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-   -   Did God use evolution to create life (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/showthread.php?t=31286)

coadie 08-23-2010 07:15 AM
Re: Did God use evolution to create life
 
Fairy tales for adults.

Quote:
The context of Sunderland’s letter to Patterson also needs to be remembered. He was simply asking why Patterson didn’t show even one single picture of any proposed transitional form anywhere in his book. Patterson’s reply made it abundantly clear that if he did, it would be storytelling, not science! In fact, he went on to say in his original letter to Sunderland:

‘It is easy enough to make up stories of how one form gave rise to another, and to find reasons why the stages should be favoured by natural selection. But such stories are not part of science, for there is no way of putting them to the test.’



Quote:
Note what Patterson said in his response to the anticreationist in question:

‘I seem fated continually to make a fool of myself with creationists. … I hope that by now I have learned to be more circumspect in dealing with creationists, cryptic or overt. But I still maintain that scepticism is the scientist’s duty, however much the stance may expose us to ridicule.

coadie 08-23-2010 07:31 AM
Re: Did God use evolution to create life
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfrog (Post 953981)
Abiogenesis is not the theory of evolution. Evolution doesn't need abiogenesis to be true before it can be true because they are two separate theories that deal with two separate things.

.
Actually you don't know what you are talking about. Abiogenesis is still being taught as a part of evolution theory. I see pretty much around 7 diifferent groups of evolutionists. How would you describe the group you fall into?

Charles Darwin "It is mere rubbish to talk about the origin of life; one might as well talk about the origin of matter."

Spontaneous generation of life was peaked in arguments about 5 years ago.
Most people studied using text books that pushed the Miller-Urey experiments. They were found to be false.

IN THE BEGINNING>

When the bishops from The first church of darwin claim the can explain species and life as we see it, I say start from the beginning. They won't because we all know they can't.
Now they say they never did push the theory of abiogenesis.
They lie.

"In tracking the emergence of the eukaryotic cell, one enters a kind of wonderland where scientific pursuit leads almost to fantasy. Cell and molecular biologists must construct cellular worlds in their own imaginations. ... Imagination, to some degree, is essential for grasping the key events in cellular history." -- B.D. Dyer and R.A. Obar, Tracing the History of Eukaryotic Cells, Columbia University Press 1994, pp. 2 & 3.

Imaginations?
Bible calls them sorcerors.

coadie 08-23-2010 07:59 AM
Re: Did God use evolution to create life
 
Evolution is baseless without a good theory of abiogenesis, which it does not have.

Quote:
The theory remains virtually unchanged since its inception in the 1920s, and assumes that life originated at some point in earth's past under conditions no longer present. The tenet of evolution can be summed-up by the phrase "abiogenesis at first biogenesis ever since". It is taught today as a certainty although the exact mechanisms remain theoretical. Discussions in evolutionary biology textbooks go to great lengths to demonstrate how abiogenesis could have occurred under multiple primordial scenarios.
How are we coming with a godless creation?

Quote:
It is also noteworthy that there is one aspect of evolution that is highly dependent on a theory of abiogenesis—universal common ancestry. There is absolutely no reason to believe that all life is descended from common ancestors unless it is predicated on a specific theory of abiogenesis. Think of it this way—why do evolutionists assume that multicellular life came from unicellular life? There's no fossil evidence of transition
http://www.nwcreation.net/abiogenesis.html

Just another reminder, We have fossils. We do not have old DNA or soft tissue that can be used to show or deny development of new organs and structures. It is all faith and wishfull thinking or sorcery as the bible calls it.

Aquila 08-23-2010 08:03 AM
Re: Did God use evolution to create life
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kristian's_mom (Post 953685)
Why should christians be so opposed to the idea of God using evolution to create life?

What do you think the scriptures mean by this:

Genesis 1-
20And God said, LET THE WATERS BRING FORTH ABUNDANTLY the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.

21And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, WHICH THE WATERS BROUGHT FORTH ABUNDANTLY, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good.


24And God said, LET THE EARTH BRING FORTH THE LIVING CREATURE after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so.
Personally, I don't believe in the Evolutionary Process, even if one claims it was God's "tool" to accomplish his goal. However, I know very faithful and spiritual Christians who believe this.

coadie 08-23-2010 08:14 AM
Re: Did God use evolution to create life
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquila (Post 953992)
Personally, I don't believe in the Evolutionary Process, even if one claims it was God's "tool" to accomplish his goal. However, I know very faithful and spiritual Christians who believe this.
Darwinism: Sorcery in the Classroom. In this well-researched work, Schroeder applies the same principle that works so successfully in his Creation Science Seminars.
I have taken 3 graduate classes in genetics from an Ivy League school. This book breaks it down for parents to discuss claims with students at their level.

I have enjoyed watching several church splits in The First Church of Darwin.
Withing 10 years, all the stuff they claim today will be counted as false and something niftier comes along.

Evolution claims matter and energy is self caused and by adding chance and time, we have complex life forms.

coadie 08-23-2010 08:53 AM
Re: Did God use evolution to create life
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Smith (Post 953860)
Surely you're sharp enough to consider the figurative nature of the word, "Day" and the considerable evidence that the word represents an "Age."
"Evidence" From a psychologist point of view, this is imagined and wishfull thinking. Since for it to be science, it would have to be observed.

I love the WORD. The serpent was the first example of claiming what God says was "figurative" in expression.
It turned out that God's word to Adam was not merely figurative.
Quote:
Genesis 3
1Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

2And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:

3But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.

4And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

5For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

Quote:
9And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
The serpent was the first apologist to tell us to NOT take the word litterally.
How did that work out?

Quote:
16And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:

Quote:
17But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.
5And all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years: and he died.
It appears Adam got the death sentence the day he sinned.

We have apologists today that follow the lead of the serpent and battle against a literal reading and understanding of Gods word whether it is history or instructions.

Truth. Were the first chapters of Genesis true or not?

coadie 08-23-2010 10:39 AM
Re: Did God use evolution to create life
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pelathais (Post 953937)
There is no "Darwinist" interpretation of the Bible. There are sound interpretations and there are unsound interpretations of the Bible.

A "sound interpretation" takes into account the fact that both the Bible's message is real and the world around us is real. The Bible's message is to impact the lives of people in this real world.

Creating a "just pretend" fantasy world will not impact people in the real world.
So under Neo darwinism, we must pretend that Adam was not formed from the earth and the spirit of life was not breathed into him?

7And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

Darwin as did Freud denied the existence of a soul.
The Materialist School began more than 2000 years before Darwin with Thales (640? - 546? BC), who was the founder of Greek philosophy.

http://www.edu365.cat

Jeremiah 1:5
Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.

Quote:
"The core of this synthetic theory restates the two most characteristic assertions of Darwin himself: first, that evolution is a two-stage process (random variation as raw material, natural selection as a directing force); secondly, that evolutionary change is generally slow, steady, gradual, and continuous. . . Orthodox neo-Darwinians extrapolate these even and continuous changes to the most profound structural transitions in life." (Gould 1980)
"I formed thee" contradicts "random variation"
The law of non contradiction. These expressions can't both be true.

Keep caging your bets and use the word "real" But is Darwinism True?
Was Darwins notion of gemmules true? Ooops.

In America they do not have classes covering evolution in medical schools. If it was both a science and it was relevant, I am sure there would be a reason to study it. Mutations are real. We just can't find mutations creating new structures that are beneficial.

coadie 08-23-2010 10:41 AM
Re: Did God use evolution to create life
 
Colin Patterson

Can you tell us something about evolution that is true?
Quote:
The molecular patterns he observed, Patterson believes, are thus only data awaiting explanation.

"I therefore believe I was mistaken in thinking that I knew something about molecular evolution," he writes. "Instead, I know (or have learned) something about the properties of molecular data, and those properties are amongst the things that must be explained by evolutionary theory."

Patterson concludes:

...I mentioned a question ('Can you tell me anything you know about evolution?') that I have put to various biologists, and an answer that had been given: 'I know that evolution generates hierarchy.' In the framework of phylogenetic reconstruction and our current problems with it, another answer comes to mind: 'I know that evolution generates homoplasy' [or "convergence," in the older jargon of systematics]. In both cases, the answer is not quite accurate. It would be truer to say, 'I know that evolution explains hierarchy' or 'I know that evolution explains homoplasy.' We must remember the distinction between the cart--the explanation--and the horse--the data. And where models are introduced in phylogenetic reconstruction, we should prefer models dictated by features of the data to models derived from explanatory theories.
Failure of the wisdom of man.
Quote:
'Can you tell me anything about evolution, any one thing that is true?'

coadie 08-23-2010 12:11 PM
Re: Did God use evolution to create life
 
nuance
Quote:
It is difficult for neo-Darwinism to explain the appearance of embryological coordinating genes before the appearance of the embryological steps they coordinate. It's like saying that the blueprints for automobile manufacturing plants were on hand before the invention of automobiles.

pelathais 08-23-2010 12:35 PM
Re: Did God use evolution to create life
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twisp (Post 953956)
Boo Hiss!

Lol, I saw your reply in the Mosque thread, not ignoring it. It just takes me longer to respond than most. That and I tend to avoid the internets on the weekend. lol.
LOL. That's not what I meant. I just wanted to say "Hi" before signing off for the night.


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