Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghost?
 

Why does God give us the baptism of the Holy Ghost?

Is the gift a reward for a person's "perfect" repentance?

Is the gift given as a token of God's approval of us?

Why does God give the gift of the Holy Ghost to people who have not been baptized in Jesus' name?

How can they be qualified to receive it without baptism?

What is the purpose of Holy Ghost infilling?

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

It's part of the new birth

It's part of the New convenant.

It helps us to overcome the word and our flesh'
;
It's the earnest of our inheritance.

To teach us.

To give us boldness to testify about Christ.

There's probaby some things I'm missiing.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Mizpeh, why did Holy Spirit baptism precede water baptism on the Day of Pentecost?

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Ok I know this is old news but how could Elizabeth be filled with the holyghost before pentecost. Are there 2 holyghost..... One before pentecost and one after.....

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

It could have been a renewing? Or maybe "a taste of things to come" But there's defiantly only one Holy Ghost . :)

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

I do believe repentance has to be a precursor to receiving the Holy Ghost. God isn't going to forcefully fill an unrepentant heart!

Obviously the Holy Ghost can be poured out on someone who hasn't yet been baptized--it happened in scriptural examples. However, it seems that the apostles were fairly prompt about encouraging new believers to be baptized immediately, so I think they felt it was important.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

and....wasn't that to declare to the public WHO they were following after they received the Holy Ghost?

Not so much they weren't saved until they were baptized, but to let everyone know they were saved?

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Please understand, I am not questioning the necessity of water baptism. Everyone here should already know that I am a strong water/Spirit advocate.

I am asking why God even offers such a thing as Holy Ghost baptism.

What is the purpose?

Mizpeh says the Holy Ghost is part of the new birth process.

Anyone else?

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Ok if tongues are so important and to consider it the proof that you have the holyghost if it was that important do you think that it would have been mentioned that Elizabeth or any of the other ones that were filled with the holyghost to note they spoke in tongues.. Talking about recieving the holyghost with the evidence of speaking in tongues. I see tongues as a language to communicate gods messege in Acts not the stuff that is heard in churches today I do not link the holyghost and tongues together I just think god blessed them in Acts to be able to get the messege across in a language that other could understand. So my answer is he gave us the baptism of the holyghost because he promised it to us.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Why does anyone need to know I am saved???
It was actually a command in the Bible.
Acts 10:48And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.

Sounds Salvational to me.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

the disciples has already repented and been baptized.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Not debating tongues or anything its just when one links the baptism of the holy ghost tongues aways get worked in there with it..

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

I offered more than that.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

People that are truly repentant receive can reason the baptism of The Holy Ghost,of course there are many reasons for the need for HG baptism, according to scripture but just why does God give the Holy Ghost, to people that I am not totally sure of but I am glad He does.God does have His reasons and since I am not God I don't know all of His reasoning all I can do is read His word,and be a witness of that word.

But I feel the biblical pattern after repentance,is Spirit Baptism and water baptism in the name of Jesus Christ.Repentance is a starting place but spirit baptism,and baptism in the name of Jesus Christ are not options.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

For one can a person be regenerated without having the Spirit of God in their lives ?
Is there a biblical difference between receiving the Holy Spirit and being baptized with The Holy Ghost.
After the ascension of Christ,His followers were not to teach and preach publicly anymore,until they were endued with power from on High.
They were commanded to wait in the upper room till the promise of The Father came to them personally.
The Baptism of The Holy Ghost seems foundational for the purpose of being a Christian witness.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Really?

By whom?

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Yes, you did.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Acts 1:8 (New International Version)
8But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth."

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Here is something of interest.
http://byonespirit.com/othertongues.htm

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

After one of interest.
http://www.johnnyleeclary.com/Holy_Spirit.htm

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

The baptism in the Spirit produces godliness in us.

Galatians 5:22-23 (New International Version)

But the fruit (end-result, culmination) of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Check this out.
http://www.isaiah58.com/

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Why do you think the Holy Ghost Baptism preceded water baptism on the Day of Pentecost?

The Holy Ghost Baptism was poured out on 120 disciples of Jesus. Most, if not all of them, would have already been baptized as disciples of John the Baptist or disciples of Jesus.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

There is only one Holy Ghost.
God is a Spirit.
Folks in the Old Testament were filled with the Holy Ghost. They were moved on by the Holy Ghost. They were used by the Holy Ghost. They were equipped and empowered by the Holy Ghost. God was active in and among them as the Holy Ghost.
The difference with the New Testament after Jesus ascended to the Father is that:
In the Old Testament the empowering or filling of the Holy Ghost was for those who served God as prophets, leaders, artisans, craftsmen, etc but not promised to everyone. In the NT, the promise is to all believers.
Also, these experiences in the Old Testament seem to be limited to those of Israel while in the New Testament the promise is for Jews and Gentiles.
Speaking with tongues is not recorded in the Old Testament whereas in the New Testament when folks were baptized in the Spirit some time it is recorded that they spoke with tongues and prophesied.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Sam do you believe that they were filled with the holyghost and god gave them the ability to speak in another language (i.e tongues) to spread the gospel.. in the book of Acts

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Some were followers of John the Baptist before they followed Jesus so they had been baptized by John. Others were disciples of Jesus so we assume they were baptized when they joined up with Him.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Ummmm...no...I don't think baptism is just an announcement. Is that what you believe? I believe baptism is for the remission of sins. Past, present and future.

And I firmly believe that it matters HOW you are baptized, else John's disciples would not have needed to be re-baptized.

There's one scripture that says if you believe, your sins are remitted, and then in another place, Philip told the eunuch he could be baptized IF he believed, and AFTER the eunuch had confessed his believe that Jesus was the Son of God, Philip baptized him. I don't see anywhere in Acts where the apostles separated repentance and baptism as part of salvation. They always "filled in the missing pieces of the puzzle. If someone had repented, they baptized them, and prayed for them to receive the Holy Ghost. If they had repented and been baptized, they prayed for them to receive the Holy Ghost. If they hadn't done anything, they tried to get them to turn their hearts toward Christ (first) as believers. If they had repented, and received the Holy Ghost, they led them to baptism.

I am a firm "3-stepper." I believe a person must repent of their sins, be filled with the Holy Ghost, and be baptized in Jesus' name in order to be saved. I don't think it matters whether you're baptized first or get the Holy Ghost first, but I think scriptural instruction and scriptural example shows repeatedly these three things working together to convert.

Why would we want to do things any differently than the apostles?

One of the issues I have with being too accepting of trinitarian doctrine as being just another version of what we believe, is that then there seems to be no recourse to lead them to a more excellent way. YES, they are believers, YES, they have repented, and YES they are disciples, but I firmly believe if Peter was speaking to one of these repentant, believing disciples, he would say, "What hinders you from being baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus?" And then he would lay hands on them and pray for the Holy Ghost to fall on them (if it hasn't already).

When we are so afraid of offending other believers/disciples that we feel we can't lead them into a better way, then something is WRONG.

Of course, I don't read where any of those disciples ever answered back and said, "Peter, what are you saying? Are you saying we aren't saved because we only repented? Are you saying we have to do more or we'll be lost?"

If they had asked those questions, what would the apostles have answered?

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

No.

On the Day of Pentecost about 120 people were baptized in the Spirit and spoke with tongues. Some of the languages were understood by those around them. Then Peter stood and preached to them all in a language all could understand.

After the Samaritans were saved and baptized in water in Acts chapter 8, the Jerusalem church sent Peter and John to minister the Holy Spirit Baptism to them. When they spoke with tongues, there would be nobody there to preach to.

Same with those of the household of Cornelius in Acts chapter 10. Peter preached to them in a language they understood. They believed what Peter preached and suddenly they began to speak with tongues as they were baptized in the Spirit. Again, there was nobody to preach to in tongues.

In Acts 19 when Paul found some disciples there and asked if they had received the Holy Spirit. They obviously understood him and he understood them. When they received the Holy Ghost Baptism later when he laid hands on them the record says they spoke with tongues and prophesied. Again, there was no need of preaching in tongues.

From examples in the Book of Acts, the Holy Ghost Baptism is seen as an experience available to all who have been converted. It is some times recorded that folks spoke with tongues after they received the experience and some times tongues are not mentioned. Based on the records of speaking with tongues in the Book of Acts, some have concluded that the Holy Ghost Baptism is always accompanied with speaking with tongues and others have not reached that conclusion.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

My thoughts, too. Also, doesn't it say somewhere that the Holy Ghost is the power of the resurrection or something like that? I can't remember the exact quote, but I've heard it preached that if you don't have the Holy Ghost, you will not be resurrected.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

I see no record that the eunuch spoke in tongues in Acts 8.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

I think you are referring to
But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you. Romans 8:11

There are differences of opinion on here and among Christians as to whether the Holy Ghost Baptism is the same experience as the birth of the Spirit.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

No, nor does it say that he was filled with the Holy Ghost. :) We don't know what happened to the eunuch, except that he "went on his way rejoicing."

I'm not saying that he didn't receive the Holy Ghost, I'm just saying you can't say that he did, without tongues, because the scripture doesn't say one way or the other. What is silent for me, is just as silent for you.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Yes, that's it! Thank you!!!!

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Yet you alluded to a pattern of conversion in Acts ... this pattern being ... repentance, water baptism, tongues .... only is cited in 3 instances of conversions ... not all ... Paul's, jailer's, eunuch's, 3000, etc.

This does not a pattern make, IMO.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

Well, IMO, it does. :D

I didn't say the pattern was repentance, baptism and tongues, btw--I said "repentance, baptism and being filled with the Holy Ghost."

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

As an added conversation piece, let me ask this...

MissBrattified, you and I believe that repentance, baptism and Holy Ghost infilling are essential to the New Birth. Can we say that we are commanded to recieve the Holy Ghost?

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

So one can be filled with the Holy Ghost and not speak in tongues?

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

btw, Paul was baptized after receiving the Holy Ghost...how does that not fit into the pattern I mentioned?

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

No, tongues are not mentioned there. He did have a conversion (born again) experience or else Philip would not have baptized him according to the way I understand verses 36-37

36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?
37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
38 And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.
39 And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord fell upon the Eunuch and the angel of the Lord snatched Philip away, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.

A couple of things are not mentioned here.
It does not say how Philip baptized the eunuch but we know from verses 12 and 16 that Philip baptized in Jesus name. We also assume that when the Spirit fell upon the eunuch that he spoke with tongues.

Re: Why Does God Give the Baptism of the Holy Ghos
 

I believe the Holy Ghost is working in the lives of believers from the moment they repent, but NO, they are not baptized with the Holy Ghost until they are baptized, and I believe speaking in other tongues is evidence of that baptism.

IF people are filled with the Holy Ghost when they believe or repent, then why did the apostles pray for believers to be filled?