When will the US Become Completely Socialistic?
 

Anyone know?

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

last Friday.

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

Is that the day everyone decided to vote for Obama?

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

well its the day most of congress signed on to elimiate RISK from the capitalist equasion.... that my friend is socialism at its best.

electing Obama will simply be one more nail in the coffin.

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

True dat... now we just know which conservatives were really liberal spys :club

Honestly.... the economy isn't so bad. I make more money now then I ever did and my shoes are brand new.... Congress needs to take a vacation.

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

Many people are overreacting to this. We are a long ways away from being a truely socialist nation. Even Europe isn't truely socialist. Russia/Cuba has not come to the US.

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P.S. the public office I told you guys I hold has nothing to do with economics....

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

Well Ferd, I will admit my surprise.

You now say what many of us have been saying for a while.

America as we knew it has died.

And say, how about that ecomomy of ours?

Oh wait, it isn't ours anymore, is it?

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

Bro. we are a long way from dead. and we can come back from this.... we did it in the 1980s.

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

no, we've still got a way to go.

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

I disagree.

This is a different America.

The old one is gone, and it ain't coming back.

Now...go ahead and label me negative.

Your attempts at marginalization have been quite entertaining.

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

Communision is not socialism

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

You can have a socialistic Democracy.

When they make the NAU I suspect will be the beginning of the end

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

What kind of freaks me out in the present scenario is that both China and Russia are emergent strongholds of creditor status while we are utterly dependant on outsiders putting their faith in there being value in our credit worthiness over periods like 10 and 30 years into the future.

Who da thunk that our military in the early '90's would have been so vital in securing our best hope for financial survival, freeing us from complete dependance from a communist country being the only buyer of our debt. The folks from Abu Dhabi at least provide some kind of marketplace that is buying up our foolish debt THAT IS NOT a government with an eye toward world domination!

Maybe if we end up being acquired or merging with another nation we can be the United States and Arab Emirates (if they are the purchasers they may want their name on the top of the marquee).

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

The USSR fell because of economic collapse.

Not because of a newfound affinity for democracy (as has been verified).

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

Which America are you speaking of? the one that existed before 1805 and the Alien and sedidtion act? Or the one where Aaron Burr was killing Alexander Hamelton?

Maybe Jacksonian America that included wonderful things like the trail of tears?

America before the Civil War where millions were slaves?

Reconstruction America where millions more were forced into abject poverty as the North punished the south?

Are you speaking of the America of the Robber Barons that pilllaged America and left children chained to work stations with little food and dangerous working conditions?

Are you talking about the Pre-Depression America of speak easy's and gangsters wreaking havoc on America?

or the soup lines of the 1930's and the Hoovervilles? When FDR introduced Socalism to America and while saving some from starvation, led others into instatutionalized poverty for generations?

Are you talking about post WW2 America of the 1940's and early 50's that ended up breading a generation of fools who came of age in the 1960's? When the Beaver was living a perfect life in the subburbs all the while his parents were insuring black folk couldnt drink from the same water fountain the Beav got to dring from?

Or how about those 1960's with the riots and deep socalist agenda of LBJ?

or are you talking about the 1970's and the gas lines and a stagnant economy and runaway inflation?

Or are you talking about the early 80's when we had double digit interest rates?

or the 1990's when we had a technology boom and crazy government regulation forcing banks to make the bad loans that we are dealing with now?

Or are you talking about pre-9/11 2000's when we all thought things were peachy keen while muslim terrorists were about to stick a knife in our ribs?

or post 9/11 when we traded some freedom for some security?


my brother, in every decade of every century of American History we have faced what we face now. and decade after decade we have made the decisions that have made america both great and yet imperfect.

America IS and IDEAL and my friend, there has never been a time when we Americans have fully lived up to it!

I will tell you like Margerate Thatcher told George Sr. Dont go wobbly on me!

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

Ferd I appreciate you offering a larger perspective.

I find no pleasure in the failure of my country, my brethren, and my own household, resulting from having brought upon ourselves a trap through reckless acquisition of debt.

We are all linked together by the marketplace wherever we call home.

But I do believe we are seeing the end of something that everyone knew was not sustainable....were pleasingly surprised how long it was sustainable...but are now going to learn that...just because something is slow to come, don't be deceived....we shall reap what we sow.

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

First, we are not friends - that I know of.

Second, American sovereignty is dead.

That is the difference.

Our founders are spinning in their graves.

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

Every large power fails eventually but they all don't lose their sovereignity. Look at England.

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

So how are you charting your future?
What approach are you taking to best provide for your family in the months and years ahead?

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

Gee, that's a rather private matter isn't it?

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

The economy is not America, the government is not America. The people that stand for what is America still exist and the fact that congress voted for a bill that taxpayers were 10 - 1 against just shows you that people are a lot smarter then what we think.

A corrupt government does not mean a corrupt America, a screwed up economy does not mean a screwed up America.

When people stop equating our power to our pocketbooks and our brains to the size our leaders we will know we have made some progress.

The ideology that is the constitution is not what this country runs on. The ideology that is our constitution is still as powerful as it ever was.

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

Well said...

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

What is your point?

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

On the bolded portion...

I am increasingly shocked and amazed at the number of people who do not know that this debt based living was not a sustainable one.

Perhaps if more realized that things could have been different.

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

WASHINGTON - The White House said on Wednesday it was "despicable" that American International Group Inc. executives spent hundreds of thousands of dollars on a posh California retreat just days after getting a federal bailout.

Lawmakers investigating the meltdown of AIG said the retreat didn't include anyone from the financial products division that nearly drove the company under, but they were still enraged that executives of AIG's main U.S. life insurance subsidiary spent $440,000 on the retreat, complete with spa treatments, banquets and golf outings.

Economic collaspe? Not if these guys can help it. We may become the biggest group of serfs cleaning these men's toliets. But the sad thing is these people will be replaced with others just like them.

Keep preaching the truth as hard as you can!!! Holiness or hell!


In Jesus name

Brother Benincasa

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

This thread is not about economic despair... or whatever it is that says... my monitor is too small to read that...

This is about economic progressiveness vs conservatism....

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

Many equate Socialism to Communism and then look at Europe and other European Nations and say "They are not Socialists"...because they don't see communism

You can have a democracy and still be socialist

Wikipedia
Socialism refers to a broad set of economic theories of social organization advocating state or collective ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods, and the creation of an egalitarian society.[1][2] Modern socialism originated in the late nineteenth-century working class political movement. Karl Marx posited that socialism would be achieved via class struggle and a proletarian revolution, it being the transitional stage between capitalism and communism.[3][4]
Socialists mainly share the belief that capitalism unfairly concentrates power and wealth into a small section of society who control capital, and creates an unequal society. All socialists advocate the creation of an egalitarian society, in which wealth and power are distributed more evenly, although there is considerable disagreement among socialists over how, and to what extent this could be achieved.[1]
Socialism is not a discrete philosophy of fixed doctrine and program; its branches advocate a degree of social interventionism and economic rationalization, sometimes opposing each other. Another dividing feature of the socialist movement is the split on how a socialist economy should be established between the reformists and the revolutionaries. Some socialists advocate complete nationalization of the means of production, distribution, and exchange; while others advocate state control of capital within the framework of a market economy. Social democrats propose selective nationalization of key national industries in mixed economies combined with tax-funded welfare programs; Libertarian socialism (which includes Socialist Anarchism and Libertarian Marxism) rejects state control and ownership of the economy altogether and advocates direct collective ownership of the means of production via co-operative workers' councils and workplace democracy.
In the 1970s and the 1980s, Yugoslavian, Hungarian, Polish and Chinese Communists instituted various forms of market socialism combining co-operative and State ownership models with the free market exchange.[5] This is unlike the earlier theoretical market socialist proposal put forth by Oskar Lange in that it allows market forces, rather than central planners to guide production and exchange.[6] Anarcho-syndicalists, Luxemburgists (such as those in the Socialist Party USA) and some elements of the United States New Left favor decentralized collective ownership in the form of cooperatives or workers' councils.

BTW Even though the ideal is that all are equal socially and economically that has never been true even in Communistic societies. Communisim creates a two caste system basically the elite and the have nots who are all equal.

it makes everyone equally poor except for a handful of elites who also control the government

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

They should spend that bailout money on padding the 401ks and other investment accounts of the people who are going to be hurt the most by this then make it possible for them to move their monies to somewhere safer for the moment. Giving the billions of money to people like THAT? that is as risky as the loans they gave to illegal immigrants who, btw, I heard on the radio make up several MILLION in forclosures...while most Americans had a hard time getting those loans to begin with.

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

I don't think America will ever be completely socialistic. We have a mixed economy that I believe will ebb and flow given the economic landscape. Those who are not flexible enough philosophically to see when a change in direction is needed will prove to be the problem rather they be from the right or the left.

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

Just as 9/11 brought compromises in our freedoms this economic failure and the fear mongering over it will probably also lead to more compromises.

Half the reason the market falls is over fears. Terrorism is about fear. It is a powerful emotions and leaders and elitests have been using it for years to manipulate people to change....even into hating Jews and being ok with their persecution.

It creates the climate for people to look for a savior...an anti-christ and social, political and economic change

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

I see your point now... note though that communism is not anything we have seen in a government what we have seen is a flawed form of a perfect system.

Anyway Also this thread is NOT about economic despair can people please stop talking about the bailout and what not. This thread is about the government, not economics.

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

Never.

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

Well I think the reason they mention the economy is perhaps they see it leading to something closer to Socialism...and on that level there is talk of nationalizing our banking system

As the financial crisis continues, the Bush administration, led by Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson, is moving ahead to enact the unconstitutional and socialistic measures contained in the recently passed and misleadingly nicknamed "bailout bill" — misleading not because it's not a bailout, but because it's much more than that.
This bill — officially the Emergency Economic Stabilization Act of 2008 — is, along with the Treasury Department's "Blueprint for a Modernized Financial Regulatory Structure," about nationalizing the entire United States financial system, a truly radical act that will hasten the United States of America along the road to total socialism.
It was Karl Marx who famously recommended, in the Communist Manifesto, the "centralization of credit in the hands of the state, by means of a national bank with state capital and an exclusive monopoly." (Emphasis added.) For almost a century we have had a national bank, the Federal Reserve, which has enjoyed a monopoly over the money supply but not over all credit. To the extent that both state and nationally chartered banks and other financial entities still enjoy some independence in the issuance of credit, the Fed's monopoly over financial activities is diluted.

Now, however, armed with supposed authority from the bailout bill, Treasury Secretary Paulson is preparing to partly nationalize a number of major U.S. banks by purchasing dodgy assets in exchange for government ownership of company stock. In this Paulson is swimming in the wake of the British government, which has already partly nationalized various troubled banks using such a procedure. Paulson himself, asked about his intentions and whether he planned to follow the British lead, was evasive. "We have a broad range of authorities and tools," he said. "We've emphasized the purchase of liquid assets, but we have a broad range of authorities. And I'm confident we have the authorities we need to work with going forward."


read the rest of what this guy says here
http://www.thenewamerican.com/econom...ainmenu-46/412

Re: When will the US Become Completely Socialistic
 

True dat, but this thread has gone down hill with all this economics talk... I'm done.