into her emotions like wimps. And since the theme on AFF the past 3 days have been about analyzing people's personality trait, here is my analysis...these thugs that picked on Rhona are the same clowns who were bullied in school and were made fun of and now are taking a vengeance and looking for retribution. Yeah...a silly analysis, but I figured I'd plug it in. :tease

BTW, I don't remember who said what in her post and don't know if you were one of them, I just know that there was a collectivity and not just one individual.

Yes, pathetic is the word that came to my mind too when I saw these cowards doing what they did on her thread.

This is worthy of the rarely awarded and highly coveted Double Toro...

Congratulations!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v325/JohnCarroll/DSCF0521.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v325/JohnCarroll/DSCF0521.jpg

[Coonskinner]

Of all the melodramatic, hyperbolic, post-menopausal sounding tripe I have read, this ranks near the top.

[SDG]

Hey J ... should we take out the Koolaid man award ... ????

[J-Roc]

You look pretty cold in that picture...dress warm.




This is worthy of the rarely awarded and highly coveted Double Toro...

Congratulations!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v325/JohnCarroll/DSCF0521.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v325/JohnCarroll/DSCF0521.jpg

[Coonskinner]

You know very well that the motive for her starting that "Dear Rhona" thread was to be a beacon of hope and healing to anyone in the community that was looking to find good ideas and words of encouragement. The motive of the thread was obvious and so it did not need anyone policing over it. For those that can do without her advice, they can simply move on to the next thread. There are many threads set up with the motive to strike up a debate, bring out the swords and the guns or whatever and that is fine...but this was not one of them.

If anyone had a sincere desire to question any particular advice, then it could have been done in a civil and unaggressive manner. Instead, the thugs came in with their daggers and knives and machetes with the sole purpose of cutting deep into her emotions like wimps. And since the theme on AFF the past 3 days have been about analyzing people's personality trait, here is my analysis...these thugs that picked on Rhona are the same clowns who were bullied in school and were made fun of and now are taking a vengeance and looking for retribution. Yeah...a silly analysis, but I figured I'd plug it in. :tease

BTW, I don't remember who said what in her post and don't know if you were one of them, I just know that there was a collectivity and not just one individual.

Yes, pathetic is the word that came to my mind too when I saw these cowards doing what they did on her thread.

ROFL!

Riiiiiiight.:)

All my repressed hostility from being picked on is trying to come out...

Whatever floats your boat, Bub. :)

[SDG]

ROFL!

Riiiiiiight.:)

All my repressed hostility from being picked on is trying to come out...

Whatever floats your boat, Bub. :)

Temper ... temper ... temper.

[J-Roc]

Hey J ... should we take out the Koolaid man award ... ????


Go ahead...D, will you do the honor? :heeheehee

[Coonskinner]

You look pretty cold in that picture...dress warm.

Ouch!

What a dazzling and brilliant shaft of repartee'!

I bet you were the terror of the sixth grade. :)

[Coonskinner]

Temper ... temper ... temper.

Temper?

Don't flatter yourself. :)

I am laughing.:killinme

[Coonskinner]

Go ahead...D, will you do the honor? :heeheehee

Giving Tweedledee the nod, are we?:tease

[Admin]

It's time to put this to rest.

Each poster is responsible for their own posts.

Please stop with all the finger pointing!

[Nahum]

Yes, THEY are doing it, not the devil! It's their own choice to believe and promote deception. The Bible says that the serpent deceived Eve but it also shows God holding Eve responsible for letting the serpent deceive her.

Of course, I don't see what your post has to do with any of the last several posts in this thread.

I don't see what your posts have to do with anything, EVER!
I have already said the serpents deception and man's lust led to sin.
But keep on arguing with the wall, if thats what floats your boat.

[SDG]

Giving Tweedledee the nod, are we?:tease

J ... all very predictable behaviors ... way too eazy ....

[revrandy]

Of all the melodramatic, hyperbolic, post-menopausal sounding tripe I have read, this ranks near the top.

Ouch!

What a dazzling and brilliant shaft of repartee'!

I bet you were the terror of the sixth grade. :)

Giving Tweedledee the nod, are we?:tease

CS.. You are killing me with your dictionary prowess!!! :killinme :killinme

You went from Hyperbolic to Tweedledee!!!! Stop this madness!!!! :killinme :D

[Coonskinner]

J ... all very predictable behaviors ... way too eazy ....

Pontificate on, O wise one.:)

We aren't fooled.

[SDG]

CS.. You are killing me with your dictionary prowess!!! :killinme :killinme

You went from Hyperbolic to Tweedledee!!!! Stop this madness!!!! :killinme :D

I'm also impressed by his verbal venom ... he is to be commended.

[SDG]

Pontificate on, O wise one.:)

We aren't fooled.

Hey Jack ... I've got the conch now.

[Coonskinner]

I'm also impressed by his verbal venom ... he is to be commended.

Venom?

Oh, please. :)

I thought guys from New York were supposed to be a little tougher than this.

[revrandy]

Venom?

Oh, please. :)

I thought guys from New York were supposed to be a little tougher than this.

Venom????

Thas' Kansas lingo .. I guess you don't take a French Poodle to a Coon Hunt!!!

[J-Roc]

Venom?

Oh, please. :)

I thought guys from New York were supposed to be a little tougher than this.


rofl....you and I can have a friendly match in the octagon to test our toughness. :killinme

I'm game! :tease

[Coonskinner]

rofl....you and I can have a friendly match in the octagon to test our toughness. :killinme

I'm game! :tease

:bliss :bliss

I'm getting goose bumps just thinking about it. :)

[SDG]

:bliss :bliss

I'm getting goose bumps just thinking about it. :)

Something tells me J ... he'd enjoy grappling with you.

[SDG]

J ... they're dancing around the Boar's head .... scary.

[Coonskinner]

Something tells me J ... he'd enjoy grappling with you.

There you go projecting fantasies again.

You guys are like the Psuedo-Apostolic version of Cheech and Chong. :)

[SDG]

There you go projecting again.

You guys are like the Psuedo-Apostolic version of Cheech and Chong. :)


Hissssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss sssssssss

[Coonskinner]

Kiddies, it has been fun.:)

Have to move along now...things to do.

Thanks for the memories. ;)

[MissBrattified]

What I have seen from Rhoni is that she dishes out quite a bit, but is too sensitive to take it in return. If you can't take as good as you give, you shouldn't be on a forum, because forums are brutal, you are expected to have tough skin.

If she is in such a place that the forum is causing her to be emotionally unstable, then I certainly don't believe she should be here.

I don't find that rrford, Coonskinner and others have attacked Rhoni, as much as she has accused them of such attacks, and when they try to defend themselves or deny it, they are pretty much made out to be the bad guys, and I have rarely seen any scraps that were provoked by them, from the beginning.

There is not a single sarcastic or facetious note in this post. It's honestly how I see it.

Further, there are longstanding disagreements that have been carried over, and the history here is important to understanding the situation.

For instance, Chan[cellor] has always disagreed with practicing psychology (as a Christian), has made no secret of it, and has stated his beliefs anytime it comes up. I have seen equally persistent statements from Rhoni on other topics that interest her, on threads that did not "belong" to her.

Malvaro stated that one of her posts "reeked of rebellion", and while I wouldn't have used the same phrase, I have to agree that the post in question showed an unbiblical disregard for authority. Just a page or two earlier, Malvaro was defending Rhoni in response to Chan, and so it strikes me as odd that we label people as abusers only when they disagree with us.

There are personal issues at work that really have nothing to do with the forum, and in many cases warrant blunt and straightforward comments, IMHO.

Other than those particulars, I really do not get any vibe other than just the normal disagreements and personality clashes that are bound to happen.

As for abuse...I haven't seen it. Sorry. I read the thread. Unless Rhoni is being viciously attacked over the phone and in PM's where no one else reads it, then I would deny its existence, especially in reference to CS and rrford, and especially compared to what is considered normal give-and-take conversation on this forum. (And NFCF and FCF and GNC....)

I agree with the discomfort they have both presented at Rhoni advising folks in a manner that seems to disparage their pastors and the authority they should respect and heed.

Finally, this is a forum which allows conversation...I think it is totally unacceptable and unreasonable for Rhoni to expect to have a thread where she gets to determine who posts and how, and who has to delete their responses, and who can disagree with her, if at all.

There ya go. My 50 cents.

[SDG]

There you go projecting fantasies again.

You guys are like the Psuedo-Apostolic version of Cheech and Chong. :)

You are like a pure, pedigreed high priest of the Lord of the Flies

[Coonskinner]

What I have seen from Rhoni is that she dishes out quite a bit, but is too sensitive to take it in return. If you can't take as good as you give, you shouldn't be on a forum, because forums are brutal, you are expected to have tough skin.

If she is in such a place that the forum is causing her to be emotionally unstable, then I certainly don't believe she should be here.

I don't find that rrford, Coonskinner and others have attacked Rhoni, as much as she has accused them of such attacks, and when they try to defend themselves or deny it, they are pretty much made out to be the bad guys, and I have rarely seen any scraps that were provoked by them, from the beginning.

There is not a single sarcastic or facetious note in this post. It's honestly how I see it.

Further, there are longstanding disagreements that have been carried over, and the history here is important to understanding the situation.

For instance, Chan[cellor] has always disagreed with practicing psychology (as a Christian), has made no secret of it, and has stated his beliefs anytime it comes up. I have seen equally persistent statements from Rhoni on other topics that interest her, on threads that did not "belong" to her.

Malvaro stated that one of her posts "reeked of rebellion", and while I wouldn't have used the same phrase, I have to agree that the post in question showed an unbiblical disregard for authority. Just a page or two earlier, Malvaro was defending Rhoni in response to Chan, and so it strikes me as odd that we label people as abusers only when they disagree with us.

There are personal issues at work that really have nothing to do with the forum, and in many cases warrant blunt and straightforward comments, IMHO.

Other than those particulars, I really do not get any vibe other than just the normal disagreements and personality clashes that are bound to happen.

As for abuse...I haven't seen it. Sorry. I read the thread. Unless Rhoni is being viciously attacked over the phone and in PM's where no one else reads it, then I would deny its existence, especially in reference to CS and rrford, and especially compared to what is considered normal give-and-take conversation on this forum. (And NFCF and FCF and GNC....)

I agree with the discomfort they have both presented at Rhoni advising folks in a manner that seems to disparage their pastors and the authority they should respect and heed.

Finally, this is a forum which allows conversation...I think it is totally unacceptable and unreasonable for Rhoni to expect to have a thread where she gets to determine who posts and how, and who has to delete their responses, and who can disagree with her, if at all.

There ya go. My 50 cents.

Another home run of the variety that routinely echoes off Miss B's bat.

I agree.

[Coonskinner]

You are like a pure, pedigreed high priest of the Lord of the Flies

ROFL!

Good show, old Chap!:killinme

[Nahum]

Posted by Miss Brattified:
There are personal issues at work that really have nothing to do with the forum, and in many cases warrant blunt and straightforward comments, IMHO.

So you think its all right to tell someone they are of the devil? That would be blunt and straightforward.

[Chan]

I don't see what your posts have to do with anything, EVER!
I have already said the serpents deception and man's lust led to sin.
But keep on arguing with the wall, if thats what floats your boat.Well, that must be your poor reading comprehension skills at work.

By the way, I was responding specifically to YOUR post. To refresh your memory about what you posted, here it is:

Baloney!

If someone tells me that I need to be tolerant of false doctrine, THEY are spouting off devlish doctrine.

When someone piles on a fellow Christian, absolutely knowing that person is already wounded, suffering, and bleeding, THEY are devlish.

I cannot stand injustice, and neither could Christ!!!!!

Would you guys quit being so ignorantly politically correct?!!!!!! PLEASE!!!!!!

That's the biggest problem in the church today. We are too big a pansies to call sin what it is. We ride the fence because we don't want to hurt someones precious little feelings.

What about when Jesus could turn to Simon and say "Get behind me, SATAN". Hello people!
Even he recognized the devils work in Simon's statement.


Now, maybe you'll want to re-think your ridiculous statement, "I don't see what your posts have to do with anything, EVER!"

It was only after you were challenged that you gave scant acknowledgement to the slightest possibility of human responsibility for one's own sins. You didn't start out that way.

You seem to be thinking that someone (or more than one) said that Satan has no involvement whatsoever, hence your histrionic response quoted above. No one has said any such thing. What was said is that we can't blame Satan for what we choose to do.

[Nahum]

Well, that must be your poor reading comprehension skills at work.

By the way, I was responding specifically to YOUR post. To refresh your memory about what you posted, here it is:

Baloney!

If someone tells me that I need to be tolerant of false doctrine, THEY are spouting off devlish doctrine.

When someone piles on a fellow Christian, absolutely knowing that person is already wounded, suffering, and bleeding, THEY are devlish.

I cannot stand injustice, and neither could Christ!!!!!

Would you guys quit being so ignorantly politically correct?!!!!!! PLEASE!!!!!!

That's the biggest problem in the church today. We are too big a pansies to call sin what it is. We ride the fence because we don't want to hurt someones precious little feelings.

What about when Jesus could turn to Simon and say "Get behind me, SATAN". Hello people!
Even he recognized the devils work in Simon's statement.


Now, maybe you'll want to re-think your ridiculous statement, "I don't see what your posts have to do with anything, EVER!"

It was only after you were challenged that you gave scant acknowledgement to the slightest possibility of human responsibility for one's own sins. You didn't start out that way.

You seem to be thinking that someone (or more than one) said that Satan has no involvement whatsoever, hence your histrionic response quoted above. No one has said any such thing. What was said is that we can't blame Satan for what we choose to do.

Ring around the rosie again Chanie-baby?
Go back and read the entire thread, Oh Wise One. Sorry to bore you with facts. Tell me, if I said the sky was blue, would you disagree with me?

[Nahum]

So, if a person lies, it isn't because he chose to lie but because the devil made him do it? Since Jesus said "there is none good but God," how can any unsaved person have a "good" spirit? Are we humans not born with a sinful nature and with a heart (seat of emotions, core of one's being) that is "deceitful" above all things "and desperately wicked"?

When are we going to stop removing from humans their responsibility for their own words, actions, attitudes, and beliefs? When are we going to stop placing the blame anywhere except in the wickedness of our own nature?

Notice anyone missing here, Chan? :tease

The devil doesn't make us do anything, but he sure likes to help us along the pathway to poor decisions, Bubba.

[Chan]

You know very well that the motive for her starting that "Dear Rhona" thread was to be a beacon of hope and healing to anyone in the community that was looking to find good ideas and words of encouragement.Yes, that was the motive and there is nothing wrong with that. But her "beacon of hope and healing" is based not in Christ and His word but in a wicked worldly philosopy, i.e. psychology.


The motive of the thread was obvious and so it did not need anyone policing over it. For those that can do without her advice, they can simply move on to the next thread. There are many threads set up with the motive to strike up a debate, bring out the swords and the guns or whatever and that is fine...but this was not one of them.
The problem wasn't with the purpose of the thread, it was that she was offering advice based on a wicked worldly philosophy (psychology). Worldly philosophies or (as Paul put it in 1 Corinthians) "wisdom" has no place in the Church. The only valid source of wisdom is God and His word.
If anyone had a sincere desire to question any particular advice, then it could have been done in a civil and unaggressive manner. Instead, the thugs came in with their daggers and knives and machetes with the sole purpose of cutting deep into her emotions like wimps. And since the theme on AFF the past 3 days have been about analyzing people's personality trait, here is my analysis...these thugs that picked on Rhona are the same clowns who were bullied in school and were made fun of and now are taking a vengeance and looking for retribution. Yeah...a silly analysis, but I figured I'd plug it in. :tease No one was trying to do anything to Rhoni's emotions. She needs to stop taking attacks on her worldly philosophy as attacks on her personally. She is NOT her worldly philosophy and she is NOT her profession.

BTW, I don't remember who said what in her post and don't know if you were one of them, I just know that there was a collectivity and not just one individual.Maybe you should go back and read exactly what was said and note the context in which it was said (as well as Rhoni's own comments).

Yes, pathetic is the word that came to my mind too when I saw these cowards doing what they did on her thread.There is nothing cowardly about challenging false doctrine and worldly philosophies.

[Chan]

Notice anyone missing here, Chan? :tease

The devil doesn't make us do anything, but he sure likes to help us along the pathway to poor decisions, Bubba.Now you're starting to get it! It's about time!

Yes, Satan roams like a roaring lion seeking whom he may devour but he doesn't force us to do anything.

[SDG]

Oh boy...

[Nahum]

Originally Posted by Chan:
There is nothing cowardly about challenging false doctrine and worldly philosophies.

You mean like humanism which teaches we are exempt from supernatural influences?

[Nahum]

Now you're starting to get it! It's about time!

Yes, Satan roams like a roaring lion seeking whom he may devour but he doesn't force us to do anything.

You are so frustrating. You would argue with a fence post! :ranting

Of course, the fence post would win.

[SDG]

You mean like humanism which teaches we are exempt from supernatural influences?

Or humanism taught in Bible schools about 4 astrological personalities that are God ordained.

[Chan]

Ring around the rosie again Chanie-baby?
Go back and read the entire thread, Oh Wise One. Sorry to bore you with facts. Tell me, if I said the sky was blue, would you disagree with me?
You WILL stop with playing around with my name!

No, you have not presented any "facts."

And, YES, I would disagree with you if you said the sky was blue. The truth of the matter is that it only looks blue: the chemicals that comprise our atmosphere have no color.

http://www.sciencemadesimple.com/sky_blue.html

[Chan]

You mean like humanism which teaches we are exempt from supernatural influences?Humanism teaches essentially that there are no supernatural influences, not that we're exempt from them. NOT that anyone here has actually said anything even remotely resembling being exempt from supernatural influences.

[MissBrattified]

So you think its all right to tell someone they are of the devil? That would be blunt and straightforward.

No, I didn't say harsh and malicious. I think Chan is way over the top with his persistence on this particular note, and I've stated so in the past. It's enough to state your views once and let them be heard. However, in spite of his brusque nature, I respect his intelligence, and appreciate his contributions. But what does Chancellor have to do with Coonskinner and rrford?

Why are they all being lumped together? I disagree with Rhoni on a number of issues. Does that mean I'm also going to be called harsh?

Chancellor posted his disagreements in the same way, in the same fashion, with the same persistence and frequency on the NFCF and FCF. It's to be expected. So I am not even addressing his posts in my assessment of the thread.

Heated disagreement does not equate abuse. That's just my opinion. I'm straightforward and blunt, but I do not believe I have ever posted a single post that could be called abusive, and I certainly have never posted a single post that I am ashamed of. And yet, there are probably some who would label me as a Big Fat Meanie, and when they do I say "go ahead", because I like the way I post, and if that makes me a BFM then I embrace the term, because I believe I am a godly person and my posts reflect it.

I think it's great that you and Daniel and J-Roc have decided to be Rhoni's defenders, and I assume you feel she is a damsel in distress. Be her heroes. Go for it. Just don't be upset when others don't hold the universal opinion that you are being heroic.

Just to clarify, previously I had only skimmed a few posts on the thread, and this morning I only read a couple, as I stated to you in PM. However, I have spent the last 45 minutes reading the thread more thoroughly, particularly posts by CS, rrford, Malvaro and Rhoni's responses to them, so I think I'm qualified to offer my opinion.

My sympathies don't really lie with Rhoni here. Does that mean I'm a meanie? :dunno

[Nahum]

You WILL stop with playing around with my name!

No, you have not presented any "facts."

And, YES, I would disagree with you if you said the sky was blue. The truth of the matter is that it only looks blue: the chemicals that comprise our atmosphere have no color.

http://www.sciencemadesimple.com/sky_blue.html

I'm so sorry. What is your name today?

I think you just love disagreement.

[Nahum]

No, I didn't say harsh and malicious. I think Chan is way over the top with his persistence. It's enough to state your views once and let them be heard. But what does Chancellor have to do with Coonskinner and rrford?

Why are they all being lumped together? I disagree with Rhoni on a number of issues. Does that mean I'm also going to be called harsh?

Chancellor posted his disagreements in the same way, in the same fashion, with the same persistence and frequency on the NFCF and FCF. It's to be expected. So I am not even addressing his posts in my assessment of the thread.

Heated disagreement does not equate abuse. That's just my opinion. I'm straightforward and blunt, but I do not believe I have ever posted a single post that could be called abusive, and I certainly have never posted a single post that I am ashamed of. And yet, there are probably some who would label me as a Big Fat Meanie, and when they do I say "go ahead", because I like the way I post, and if that makes me a BFM then I embrace the term, because I believe I am a godly person and my posts reflect it.

I think it's great that you and Daniel and J-Roc have decided to be Rhoni's defenders, and I assume you feel she is a damsel in distress. Be her heroes. Go for it. Just don't be upset when others don't hold the universal opinion that you are being heroic.

Just to clarify, previously I had only skimmed a few posts on the thread, and this morning I only read a couple, as I stated to you in PM. However, I have spent the last 45 minutes reading the thread more thoroughly, particularly posts by CS, rrford, Malvaro and Rhoni's responses to them, so I think I'm qualified to offer my opinion.

My sympathies don't really lie with Rhoni here. Does that mean I'm a meanie? :dunno

No, from what I see you're rather perceptive. I am nobody's hero.

[SDG]

Has nothing to do with Rhoni ... although she is being attacked ....B ... there is a pattern of behavior I am reacting to ... 'nuff said.

[Chan]

So you think its all right to tell someone they are of the devil? That would be blunt and straightforward.Only if you are omniscient and know absolutely that the person really is "of the devil."

[J-Roc]

Yes, that was the motive and there is nothing wrong with that. But her "beacon of hope and healing" is based not in Christ and His word but in a wicked worldly philosopy, i.e. psychology.

The problem wasn't with the purpose of the thread, it was that she was offering advice based on a wicked worldly philosophy (psychology). Worldly philosophies or (as Paul put it in 1 Corinthians) "wisdom" has no place in the Church. The only valid source of wisdom is God and His word.
No one was trying to do anything to Rhoni's emotions. She needs to stop taking attacks on her worldly philosophy as attacks on her personally. She is NOT her worldly philosophy and she is NOT her profession.

Maybe you should go back and read exactly what was said and note the context in which it was said (as well as Rhoni's own comments).

There is nothing cowardly about challenging false doctrine and worldly philosophies.


You act as if everything that involves the study of psychology is wicked...we all went and got degrees from schools that teach this supposed "wickedness" and we all know how to retain the good...I'd give her the benefit of the doubt that she too knows how to separate the good from the bad....so let's put down our crucifix and take a chill pill.

[MissBrattified]

No, from what I see you're rather perceptive. I am nobody's hero.

Well, I disagree with you. We're all heroes to someone. :highfive I think it's heroic for a man to jump in to defend a woman, even if he's a bit misguided.

Case In Point: :heeheehee

Misguided Hero (http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/02/22/porn.sword.ap/index.html)

[SDG]

You act as if everything that involves the study of psychology is wicked...we all went and got degrees from schools that teach this supposed "wickedness" and we all know how to retain the good...I'd give her the benefit of the doubt that she too knows how to separate the good from the bad....so let's put down our crucifix and take a chill pill.

Paul quoted Greek philosophers ....

[Nahum]

Only if you are omniscient and know absolutely that the person really is "of the devil."

What if I'm just really pretty sure? Would it be okay then?

Like uhm, child molesters, are they of the devil?
What about murderers? Rapists? Backbiters?

Are we really totally unable to discern spirits?

[J-Roc]

Only if you are omniscient and know absolutely that the person really is "of the devil."

You dont need to be all-knowing to determine the works of satan. Some of his footprints are elephant footprints and many are very subtle and hidden....

[Coonskinner]

Paul quoted Greek philosophers ....

But he didn't propose that they formed the basis for a "ministry."

[Chan]

You dont need to be all-knowing to determine the works of satan. Some of his footprints are elephant footprints and many are very subtle and hidden....
But you do have to be all-knowing before you have sufficient knowledge to say a particular PERSON is "of the devil."

[Nahum]

But you do have to be all-knowing before you have sufficient knowledge to say a particular PERSON is "of the devil."

So now you don't believe in the gift of discernment?

What about Peter, Ananias, and Sapphira?

[Chan]

What if I'm just really pretty sure? Would it be okay then?

Like uhm, child molesters, are they of the devil?
What about murderers? Rapists? Backbiters?

Are we really totally unable to discern spirits?If you're calling sins that people commit "spirits," then I'd say you are unable to discern spirits. People choose to sin. It is their nature to sin. For unsaved folks, Satan doesn't have to do anything to prod or encourage them to sin. It's with the saved folks that Satan has to prod and poke and do other things to try to get them to sin. Why is it different for saved folks than unsaved folks? Because saved folks have the Spirit of God dwelling in them conforming them to His image. This creates within us a battle ground and Satan is on the side of our flesh (sinful nature).

[MissBrattified]

But you do have to be all-knowing before you have sufficient knowledge to say a particular PERSON is "of the devil."

I'm not sure I agree, Chan. I person identifies who they are "of" or "for" through their actions. A godly person can be said to be "of god", and a sinful person can be said to be "of the devil."

I have met people who I knew were possessed of a devil, because the Spirit in me bore witness of that fact. I have met folks who I could say for certain were evil, without knowing what particular form of evil they were involved in. We can't discount spiritual sensitivity.

[Nahum]

BTW, who said anything about persons here? We are talking about comments, and their origins.

Come on Chan, get with the program.

[Chan]

So now you don't believe in the gift of discernment?

What about Peter, Ananias, and Sapphira?I do believe in the gift of discernment. I just don't believe that gift extends to being able to say a person is "of the devil" (as opposed to what a person says or believes being of the devil). As for Peter, Ananias and Sapphira, Peter never said they were of the devil, he only asked why Satan has filled their hearts so as to lead them to lie to the Holy Ghost. Satan didn't force them to lie, they chose to do it. Did Satan entice them to do it? Certainly, but the choice to lie was still theirs and they made that choice. Notice that God's response was not to go after Satan but to take the lives of Ananias and Sapphira. God obviously knew that Ananias and Sapphira were responsible for their own actions.

[whollyHis]

I think all of hell is laughing because of the time this thread has taken from some folks' day today...JMHO

[Chan]

BTW, who said anything about persons here? We are talking about comments, and their origins.

Come on Chan, get with the program.You did...here:

"So you think its all right to tell someone they are of the devil? That would be blunt and straightforward."

[J-Roc]

But you do have to be all-knowing before you have sufficient knowledge to say a particular PERSON is "of the devil."


Okay...we disagree then. That's fine.

[SDG]

But he didn't propose that they formed the basis for a "ministry."

If I study World Religions or anthropology in college does it mean I cannot use some of my experiences and eduacation as a Minister of the Gospel ... CC... I think no one would deny the counseling should be bible-based but to say that we can't learn from the secular world is to be oblivious ....

[Chan]

I'm not sure I agree, Chan. I person identifies who they are "of" or "for" through their actions. A godly person can be said to be "of god", and a sinful person can be said to be "of the devil."

I have met people who I knew were possessed of a devil, because the Spirit in me bore witness of that fact. I have met folks who I could say for certain were evil, without knowing what particular form of evil they were involved in. We can't discount spiritual sensitivity.
There's a difference between being possessed by demons and someone being "of" the devil. The point of the matter is, though, that we must not be so quick to go around accusing people of being "of the devil," particularly people in whom the Spirit of God resides.

[Praxeas]

I do believe in the gift of discernment. I just don't believe that gift extends to being able to say a person is "of the devil" (as opposed to what a person says or believes being of the devil). As for Peter, Ananias and Sapphira, Peter never said they were of the devil, he only asked why Satan has filled their hearts so as to lead them to lie to the Holy Ghost. Satan didn't force them to lie, they chose to do it. Did Satan entice them to do it? Certainly, but the choice to lie was still theirs and they made that choice. Notice that God's response was not to go after Satan but to take the lives of Ananias and Sapphira. God obviously knew that Ananias and Sapphira were responsible for their own actions.
Sounds like semantics here....it really comes down to what does each person mean by "of the devil"

[MissBrattified]

There's a difference between being possessed by demons and someone being "of" the devil. The point of the matter is, though, that we must not be so quick to go around accusing people of being "of the devil," particularly people in whom the Spirit of God resides.

Well, this part I agree with!

I also agree with Prax...it's semantics to a point....:dunno

[Nahum]

You did...here:

"So you think its all right to tell someone they are of the devil? That would be blunt and straightforward."

Maybe you need to enroll in the Evelyn Wood speed reading program.

IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII never said any person was of the devil. I simply asked a question. Get it?

[MissBrattified]

Am I the only one finding this thread humorous? :heeheehee

[Chan]

You act as if everything that involves the study of psychology is wicked...we all went and got degrees from schools that teach this supposed "wickedness" and we all know how to retain the good...I'd give her the benefit of the doubt that she too knows how to separate the good from the bad....so let's put down our crucifix and take a chill pill.Psychology is a worldly philosophy. Because it is a worldly philosophy, that makes it wicked (because it is worldly wisdom originating in a wicked world). There is nothing good in any worldly philosophy/wisdom. Paul said that the wisdom of this world (which would include psychology) is foolishness to God. That being the case, there is no place for worldly wisdom in the Church.

[Nahum]

Am I the only one finding this thread humorous? :heeheehee

No, all of a sudden I find it quite enjoyable. :bliss

[berkeley]

luks like I missed somethin

[SDG]

Psychology is a worldly philosophy. Because it is a worldly philosophy, that makes it wicked (because it is worldly wisdom originating in a wicked world). There is nothing good in any worldly philosophy/wisdom. Paul said that the wisdom of this world (which would include psychology) is foolishness to God. That being the case, there is no place for worldly wisdom in the Church.

Capture this ... Chan ... biology teaches evolution should an Apostolic teacher or doctor
not study biology ????

[Nahum]

Psychology is a worldly philosophy. Because it is a worldly philosophy, that makes it wicked (because it is worldly wisdom originating in a wicked world). There is nothing good in any worldly philosophy/wisdom. Paul said that the wisdom of this world (which would include psychology) is foolishness to God. That being the case, there is no place for worldly wisdom in the Church.


So what about CPA's and lawyers?
Should we not hire them to help us with church matters?

[Rhoni]

For Miss Brattified: This is the quotes of RRFPRD and you tell me if you think it is personal or about the subject of studying psychology...

Probably because those folks do not get so self-involved in their threads. Not do they have the majority of posts on thier threads. Go figure...

Not unlike the majority of yours or anyone else' who have started a thread...

Take things for what they are? Who ever heard of an internet counsellor? I don't know who has the bigger issue, the counsellro or the counsellee.


Read the disclaimer on the thread...I never claimed to be the AFF counsleor...this is where you push your own agenda...

Rhoni, it is too bad you cannot find a church to let you practice your particular ministry.

The last three churches I have been a member of, including the present one...I do counsleing in...so I am not sure why you think I have no place to practice...again your own agneda to make others think a lie.

It is tto bad that some would question your ability to effectively counsel.

You know nothing of my ability to counsel! Again wanting others to believe a lie.


But don't ever forget you are the one who put out way too many personal details of your life to be taken overly seriously when it comes to counselling.

Personal details of everyone's life is posted along with pictures on the thread...shall we name names? Is there ar eason why I am singled out...maybe you have issues with me?

I am not against PROFESSIONAL counselling. I have recommended folks that I pastor to seek such. I am well aware of my deficincies

Have I ever pointed out your deficiencies? I don't know you and know nothing of your ability or lack of ability to counsel but you know so much about mine...go figure...

. But believe it or not Rhoni it is really, really hard to argue against the working of the Spirit in people's lives. If we elevate counselling above that then we have denigrated the Spirit.


This is a bold faced lie...I am all about the spirit moving in people's lives. You have told a lie about me...


And I will totally concur with CS. You cheap shot at Pastor's is standard practice.

ANOther lie

Perhaps this is due to some latent hostitlities of a past ministry that went awry?

You again have told an untruth - you know nothing of my past ministry or my present ministry!

Perhaps your aggravation with males is due to a failed relationship somewhat of your own doing?

And which relationship would that be? You trying to tell more stories?peanut butter and jelly sandwiches, aka..lies

You see, we all have problems and they can, and do, affect our judgments. Just don't be surprised when folks call your hand on them.

And you are my judge? Who died and made you God?

Now if anyone cannot see this was a personal attack then you are deluded and believe a lie!

[J-Roc]

Satan didn't force them to lie, they chose to do it. Did Satan entice them to do it? Certainly, but the choice to lie was still theirs and they made that choice..


I understand your desire not to make satan out to be overly powerful, but I think you are doing it at the cost of making him out to be very wimpy. I've seen the strength of his power when working with a demon-possessed friend and I was literally dealing with two different characters and the battle with the two identities was clearly evident...in one voice my friend was pleading me for help and in another demonic voice he opposed me. The stronghold was evident and there was no denying the power of it!

[Nahum]

Whoops! I think I'll be leaving now.

[SDG]

Hmmm ... this is not about psychology is it ...??? Rhoni????

[Chan]

If I study World Religions or anthropology in college does it mean I cannot use some of my experiences and eduacation as a Minister of the Gospel ... CC... I think no one would deny the counseling should be bible-based but to say that we can't learn from the secular world is to be oblivious ....
No one said we can't learn from the secular world. However, we also can't take worldly wisdom, values, beliefs, philosophies (such as psychology) and bring them into the Church as if they were Truth. Bringing psychology into the Church is like bringing the philosophies of Plato or Nietzche or Ayn Rand or Bertrand Russell into the Church or like bringing in evolution as a theory of origins or bringing in Buddhism or Taoism.

Worldly philosophies are not entitled to consideration as absolute truth (not that there's any other kind of truth). Not even "science," which even most Christians seem to accept without question, is entitled to the elevated status of absolute truth.

[J-Roc]

There's a difference between being possessed by demons and someone being "of" the devil. The point of the matter is, though, that we must not be so quick to go around accusing people of being "of the devil," particularly people in whom the Spirit of God resides.


I agree with this.

[berkeley]

Hmmm ... this is not about psychology is it ...??? Rhoni????
Bruddah... what I miss??

[Rhoni]

Hmmm ... this is not about psychology is it ...??? Rhoni????


Not a bit...:drawguns :ty

[Chan]

I understand your desire not to make satan out to be overly powerful, but I think you are doing it at the cost of making him out to be very wimpy. I've seen the strength of his power when working with a demon-possessed friend and I was literally dealing with two different characters and the battle with the two identities was clearly evident...in one voice my friend was pleading me for help and in another demonic voice he opposed me. The stronghold was evident and there was no denying the power of it!Satan is certainly not "wimpy" but he really does not have any power over the Christian that the Christian does not allow him to have.

I don't deny that there is such a thing as demon possession (I'd better not deny it, the Bible makes it abundantly clear that it exists) but I don't think that's what we're talking about here.

[Chan]

Hmmm ... this is not about psychology is it ...??? Rhoni????No, it's about people being accused of being used by the devil.

[J-Roc]

Psychology is a worldly philosophy. Because it is a worldly philosophy, that makes it wicked (because it is worldly wisdom originating in a wicked world). There is nothing good in any worldly philosophy/wisdom. Paul said that the wisdom of this world (which would include psychology) is foolishness to God. That being the case, there is no place for worldly wisdom in the Church.


Now this is too extreme, brutha.

[Praxeas]

For Miss Brattified: This is the quotes of RRFPRD and you tell me if you think it is personal or about the subject of studying psychology...



Not unlike the majority of yours or anyone else' who have started a thread...



Read the disclaimer on the thread...I never claimed to be the AFF counsleor...this is where you push your own agenda...



The last three churches I have been a member of, including the present one...I do counsleing in...so I am not sure why you think I have no place to practice...again your own agneda to make others think a lie.



You know nothing of my ability to counsel! Again wanting others to believe a lie.




Personal details of everyone's life is posted along with pictures on the thread...shall we name names? Is there ar eason why I am singled out...maybe you have issues with me?



Have I ever pointed out your deficiencies? I don't know you and know nothing of your ability or lack of ability to counsel but you know so much about mine...go figure...



This is a bold faced lie...I am all about the spirit moving in people's lives. You have told a lie about me...




ANOther lie



You again have told an untruth - you know nothing of my past ministry or my present ministry!



And which relationship would that be? You trying to tell more stories?peanut butter and jelly sandwiches, aka..lies



And you are my judge? Who died and made you God?

Now if anyone cannot see this was a personal attack then you are deluded and believe a lie!

Sister. You are letting them get to you. Let them think and believe what they want.

A heart specialist studies the heart. A psychologist studies the mind. There is nothing wrong with counseling and I have known churches, including UPCs that have on staff a professional counselor.

That doesn't mean though that I buy into the whole psychological field of study, but clearly it's NOT evil to counsel someone for their problems and it would be even more advantageous to do so from a biblical perspective

[Chan]

So what about CPA's and lawyers?
Should we not hire them to help us with church matters?
What part of "philosophy" did you NOT understand? I really wish you'd actually read what's written instead of trying to read things into it.

[Chan]

Now this is too extreme, brutha.
As extreme as light is from darkness. Hmmm, didn't Jesus say something about His disciples being the light of the world?

[SDG]

No, it's about people being accused of being used by the devil.

No it's an assumption that if somehow someone studied psychology or basketweaving ... they don't have the giftings to counsel using the Word of God because a select few have declared it so ....

{Help you Berk???}

[J-Roc]

THE TRUTH IS INCONTROVERTIBLE...MALICE MAY ATTACK, IGNORANCE MAY DERIDE IT, BUT IN THE END THERE IT IS!






For Miss Brattified: This is the quotes of RRFPRD and you tell me if you think it is personal or about the subject of studying psychology...



Not unlike the majority of yours or anyone else' who have started a thread...






The last three churches I have been a member of, including the present one...I do counsleing in...so I am not sure why you think I have no place to practice...again your own agneda to make others think a lie.



You know nothing of my ability to counsel! Again wanting others to believe a lie.




Personal details of everyone's life is posted along with pictures on the thread...shall we name names? Is there ar eason why I am singled out...maybe you have issues with me?



Have I ever pointed out your deficiencies? I don't know you and know nothing of your ability or lack of ability to counsel but you know so much about mine...go figure...



This is a bold faced lie...I am all about the spirit moving in people's lives. You have told a lie about me...




ANOther lie



You again have told an untruth - you know nothing of my past ministry or my present ministry!



And which relationship would that be? You trying to tell more stories?peanut butter and jelly sandwiches, aka..lies



And you are my judge? Who died and made you God?

Now if anyone cannot see this was a personal attack then you are deluded and believe a lie!

[Nahum]

Originally Posted by Chan:
That being the case, there is no place for worldly wisdom in the Church.

You're words dude. Keep up with the conversation, please?
Reminding you of what you posted gets a little old.

You said worldly wisdom.

[Chan]

Capture this ... Chan ... biology teaches evolution should an Apostolic teacher or doctor
not study biology ????Biology is not philosophy and not all schools that teach biology teach it from an evolutionary perspective.

You really need to go back and read what I posted. I specifically referred to worldly philosophy/wisdom, not to things like biology, law, accounting, etc. that are not philosophy/wisdom.

[Chan]

You're words dude. Keep up with the conversation, please?
Reminding you of what you posted gets a little old.

You said worldly wisdom.Yes, I did say that. Maybe you should go learn what it means.

[SDG]

Sister. You are letting them get to you. Let them think and believe what they want.

A heart specialist studies the heart. A psychologist studies the mind. There is nothing wrong with counseling and I have known churches, including UPCs that have on staff a professional counselor.

That doesn't mean though that I buy into the whole psychological field of study, but clearly it's NOT evil to counsel someone for their problems and it would be even more advantageous to do so from a biblical perspective

Some would rather teach a canned occult theory form of pop psychology than examine research based theories ... of Skinner, Glasser, Gardner, Piaget ... which by the way only can only glorify God's creation by their findings.

[MissBrattified]

Rhoni,

Then I guess I am deluded and believing a lie, because I don't believe for a moment that RRFord and Coonskinner have it in for you. I do believe that they disagree with what you are doing, and they point it out whenever they feel like it.

So do I, come to think of it (point out what I disagree with when I feel like it). So just lump me in with them.

I personally think you are way too sensitive to be participating in these online forums. You consistently are deeply offended, and usually by comments that are no different from what is offered to every other person. In other words, what I would say to you when I disagree is no different than what I would say to Pastor Poster, Chan, Coonskinner, Felicity or anyone else, e.g., I'm not picking on you.

I haven't seen inconsistency from these men. Chan calls it like he sees it all the time, on every topic that interests him, no matter who authored the first post. He's disagreed with me quite vehemently before, and I don't recall taking it personally. He has the right to think what he thinks and state what he thinks, just like you do.

Coonskinner was quite amiable in his first few posts on your thread. Then he happened to disagree with some of your advice offered, and suddenly he was Public Enemy No. 1.

What I object to from you is this constantly offered up problem of being picked on and victimized and mistreated, allegedly in a way no one else is subjected to, and I just don't see it. I think there are a myriad of posting styles and points of view and they are all worth hearing, including yours, but you seem to only want to hear the ones that agree with you, and if anyone posts something in disagreement, you respond defensively rather than intellectually, which really doesn't work in a productive manner.

You seem to always feel you are being judged, when, again, folks simply disagree with you. Instead of supporting your points, defending your arguments and propping up your perspectives, you spend your time being offended and stating how offended you are, and then you are even more offended when some people find that sort of response discredits you overall.

[Chan]

No it's an assumption that if somehow someone studied psychology or basketweaving ... they don't have the giftings to counsel using the Word of God because a select few have declared it so ....

{Help you Berk???}Talk about reading INTO things! It has nothing to do with merely studying psychology (a form of worldly wisdom), it has to do with being a practitioner of it and trying to force it into the Church. But this thread is about being accused of being used by the devil.

[MissBrattified]

THE TRUTH IS INCONTROVERTIBLE...MALICE MAY ATTACK, IGNORANCE MAY DERIDE IT, BUT IN THE END THERE IT IS!

The problem here is that a "response" is not the same as an "attack", and the two are being made equivalent.

[SDG]

Rhoni,

Then I guess I am deluded and believing a lie, because I don't believe for a moment that RRFord and Coonskinner have it out for you. I do believe that they disagree with what you are doing, and they point it out whenever they feel like it.

So do I, come to think of it (point out what I disagree with when I feel like it). So just lump me in with them.

I personally think you are way too sensitive to be participating in these online forums. You consistently are deeply offended, and usually by comments that are no different from what is offered to every other person. In other words, what I would say to you when I disagree is no different than what I would say to Pastor Poster, Chan, Coonskinner, Felicity or anyone else, e.g., I'm not picking on you.

I haven't seen inconsistency from these men. Chan calls it like he sees it all the time, on every topic that interests him, no matter who authored the first post. He's disagreed with me quite vehemently before, and I don't recall taking it personally. He has the right to think what he thinks and state what he thinks, just like you do.

Coonskinner was quite amiable in his first few posts on your thread. Then he happened to disagree with some of your advice offered, and suddenly he was Public Enemy No. 1.

What I object to from you is this constantly offered up problem of being picked on and victimized and mistreated, allegedly in a way no one else is subjected to, and I just don't see it. I think there are a myriad of posting styles and points of view and they are all worth hearing, including yours, but you seem to only want to hear the ones that agree with you, and if anyone posts something in disagreement, you respond defensively rather than intellectually, which really doesn't work in a productive manner.

You seem to always feel you are being judged, when, again, folks simply disagree with you. Instead of supporting your points, defending your arguments and propping up your perspectives, you spend your time being offended and stating how offended you are, and then you are even more offended when some people find that sort of response discredits you overall.

The answer is simple ... if you don't like Dear Rhoni ... don't read it .. but to dedicate man hours into somehow discrediting it ... is transparent in its real motives.

[SDG]

Talk about reading INTO things! It has nothing to do with merely studying psychology (a form of worldly wisdom), it has to do with being a practitioner of it and trying to force it into the Church. But this thread is about being accused of being used by the devil.

Chan ...you know that there are two strands of conversation in this thread .. the title is irrelevant .. own up to it.

[whollyHis]

Can a Holy Ghost filled person allow themselves to be a 'tool' for the enemy??? Can they be used to promote division and such in the Body???

[Chan]

A heart specialist studies the heart. A psychologist studies the mind. There is nothing wrong with counseling and I have known churches, including UPCs that have on staff a professional counselor.

That doesn't mean though that I buy into the whole psychological field of study, but clearly it's NOT evil to counsel someone for their problems and it would be even more advantageous to do so from a biblical perspectivePsychology is not merely a study of the mind, it's a study based in wordly philosophies. As for counseling, that's what we have pastors, elders and mature saints for. You cannot mix psychology with the Bible any more than you can mix what is unholy with what is holy.

[MissBrattified]

The answer is simple ... if you don't like Dear Rhoni ... don't read it .. but to dedicate man hours into somehow discrediting it ... is transparent in its real motives.

Oh, come on, Daniel. That isn't the way a forum works. You don't avoid the threads you disagree with. You respond to the threads you disagree with, and that's what keeps the conversation going.

I personally don't normally read "Dear Rhoni", but because this conversation came up this morning, I decided to read it more thoroughly so I could comment with some level of intelligence. I have been posting online with Rhoni far longer than you have, so in many ways you speak of that which you know not.

[Chan]

Chan ...you know that there are two strands of conversation in this thread .. the title is irrelevant .. own up to it.Just trying to separate the two.

[Chan]

Can a Holy Ghost filled person allow themselves to be a 'tool' for the enemy??? Can they be used to promote division and such in the Body???
Yes.

[Michlow]

I find this all very very sad. And now I remember why I don't come around very much anymore. :ignore

[SDG]

Psychology is not merely a study of the mind, it's a study based in wordly philosophies. As for counseling, that's what we have pastors, elders and mature saints for. You cannot mix psychology with the Bible any more than you can mix what is unholy with what is holy.

Chan ... when's the last time you sat in an Apostolic bible school that teaches medieval pyschology ... it's done ...

I've sat in psychology classes ... and have able to retain the good ... especially when I look at how awesome its Creator is ....

[J-Roc]

The problem here is that a "response" is not the same as an "attack", and the two are being made equivalent.

I think the quotes she listed are self-evident and display the motives in their heart. They were the words of cowards. :dunno

[Nahum]

Yes, I did say that. Maybe you should go learn what it means.

I'm sorry, I assumed you meant what you actually wrote.
I guess I really do need the gift of discernment when talking to you.

[Chan]

Chan ... when's the last time you sat in an Apostolic bible school that teaches medieval pyschology ... it's done ...

I've sat in psychology classes ... and have able to retain the good ... especially when I look at how awesome its Creator is ....There is nothing good in psychology and God did not create it!

[SDG]

Oh, come on, Daniel. That isn't the way a forum works. You don't avoid the threads you disagree with. You respond to the threads you disagree with, and that's what keeps the conversation going.

I personally don't normally read "Dear Rhoni", but because this conversation came up this morning, I decided to read it more thoroughly so I could comment with some level of intelligence. I have been posting online with Rhoni far longer than you have, so in many ways you speak of that which you know not.

And it's apparent that a select few have an agenda to discredit ... as evidenced today and in the past ... IMHO

[SDG]

There is nothing good in psychology and God did not create it!

God didn't create the mind ???... or the person attempting to study it .... ???Hellooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

[Nahum]

Can a Holy Ghost filled person allow themselves to be a 'tool' for the enemy??? Can they be used to promote division and such in the Body???

Yes.

[Chan]

I'm sorry, I assumed you meant what you actually wrote.
I guess I really do need the gift of discernment when talking to you.I did mean exactly what I wrote. Your question about CPAs suggests that you were thinking I meant something else.

[Chan]

God didn't create the mind ???... or the person attempting to study it .... ???HelloooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooPs ychology is not the mind and psychology is not the person studying the mind.

[J-Roc]

Oh, come on, Daniel. That isn't the way a forum works. You don't avoid the threads you disagree with. You respond to the threads you disagree with, and that's what keeps the conversation going.

I personally don't normally read "Dear Rhoni", but because this conversation came up this morning, I decided to read it more thoroughly so I could comment with some level of intelligence. I have been posting online with Rhoni far longer than you have, so in many ways you speak of that which you know not.


And I can sense the subtle animosity also...but it is displayed so prim and proper.

[Chan]

Yes.Be careful, you and I are in agreement on this one. What's that going to do to your reputation?

[Nahum]

I did mean exactly what I wrote. Your question about CPAs suggests that you were thinking I meant something else.

No, I was thinking you meant wordly wisdom. Did you mean worldly wisdom? Becuase that's what you wrote. If you meant worldly philosophy, that would be fine, just go back and change your post to worldly philosophy.

CPA's operate from a certain business philosophy. Would that be a worldly philosophy in the church?

[MissBrattified]

And I can sense the subtle animosity also...but it is displayed so prim and proper.

Your sensors are off. I don't hold any animosity toward Rhoni. *shrug* You mistake disagreement with her perspectives and views as animosity, and that's your prerogative. (To be mistaken.) :dunno

As for prim and proper...I do try to mind my manners. Disagreements can be made civilly or maliciously, and I choose the former method. :ty

[SDG]

Psychology is not the mind and psychology is not the person studying the mind.

Big red truck ... it's the study of the mind ... neurologists, psychologists, pyschiatrist ... study the mind and brain ... C'mon Chan ... you're beating a dead horse ... you attacked Rhoni on what you pre-supposed as her affinity to practice psychology ... and in fact she is espousing bible base counseling while using her secular education as a supplement.

[SDG]

No, I was thinking you meant wordly wisdom. Did you mean worldly wisdom? Becuase that's what you wrote. If you meant worldly philosophy, that would be fine, just go back and change your post to worldly philosophy.

CPA's operate from a certain business philosophy. Would that be a worldly philosophy in the church?

Yep .. various theories to economics ....

[J-Roc]

Psychology is not the mind and psychology is not the person studying the mind.


you're falling too in love with the exactness of what people say...step back and decipher what their implication is...that's more fun of an approach to the mental gymnastics, isn't it?

[Tina]

Due to the fact that the Dear Rhoni thread was locked earlier in the day by Admin, and comments from that thread have been brought here into this thread by Rhoni after Admin locked the thread asking that it not be carried elsewhere on the forum, I am going to lock this thread temporarily until the rest of the admin team can review it and make a decision on whether it needs to be reopened.