Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

Narrow-Is-The-Way,

You mentioned how the world has ungodly influence on Pentecostals, but you failed mentioning the ungodly influence within churches. I'm going to address personal situations which I've encountered, which are bothersome to me.

I recall a discussion between your grandpa, another preacher and I. We discussed various shirt colors, and personally I could careless about any color shirt any man chooses to wear. Your grandpa stated no man should wear a pink shirt because it renders a man "effeminate." Men must only wear white shirts, especially when preaching behind any pulpit. Are God and angels queers for being arrayed in such beautiful "effeminate" colors? Is wearing "white shirt standard" biblical or an ungodly non-biblical influence?

I believe "modest apparel" on men is elbow sleeve length shirts. Your grandpa and others I fellowshipped with claim you must wear long sleeve shirts. It that biblical or a man-made ungodly influence? Will I go to hell for wearing elbow length sleeve shirts? If your answer is yes, I await scripture.

If a male congregant didn't wear a tie to every church service, he wouldn't be considered for any future position.
They said when any man wants to enter any field, they must dress according to the field they're wanting to acquire. Should young men desiring to be plumbers or peace officers dress in that attire before filling the position? Their actions showed me they rather place a man into a position of their choosing, after their judgment has gone forth, rather than allowing the Spirit to lead. That my friend is dangerous. Is that biblical or an ungodly non-biblical influence?


For this reason many conservative churches are dead! Many of these churches haven't grown in multiple years, and these pastors remain content? They haven't added a soul to the church in years and they call themselves "the church of Acts?" These pastors chose to rule with an iron fist, and prevent men within their congregations from growing spiritually. I said the following from behind a pulpit, and I'll keep saying it! God will not put babies in a dying mother's womb! In order for a women to birth children, her body my work in unison. If a pastor chooses to remain a dictator rather than helping saints develop, that church will remain stagnant!

You asked sister Alvear if her husband preaches against make-up, but now I'll ask you a few questions. Do the gifts of the spirit function through your life? If yes, which and when? When was the last tongue interpretation within your church? When did you last buy a homeless person a hot meal? When was the last time you approached a female on the street that was wearing make-up and invite her to church? When was the last time a sinner was added to your church? When was the last time your pastor preached on how to fulfill God's will, or does he only preach against wearing make-up?

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

HA HA, who do you think narrow is.........your wrong

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

I feel like these guys all go to the same church. Scary.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

I was thinking narrow was your pastor's son.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

No, Narrow is a fellow minister.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

That would be awesome…..talk about having church, we would have church!:)

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

Yep. But I wouldn't be welcome there.

I always wonder how y'all think sinners are going to find God if they can't go to your church unless they look and act right? Do they really need to clean up before they can get to God?

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

Nahkoe, I think I agree more with you on this, but to be fair, I don't think they exclude anyone from coming to their church... or have a prerequisite for what you have to do/wear. If they come and enjoy the service, are in Bible Study, it's just a matter of time until group conformity sets in and they want to be like everyone else and not stand out!

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

No way! first they need God to do a work on their heart. Nobody is uncomfortable when they come to our church because of how they look unless they are convicted by God. Do you really think that we tell sinners this stuff when they walk in our doors?

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

[QUOTE=GrowingPains;777443]Nahkoe, I think I agree more with you on this, but to be fair, I don't think they exclude anyone from coming to their church... or have a prerequisite for what you have to do/wear. If they come and enjoy the service, are in Bible Study, it's just a matter of time until group conformity sets in and they want to be like everyone else and not stand out![/QUOTE]

NO. Its called Good old fashion bible study and the spirit of God working.
But thanks for the first part of your comment.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

Ah..but the thing is, I wouldn't feel welcome there because I know very well if what I'm wearing is such a stumbling block to them, there's no way they could deal with the very real sin (you know, the stuff the Bible calls sin) that I was dealing with when I came into church, and honestly still deal with.

The first church I went to, I did clean up and live the ultra con standards. But because I'm divorced and my ex didn't want my kids in church anyhow, and I knew he could well say they couldn't go and get away with it, I didn't make my daughter follow these standards in order to keep the peace with him. When the pastor told me I was going to go to hell because she wore pants, all I could think of were the things he didn't know about. I'd never felt ok telling him those things because he very nearly didn't know what to do with what little I had told him about. If clothes was so heaven or hell, then forget it..I was beyond hope because I was dealing with stuff far, far, far, far, far bigger than that.

It's not an ultracon issue. I have friends who are, and their support has been absolutely invaluable to me. As much as these friends have done for me, prayed for me, offered support, encouragement, etc, I'm not sure I'd be ok in some of their churches because I would feel out of place.

Dragging a bunch of dirt into a church that emphasizes cleanliness isn't going to work so well. That's exactly what I felt like I was doing.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

No one *told* me either. But it was very obvious what was expected because of the emphasis placed on dressing and looking holy.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

I don’t know the situation but it sounds like he didn’t get to the root of the problem. The root of the problem was not her wearing pants but her parents not teaching her submission.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

I can't believe you just said that.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

I said it with a smile...i just forgot to put it :)

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

Smiling or not, did you really read nahkoe's post?

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

No I didn’t read I just skimmed through it. I am sorry nahkoe. I apologize. Thanks for pointing that out to me. I hope you accept it.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

So now that that's out of the way, and you've really read it, do you see what I'm saying about feeling out of place? Nothing has to be said. It comes across when all the outside stuff is emphasized.

I came into church from a subculture that takes a pretty heavy rap in pretty much all Christian churches. Having grown up in a church, I knew full well that I had to be careful who I told and how I told them. I've seen how people are treated in a lot of places when they have this in their past and/or present. To then have this focus on clothing and make up and hair when I knew that inside I was something these people would find disgusting and unwelcome didn't help me face up to that or seek the help and support I needed to get through that, and just maybe past it.

As things would go, God did provide support for me, and a fair bit of that comes from people considered ultracon. I suspect this is in part to keep me from throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

I don't think American churches as a whole are conducive to reaching sinners. I'm definitely not picking just on UPC or Apostolics or ultra con or anything like that. But I will tell you that the more focus there is on the outside, the more fake it looks from the world.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

[QUOTE=1Corinth2v4;777390]



If a male congregant didn't wear a tie to every church service, he wouldn't be considered for any future position.


haha, this reminds me of a story D Segraves told of a preacher that was invited to preach in a former eastern bloc country, anyway none of the men wore ties in that church because all the communist dudes wore ties and they didn't want to be associated with comunists. The visiting preacher said he was going to wear his tie anyway and the host pastor told him " Do you want everyone to concentrate on your sermon or on your tie?" He removed his tie and preached a wonderful sermon.


:doggyrun

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

Nahkoe the church will always be a little different. If it was like where you were coming from, what's the point. They that hunger and thirst will be saved. I'm not justifying their church, but I don't believe the church should be more congruent with the troubled, weary, and tired souls seeking refuge. The church is distinct and different. Modesty, godliness, joy, humility and worship itself will make anyone perhaps uncomfortable.

To you other points, dogmatizing things that aren't certainly are harmful and needless stumbling blocks for sinners.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

As for the argument, if the crowd does it, it must be wrong, the crowd uses the internet.

Therefore in order to come out from among them you need to stop using the Internet. We can go on all day like this.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

Prax, they are liberals. Not REAL conservatives. They are compromisers. REAL conservative churches don't use the internet.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

Nope. Change comes after you receive the Holy Ghost. You have to first get God to get good.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

Some believe "you have to first get holy to get God!"

Anyways, I'm still waiting for your answers to my questions.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

I'd like to see you answer your own questions! I don't know you, but it seems to me that you really aren't what you claim to be.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

YES! I have finally been called a liberal! HA HA! I'm just messing with you GP! :thumbsup

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

Hey Praxeas, thank you for your conviction on the internet! We shall not tear your conviction down!:thumbsup

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

Lol, hey, what did you think?

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

What have I claimed to be?

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

A conservative. But you have challenged others who have also claimed to be conservative, on everything! No offense to anyone else! The way you talk, I don't think you are. Now, for our sake, answer your own questions!

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

It's not my conviction. But if you argue that because the world does not see makeup as wrong then that makes it wrong then you should have a conviction against the internet too to remain consistent

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

I claim to be a Christian........and if you ever receive the Holy Ghost, maybe then you could too!

I'm still awaiting Narrow's response.....or perhaps he's afraid I'll take him to school!

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

:nah Lol, oh I'm sorry! Maybe I didn't tell you, but I do have the Holy Ghost! Must have forgot to post that! Hmmm... so can I now claim to be a Christian? Let me know! I'm starting to get worried now!

And btw, from the posts that I have seen from Narrow, compared to yours, I hope you have a notepad, cuz I think YOU'RE the one about to get taken to school! :gotcha

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

BTW arguing and trying to one up the other person is just as much a pride issue as someone's facial hair IMO

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

That's some funny stuff!


I'll take you, narrow and the rest of your holy Jihad army on any day.
He's hiding while I sit here and wait!

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

HA HA! Jihad! Thats good...

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

You know what Praxeas, thats so true! I sure hope I don't do anything of that sort!

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

The thing is it's absurd to claim "facial hair is a pride issue" when just about anything can be a pride issue.

Facial hair is not a problem. Pride is. You can have pride and not have facial hair.

And what is worse is having pride and being too proud to admit it while pointing fingers at others

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

LOL this thread is the battle of whose the greatest con.

Me thinks someone is posting with the same name, or at least they are in the same room.

Re: Questions for poster NarrowIsTheWay
 

Too many cons in the "Apostolic Forum" world. Con Artists, that is. It's best to not get too wrapped up with them.