If the Long Hair is a covering
 

I was discussing with a brother the other day the appearent contradiction of some UPCs that require women to wear their hair up at church...yet her hair is supposed to be a covering (veil)...veils my dear friends are not meant to be skull caps.

They are veils that come down off the head to the shoulders and lower. Telling women to wear their hair up in church sort of defeats the purpose of what the bible says about praying or prophesying uncovered if you ask me...if anything it would be in reverse....wear it up OUTSIDE of church.

This extends to those that wear actual material coverings. A veil is not a little piece of fabric on the head. What's the point in teaching long uncut hair if you are going to pile it or hide it (your glory) by wearing it up or teaching you are to wear an actual veil only to wear just a scarf or a fabric cap on the head?

Right.

:bored

Prax, now you done went and did it!! You're using the bible and logic again! Don't you know that it flies in the face of tradition? Are you crazy? Have you lost your mind? Have you been smokin' wacky tobacky? You'll get grilled and charred, boy!!! :D

You just also happen to be right on the money!!

I would tend to think folks on the other side of the aisle would argue this is not just a fleshly covering, but a spiritual one as well. That God sees the long hair and it represents a submitted heart. This passage refers to God's order of authority and I would imagine most guys (UC's) would say as long as its uncut, then the woman is in her proper order???

I know it sound silly, but this is probably what they would argue. Again, they would play the obedience card. It's not a sin to cut your hair, its a sin to be disobedient.

Wouldn't a woman being submitted to Jesus Christ have a covering ?
Does long hair on a women mean uncut, is snipping bangs a damanable offense?of course there is to be gender distinctions between a man and a women.

I've been saying that for a long time, that they are binding their glory, and I get some of the nastiest looks.

ARPH :doggyrun

Well, one would think we are all covered by the Blood of Jesus. This doctrine is problematic for divorcees, single women, etc. if the covering is their hair and it shows submission to the male authority. I've heard pastors preach that if there isn't a husband , then the pastor would fill that role and would need to get permission from him to cut her hair.

But the point here is that it is supposed to be her covering (see veil) and she is to be covered when she prays...yet some tell her to PILE IT ALL UP on top of the head in church. If it is her glory too...why hide it?

Let's stick with the topic Scott

Uh...actually they are giving you those nasty looks for another reason that I can't say here in public :christmoose

Of course, I heard a fellow preacher tell me when his wife was diagnosed with cancer, the doctor told her to go ahead and shave her head since she would loose her hair. He told me they told the Dr. they would never do such a thing because her hair was God's glory.

This is how twisted and convoluted this doctrine has become.

I also know of situations where parents disowned their daughter because she cut her hair.

Is it any wonder the world thinks of Pentecostals are cultic ?

Giant Robot-DESTROY, use ATOMIC PUNCH!!!!

ARPH :doggyrun

:jolly

This is like the "no beard" issue. Many Apostolic Christians now understand it is not sin to have a beard. Yet where are the Churches one could wear one without offence?

On this forum it appears a good number of Saints know its not a sin for women to trim. Where are the Churches that stand by this truth?

The whole world?

Only the nations that have been conquered by Rome...

This might be off the subject just a tad, but according to those who believe a womans hair should be long, their idea of long is "uncut." Obviously some womens hair grows longer than others, but thats no problem, because long is, according to them, "uncut." So a woman who doesn't cut her hair and it only grows to her shoulders has long hair and a woman who has hair to the floor, as long as it is uncut is long...

Now the same ones preach against men having long hair, right? If long is "uncut" then a man could have hair down to his rear end and as long as he cuts, trims, or whatever it is not long, right?

There is something wrong with the logic or long being "uncut!"

Why is it that those who propagated these doctrines didn't have any logic or commons sense to think them through. Also, what's worse is why do people ck their brains at the door not to see the loopholes.

Tell me where you live, I'll send you some directions!:santathumb

The Catholic cult?


ARPH :doggyrun

Well let's face it when alot of people thinks of us only as people of rules and restrictions and such ,alot of folks out there preceive us as cultic.
I'm not attacking modesty either but God doesn't want to be nuts and flakes.
We can be Holy and have holiness without being out of balance.

lol

The ones that see them as rules and restrictions need rules and restrictions.
It's too bad that so much goes into holiness and seperation, and not enough into dedication, know what I mean?


ARPH :doggyrun

Ah, but to them, that is their dedication.

I don't think that they do it as a dedication to God, but just to be seperated by looking holy, (because someone told them too) without thinking of it as a living sacrifice, or doing everything as unto the Lord.


ARPH :doggyrun

If one is dedeicated to God,then Holiness is sure to follow,but it must come from the inside to the outside.
External only ritualism is superficial.

That may be the majority that you speak of. I dunno. Don't want to broadbrush the movement. You sound like a liberal! H is not a liberal congregation! :jolly

It's late and I'm tired...but I must comment. What about the churches that specify an age when your hair must be worn "up". Try 10 or 12, so you have a young girl that looks like a grandmother.
I know a family that followed their churches teaching> guilt, obedience,church peer pressure etc<.
The young lady grew up and went to college. Now has shoulder length hair, looks her age, looks very nice....but 10 yrs of her life have photos of an old lady in a young body. Floor length denim skirts with the pleat or slit stitched shut so she could not walk. Teachers felt sorry for her. Bun on her head at all times. Is this a testimony or evidence of a cult?



I'm aware not all churches take it to this extreme. :santathumb

liberal? NAY! A THOUSAND TIMES NAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If anything, even more conservative, I'm starting to think of

neckties as outward adornment.(except solid black)


ARPH :doggyrun

I commend you on those two issues. Very good! But I wont come because of Santa. Maybe when his season is over.

Aw, now, brother, if you want everything your way, you'll just have to start your own!

LOL!:jolly

lol

'scuse me but why are you so intent on stating that no one does "it" as dedication when I have several times throughout this forum, on related threads, stated that I DO both cover my heads and have long hair as a consecration to GOD as well as obedience? certainly NOT for to look 'holy' or for 'seperation' purposes it goes much deeper than that but how would you know; I suggest that instead of just thinkin find out from someone who does follow this 'standard'(s)., and forsake the innuendos. :rolleyes:

Bro Scott lives in small town USA...just ignore him :christmoose

Same ones that don't know which bathroom to go into unless there are stick figures on the door? AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! :jolly

To start with,the covering (veiling with a cloth veil) of women only when praying and prophesying was and still is a Jewish custom that was carried into the church.Even to this day Jewish women still veil their heads when they pray.This veiling is not the veiling with hair when praying.It is with a veil cloth that covers the whole head only when praying and prophesying.Even if it was talking about a womans hair hanging down for a veiling she is only to be veiled when praying and prophesying.Her hair hanging down would veil her all the time.The bottom line is,).[5] But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered(unveiled with a cloth veil) dishonoureth her head(athority,man): for that is even all one as if she were shaven.[6] For if the woman be not covered(veiled), let her also be shorn(cut her hair also): but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn(cut her hair) or shaven, let her be covered(veiled).We know there are people who are contentious so we should not even hold to such a custom.
1 Cor.11:16: But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.

I love it when people add their own interpretations and words to the Bible as if it needs the help.

I have had this same thought myself. It has been a matter of discussion with a dear friend and myself, and her husband.

I personally developed a conviction about this, that my hair was always down when I went to a service. It is my covering, why hide it? Why try to "get it out of the way"? I found that if I even tried to put my hair up, it felt very, very wrong, and I had to take it down.

Not long after that, my friend's husband made an excellent point that confirmed this for me... When a woman wears her hair down, and is bowed praying, it is amazing how that hair falls forward and actually creates a veil or curtain around her face. It almost creates a private space where only you and God are, where no one can see your face and there is no need to worry about what you look like. It is just you and God.

God bless!