Cosmetics???
 

Ok folks I've doing a little research on what the bible says about makeup and such. This not let's fight over standards thread, I just want others input ont he subject.

Let me start it off.

Isa 3:16

16 Moreover the LORD saith, Because the daughters of Zion are haughty, and walk with stretched forth necks and wanton eyes, walking and mincing as they go, and making a tinkling with their feet:
KJV


Isa 3:16

[And wanton eyes] "And falsely setting off their eyes with paint." Hebrew, falsifying their eyes. I take this to be the true meaning and literal rendering of the word; from shaaqar. The Masoretes have pointed it, as if it were from saaqar, a different word. This arose, as I imagine, from their supposing that the word was the same with saaqar, Chaldee, "intueri, innuere oculis;" or that it had an affinity with the noun sikra, which the Chaldeans, or the rabbis at least, use for stibium, the mineral which was commonly used in colouring the eyes. See Jarchi's comment on the place. Though the colouring of the eyes with stibium be not particularly here expressed, yet I suppose it to be implied; and so the Chaldee paraphrase explains it; stibio linitis oculis, "with eyes dressed with stibium." This fashion seems to have prevailed very generally among the Eastern people in ancient times; and they retain the very same to this day.
(from Adam Clarke's Commentary, Electronic Database. Copyright © 1996, 2003 by Biblesoft, Inc. All rights reserved.)




Are wanton eyes sin? and is it painting them as Adam Clarke says?

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Isa 3:16

[And wanton eyes] uwmsaqrowt `eeynaayim. The word shaaqar usually means "to lie, to deceive," and may here refer to the art of alluring by a wanton or fascinating glance of the eye. There has been great diversity of opinion about the meaning of this expression. Lowth proposes to read it, 'and falsely setting off their eyes with paint,' in allusion to a custom known to prevail in the East, of coloring the eye-lids with stibium, or the powder of lead ore. This was done the better to exhibit the white of the eye, and was supposed by many to contribute to the healthful action of the eye itself. This practice is known to prevail extensively now; but it is not clear that the prophet here has reference to it. The expression is usually interpreted to mean 'deceiving with the eyes,' that is, "alluring" or "enticing" by the motion of the eyes. The "motion" of the eyes is mentioned (Prov 6:13-14) as one mode of "deceiving" a person:

He winketh with his eyes,
He speaketh with his feet,
He teacheth with his fingers;
Frowardness is in his heart,
He deviseth mischief continually.

Compare the notes at Job 42:14. The meaning here, doubtless, is, that they attempted to entice by the "motion" or "glance" of the eye. The Chaldee seems to have understood this of staining the eyes with stibium.
(from Barnes' Notes, Electronic Database Copyright © 1997, 2003 by Biblesoft, Inc. All rights reserved.)

Re: Cosmetics???
 

I have black shadows from not getting enough sleep...does that count? ha...
I know you are serious...I am just joking with you.

Re: Cosmetics???
 

What about those little false buttons (?) I see on men's cuff's...not shinning silver or gold but purple, green, blue and even pink...sure doesn't look like a button but a decoration...I already told my son that stuff looks awful worldly to me...I just don't think men ought to wear that stuff... You know that is false too...and all that gel men put on their hair I really think that is worldly...and those silk neckties oughta go...

Well, I got up in a teasing mode...

NOW let me say something serious if I can without revealing who I am talking about...


Why do people even want to be false? The LORD hates every false way. I will answer my own question...people portray a false holiness sometimes because of peer pressure...preach against videos where they can get a lot of points and go on trips and take video cameras...preach against videos and go home and watch your tube...

If we really knew how strong politics are in the Apostolic Pentecostal church we would tremble. All those pats on the back thoses political sermons and connections...

I need say no more...

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Let me say a little more...One preacher told me how he disliked preacher x...and low and behold when his special service came around preacher x was one of the speakers...I mentioned I thought you didn't like preacher x...well...well...he beat around the bush...I knew what it was..politics...

The more I know the further I want to get away from things like that...

Re: Cosmetics???
 

sorry...got off track..

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Better watch out for the tinkling feet too!

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Well, I for one will not use eye shadow. hmmm... unless that camo stuff used for hunting counts.

But I agree with Sister A - get rid of the ties. What's with those things any way? And every sort of do-bob and bo-dangle. T-Shirts and Blues jeans are the most appropriate "uniform" for the Apostolic gentleman.

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Well, OK, but the jeans can't have any decorative stitching on the pockets. And the T-shirts: nothing printed on them, but that goes without saying.

;)

Re: Cosmetics???
 

boy oh boy that camo stuff is misleading!:gotcha

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Now. Tim you know those T-shirts are underclothes...:blush

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Oh my. Hadn't thought of that! Pel, bad boy! :toofunny

Re: Cosmetics???
 

"Truthstirrer" writes: [correction assumed and inserted by tbpew]
Based on the first set of replies, has your starter post resulted in what you had hoped for?

Can you amplify what kind of direct and specific input you would expect that is not packaged as a debate relating to outward standards?

I feel its important and timely to wait for MOW to post on this thread.

Re: Cosmetics???
 

If people think this verse is "proof" that using cosmetics, or eye makeup in particuar, is a sin before God... then that's pretty flimsy "evidence".

Re: Cosmetics???
 

:beatdeadhorse :tantrum

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Actually, most "apostolic" men I know are way too "developed" in the chest to look anything but un-holy sporting just a T-Shirt. LOL

Re: Cosmetics???
 

:foottap,:ursofunny

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Wanton eyes are a sin, but it has nothing to do with makeup.

I've known a few Apostolic women (with make-up bare faces) who had extremely wanton eyes.... and spirits.

Re: Cosmetics???
 

:thumbsup

Re: Cosmetics???
 

I never have tinkling feet!:nah

Re: Cosmetics???
 

I hope not,that might be a problem.

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Emma is never a problem. :) She woud not have tinkling feet for any reason. Not even if a dog came by and lifted it's leg.

Re: Cosmetics???
 

:toofunny

Re: Cosmetics???
 

ever since reading this I have been plagued by having the song "Sweet Gypsy Rose(?)" jangling my otherwise peaceful contemplations:sad.

Oh, say has anybody seen my sweet Gypsy Rose
Here's her picture when she was my sweet Mary Jo
Now she's got rings on her fingers and bells on her toes
Say has anybody seen my sweet Gypsy Rose

Evil purpetrators who come to this board ought to be required to put warning messages at the top of any post that could cause pop-cultural audio flashbacks that take on the form of an infinite tape loop playing inside one's head.

Aren't there any STANDARDS here?

opps...my bad....what was I thinking:ursofunny

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Well, your platform standard can be like so many...you can where makeup as long as there is no color, i.e., no eye shadow or lipstick, or rouge/blush.

We can go back to pinching our cheeks, using vaseline and eye lash curlers, wearing Dr. Pepper flavored Lip Smacker [has the most red dye in it but is officially lip gloss not color], and over perming our hair to get a few inches trimmed off the bottom.

Blessings, Rhoni

:)

Re: Cosmetics???
 

OOOPs, Hi Emma! You're back so I think you can handle this thread!:highfive

Blessings Sis.

Rhoni, the shunned one:sad

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Years ago the cloth around the neck was used for wiping off the mouth, so at one time a necktie had a useful purpose. We no longer (usually) wipe our mouths on our necktie so it has degenerated into an ornament with no useful purpose. It has become a cloth necklace.

Re: Cosmetics???
 

:heeheehee:heeheehee:heeheehee

Re: Cosmetics???
 

I am at fault for your sinful flashbacks?????? :ursofunny

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Are tinkling feet like tingling feet?

Re: Cosmetics???
 

I would suspect they are different.

I've seen some shoes that tinkle and make noise when walking - - I suppose those sinful ladies in the Bible wore rings and chains on their feet that caused tinkling as they walked!

Re: Cosmetics???
 

I meant not fight over it, my questions are a honest inquiry on what the word says on the subject. I mostly trying to show my intent was not to just argue another standard, but seek out the turth on the subject.

Re: Cosmetics???
 

explain why. It does appear painting eye is always associate with wicked women or those under judgement.

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Commentaries say it painting of eyes as well, why are they wrong.

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Let me make my point with some basic questions here:

If a group of "wicked women" were described as wearing high-heeled shoes, should we consider high-heeled shoes to be sinful? (And if not, why not?)

...and why is it that you seem to assume that "eye painting" was done only by wicked women, and not righteous women, of Israel?

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Good questions, that's why I'm asking to get others input.

Now do you know women of Israel painted themselves?

It does appear when the bible speaks of painting the eyes it's always in a bad situation. Why even mention painting the eyes if it means nothing?

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Sorry, but that's really not much of an anwer, TS.

First of all, lets do this.

Instead of responding to my questions with a bunch of other questions...maybe you should try to offer up some answers to the questions I asked you... and then I'd be happy to reply back with some answers to these extra questions you're asking me.

Re: Cosmetics???
 

This is funny! You answered my questions with questions then then say don't answer questions with question.

I answered with "good questions" because I don't know if the ladies of Israel wore makeup or not. I can't say.

Re: Cosmetics???
 

Some women will do anything for that "look"!!!! (now you have probably started a trend with those same women who burn their hair off with their irons. They are now going to go without sleep to get those dark eyes!):thumbsup

Re: Cosmetics???
 

You asked me questions? Nah.
In post #33, you asked me to explain...
With my question to you about "high-heeled shoes", I answered you with a rhetorical question, to illustrate a point -- a point which you chose to ignore!
If you look into it, you'll see that makeup (of various types, not just eye makeup) was common in eastern/middle-eastern world since ancient times. There's nothing to indicate that it was just something done by "wicked women".

And even the very commentary you quoted above lets us know that women using eye-makeup was common in that part of the world in those days. (Again, no-one has ever shown evidence or proof that this was something only done by unrigheous women.)

""with eyes dressed with stibium." This fashion seems to have prevailed very generally among the Eastern people in ancient times; and they retain the very same to this day.
(from Adam Clarke's Commentary, Electronic Database. Copyright © 1996, 2003 by Biblesoft, Inc. All rights reserved.)"