Went a-Soulwinning....
 

With an Assembly of God friend of mine last Saturday night.


It wasn't planned at first-- it just happened.


An awkward moment came when my friend wanted me to lead our new convert in a "sinner's prayer". In fact, my friend asked me if I knew, "The Sinner's Prayer" and I told him, "No," but I was willing to pray.


The most awkward moment came when after my friend led the new convert in a "sinner's prayer", he announced to the new convert,

"YOU'RE SAVED! YOU'RE SAVED!! HOW DO YOU FEEL?"

The guy said he felt good, felt happy.





But I could not help to feel that somehow, something was missing.

I told him with as much intensity as I could that God had so much more for him and that he is not to stop here- but to keep seeking the Lord, reading and obeying His Word.


We parted ways soon after that.


I have prayed for this guy, but I can't shake the feeling that there was indeed something incomplete about the whole transaction.



Just thought I'd share this experience.

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

Sounds like he repented and ask god into his heart.So I guess god saved him..see nothing wrong with this

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

Yeah, but like I said, something was missing.


Maybe he didn't really repent?

Maybe we should have tried to get him baptized right then and there, but it wouldn't have been a simple task and then my friend and I differ on the baptismal formula.


Maybe we should have prayed with him longer. It would have been much more comforting, in a way, to know that God was working in his heart, somehow.

The way it stood that night, it was just his word that he was "happy."


I've tried to follow up with this guy, but my cell phone was stolen on campus on Monday morning (that or I misplaced it).


Like I said, there was something missing in our transaction. It still gnaws at me.


I am not sure that this guy's heart was converted.


I guess if we had prayed with him until tongues, then I'd be a bit more at ease about the transaction.

But that NEVER happened in this context when I would witness as a three stepper. The main thrust of my efforts were to spread the Gospel, pique interest and get them to my church for the next service so that God can "fill them with the Holy Ghost" there.

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

So if you were falling off a cliff and ask God to forgive you before you hit bottom you don't think he would?

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

I am not sure if true repentance can occur in a matter of seconds.

If God is the only one who draws souls to repentance, then surely He can keep the guy from falling off of the cliff if he is about to be drawn to repentance.



Besides, I doubt someone who is unsaved at the time of such a tragedy with death following so quickly (usually) would be in the mindset to pray for forgiveness.

They may be cursing in anger, yelling in horror-- but I am not sure if they would really be praying.




If we're talking about someone who is already saved, then their response will be (should be anyway) different and I believe that person would be saved.

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

I see what your saying but the Thief on the cross contridicts your thinking...

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

hanging and dying an agonizingly slow and painful death on a cross is completely different from trying to get a prayer of repentance out in the last 20 seconds of your life-- especially if you are already unsaved.

The scripture, "Him that is filthy, let him be filthy still" comes to mind.

It would be a very unfortunate situation, and that is being very mild about it.



For this guy, he's still alive, as far as I know and I will try to contact him.



But in the future, I don't think it would be wise for me to go soul-winning with someone who is currently in the A of G.

Then again, I am not sure if that was the one and only issue, or if this guy really didn't repent or why it was I felt and still feel uneasy about it.


If he is dead,
how do I know this guy repented?

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

I got to go.

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

But I have to wonder, is the Oneness approach really better? How can you tell if anyone is really saved? (Even yourself, for that matter. See http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com...ad.php?t=20984. Note that 40% voted something other than "100% sure".)

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

I think that is why we are not allowed to judge. We are always, always working with incomplete information. Only the Lord knows if that man truly repented or not.

Beyond that, even 3-steppers must admit that by repenting, this man made at least the first step towards salvation. Every one of us, started with that same 1st step.

Perhaps if you are still feeling uneasy it's because there is something else God is asking you to do. Maybe keep this man in your prayers, befriend him, or disciple him.

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

We are not instructed never to judge, but to judge with righteousness judgment - John 7:24

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

The thief on the cross received what he needed. This has been stated before, but you choose to continually ignore that Jesus kept pointing to the time after He died in which we would receive His Spirit. The thief couldn't receive something that wasn't available yet.

Simply "accepting Christ" isn't enough. Jesus said you must be born again, of the water and the spirit. Reciting the "Sinner's Prayer" may be enough for repentence, if sincere ... but it does nothing for new birth.

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

Amen

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

So Elizabeth really did not have something that wasn't available yet...Luke said she did....I will bump a post so we can discuss futher in the deep water section

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

Whatever happened to Judge not, lest ye be judged?

Not to mention that other chapters in John that specifically talk about how the Father has left all judgment to the son, and then Jesus turns around and says that he came to save and not to judge. (John 5, 8 & 12) And I will also throw in the scripture in Romans about not Judging another man's servant. Overall, I would have to vote that the bible takes an anti-judging stance.

Yes we can make assumptions, have opinions, or theories. But it is pointless to judge another person's heart, motivations, or salvation. Only God is smart enough to do that.

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

1 Corinthians 6:3-4:

(3)Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?

(4) If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.

When God speaks of "righteous" judgment, He is speaking of us being careful with a person's heart, motivations and salvation. But, the scripture still implies and instructs that we will judge things - in this life also.

1 Thessalonians 5:12 "And we beseech you, brethren, to know them which labour among you, and are over you in the Lord, and admonish you;"

This passage is a form of judging those that labor among us. "Know" means to perceive, be aware, look on. That would be for the purpose of protecting ourselves from those that would oppose sound doctrine.

Matthew 7:16 "Ye shall know them by their fruits."

Same implication as above - know them.

When he tells us not to judge a servant in Romans 14, he speaks, also, of judging in ourselves whether we will cause our brother to stumble or put an occasion before him to stumble.

We judge with "righteous" judgment - watching the mote or beam in our own eye - bringing ourselves into subjection lest while preaching, we ourselves should become a castaway/rejected.

We judge.....in this life.

I will also add that God is instructing us NOT to judge hypocritically, according to Matthew 7:2 "For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again."

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

The thief on the cross was in a wonderful and one of a kind position. Jesus hadn't died yet, so the thief was still under OT law. And right at the moment of his death, he had the two things he needed for cleansing... a lamb and a priest... As a matter of fact, he had The Lamb and The High Priest. He was in a beautiful, amazing situation, but it wasn't the same as we face today.

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

If you want to set yourself up as judge over others, that is your choice. But I personally choose to leave that to God.

I believe that there is a big difference in using discernment about someone else in reference to your own spirituality (i.e. whether to partner with them in their ministry, or join their organization, etc.), and to walk around putting everyone else in heaven or hell.

For the record, this is exactly why I believe that the Bible can't be used as a rulebook!

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

You handled the situation the best you could under the circumstances. You can just pray that the repentant sinner will think about what you said and do some searching for that MORE you told him was available. The guy probably did feel happy and he should have, he just took the first step to salvation although I'm not a great fan of the canned sinners prayer.

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

Add another step, then another, and he's gonna start wondering "how many more steps are there?" :winkgrin

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

I have seen that happen time and time again and is why I believe the way I believe.

It's just that as I applied what I believe, I felt that the interaction was incomplete.

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

Better than being one or two steps short of the Rapture. It's a one shot deal you know. That means if you miss it you don't get another chance to go. It's all or nothing my friend. Are you sure you want to chance it? :foottap

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

I was raised in a denominal church that taught NOTHING about salvation. Not repentance, not baptism, NOTHING. I visited friends' churches in the summer... I think the summer I was nine I "got saved" about 25 times by saying the sinner's prayer. God was drawing me, but I had no idea what those few sentences really were supposed to sum up. I wanted Jesus in my heart, yes. But I didn't understand what repentance even was. There was no feeling sorry for what I had done, just an expectation that I would "feel good" if I said it, and a feeling of the overflow excitement from the person praying with me.

I was sincere, in what I knew and in a nine year old way. God was starting to draw me and I responded the only way I knew how, and that was good, but it sure wasn't all God had for me.

Re: Went a-Soulwinning....
 

I have a real problem telling people they are born again. Thousands of people say the sinners prayer just like thousands do the three-steps of Acts 2:38 and they are not anymore saved than a baby being baptized.

The new birth comes from above and will always result in saving faith and life change.

I was listening to Mark Denver, a baptist preacher in Washington, D. C., and his church does not encourage people to pray the sinners prayers and pronounce someone saved.

No where in the bible is a sinner's prayer repeated in order to be saved. Look at Cornelius' household, the word of God was preached and they became Christians full of the Holy Ghost.

I am to the point that I believe Evangelism is preaching the word of God and then expecting God to move in a sinners heart. If someone responds to the gospel or not is not our worry but Gods. All this "soul winning" is a numbers game and sadly is leading many into religion. Altar calls and huge outpourings are all about glorifying man and what man has done.