Tongues and Interpretation T&T
 

This was mentioned in another thread.

I have been in awesome services and we all know the enviroment, things get intense, then someone starts speaking in tongues, we all lay our heads on the floor and close our eyes really tight asking the Lord to speak.

I have honestly been waiting at the edge of my seat, excited with the thick cloud of expectation that the Lord is going to speak then the message comes out more often than not something like this...

Behold!...:D but seriously...

Behold, if MY people who are called by my name...

If my people humble themselves and pray...

Look to the Hills from when cometh thy help....

Do not be seekers of pleasure...

Listen to the voice of the Lord...

I am just curious these messages are so obvious, I have a tendency to wonder if the Lord is really speaking in what the bible would call the gift of Prophesy having to do with tongues. While these messages are inspiring, and even to an extent admonitions, and exhortations, they aren't even close to being prohetical.

I am curious. Has anyone ever heard a message in tongues that was truly prophetic? Or am I off base questioning this?

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Can you say "bad karma?"

I ain't touching this one.

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No. No.

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I have heard some that were truly prophetic.

One that comes to mind was judgment though, so that would be immediately written off here.

Don't worry, I won't repeat it to be poked and prodded by cynics who weren't there. :)

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I don't think tongues and interpretation has to be prophetic.

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AgrEEd. And sOmE thinK proPHecy iS juST the forETElling oF eVENts.

http://www.christcenteredmall.com/te...s/prophecy.htm


HowEVEr, it muST be noTED thAT the HeBReW fOR propHeCy iS nahbi - it mEAns "to announce".

THe ProPHetS of The OT ofteN aDmonIshed anD eXhoRted and InSpired aS thE VoiCe of GOd.

I bElieVe OuR movEmenT hAs a lOt to LeaRn abOUt the PrOpheTic buT Are ScAreD ouT oF ouR minDS to DelVe dEEpEr In IT

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I heard one a few years ago that I don't even want to repeat here.

It was pretty moving ... but some of the Post-tribbers and Preterists among us might have a hard time accepting that it was from the Lord.

...Anyway, to God be the glory!

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I have heard both T.and I. and Prophecy from the Lord...

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For almost four hundred years the King James Version of the Holy Bible has been God's Word in the English speaking world, and in most Oneness Pentecostal churches, it continues to be the Word of God. Why would it be any surprise that people in conveying God's word would use the language in which they have received God's word for their whole life?

It may be in vogue in the "relevant" churches to use a Bible that makes God sound like He smoked too much Mary Jane in His early years, but when the King James Bible falls into complete disuse, we will be the less for our dumbing down of God's Word.

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Exactly. I always get amused when this particular jeer comes across.

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I was standing on the platform next to Bro J T Pugh, at V Arlen Guidroz' church, in 1981, when someone gave out a tongue. I immediately recieved the interpretation, but while I hesitated, wanting to be sure, Bro Pugh came out with the interpretation, and it was verbatum.

A learning experience for me.

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My opinion

Prophecy is words to edify (build up), exhort (stir up), or comfort (cheer up or lift up) people. Prophecy is spoken in the language that is understood by the hearers. Prophecy is better for the hearers than tongues, unless the tongues are interpreted, then prophecy is equal to tongues and interpretation. In other words T + I = P (Tongues plus Interpretation equals Prophecy.

When a person prophesies or interprets an utterance in tongues, he/she is speaking out to people and giving them what he/she thinks God would say to them at that time. We have some times made it too "magical" or too "spooky" or too "spiritual." Often the person just speaks from their heart without "planning" what they are going to say. Consequently it is spoken in the same way the person usually speaks (as far as grammer, pronunciation, local slang, etc.). Because the person feels like they are speaking for God they often "dress it up" in KJV English because: 1) they think God talks that way, and 2) it is expected by the hearers.

Now, please don't take this as a putdown of tongues, interpretation, and prophecy. As the person yields and speaks out by faith, God can and some times does, get some things out there that would not have been spoken under ordinary circumstances. Some things may be revealed that would have been otherwise unknown. But, usually, the person speaking is saying something to build up, stir up, and cheer up or lift up the hearers, so it is often about: God knowing what we are going through; God's promise of His presence with us at all times; encouragement to hold on if prayer is not answered as soon as we would like it to be; encouragement to be faithful to God; a move of God just around the corner; the rapture which is the hope of the saints; etc. We all could stand to hear those things every once in a while.

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I made this a separate post because the other one was getting long.

Two incidents:
Several years ago there was a message in tongues at a UPC where I was a member. A woman, who was not very intelligent, gave the interpretation. She actually used words that you would not expect to hear from her and alluded to some things that were going on that she would not have ordinarily known about. The pastor confirmed what she said and that this was from God because she spoke of things that were beyond her knowledge. Well, after that, if there was a message, even if she was back in the nursery, she would run out to give an interpretation and it just wasn't the same as that one time. She became repetitious and fell into the rut of saying the regular old stuff that we hear over and over. Were these genuine gifts? I would say yes. She knew that she had been used by God and she was saying what was on her heart to build up, stir up, and cheer up or lift up the saints.

Another story I heard when I was a teenager in a UPC in Wisconsin. Sis. Geneva Bailey was a missionary in Africa associated with Sis. Gruse. That was before the airplane was available and she had to walk quite a distance even fording some rivers. She had rubbed a blister on her foot, it had broken, and she had blood poisoning. She felt like she could go no farther. She sat down and asked God to place her on some body's heart to pray for her because she just couldn't pray for herself any more. At that same time (this was confirmed later by checking dates and taking into account the time difference) there was a message in tongues and interpretation in Texas that Sis. Bailey was dying from poisoning. The folks in Texas interceded until they felt like God had heard and answered. They had heard of the poisoning but they didn't realize it was blood poison. They thought someone had poisoned her. It's been many years since I heard Sis. Bailey tell this story and I may not have it 100 percent accurate.

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I knew Sister Bailey and her friend Sister Stewart well. They attended our church for a couple of years after they retired.

Precious ladies.

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Tongues and Interpretation are not meant to be prophetic....that is why there is the gift of prophecy.

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good answer

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About the same thing over and over....just seems like it is too general sometimes....not poking holes cause its only happened to me personally one time...I had the interpretation but I thought it was me...took someone coming to me and telling me to give the message.Was specific...scared me though cause it had never happened before.

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There are times when I feel that the interpretation of tongues is from God, and other times when I doubt!

I have found that the King James English in interpretations is cultural. The practice has been parroted down through generations at some churches. More and more churches are using modern English these days.

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The unction is the Spirits the voice is the speakers. The greatest authority in many church folks lives is the KVJ, so it doesn't seem to odd that the speaker would bring forth the interpretation with the most authority they know.

With different versions of the Word being published in more modern English I'd imagine that the interpretation would be coming forth in more modern English.

Sometimes folks might be more in the flesh then in the Spirit and speak out things that don't seem to jive with our spirit.


Caution: Tread lightly. Mocking T&I is an area to be avoided. [This is not to anyone specifically, but in general]

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Yay I say thou hast missed the mark somewhat in thy posting. While I agree that the KJV has a historical importance to the church it is entirely appropriate for the church today to useth a translation that utilizes modern English.

Many words in the KJV are obscure today or have meanings that have changed over hundreds of years.

I do agreeist with thee that people giveth tongues and interpretation in olde English because they perceive that to be the way God speaks. I do not see that as a good thing but as a little bit of ignorance.

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You see, God knows he can depend on people from Texas.:ursofunny:ursofunny

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There arst some people who no longer posteth on this forum who pride themselves in their ability to understandeth the KJV and looketh downeth on people who do not see the necessity to learnith a 400 year old dialect ofeth a language that Jesus never even KNEW to geteth closer to himeth.

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Bro. CC1,

I guarantee you that it isn't any worse than some of the folks from LA or TN giving interpretations in the way that folks from LA or TN really DO speak! :D In fact it may be more accurate and easily understood in the KJ English!

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Some of us were taught that tongues and interpretation were God speaking directly to His people... if it is filtered through the brain of someone to the point that their perceptions are evident in the language that they use to deliver the message, I would say that the message is tainted and most definitely not a DIRECT message from God... but more like a note scribbled on the refrigerator door and someone tells someone else over the phone what the note said...

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LOL!!!! You make a very good point.

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Because it is filtered through a human beings brain and emotions you are correct that it can be imperfect.

I do believe God uses T&T but I also believe that sometimes other things occur like;

1. A good intentioned person can want something to be so badly that they
give this as an interpretation to tongues thinking it is from God when it is
from their own mind. An example would be a false prophecy about someone
being healed who is not.

2 In the process of giving the interpretation a person's mind is subject to
their intellect, excitement, and other factors that can color the message
given. We have to keep in mind that it is the essence of the message
given that is important not any improper english used, etc as they are
the fault of the imperfect human vessel the message is coming through.

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I had a AoG mother daughter team, wanting to be rid of my oneness, Jesus name witnessing at Florida Christian coffee house they supervised.

The daughter gave the tongues, then Momma gave the interprtation that God was calling me to another area of service. That I should follow the leading of the Lord as he directed my paths away from their area of ministry. (paraphrased)

I found it quite humorous.

Tongues and Interpation? I think I may have heard the real thing o couple times in my 37 years around Pentecost.

But I have doubted it's validity on mmany occasions.

I gave an intrepation once. I pray I was in the Spirit.

I would seriously question any T and I that gave personal direction to any one individual.

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Once we had a guest preacher, and as I turned the pulpit over to him, a message in tongues went forth, and my brother, who was our youth leader at the time, gave the interpretation.

When he ceased, the preacger turned around and looked at me, his mouth agape...

He took his notes off the pulpit, and showed me the title.

The last words of the interpretation were exactly verbatim the same words as his title.

What a divine confirmation that his message was indeed the mind of God.

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Oh how I long for that true demonstration, Elder...

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Sister, it isn't as rare as some seem to think.

I could tell story after story, but I know by experience that when you start talking about the works of the Holy Ghost and the moving of the supernatural in some settings, the sound of cloven hooves punctuated by a frenzy of "oinks" is usually soon to follow.

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i'm sorry to hear that because I could sit and listen to story upon story and be inspired to seek God. Can't you ignore the mockers for the sake of those who earnestly desire to see the power and glory of God like in the book of Acts and the rest of the Bible?

My pastor had a great testimony this Wednesday night of the Lord healing a man who was working on his home when my pastor laid hands on him and prayed for him.

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The KJV is a part of the foundation of the modern English language, and while I won't argue in favour of its exclusive use, I do think that it should be retained, not only as a part of our history, but as an important element in our Western Christian identity.

As far as the obscurity of its words, I would argue that any serious reader of Scripture will, of necessity, have to enlarge their vocabulary to understand the theological language of the Bible. Should we dumb down the Scriptures until they only appeal to the least literate among us?

There are views promoted on this forum that require the addition of Greek words to the vocabulary in order to understand the Scriptures. Why is it a big deal to enlarge the vocabulary to include additional English words when reading Scripture?

One thing that I would argue in favour of is the consistent use of a translation by a congregation. There are significant differences between translations that makes congregational reading and study needlessly confusing when everybody is using the "translation du jour."

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Thou makest sense.

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I find it ironic that old time Pentecostals who are eager to get in line to criticize old main line deominations and the Roman Catholic church of making relgion a ritual and out of touch experience, and who promote a real, living, intimate, "today" relationship with God cling to a translation of the Bible in an outdated form of the English language.

I do think it is asking a lot of many in the USA today to understand archaic old English when they barely know where the USA is on a map of the world.

Why put the obstacle of archaic language and words in their way?

Again I do agree that we need to keep the KJV around and honor it's historic place in the reformation, etc. However I do think it makes sense to use a modern translation that is easily understandable to everybody the vast majority of the time and in partiulcar when preaching (especially evangelistically).

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I love those instances when you don't have to wonder if it is God!

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We can learn the vocabulary of baseball, words like:
strike
ball
walk
error
grounder
etc.

We can learn the vocabulary of football like:
center
pass
tight end
quarter
extra point
etc.

We can learn the vocabulary of cooking like:
teaspoon
tablespoon
stir
blend
etc.

If we are interested enough in something we become conversant in its terms.

If we are interested enough in the Bible, we can learn the meaning of some older English words like:
let
wot
hitherto
moreover
prevent
etc.

It just depends on how interested we are and how much of an effort we want to make.

Having said that, I am not a KJV only person, but I think any reasonably intelligent person can can put forth a little effort and become familiar with the English used in it.

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Someone once asked me, sorta jokingly, "When God speaks to you, does He speak in King James English?" I replied that He some times does. I have many, many translations of the Bible but for years I read only the KJV, so if God drops a Scripture into my mind it is in KJV because that's what I am familiar with, that is the way I usually have read and memorized it.

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We had a message once where a friend of mine had the interpretation and I think it was his first time. He was pretty nervous and half way through lost it totally....right at the moment he stopped another person picked it up exactly where he left off almost instantaneously

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I have been teaching the midweek Bible study at our church for the last three months. Ordinarily I use the NKJV because it is close to the KJV but without some of those older words and verb endings. However, this past week while teaching on the importance of keeping short accounts with God and confessing/admitting any sin right away and getting it out of the way I provided Psalm 32 from The Living Bible in the notes. I really like the way it has been paraphrased by Dr. Kenneth Taylor.

Here is Psalm 32 from The Living Bible (TLB)

1 What happiness for those whose guilt has been forgiven! What joys when sins are covered over! What relief for those who have confessed their sins and God has cleared their record! There was a time when I wouldn’t admit what a sinner I was. But my dishonesty made me miserable and filled my days with frustration. 4 All day and all night your hand was heavy upon me. My strength evaporated like water on a sunny day 5 until I finally admitted all my sins to you and stopped trying to hide them. I said to myself, “I will confess them to the Lord.” And you forgave me! All my guilt is gone. 6 Now I say that each believer should confess his sins to God when he is aware of them, while there is time to be forgiven. Judgment will not touch him if he does.
7 You are my hiding place from every storm of life; you even keep me from getting into trouble! You surround me with songs of victory.
8 “I will instruct you (says the Lord) and guide you along the best pathway for your life; I will advise you and watch your progress.
9 Do not be like a senseless horse or mule that has to have a bit in its mouth to keep it in line!
10 Many sorrows come to the wicked, but abiding love surrounds those who trust in the Lord.
11 So rejoice in him, all those who are his, and shout for joy, all those who try to obey him.