Signs and Wonders NOT always a sign
 

Deu 13:1 "If a prophet or a dreamer of dreams arises among you and gives you a sign or a wonder,
Deu 13:2 and the sign or wonder that he tells you comes to pass, and if he says, 'Let us go after other gods,' which you have not known, 'and let us serve them,'
Deu 13:3 you shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams. For the LORD your God is testing you, to know whether you love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul.

Just because someone is associated with a miracle does not mean the doctrine they teach is the truth.

Re: Signs and Wonders NOT always a sign
 

Can you expound on this a little more, is there a specific miracle or sign connected with this thread?

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Did you read the verses? lol

There is nothing to expound on. The verses make it clear.

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That verse is scary! But I would definitely agree with it-

You have to try the spirits just because a person can do a miracle or a sign or wonder-does not mean they can not be wrong doctrinally

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AMEN!

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Amen. Paul praised the Bereans for testing his words verses the bible. He did not get uppity and say "Look! I am an Apostle. I have worked Miracles. Just accept what I say unconditionally"...Paul reasoned from the word of God.

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I believe the VAST majority of these signs and wonders from false prophets and teachers are nothing but trickery. In today's church (ok, ANY group of believers where the belief in question is supernatural in origin) it is so very easy for someone to perform a trick obtained from a magic book aimed at Elementary age kids and "wow!" a whole congregation.
It is much simpler for the bible to simply instruct us to judge the motive of the performer rather than go into immensely more detail about what is trickery and what is real. Much simpler and ultimately gets us to the same place.

Re: Signs and Wonders NOT always a sign
 

False Ministers and Miracles

1 John 4:1
(1) Beloved, BELIEVE NOT EVERY SPIRIT, BUT TRY THE SPIRITS WHETHER THEY ARE OF GOD: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

Deuteronomy 13:1-5
(1) If there ARISE AMONG YOU A PROPHET, OR A DREAMER OF DREAMS, AND GIVETH THEE A SIGN OR A WONDER,
(2) And THE SIGN OR THE WONDER COME TO PASS, whereof he spoke unto thee, saying, Let us go after other gods, which thou hast not known, and let us serve them;
(3) Thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams: FOR THE LORD YOUR GOD PROVETH YOU, TO KNOW WHETHER YE LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL.
(4) Ye shall walk after the LORD your God, and fear him, and keep his commandments, and obey his voice, and ye shall serve him, and cleave unto him.
(5) And that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams, shall be put to death; because he hath spoken to turn you away from the LORD your God, which brought you out of the land of Egypt, and redeemed you out of the house of bondage, to thrust thee out of the way which the LORD thy God commanded thee to walk in. So shalt thou put the evil away from the midst of thee.

Proverbs 14:15
(15) The simple believeth every word: but THE PRUDENT MAN LOOKETH WELL TO HIS GOING.

2 Corinthians 11:12-15
(12) But what I do, that I will do, that I may cut off occasion from them which desire occasion; that wherein they glory, they may be found even as we.
(13) For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
(14) And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
(15) Therefore IT IS NO GREAT THING IF HIS MINISTERS ALSO BE TRANSFORMED AS THE MINISTERS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS; whose end shall be according to their works.

Isaiah 66:4
(4) I ALSO WILL CHOOSE THEIR DELUSIONS, and will bring their fears upon them; BECAUSE WHEN I CALLED, NONE DID ANSWER; WHEN I SPAKE, THEY DID NOT HEAR: but they did evil before mine eyes, and chose that in which I delighted not.

2 Thessalonians 2:7-13
(7) For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
(8) And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
(9) EVEN HIM, WHOSE COMING IS AFTER THE WORKING OF SATAN WITH ALL POWER AND SIGNS AND LYING WONDERS,
(10) And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; BECAUSE THEY RECEIVED NOT THE LOVE OF THE TRUTH, THAT THEY MIGHT BE SAVED.
(11) AND FOR THIS CAUSE GOD SHALL SEND THEM STRONG DELUSION, THAT THEY SHOULD BELIEVE A LIE:
(12) THAT THEY ALL MIGHT BE DAMNED WHO BELIEVED NOT THE TRUTH, BUT HAD PLEASURE IN UNRIGHTEOUSNESS.
(13) But we are bound to give thanks always to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

There is a difference between a truthful statement and one that is biblical Truth. One could say that a preacher “fell in adultery,” and be correct. That would then be a “truthful” statement. Another could say that the Bible teaches against adultery. That would be “biblical Truth.” Deception occurs when biblical Truth is perverted by false teachings or human behavior that’s contrary to Jesus' New Covenant message. When this occurs, biblical Truth is obscured. That was the problem with Simon the Sorcerer. He saw the power of God and wanted to preach it to his own gain. That meant he wanted to preach “biblical Truth” in a perverted way. The apostles rebuked him for his “wickedness.” They called him to repent...and even wrote of his sin (Acts 8).

The Apostles called sin, “sin.” They openly rebuked false prophets, ministers, and even sorcerers for the wickedness of their doctrine. Their rebuke was followed by a call for repentance. That was the apostolic way then, why should it be any different today? To see why such a stance is still “apostolic,” look at these: 1 Tim 5:19-21; Mat 18:15-20; Rom 16:17-18; 1 Cor 5:3-5; 2 The 3:6, 14-15; 1 Tim 6:5; 2 Joh 1:10-11. But if ever such as stance is deemed necessary, it should only be done through the love of Christ.

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The Bereans were a bunch of preacher haters. :)

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A most excellent post! But, alas, does there exist an assembly that has the spiritual courage to exercise their responsibilities as noted in the scriptures cited in your post?

A point to remember: One does not have to be a Spirit filled Christian to have and exercise true spiritual power. The laws that govern the spiritual universe work for everyone that operates in that environment, be they saint or demon. The story concerning the overwhelming power of a combined force of individuals is well documented in Genesis 11 and of individuals acting alone, as in Mt 24:24 & Mark 9:38-39.

Final comment: John 4:48, and Mt 12:39. Seeking after signs, wonders and miracles will be the downfall of many. Also see 2 Thess 2 & 3 for additional warnings and instructions.

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Prax, that is funny because I keep thinking of that scripture since RD's thread this week-

Acts 17:11
Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.

It is not a sin to search the scriptures to see if what one is being taught indeed in the word of God.

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Magic hair ?

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Obviously not all signs and wonders are of God. We should be warned and taught that. We should be trained in spirit and in truth. We should also come to understand that signs will follow believers. They will be a part of our lives.

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lol

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:shhh

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There is a true and a false... however some people it seems just run after signs...

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Signs and Wonders in the bible served to give the disciples boldness and to help the body.

It also drew attention to the speakers...that is when and why we must always be VERY careful and not conceited by our own success. Just because God used any one in the past does not mean he approves of ALL your doctrinal beliefs....else we'd all be believing the same thing

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Big fat AMEN to that.

Makes me want to ask another question. Do you think it is possible for someone to have discernment/knowing prior to receiving the Holy Ghost?

Reason I ask... I ALWAYS had extra-sensitive antennae (my grandmother had it too) - Sometimes I just KNEW things... also have an ability to sense danger (kinda like a dog's hair stands up). However, I will say, since receiving the HG, it has been MUCH stronger...

Any thoughts on this?

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Also, messages in tongues and interpretation and messages in prophecy should never be accepted without checking them against the Word of God.
Give no more credence to a prophecy or message in tongues and interpretation than you would to a sermon, testimony, etc.

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signs are to follow us
we are not to follow signs

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Amen!

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Naw, that is too simplistic.

I need to hear the preacher with the word of knowledge. HE'LL tell me what to do!

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I remember hearing someone say he had the gift of interruption.