Apostolic Friends Forum - Why I break the law

Apostolic Friends Forum (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/index.php)

- Fellowship Hall (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=7)

- - Why I break the law (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/showthread.php?t=16579)

Pleroo translates Malei; Malei means affirm

You mention several things in this thread about Jesus giving new laws to replace old ones, new contracts replacing old contracts, people living according to a strict list of do’s and don’ts instead of faith in Him alone, and while some were looking for a book to throw at you, I found one: The Septuagint.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baron1710 (Post 523914)

He said he didn't come to abolish it but fulfill it. He fulfilled it. Fulfilled means to complete.

In English. Not in Semitic thought.

Pleroo is the word from Matthew 5:17 the English language translators translated into fulfill. The Greek translation of the Hebrew Scriptures is the Septuagint (LXX) and it translates the Hebrew word Malei nearly every time with the word Pleroo.
Malei means affirm or confirm.

Jesus came to affirm/confirm the Law, not make it complete as though YHVH had given something that was incomplete. Again, King David declared the Law to be perfect.

Jesus came to affirm/confirm the Law at the very least, especially in light of the two verses that follow.
In verse 18,

The Master states that not the smallest letter or stroke of a pen shall pass from Torah until all has been affirmed, and that hasn't happened yet, especially in light of a few Old Testament prophecies remaining unfilled.

In verse 19,

The Master exhorts His Disciples to be great in the Kingdom of Heaven by keeping the commandments and teaching others to do the same. He also states that the one who annuls the commandments and teaches others to do the same shall be least in the Kingdom. And you want to be known as a breaker of the Law?

A note: I have a Bible that was printed in Israel, with Hebrew on one side and NKJV on the other. What’s interesting is that they don’t use the word Malei for the Matthew 5:17 passage, but the word Qum. Qum means to do, to put into action.

Not only did Jesus not come to do away with Torah, but at the very least, Jesus came to affirm Torah. At best, He came to do Torah.

Shalom shalom, Baron.

Why I don't break the Law

Mr. Baron:

A sacrifice for sin was made once and for all. In this, you and I agree. Where we disagree is in the validity of Torah for all who believe in Jesus. Paul wrote in his second letter to Timothy that “…every Writing [is] God-breathed, and profitable for teaching, for conviction, for setting aright, for instruction that [is] in righteousness,…” (2Tim. 3:16 YLT) but Timothy didn’t have a copy of the New Testament, because it hadn’t been written yet. The only Scriptures that existed were the Hebrew Scriptures: your Torah and Old Testament, which is the Bible that Jesus, His Disciples, and the Apostle Paul read.

I can’t explain it any better than this, Baron. You stated in the very first post that people like me want to bring people like you under the curse of the Law, but you'll find in Deuteronomy that the Torah is a blessing to those who obey YHVH's Commandments and a curse to those who reject Him and His Commandments. Either YHVH’s Torah is something you will despise or embrace.

In two different parts of the Gospels, Jesus was asked, "What must I do to inherit eternal life?" His answer both times was, "obey the commandments." If the Commandments were bad, our Messiah would not have instructed people to obey them and He especially would not have instructed His Disciples to obey them and teach them to others.

I don't break the Law because it is YHVH's everlasting covenant between Him and His People: I am one of His people as a Natural branch of the Olive Tree of Israel and you are one of His as a grafted-in branch to the same tree.

May Yeshua, The Living Torah, reveal to you that the one who will endure will be the one who holds to the commandments of YHVH and to the testimony of Jesus. (Rev. 12:17 YLT, Rev. 14:12 YLT)

I have stated my position. I'm not a 'last word' type of person, so the last word is yours, Baron. Shalom shalom to you in the name above all names, the name that delivers, redeems, gives life, and saves like no other: the name of Jesus, known by His disciples as Yeshua, the Jewish Messiah.

Re: Why I break the law

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rico (Post 525843)

Weren't there provisions in the law for exemptions to working on the Sabbath, and example of which was an ox in a ditch?

Actually Rico that was a teaching of Jesus where he revealed the law more perfect which is what he came to do. There is only a few laws concerning the Sabbath. Teh rest are traditions of men added to the law which was against the law to do.

Re: Why I don't break the Law

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neubill (Post 547991)

Mr. Baron:

A sacrifice for sin was made once and for all. In this, you and I agree. Where we disagree is in the validity of Torah for all who believe in Jesus. Paul wrote in his second letter to Timothy that “…every Writing [is] God-breathed, and profitable for teaching, for conviction, for setting aright, for instruction that [is] in righteousness,…” (2Tim. 3:16 YLT) but Timothy didn’t have a copy of the New Testament, because it hadn’t been written yet. The only Scriptures that existed were the Hebrew Scriptures: your Torah and Old Testament, which is the Bible that Jesus, His Disciples, and the Apostle Paul read.

I can’t explain it any better than this, Baron. You stated in the very first post that people like me want to bring people like you under the curse of the Law, but you'll find in Deuteronomy that the Torah is a blessing to those who obey YHVH's Commandments and a curse to those who reject Him and His Commandments. Either YHVH’s Torah is something you will despise or embrace.

[B]In two different parts of the Gospels, Jesus was asked, "What must I do to inherit eternal life?" His answer both times was, "obey the commandments." If the Commandments were bad, our Messiah would not have instructed people to obey them and He especially would not have instructed His Disciples to obey them and teach them to others.[/B]
I don't break the Law because it is YHVH's everlasting covenant between Him and His People: I am one of His people as a Natural branch of the Olive Tree of Israel and you are one of His as a grafted-in branch to the same tree.

May Yeshua, The Living Torah, reveal to you that the one who will endure will be the one who holds to the commandments of YHVH and to the testimony of Jesus. (Rev. 12:17 YLT, Rev. 14:12 YLT)

I have stated my position. I'm not a 'last word' type of person, so the last word is yours, Baron. Shalom shalom to you in the name above all names, the name that delivers, redeems, gives life, and saves like no other: the name of Jesus, known by His disciples as Yeshua, the Jewish Messiah.

Now come on Neubill those a Jesus's words they don't matter. It's all about reading the word of God through twisted logic of Jewish haters. (Sarcasm)

Excellents points! Earth is still here and I don't know anywhere in the OT that the "law of God" would ever be done away with anytime soon.

Re: Why I break the law

Also the only people under a curse when it comes to the law are ones who do not obey it and those who think they are saved because of faithless works and think they are justified by them. To obey the law in itself to please God is not a curse.