Polygamist children
 

I heard today from someone whose children went to one of the homes where the children were being kept. Interesting facts was related as follows:

1. The children are not allowed to play. They did not know how to play. They are always made to work.

2. The education is only to the 8th grade. If the boys misbehaved they are thrown out to make it on their own with an eight grade education.

3. The boys are made to wear long johns year round, "for their protection". ??

I think we should pray for these children. This truly makes me sad to hear such a report.

Re: Polygamist children
 

This is interesting, I have seen tons of videos and pictures of these children playing before they were taken hostage by the government.... even the television footage shows them all playing ball....

God forbid they are made to work and actually learn a trade besides how to play nintendo and X-Box.. what abuse that must be.... glad you didn't come to my house when I was growing up,, we worked all day long...

Sort of like our Holiness boys.. are MADE TO WEAR LONG PANTS all year round.. isn't that so abusive?

You see.. these stories can be spun a thousand ways

Re: Polygamist children
 

At least you knew who your Mom and Dad were-at least I hope you did.

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Indeed I did... but it is interesting to me,, how we the very people that the world has made just as much fun of as they now do the "el Darado" people are doing the very same thing...

All my life we were pitied because we couldnt have a television... people had pity on us because we couldn't attend ballgames or rodeos or fairs for that matter..... children I played with their parents would always "feel so sorry for me" because of how I was being brainwashed... and then my poor sisters having to walk around in the winter with skirts on.. it was just plain abusive to them.. but you know what? IT WAS OUR LIFE,, we loved who we were.. we felt were part of a "set apart" people.. we believed we were serving God without our lifestyles... and it blows my mind now how US, THE VERY PEOPLE who suffered from the misunderstanding of others.. now join their ranks and mock these people from their clothing to their hairstyle... WHAT IF.. just WHAT IF these people are actually pleasing to the Lord.... no matter how wrong their doctrine is....

I heard a Prophet say one time.. I would rather have the wrong doctrine and the right Spirit.. than the right doctrine with the WRONG spirit.... so true

Re: Polygamist children
 

I think you are missing some key points here.

Number one there is nothing wrong with children learning to work, however, there should be balance.

Two, boys wearing long pants is NOT the same thing as wearing hot long johns.

Re: Polygamist children
 

With all due respect, Esther, if those were the only concerns, I wouldn't be all that concerned. The concerns are whether or not young women are being forced into a lifestyle they didn't choose, whether or not underage girls are being forced (or inappropriately persuaded) into marriage and pregnancy, and whether there is any other sexual, physical or emotional abuse present.

Their polygamist practices in general are not of great concern to me. Their conservative lifestyle, generally speaking, doesn't concern me either, extreme as it may be.

As a mother, though, I understand what you're saying. I can't stand for a child to be unhappy or neglected in any way. :( Children should be allowed time to just be children, to explore, to dream, to be creative, etc. But working hard will certainly not ruin them.

The long johns in Texas heat--well, I hope that's just a rumor.

Re: Polygamist children
 

I guess the point I didn't get across is IF they are never allowed to be children then you can see where they are pushed into adulthood way before they should be.

The sexual questions are very legitmate and our concerns should be for their total well being. IMO

As to hard work, I grew up working hard, I know all about it. Unfortunately, I didn't have the opportunity some did to be kids longer. But I survived. :)

Re: Polygamist children
 

Long johns under pants in West Texas? Lord have mercy.

Re: Polygamist children
 

Esther,

I saw a Today Show segment which had a couple who were helping a dozen or so of the "Lost Boys" from the FLDS. Those boys were chased off like stray dogs into a world they knew nothing about...

It was hard to imagine that parents kicked their sons out of the house, some as young as 13, so the girls could marry older men.

I read the article below, which outlined those poor kids plight in life.

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articl...gamist-ON.html

We live in a really messed up world!

CB1

Re: Polygamist children
 

This poor sister hated having to wear skirts in winter. I have always hated to be cold. And it was horrible walking to school in a skirt when it was cold. I remember turning around and going home once. But you are right I do remember being mocked some in Elementary school. Funny thing though after we got into Jr. High school it wasn't so bad. No TV was fine as I was a tomboy and had an older brother that taught me to do a lot of things, some dangerous. Can you believe I learned some football plays, how to walk on stilts? Go figure I played more with my brother than I did my sister.
And I agree Bro. Vaughn, about having a right spirit. My head gets sore from God having to smack me sometimes.

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If they kick all the boys out, what happens when the older men die? I don't think they kick them all out, there are two or three prominent names in this group though.

Re: Polygamist children
 

Brother Vaughn how can their faith be tested if they are never exposed to the world? I understand the men are, as some of them have jobs outside the compound, one which sticks out to me is police officers. And I think that I read that the group owns some business's.

You were never allowed to play?

Re: Polygamist children
 

No, they don't kick them all out. They just make sure that the girl/boy ratio was lopsided so that there would be more girls available to satisfy the older men desire to marry children!

Re: Polygamist children
 

We have a sect of Warren Jeffries in B.C. near the American Border called Bountiful.
There are hundreds there.
The B.C. Government has been wanting to deal with them for a long time but was afraid of a Constitutional challenge to the Charter Of Rights & Freedoms before the Supreme Court of Canada.

They were afraid of the sect winning.

They are appointing a Special Prosecutor who will try to bag them on the Polygamy charge which is still illegal in Canada.

The sect will probably respond by saying that thier practice of Polygamy is a religious practice protected by the charter.

So far they have found no direct evidence of abuse of minors.

Special Prosecutors are only appointed in high profile crimes like the Mafia, or Government Ministers.
They are only answerable to the Courts.

Should be interesting.

Re: Polygamist children
 

In this the community is ran no differently than your typical herd of large animals. The could almost have Marlin Perkins and Jim Fowler do an episode based on this "ranch"..... "And now we see the older dominant males chasing away the less dominant in order to better preserve their superior genes. Such is the way of nature. The cast offs of the herd will now be forced to fend for themselves. Such is the life of the elephants, wilderbeasts, and polygamists males."

>insert Mutual of Omaha "piece of the rock" commercial<

Re: Polygamist children
 

Not only was your above post humerous (though the story itself about the Lost Boys was tragic) it really was very clever. Comparing the males to bulls for instance, a yearling can serve between 10 and 12, while a bull 18 months and older can serve 20 to 25 cows.

Since, the goal of the FLDS men is to have multiple wives, it only makes since that the geezers could handle (support) more wives than the much young boys. Why should the geezers keep the younger males around to only grow older, stronger and powerful and limit the pool of available girls? Do they take pride in the number of wives that they have? Is that the pecking order for the men's position in the cult? It would be nice to have a little more detail on this cult.

The one thing that is clear after thinking about this is that the desire for POWER seems to be at play. It's funny how that seems to happen again and again in this life, huh?

Re: Polygamist children
 

Pride, and the selfishness and desire for power that result from it, really IS the #1 base ingredient for all sin.

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The FLDS believe that the more wives and children they have here on earth, the better their heaven will be. They are populating heaven.

The men claim it is a 'sacrifice' on their parts but a command nonetheless....

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ROFL!!!!!!!!!!! :toofunny :toofunny :toofunny

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"On this weeks episode of Dirty Jobs, Mike Rowe tackles the pain and misery of being a polygamist with multiple wives."

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I would think having multiple wives would be more along the lines of self-inflicted torture than sacrifice.

One woman is more than enough for anybody!

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It actually is a sacrifice on their part to some degree. Can you imagine living in a home with 7 wives and none of them being happy. What kind of peace would a man have. It would be stressful having to shuffle the schedule to make it fair for the different wives to all spend time with him and when he did spend time with them he spent half his time listening to them complain.

A good book on the subject "Shattered Dreams The Life of a Polygamist Wife". She wasn't from this sect, but she did associate with them. Some of the views are a little different and now they have grown more controlling then when she was involved in it. She is very open and transparent about what happened to her. One example would be their were 3 families living in the same household at one time, with around 25 children it was just too crowded.
Irene, the women telling the story, was never nice or accommodating to her husband when he was with a different wife without a fight. She was the 2nd wife and it was her husbands turn to be with the 3rd wife. She voluntarily gave up her room which had been cleaned for them that evening. The third wifes bedroom was above the 1st wifes room. She slept in the third wifes room that night and jumped on the bed most of the night long. In the morning the 1st wife wouldn't speak to the husband except to demand she get her own home. Not long after that they were all put into different living quarters. The first wife has a lot of pull, usually.

Re: Polygamist children
 

The boys are only put out if they break the rules. Like talking to girls, holding hands with girls, drinking, smoking, swearing and the such. They actually have to do something to get them kicked out. The families absolutely believe in the doctrine and even though it is hard turn their backs on them they support the decision to kick them out.

Re: Polygamist children
 

They actually believe that they will be given a world to populate like Adam was. A man is assured of the is position if he has 7 wives. He can't even begin to attain this position unless he has 3 wives. A women will be a goddess if her husband calls her by name. Hence the reason to be obedient to her husband even when it wouldn't make sense. If he doesn't she will be only an angel forced to serve her husband and his wives that are goddesses. This can be a very humiliating thought after living one life fighting with the other wives. These women are told to be sweet. There is a lot of pent up anger that they take out on the other wives children. A lot of the abuse that goes on is from the women to the children of other wives.

Re: Polygamist children
 

I couldn't imagine a young teenage boy, who was in the middle of going through puberty, not to be able to talk to girls his own age. That just seemed like another layer of cruelty imposed of those kids.

While much of the media's attention has been focused on the girls, these boys have had to endure their own hell on earth.

This story just makes me see red!

Re: Polygamist children
 

This is from a neutral colmunist at:

http://blogs.sltrib.com/plurallife/


Using bishop's records and photographs found at the YFZ Ranch, the Texas Attorney General's Office alleges:

1. A marriage between Jeffs and a 14-year-old girl on Jan. 18, 2004, in Utah. The evidence: Wedding photos.

2. That the girl gave birth on Oct. 14, 2005, when she was 15. The evidence: Photos of the girl and Jeffs moments after birth; he is holding the newborn.

3. That Jeffs sexually assaulted a 12-year-old he married on July 27, 2006, at the YFZ Ranch. The evidence: Bishop's records and photographs.

4. A marriage between Jeffs and a 14-year-old girl on July 22, 2004, at the YFZ Ranch. The evidence: Bishop’s records.

5. A marriage between Jeffs and a 12-year-old girl on April 16, 2005, at the YFZ Ranch. The evidence: Bishop's records.

The DNA will show whether Jeffs and any of the girls are parents of any child at the ranch.

And if they do, the probe will likely snare others: the girls' parents and anyone else who knew and kept silent. No more floodlights; this time the state will be proceeding with laser-beam focus.

It's fixin' to get rough.

Re: Polygamist children
 

I think its about time they get him and good! And get all of HIS children out of there for sure!

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Isn't there something about the husband "pulling the wife through" somehow?
I read the same book but can't remember the details like You do.

Nina

Re: Polygamist children
 

Kinky Friedman said only in Texas could a man be married five times and still have the same in-laws.

The media has a double standard on the issue. It is okay to tell girls as early as 8 or 9 years old they can have sex and provide the tools to keep them from getting pregnant, yet the media finds it repulsive 11 and 12 year old girls are reportedly getting married.

I am glad the kids are back in the compound. The government dropped the ball big time on this one.

The family should be thankful. If it were the federal government and Bill Clinton was in charge, he would have shot first and asked questions later.

Re: Polygamist children
 

Why repulsed at marrying at such a young age. Loretta Lynn married at twelve years old. (wikipedia). Many cultures for dozens of centuries have practices of marrying young.

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We should also be thankful Janet Reno wasn't hired as adviser.

:toofunny

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He has to call her by name. So if she wasn't pleasing or obedient he doesn't have make her a goddess. This of course puts fear in the women to not rock the boat.