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-   -   New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentance (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/showthread.php?t=18322)

Joelel 09-05-2008 10:43 AM
Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltaguitar (Post 583092)
I think you are mistakenly trying to link justification with sanctification. We are justified by faith, and should allow the Holy Spirit to work in our lives after we are saved in a process called sanctification.

If sanctification were linked with salvation then at anytime you aren't walking perfectly in line with God then you are doomed to Hell. Only one person ever lived a perfect life and that was Christ. Your comments do not line up with the Gospel.
How can we have justification without sanctification,sanctification is having good works ? We are also justified by works.

My friend,we are sanctified if we do not wilfully sin.The blood cannot be sacrificed if we sin wilfully.Heb.10
[26] For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

Joelel 09-05-2008 10:48 AM
Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Epley (Post 583097)
Firstly I have never claimed to be a 3-stepper. Acts 2:38 is the only way for men to be saved since Pentecost.
However Dan is correct sins are forgiven at repentance but not remitted until they are baptized in Jesus Name. My thoughts on this is simple I am a simple person sins were forgiven in the OT but NOT remitted. Man's sins were remitted at Calvary by the blood and through baptism in Jesus Name the penitent recieves that benefit recieved by his shed blood.
There is no differance,if your sins are forgiven they are remitted.

deltaguitar 09-05-2008 10:53 AM
Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joelel (Post 583109)
My friend,James said,24: Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only. Do you not have to obey to have works.You must obey to have the work of repentance and baptism and being filled with the Holy Ghost.We are justified also by works .If you say you have faith will you not obey the works of repentance and being baptized ?

Acts 5:[31] Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.
[32] And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.
[33] When they heard that, they were cut to the heart, and took counsel to slay them.
Sorry, this was James not Peter. James is addressing those who don't have saving faith. He mentions that just believing in God isn't the same as true faith. True faith means you put everything you have into Gods saving grace. True faith is more than just mental assent. It is a life changing experience that means dying to the old man and taking up OUR cross and following Christ.

You are adding to the scripture. Where does it say that you have to be baptized and speak in tongues to be justified. It isn't in there. You are equating the works that follow faith with baptism. You could add communion, washing feet, prophesying, healing, circumcision or any other step that believers took after conversion as a work that had to be done in order to be justified and this just doesn't line up with scripture.

Steve Epley 09-05-2008 11:03 AM
Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joelel (Post 583133)
There is no differance,if your sins are forgiven they are remitted.
If that is so why were men's sins not remitted in the OT??? They were forgiven. Heb.9 & 10 declares sins were NOT taken away. John declared "the Lamb that TAKETH away the sin of the world." Jn.1:29
ONLY the shedding of blood remits sins. Heb. 9:22
Remission of sins is in His blood which was shed for many. Mt. 26:28
I realize both forgiveness and remission comes from the same Greek word and both are purchased by His blood yet NOT the same in functions and experience.
ONLY in baptism in Jesus Name are the sins of the penitent remitted.

Steve Epley 09-05-2008 11:08 AM
Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltaguitar (Post 583143)
Sorry, this was James not Peter. James is addressing those who don't have saving faith. He mentions that just believing in God isn't the same as true faith. True faith means you put everything you have into Gods saving grace. True faith is more than just mental assent. It is a life changing experience that means dying to the old man and taking up OUR cross and following Christ.

You are adding to the scripture. Where does it say that you have to be baptized and speak in tongues to be justified. It isn't in there. You are equating the works that follow faith with baptism. You could add communion, washing feet, prophesying, healing, circumcision or any other step that believers took after conversion as a work that had to be done in order to be justified and this just doesn't line up with scripture.
Obeying what Jesus and the Apostles said is NOT works.

1Cor. 6:11 says we are justified-washed-sanctified- IN THE NAME OF THE LORD JESUS(WATER) AND the SPIRIT.

Michael Phelps 09-05-2008 11:14 AM
Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Epley (Post 583161)
Obeying what Jesus and the Apostles said is NOT works.

1Cor. 6:11 says we are justified-washed-sanctified- IN THE NAME OF THE LORD JESUS(WATER) AND the SPIRIT.
"Water" is your interjection, Elder. I wouldn't make my assumption on that.

Aquila 09-05-2008 11:18 AM
Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsMcD (Post 583035)
I must not be comprehending some of this conversation. If I had not been baptized yet and I repented of my sins today, why would God not immediately forgive me. Am I missing something?
I believe that God would forgive you of your sins and you'd be justified in his eyes. Then you could receive the Holy Ghost and be water baptized. But if you refuse to receive the Holy Ghost, you'll not be regenerated and you'll be lost. If you refuse to be water baptized you'll be in rebellion and your sin will be upon you...and you'll be lost.

God forgives and calls us to move into the fulness of salvation, meaning the redemption of our entire person.

Michael Phelps 09-05-2008 11:20 AM
Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquila (Post 583171)
God woudl forgive you of your sins and you'd be justified in his eyes. Then you could receive the Holy Ghost and be water baptized. But if you refuse to receive the Holy Ghost, you'll not be regenerated and you'll be lost. If you refuse to be water baptized you'll be in rebellion and your sin will be upon you...and you'll be lost.

God forgives and calls us to move into the fulness of salvation, meaning the redemption of our entire person.
Can you provide your scripture basis for this?

deltaguitar 09-05-2008 11:25 AM
Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquila (Post 583171)
I believe that God would forgive you of your sins and you'd be justified in his eyes. Then you could receive the Holy Ghost and be water baptized. But if you refuse to receive the Holy Ghost, you'll not be regenerated and you'll be lost. If you refuse to be water baptized you'll be in rebellion and your sin will be upon you...and you'll be lost.

God forgives and calls us to move into the fulness of salvation, meaning the redemption of our entire person.
Have you ever met anyone who repented of their sins that didn't want the Holy Spirit or Water Baptism. These are easy works to follow. I mean, why not pick some hard ones like loving your brother as yourself.

Aquila 09-05-2008 11:27 AM
Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Phelps (Post 583173)
Can you provide your scripture basis for this?
Bro. David K. Bernard wrote about how Justification, Regeneration, Adoption, and Sanctification all work together for the salvation of the individual in his book, The New Birth. I believe it's chapter 13.


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