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Esther 01-24-2010 07:58 PM

Why a Sin offering?
 
Lev 12:6 And when the days of her purifying are fulfilled, for a son, or for a daughter, she shall bring a lamb of the first year for a burnt offering, and a young pigeon, or a turtledove, for a sin offering, unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, unto the priest:

Gen 9:1 And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth.

pelathais 01-24-2010 08:53 PM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Esther (Post 869611)
Lev 12:6 And when the days of her purifying are fulfilled, for a son, or for a daughter, she shall bring a lamb of the first year for a burnt offering, and a young pigeon, or a turtledove, for a sin offering, unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, unto the priest:

Gen 9:1 And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth.

Leviticus 12:7 helps us with this a little bit: "... and she shall be cleansed from the issue of her blood."

It's not the birth of the child that is a "sin," but the issuance of blood is considered "unclean" for purposes associated with the ritual at the Tabernacle/Temple.

A typical human birth will involve the shedding of blood. Since "the life of the flesh is in the blood," this shedding or issuance of blood is dealt with as being "unclean." Leviticus 15 deals with menstruation and also with men who suffer an "issue of blood."

The use of the term "sin offering" also may be something of a short hand and not intended to identify the condition of those involved as being "sinful." If the question arose, "What do we do about an issue of blood?" Then the answer would be to give a "token offering" such as a "sin offering" as described in the preceding chapters of Leviticus.

It's the spilt blood that must be atoned for, not the birth of the child.

DAII 01-24-2010 09:03 PM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
Weren't their ritual cleasings / mikveha also for menstruation and the spillage of other bodily fluids?

pelathais 01-24-2010 09:13 PM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DAII (Post 869635)
Weren't their ritual cleasings / mikveha also for menstruation and the spillage of other bodily fluids?

Leviticus 15 repeatedly states the requirement for the "unclean" person to be "washed." In Jerusalem itself the mikvaot would have been the place for this since there are no large streams or natural bodies of water.

I took Esther's question to have been about the requirement for a "sin offering" after the birth of a child.

Timmy 01-25-2010 10:18 AM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
But an offering doesn't cleanse anything literally. It is for regaining God's approval, yes? So, it seems that God marks giving birth (or the bleeding that accompanies it, if you prefer) in the "sin" column, for some reason, and requires atonement for it before erasing that mark.

Just sayin'.

Timmy 01-25-2010 11:07 AM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
And it's interesting that v 7 mentions that the offering was to come only after the time of purifying. The purifying would seem to take care of any physical needs, so there must have further been some kind of spiritual "need" to take care of.

Esther 01-25-2010 11:14 AM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
Some interesting thoughts, but couldn't it have been a burnt offering instead of sin?

Esther 01-25-2010 11:14 AM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Timmy (Post 869773)
And it's interesting that v 7 mentions that the offering was to come only after the time of purifying. The purifying would seem to take care of any physical needs, so there must have further been some kind of spiritual "need" to take care of.

Good point Timmy.

Timmy 01-25-2010 11:25 AM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Esther (Post 869781)
Good point Timmy.

Really?

:woohoo:happydance:hanky

:D

pelathais 01-25-2010 01:00 PM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Timmy (Post 869773)
And it's interesting that v 7 mentions that the offering was to come only after the time of purifying. The purifying would seem to take care of any physical needs, so there must have further been some kind of spiritual "need" to take care of.

And just what needs are "taken care of" whenever any "offering" is made?

pelathais 01-25-2010 01:01 PM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Timmy (Post 869788)
Really?

:woohoo:happydance:hanky

:D

Nah. She's just kidding. I told her to say that.

Timmy 01-25-2010 01:52 PM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother David (Post 869863)
And just what needs are "taken care of" whenever any "offering" is made?

Atonement for sin? At least, I thought that was the main reason for them, in OT times. There were different kinds of offering, but this one was specifically called a sin offering.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother David (Post 869866)
Nah. She's just kidding. I told her to say that.

:heeheehee

Timmy 01-25-2010 02:26 PM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother David (Post 869631)
Leviticus 12:7 helps us with this a little bit: "... and she shall be cleansed from the issue of her blood."

It's not the birth of the child that is a "sin," but the issuance of blood is considered "unclean" for purposes associated with the ritual at the Tabernacle/Temple.

A typical human birth will involve the shedding of blood. Since "the life of the flesh is in the blood," this shedding or issuance of blood is dealt with as being "unclean." Leviticus 15 deals with menstruation and also with men who suffer an "issue of blood."

The use of the term "sin offering" also may be something of a short hand and not intended to identify the condition of those involved as being "sinful." If the question arose, "What do we do about an issue of blood?" Then the answer would be to give a "token offering" such as a "sin offering" as described in the preceding chapters of Leviticus.

It's the spilt blood that must be atoned for, not the birth of the child.

If the shedding of blood, whether it was technically "sin" or not, needed atoning via offerings, would an offering be necessary if one cut one's finger?

Esther 01-26-2010 01:50 PM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
I'm wondering if there is anyone on this forum that has access to the JP forum that can take this question to them and bring back their answers?

Timmy 01-26-2010 08:02 PM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Esther (Post 870357)
I'm wondering if there is anyone on this forum that has access to the JP forum that can take this question to them and bring back their answers?

You don't like our answers? :heeheehee

Esther 01-26-2010 09:28 PM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Timmy (Post 870546)
You don't like our answers? :heeheehee

There weren't very many answers given, did you not notice??? :smack

Timmy 01-26-2010 09:41 PM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Esther (Post 870591)
There weren't very many answers given, did you not notice??? :smack

Yeah, but I thought the few answers were pretty good. (Mine was best! :lol)

OK, my answer didn't look much like an answer, did it? But the gist of my posts was this: it does seem that God considered childbirth (or at least the bleeding that normally accompanies it) to be sin. Just because that seems strange doesn't mean that's not what the Bible actually means. Right? God also thought it was evil to build cisterns that don't hold water. (Jeremiah 2:13) I don't know how many times I've been told "God's ways are not our ways"! :lol

Esther 01-27-2010 02:48 PM

Re: Why a Sin offering?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Timmy (Post 870604)
Yeah, but I thought the few answers were pretty good. (Mine was best! :lol)

OK, my answer didn't look much like an answer, did it? But the gist of my posts was this: it does seem that God considered childbirth (or at least the bleeding that normally accompanies it) to be sin. Just because that seems strange doesn't mean that's not what the Bible actually means. Right? God also thought it was evil to build cisterns that don't hold water. (Jeremiah 2:13) I don't know how many times I've been told "God's ways are not our ways"! :lol

Amen!


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