UPCI Ministers and Televison
 

I relize I may get blasted by many or ignored for starting this thread.

This thread is not about standards but about telling the truth.

If you are a licensed minister with the UPCI and have a televison PLEASE explain your stanch on it.
I do not have a current manual, but am aware of what is stated in the 2006 manual, Article VII, Section 7, #31, under Ministry.

As of 2007 the application for a license still had the question, do you have a televison?

How can one preach the truth yet live a lie?

Re: UPCI Ministers and Televison
 

stanch? Did you mean stench? :ursofunny

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You're good.

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Easy, have your wife buy it and say it's hers.:aaa

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Define TV? cable? just dvd player but no cable?

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Maybe I should have used the word STAND instead?????

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A TV can receive outside signals. A monitor by its self can only pick up what is set to it. No signals from TV stations unless modified. Cable would allow you to pick up outside signals.
If you have a monitor and a dvd player, I'm cool. But if you are using a tV as a monitor then do you not have a tv also?

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That is a cop out and a lot are using it. Does that make it ok.

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Hey, my owns the laptop I'm using, it's belongs to here, sure it can work the same for TV. :tease

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I don't have a dog in this race and deleted my comment...Sorry I didn't delete it prior to your posting. It would be cable and dvd player.

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Very true, but the UPCI has not taken a stand against internet as they have for a minister having a tv.

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I'm sorry I mistyped I meant my wife owns a laptop and it's hers so the same could said about TV. Refering to how someone can play semantics with saying they don't own a TV but their wife does.

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I understand, but the manual is very clear on what it states.

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I will check back later, have a death call to make.

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Who needs a TV when you have this wonderful thing called the internet. Who wants to flip the switch on when you can just go to your local computer and find all the neat stuff going on in your local church community, right on the internet. So much more can happen and keep good people busy. :stirpot

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If the above is true, then pastors ought not be surprised or disappointed when saints use the same kind of tap dancing regarding whatever standards issue they may want to get away with. Wouldn't it be fair? "Whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap?"

SOS

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We've been over this before. They call a television a monitor. Legalism is a wonderful thing..... not!!!!!!!!!

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True story: A minister in the church I pastor, who was in the UPC at the time was getting ordained. Honestly, he put down that he did have a TV on his ordination application. The Presbyter called and asked him about it and said, "You don't really have a TV do you?" The minister replied that he did. The Presbyter said, "No, you really don't have a TV right?" The minister said that he was looking right at it in his living room. The Presbyter replied, "No, you really don't have a TV. What you have is a monitor. I will change your application to reflect that you do, indeed have a monitor." The minister told him that he could call it whatever he wanted but that it was, in fact a TV.

No more questions were asked and the minister was ordained in UPCI. Don't think for a moment that all the District and National officials follow the manual to the letter. They most certainly don't. Maybe they need to enact a more strict Affirmation Statement for the officials. I'm sure that would rid the org of the liberals! :D

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Why?

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I have more respect for the man that did not lie than that for the Presbyter who used a play on words. I agree they should have a strict Affirmation Statement for the officials.

You know what hurts the most. I was raised in the UPCI and would hold licenses in it today except I could not / would not tell that lie. I love the UPCI, but it hurts me to see and know several ministers who will do wrong and a blind eye by others be turned to it. Where is their love for the truth. They say they stand for the Word of God. I've talked to a few and they say it's for the better good. I must ask, where does this thinking come from?

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I'm not agains't the UPCI,I'm not apart of it,hows does the manual explain the difference about advertising on TV,and a person owning one ?

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According to the UPCI bylaws, a minister can...

• Have a television program, but not a television.
  
• Advertise on television, but not own one.
  
• Watch anything on the internet, including porn, but not own a television.
  
• Watch television anywhere but in his own home, unless his wife or kids "own" the television.
  
• Purchase full seasons of television programs.

Herein is the problem with legalism. There is always a loophole. A minister can watch anything, literally ANYTHING on the internet. Shows from abc.com, cbs.com, fox.com and much more of the exact same content found on the box we call television.

The trouble is, you seem to worship the almighty manual. Why not return to the Word of God?

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So, if you are you are not in the UPCI, why in the world do you even care?

Do I detect bitterness?

Two words.

Move on.

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To watch the church commercials that same manual said that can be produced by UPCI ministers.

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No.

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I think you mean "stance" :tease

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Are you saying that owning a TV should be the "litmus" test for fellowship?

Certainly, you're not serious? Of all the things a minister could be doing and some ARE doing, you're concerned about someone committing the heinous crime of owning a TV? MANY UPC officials own TV's. Dude, the camel's nose is in the tent and you're just a wee bit too late on this one!

There is absolutely NO WAY that "they" will EVER rid the UPC of TV. It's just too late and the internet has made it a moot point anyway! :D

Re: UPCI Ministers and Televison
 

Originally Posted by tv1a
We've been over this before. They call a television a monitor. Legalism is a wonderful thing..... not!!!!!!!!!Be careful here. While there is some truth to his statement, as some do just that. (and they are wrong for it.)
His statement is a (very large) blanket statement covering not just the hypocrites who say "I have no TV, I have a monitor" But they get the same channels everyone else with a TV has. It also covers every other person who has any reservations about TV, and limiting/abandoning its use in general.

Yes, it strongly gives the impression that the author holds ......disdain towards anyone who stands for limited use of video entertainment.
If its a screen, and can play video only from an external source and there is no broadcast video feed into it, then it is a monitor.

Some people feel that is perfectly OK, and do not receive or watch broadcast TV.
Some people seem to believe that that is hypocritical and that if you wont watch TV then you should disallow all types of video, screens of any type, often including Internet, and submit yourself to being labeled an ultra con, right wing nut job.

They often also believe that if you watch anything in any form you should permit everything because there is no difference between watching "finding nemo" on the DVD player fed to a monitor and watching "SAW3" on broadcast HBO. No difference between email, news, and Christian forums on the web than having the family sit down for an "American pie" marathon on TV.

It's so easy to bash anyone who rejects TV when you can lump them all into the ultra con hypocrite handbag. It makes opening ones mind unnecessary.
It also makes it very easy to justify ones own view of accepting whatever comes over the TV guide, when you can view anyone else as hypocrites.

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Lets not play games here.
It has nothing to do with "committing the heinous crime of owning a TV".
It has everything to do with saying you won't do something, saying you are not doing something, and then doing it anyway.

That was the whole nature of his question.
Had he asked it about chewing bubble gum, everyone would have been discussing the hypocrisy of saying you wont, but chewing it anyway.

Throw TV into it, and people have a hissy fit going off on tangents defending their pet ideals on TV, totally missing the point of the post.

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Oh puulleezzz. Put down the "self righteous" bull horn.

You ask "where is their love for the truth" and then in the next sentence talk about standing for the "Word of God". Yet your argument is against a rule of man not the Word of God..

I have spoken to some pastors also and have found that the general opinion is they will sign the little card because over all the UPC is a good organization to be a part of. But they do not neccesarily agree with everything. I am a member of a UPC church. We have members who don't adhere to the "custom" standards but are still very much Holy Ghost filled saints of God.

If they have a TV in their home and use it to watch dvd's or such.. oh well.

Personally its a double standard to allow internet without restrictions but not TV. Another falicy of the UPC. They have several. But I have always been a member and don't fore see that changing. It is a great group in bringing together the body of Christ.

Funny, everyone claims we can not be perfect yet they expect UPC to be perfect. Of course thats probably because its in the manual that the UPC is perfect. Forgot what section, paragraph, article.

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Charnock has it correct.

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What does the Word of God say about lying?

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No bitterness, because I love the UPCI. I think it's a shame it happens. Ministers calling it whatever tv or monitor and as someone said they can get it all from the internet plus some. But no hard core stand from the UPCI on the internet.

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If you love it so much, why are you not a part of it.?

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I will fellowship with most all. Even those that did tell the White Lie:ursofunny

I own a tv and watch it. But if a minister will say what ever to get a license where doe he stand?

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Scotty, I must ask am I to obey those that have rule over me? If so does the UPCI set the rules that a UPCI minister should follow? Yes it is a good organization but as all do it has problems. You said "It is a great group in bringing together the body of Christ". Did Chist tell lies.

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I'm very much a part of it my friend. I'm licsensed with the ALJC's because I could not/would not tell that lie on the paper and I attend a UPCI church where I am the assisitant pastor.
I have a great pastor who stands by me and understands where I'm coming from and helped me get into the ALJC.

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Hmmm. good point ! So if those directly over us do not obey those over them then we should just walk away or ignore their rule.

Coool. That would include pretty much every police officer, mayor, governor, district attorney............. well , now that you mention it, I guess our momma's was just simply wrong to tell us what to do.

Starting to see why Jesus saved perfection for resurection instead of at salvation? We can't handle it.

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LOL. As you say Scotty. As you say.
On a different note I see you're from Arkansas. Same here. What part.
White Hall

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I dont know why some of you choose to cloud the issue, when the issue is actually pretty straightforward here.

If they sign something saying they wont own a TV in their homes, then they should honor their word. To do otherwise is dishonest. Plain and simple, it's lying.

If they insist they want to have a TV in their house, then they shouldn't sign something pledging that they wont own one. Again, if a man signs an agreement knowing that he intends to violate it (or is already violating it and plans to keep doing so), then he's not being truthful. What's wrong with expecting a man to keep his word?

It's not even an issue of whether it's acceptable or not for an Apostolic minister to have a TV at home. That's not being debated here; and good men can and will always disagree on that issue. But I think we should all be able to agree that if a man gives his word, verbally or by signing something, he should keep his word. That is the honorable way for a man to conduct himself, not just before man, but also in the sight of God.