Apostolic Friends Forum

Apostolic Friends Forum (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/index.php)
-   Fellowship Hall (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=7)
-   -   Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtain! (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/showthread.php?t=18037)

Nahum 08-23-2008 10:00 PM

Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtain!
 
Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtain!

Recently, my daughter and I revisited her love affair with the old film classic The Wizard of Oz. Over the course of my life I have seen portions of the film, but never disciplined myself to watch the entire thing. Fantasy flicks never have been of much interest to me.

However, this time Rebecca asked me to watch the whole thing with her, and I complied. I suppose I gave in because I knew she was leaving, this week, for her freshman year of College and I wanted to spend every moment I could with her, even if that meant watching The Wizard of Oz.

So we sat and watched it, eating our popcorn and drinking our soda pop.

I must admit that I enjoyed it. To be sure, it is corny theatre. The film alternates from black and white to color. The main characters are Dorothy, her dog Toto, a scarecrow, tin man and a cowardly lion.

Each character seems to be missing something in life. Dorothy and Toto miss home, the scarecrow is missing a brain, the tin man a heart and the cowardly lion courage.

In order to find what is missing, the group is directed to “follow the yellow brick road” because it leads to The Wizard of Oz. They are directed to The Wizard because it is believed he is the only one with the power to give them what they lack.

And so, through many dangers, they follow the road. They do as instructed. They trust the instructions given. The group fights imps, a wicked witch and their own personal imperfections to reach The Wizard.



www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZR64EF3OpA
When at last they reach The Emerald City, and gain audience with The Wizard, they enter a chamber filled with smoke and a dazzling light. The frightening image of The Wizard is seen on a wall and his booming voice rains down at them.

When given a chance to speak, Dorothy makes her plea for help. She informs The Wizard that the group has completed its mission, that the Wicked Witch of the West is dead and that she and her friends expect to be rewarded for their heroic acts.

The Wizard is insulted by this. A great show is made to express his anger. The booming voice booms louder, the smoke becomes thicker, the image more vitriolic.

However, in the middle of all of the chaos, Toto breaks loose from Dorothy and runs to a portion of the room hidden behind a curtain. Jumping on the curtain, he pulls it back to reveal a small man at an elaborate control panel. As the man pushes each button, the image and voice of The Wizard is activated.


When the little man turns and realizes Dorothy and her friends see him for what he really is, he pulls the curtain closed and screams into the microphone “pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!”

As I watched this scene I was smitten with the irony of his command. The little man commanded Dorothy and her friends to ignore the reality of the moment in order to buy in to a myth: The myth that he was “The Great and Powerful Wizard of Oz.” He commanded them to ignore what they absolutely knew as truth in order to believe a lie. He commanded them to ignore every sensory skill in order to perpetuate a theatrical persona.

There are powerful voices in Christianity who want to hide what is behind the curtain. These voices boom with authority, but lack Pentecostal power. And at the tender age of forty, I now realize that some things cannot be hidden behind a curtain. I simply refuse to suspend everything I see in the Word, feel in my spirit and know intellectually.

Religion, far too often, fails in the areas of truthfulness and transparency. Religion, based upon faulty oral tradition, is useless. It is time for truthfulness. It is time for introspection. It is time for a return to God’s Word.

Everything else is a myth, and I am tired of giving my life to lies. How sad to work, and build, and give to a paradigm only to discover that all of the effort was wasted on a faulty theological premise.

Truth, once revealed, demands close inspection. Do not allow blind allegiance to men and their traditions trump what God reveals to you through His Word and by His Spirit.


Pay close attention to that man behind the curtain.

stmatthew 08-23-2008 10:05 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
PP,

Great post!!

I think many of us 40 something folks are tired of the ritual of authoritarianistic leadership. I personally refuse to submit to any leader that is as dry as last years birds nest. Give me a man that has prayed and fasted, and walks with God in Word AND in power. But alas, there are very few of that breed of character left, as we stoned most of them already.

Hoovie 08-23-2008 10:16 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Very good PP. Now don't go meddlin with this in a practical application... :)

Sam 08-23-2008 10:19 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Who is the little man behind the curtain who has impressed you and fooled you?

MissBrattified 08-23-2008 10:24 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Good post.

CC1 08-23-2008 10:35 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster (Post 573773)
Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtain!


There are powerful voices in Christianity who want to hide what is behind the curtain. These voices boom with authority, but lack Pentecostal power. And at the tender age of forty, I now realize that some things cannot be hidden behind a curtain. I simply refuse to suspend everything I see in the Word, feel in my spirit and know intellectually.

Religion, far too often, fails in the areas of truthfulness and transparency. Religion, based upon faulty oral tradition, is useless. It is time for truthfulness. It is time for introspection. It is time for a return to God’s Word.

Everything else is a myth, and I am tired of giving my life to lies. How sad to work, and build, and give to a paradigm only to discover that all of the effort was wasted on a faulty theological premise.

Truth, once revealed, demands close inspection. Do not allow blind allegiance to men and their traditions trump what God reveals to you through His Word and by His Spirit.[/FONT][/COLOR][/SIZE]

Pay close attention to that man behind the curtain.

PeePee,

Can you elaborate on the parts of your post I have bolded above? Specifically what do you mean by;

-"I refuse to suspend everything I see in the word, feel in my spirit, and know intellectually."
-Faulty oral tradiditions
-A Faulty theological premise

mizpeh 08-23-2008 10:41 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Praying for perfect peace for you, PP.

mizpeh 08-23-2008 11:09 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam (Post 573780)
Who is the little man behind the curtain who has impressed you and fooled you?

Jude 1:16 These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, having men's persons in admiration because of advantage.

(I know this is out of context, but it fits the bill..)

ManOfWord 08-24-2008 05:37 AM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by stmatthew (Post 573774)
PP,

Great post!!

I think many of us 40 something folks are tired of the ritual of authoritarianistic leadership. I personally refuse to submit to any leader that is as dry as last years birds nest. Give me a man that has prayed and fasted, and walks with God in Word AND in power. But alas, there are very few of that breed of character left, as we stoned most of them already.



Matt, I couldn't agree with you more here!! AMEN!!!



I heard it said once, and believe it, "Never trust a man who doesn't walk with a "limp." :D

StillStanding 08-24-2008 06:04 AM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Excellent Post, PP! :thumbsup

You lead off with a home run! :D

What's interesting is that once someone is enlightened about the man behind the curtain, others will accuse them of lying. They have spent their entire life believing, and they refuse to believe it's just a myth!

Brad Murphy 08-24-2008 07:11 AM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pianoman (Post 573816)
Excellent Post, PP! :thumbsup

You lead off with a home run! :D

What's interesting is that once someone is enlightened about the man behind the curtain, others will accuse them of lying. They have spent their entire life believing, and they refuse to believe it's just a myth!

Yep! "The Wizard of Oz" has some amazing correlations to "other things"... as does "The Emperor's New Clothes" and "Don Quixote".

Not to mention, "The Village", "The Matrix" and others.

MikeinAR 08-24-2008 10:13 AM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster (Post 573773)
Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtain!
Religion, far too often, fails in the areas of truthfulness and transparency. Religion, based upon faulty oral tradition, is useless. It is time for truthfulness. It is time for introspection. It is time for a return to God’s Word.

Everything else is a myth, and I am tired of giving my life to lies. How sad to work, and build, and give to a paradigm only to discover that all of the effort was wasted on a faulty theological premise.

Truth, once revealed, demands close inspection. Do not allow blind allegiance to men and their traditions trump what God reveals to you through His Word and by His Spirit.[/FONT][/COLOR][/SIZE]

Pay close attention to that man behind the curtain.

PP your post really grabbed me for a couple of reasons. Firstly, the sincerity of your post shined through. Secondly, it's exactly what my generation of 20 somethings needs. I'm concerned about things I see around me and that my generation is falling for.

I'm tired of seeing people base Christianity on what came out of last week's conference and what so and so said. I'm tired of everyone baseing every program in the church on some silly model that has worked here and there and yet the programs lack any power.

It's past time for us to "return to God's word" as the exclusive source of our beliefs and power. Traditions and opinions will disappoint and leave people feeling empty, confused, and dissatisfied.

We've got to have people that will "demand close inspection" and base what we do solely on sound scriptural doctrines. Put opinions, traditions, completely behind the Word of God and let it produce what we need. We're losing credability to a dying world if we do any less.

HappyTown 08-24-2008 10:56 AM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Pastor Poster's Better you then I..;) I still not watch Star Wars through!

CC1 08-24-2008 11:12 AM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Lib.

Obviously "gone charismatic".

Sherri 08-24-2008 01:19 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
:girlpopcorn

CC1 08-24-2008 02:11 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
This thead is the kind of thinking that develops once one heads down that slippery slope.

This is what wearing shirt sleeves above your elbows and allowing other worldly things to creep into your lifestyle leads to.

I guess next we will be hearing from PP how that the Bible doesn't teach against women wearing pants, makeup, and jewelry when we all know it is right there in black and white. Somewhere (never seen it myself but according to others it is there).

Any day now I expect to see PP promoting some youth event with colored lights and fog.

Tsk, tsk, tsk. Oh the shame.

HeavenlyOne 08-24-2008 02:29 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
This morning, I attended a church where the Jesus Name doctrine is the same, but no 'holiness standards' are preached or mandated. It was a nice service, although I have to admit that seeing women with cut hair and jewelry on the platform of an Apostolic church throws me.

I noticed several things though. One of those things was the spirit of God that I felt there. It was a wonderful service and the messages preached were great.

I also noticed that while the women looked different, the men didn't. Strange...I mean, if what we look like on the outside tells people how saved or holy we are, it appears that the men continued having holiness and the women didn't. (insert TIC smiley here)

I spoke to the pastor after church and in the course of conversation, I told him that I was there at the invitation of a friend I hadn't yet met because I know her from the internet. She's a member here and I was telling him how I'd met her. He asked for the name of the forum and when I told him, he said, "Oh, I know of that forum." I laughed, and he asked why I was laughing. I didn't know what to say.....LOL!

Anyway, I asked him why he decided to leave the UPC and he told me basically what I expected to hear....he'd studied and did research and prayed and decided that living for God according to the Bible was more important than living for God according to the UPC manual. There were other issues related to ministerial situations and such, but I didn't inquire about those. A very nice guy. I'm sure I'll visit there again.

I'm looking for a place where I can worship in freedom and not have to worry about the man behind the curtain telling me how to be saved and keep my salvation and how to look so everyone else can see how saved I am.

CC1 08-24-2008 02:39 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
HO,

Now I am dying of curiosity to know what church you visited!

Baron1710 08-24-2008 03:18 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
PP,

Thanks for sharing. This post obviously comes from a time of struggle and reexamination.

HeavenlyOne 08-24-2008 03:46 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by CC1 (Post 573966)
HO,

Now I am dying of curiosity to know what church you visited!

It's called New Life something or other....LOL! It's in West Frankfort, IL.

It used to be Glad Tidings church that was pastored by not one, but two women for over 40 years!!

Both passed on in recent years, and a former UPC preacher took it over and it's doing great!

They don't have a Christ Church in these parts.

A_PoMo 08-24-2008 05:44 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
It's no accident that those who write about spiritual abuse use the analogy of the man behind the curtain to talk about authoritarian spiritual leaders who abuse and beat people down with their oppressive doctrines and their manipulative tactics. It's a great analogy. And true.

ILG 08-24-2008 08:35 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster (Post 573773)
Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtain!

Recently, my daughter and I revisited her love affair with the old film classic The Wizard of Oz. Over the course of my life I have seen portions of the film, but never disciplined myself to watch the entire thing. Fantasy flicks never have been of much interest to me.

However, this time Rebecca asked me to watch the whole thing with her, and I complied. I suppose I gave in because I knew she was leaving, this week, for her freshman year of College and I wanted to spend every moment I could with her, even if that meant watching The Wizard of Oz.

So we sat and watched it, eating our popcorn and drinking our soda pop.

I must admit that I enjoyed it. To be sure, it is corny theatre. The film alternates from black and white to color. The main characters are Dorothy, her dog Toto, a scarecrow, tin man and a cowardly lion.

Each character seems to be missing something in life. Dorothy and Toto miss home, the scarecrow is missing a brain, the tin man a heart and the cowardly lion courage.

In order to find what is missing, the group is directed to “follow the yellow brick road” because it leads to The Wizard of Oz. They are directed to The Wizard because it is believed he is the only one with the power to give them what they lack.

And so, through many dangers, they follow the road. They do as instructed. They trust the instructions given. The group fights imps, a wicked witch and their own personal imperfections to reach The Wizard.



www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZR64EF3OpA
When at last they reach The Emerald City, and gain audience with The Wizard, they enter a chamber filled with smoke and a dazzling light. The frightening image of The Wizard is seen on a wall and his booming voice rains down at them.

When given a chance to speak, Dorothy makes her plea for help. She informs The Wizard that the group has completed its mission, that the Wicked Witch of the West is dead and that she and her friends expect to be rewarded for their heroic acts.

The Wizard is insulted by this. A great show is made to express his anger. The booming voice booms louder, the smoke becomes thicker, the image more vitriolic.

However, in the middle of all of the chaos, Toto breaks loose from Dorothy and runs to a portion of the room hidden behind a curtain. Jumping on the curtain, he pulls it back to reveal a small man at an elaborate control panel. As the man pushes each button, the image and voice of The Wizard is activated.


When the little man turns and realizes Dorothy and her friends see him for what he really is, he pulls the curtain closed and screams into the microphone “pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!”

As I watched this scene I was smitten with the irony of his command. The little man commanded Dorothy and her friends to ignore the reality of the moment in order to buy in to a myth: The myth that he was “The Great and Powerful Wizard of Oz.” He commanded them to ignore what they absolutely knew as truth in order to believe a lie. He commanded them to ignore every sensory skill in order to perpetuate a theatrical persona.

There are powerful voices in Christianity who want to hide what is behind the curtain. These voices boom with authority, but lack Pentecostal power. And at the tender age of forty, I now realize that some things cannot be hidden behind a curtain. I simply refuse to suspend everything I see in the Word, feel in my spirit and know intellectually.

Religion, far too often, fails in the areas of truthfulness and transparency. Religion, based upon faulty oral tradition, is useless. It is time for truthfulness. It is time for introspection. It is time for a return to God’s Word.

Everything else is a myth, and I am tired of giving my life to lies. How sad to work, and build, and give to a paradigm only to discover that all of the effort was wasted on a faulty theological premise.

Truth, once revealed, demands close inspection. Do not allow blind allegiance to men and their traditions trump what God reveals to you through His Word and by His Spirit.


Pay close attention to that man behind the curtain.

Boy, did you say a mouthful there...

Sherri 08-24-2008 08:37 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by HeavenlyOne (Post 574031)
It's called New Life something or other....LOL! It's in West Frankfort, IL.

It used to be Glad Tidings church that was pastored by not one, but two women for over 40 years!!

Both passed on in recent years, and a former UPC preacher took it over and it's doing great!

They don't have a Christ Church in these parts.

Glad Tidings...........wow! That brings back a truckload of memories for me. Can you tell us who the pastor is now? Or PM me.

HeavenlyOne 08-24-2008 09:26 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sherri (Post 574189)
Glad Tidings...........wow! That brings back a truckload of memories for me. Can you tell us who the pastor is now? Or PM me.

Kevin Edwards. He was an associate pastor in Mt. Vernon before taking the church in WF.

It's a really nice church. I didn't expect it to be as big as it is.

Charnock 09-01-2010 02:10 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nahum (Post 573773)
Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtain!

Recently, my daughter and I revisited her love affair with the old film classic The Wizard of Oz. Over the course of my life I have seen portions of the film, but never disciplined myself to watch the entire thing. Fantasy flicks never have been of much interest to me.

However, this time Rebecca asked me to watch the whole thing with her, and I complied. I suppose I gave in because I knew she was leaving, this week, for her freshman year of College and I wanted to spend every moment I could with her, even if that meant watching The Wizard of Oz.

So we sat and watched it, eating our popcorn and drinking our soda pop.

I must admit that I enjoyed it. To be sure, it is corny theatre. The film alternates from black and white to color. The main characters are Dorothy, her dog Toto, a scarecrow, tin man and a cowardly lion.

Each character seems to be missing something in life. Dorothy and Toto miss home, the scarecrow is missing a brain, the tin man a heart and the cowardly lion courage.

In order to find what is missing, the group is directed to “follow the yellow brick road” because it leads to The Wizard of Oz. They are directed to The Wizard because it is believed he is the only one with the power to give them what they lack.

And so, through many dangers, they follow the road. They do as instructed. They trust the instructions given. The group fights imps, a wicked witch and their own personal imperfections to reach The Wizard.



www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZR64EF3OpA
When at last they reach The Emerald City, and gain audience with The Wizard, they enter a chamber filled with smoke and a dazzling light. The frightening image of The Wizard is seen on a wall and his booming voice rains down at them.

When given a chance to speak, Dorothy makes her plea for help. She informs The Wizard that the group has completed its mission, that the Wicked Witch of the West is dead and that she and her friends expect to be rewarded for their heroic acts.

The Wizard is insulted by this. A great show is made to express his anger. The booming voice booms louder, the smoke becomes thicker, the image more vitriolic.

However, in the middle of all of the chaos, Toto breaks loose from Dorothy and runs to a portion of the room hidden behind a curtain. Jumping on the curtain, he pulls it back to reveal a small man at an elaborate control panel. As the man pushes each button, the image and voice of The Wizard is activated.


When the little man turns and realizes Dorothy and her friends see him for what he really is, he pulls the curtain closed and screams into the microphone “pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!”

As I watched this scene I was smitten with the irony of his command. The little man commanded Dorothy and her friends to ignore the reality of the moment in order to buy in to a myth: The myth that he was “The Great and Powerful Wizard of Oz.” He commanded them to ignore what they absolutely knew as truth in order to believe a lie. He commanded them to ignore every sensory skill in order to perpetuate a theatrical persona.

There are powerful voices in Christianity who want to hide what is behind the curtain. These voices boom with authority, but lack Pentecostal power. And at the tender age of forty, I now realize that some things cannot be hidden behind a curtain. I simply refuse to suspend everything I see in the Word, feel in my spirit and know intellectually.

Religion, far too often, fails in the areas of truthfulness and transparency. Religion, based upon faulty oral tradition, is useless. It is time for truthfulness. It is time for introspection. It is time for a return to God’s Word.

Everything else is a myth, and I am tired of giving my life to lies. How sad to work, and build, and give to a paradigm only to discover that all of the effort was wasted on a faulty theological premise.

Truth, once revealed, demands close inspection. Do not allow blind allegiance to men and their traditions trump what God reveals to you through His Word and by His Spirit.


Pay close attention to that man behind the curtain.

Excellent post!

rgcraig 09-01-2010 02:11 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Baawaaahhhaaa!

Charnock 09-01-2010 02:14 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
:)

MissBrattified 09-01-2010 02:15 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
There's a whole lot of tootin' goin' on. :D

Ferd 09-01-2010 02:20 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Hows the young lady doing in college?

Charnock 09-01-2010 02:21 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ferd (Post 958201)
Hows the young lady doing in college?

Just started her junior year. Doing great!

Ferd 09-01-2010 02:24 PM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Charnock (Post 958202)
Just started her junior year. Doing great!

sweet! You are a blessed man!

iceniez 09-02-2010 04:15 AM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mizpeh (Post 573793)
Jude 1:16 These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, having men's persons in admiration because of advantage.

(I know this is out of context, but it fits the bill..)

AMEN

DAII 09-02-2010 06:35 AM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
Poster child for multiple personality disorder!

mfblume 09-02-2010 10:58 AM

Re: Pay no Attention to That Man Behind the Curtai
 
One thing that may add additional insight to the illustration of the man behind the curtain (unless someone else already noted this) is that the author of the story intended OZ to represent the OUNCE count of gold. OZ is the abbreviation for ounces. And the yellow brick road speaks of gold bars. The EMERALD (green) city speaks of money and cash. Dorothy's shoes were originally SILVER in the books, and not ruby. The moral of the story is that the man behind the curtain was in it for the money, and really could not provide anyone with a mind, a heart and courage! But everyone found that out afterwards after being duped to seek these things from those sources, and came to the realization of what they already had, anyway.


hmmmm....


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:42 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2026, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.