Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

I have heard many times hate the sin, but not the sinner. Does it seem like sometimes some christians hate others and not their sins? I have heard and read some comments that seem hateful to me about people that are lost, and sometimes even to other christians. How do we separate the two?

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

Some do, some don't. Just like regular people! :heeheehee

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

It is human nature to judge others who are not like us, or don't agree with us ,I am not saying it is right , just a fact.

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

I'm reading 'The Prodigal God' by Timothy Keller. It illustrates the Elder Brother mindset, and explains why this is not pleasing to God any more than the sin of the younger brother. Covers the idea in your post very well.

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

Yeah, and it concerns me that some use the Word of God against people. And I don't mean in a general way as if you don't live like the Word says you are going to hell. I mean it seems personal sometimes, as in not the sin but the person. Kind of negates the Word being used to draw people to Jesus.

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

When we say "Hate the sin, not the sinner" are we truly saying that we love people and want them to turn from their sins by showing them the grace and mercy of God, or are we simply making an excuse for our poor attitude toward others? If the first, then why not just say that? Or at least change it to "hate the sin, love the sinner." :friend

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

We forget where God brought us from.

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

Galatians 6:1 Brethren,if a man be overtaken in a fault ,ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness ; considering thyself ,lest though be tempted. I know this is what you are meaning right ?

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

Most places I've seen that phrase used, a member will be excommunicated if they "sin".
I don't read that in the bible-the verse in Corinthians about turning the person over to Satan was not a person that trimmed her hair or didn't shave one day. It was about a person who was in fornication with his father's wife-something even the Gentiles didn't do! We aren't talking about a mistake or a bad hair day or a refusal to follow a standard or hold a different opinion than the pastor. We're talking about a blatant sin that even non-Christians saw as wrong. That verse does not apply to most situations in the church today. Not even the public blastings of visitors and saints are biblical. Nor spreading gossip about another individual.

Gal 6:1 ¶ Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted.
Gal 6:2 Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.

Mat 18:15 ¶ Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.
Mat 18:16 But if he will not hear [thee, then] take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
Mat 18:17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell [it] unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.

There are others. I can't think of the wording right now.

:heart

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

There's a clip in Religulous of an anti-gay demonstrator saying "I don't hate them. God hates them!" Uh, yeah, thanks for the clarification! :thumbsup

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

I was searching while you were typing! Thanks.

I was looking for another one too, about keeping a matter private, or winning your brother.

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

God doesn't hate people, he abhors sin.

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

God's word is good...

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

Awesome thought !

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

Great thoughts Cindy, and I think that far too often, religious people do not see the distinction. It troubles me when I hear people who are supposed to have a walk with/relationship with God, talk about a person in a hateful tone of voice or say hateful things about them based on their sinful behavior.

I will be honest and say that I myself struggle with this, not towards people who are involved in "bad" outward sins (addictions, promiscuity,etc,) but towards people who are involved in "good/acceptable" inward sins (gossiping, jealousy, hateful attitudes, etc.)

I know full well that sin is sin, and one sin is no worse than the other, but I struggle with being judgmental toward those involved in "hidden" sin. We too often miss the message on this I am afraid.

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

I have seen people walk away for this kind of stuff. People who were seeking God and trying to please Him.[ New converts] They were told they were going to hell right out of the blocks . Treated as second class people. IMO if someone is Baptized in Jesus Name and full of the Holy Ghost, God has excepted them .Are we greater than God ? Do we judge more harshly than God ? I wonder.

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

If a person can't love people, really love them, including feeling compassion for them and at least sometimes empathizing with them, they really don't know God at all.
1 Jn 4:7-8

Goodness, there is a lot I'd like to say, and I type it and then think, no, this probably would be misunderstood. Suffice it to say, "been there, done that." I've been on both sides (judger and judged), and don't like either one.

:haloplug

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

Prov 6:16 These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him:

17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,

18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief,

19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.

Seven things God hates. People are on the list.

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

Timmy, I've heard people use this against different people and groups... but most of it could just as easily apply to those who are quoting it and standing in judgement of others.

Several do, but this one stands out to me: Hands that shed innocent blood. Check out Mat 5:22: But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire. I think most murder originates in the heart and starts with hatred or pride.
False witness (gossip again?)

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

Psalm 5:4 For thou art not a God that hath pleasure in wickedness: neither shall evil dwell with thee.

5 The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity.

6 Thou shalt destroy them that speak leasing: the LORD will abhor the bloody and deceitful man.

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

Hosea 9:15 All their wickedness is in Gilgal: for there I hated them: for the wickedness of their doings I will drive them out of mine house, I will love them no more: all their princes are revolters.

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OK, Timmy. OK. If you want to hate people, go ahead... :nah

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

I don't hate them. God hates them.

:D

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Timmy, Timmy, Timmy.... :foottap

One major flaw in your argument here is that WE are not God. We are commanded to love! :heart

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

I was merely pointing out that (according to the Bible) God does hate people.

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

Malachi 1:2 I have loved you, saith the LORD. Yet ye say, Wherein hast thou loved us? Was not Esau Jacob's brother? saith the LORD: yet I loved Jacob,

3 And I hated Esau, and laid his mountains and his heritage waste for the dragons of the wilderness.

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Yeah, and I've put this into several messages and then deleted it. Preached this year in a good strong OP church, at a woman because she quoted a verse to her neighbor during the preaching. Top volume, top speed, pointing her out and insinuating some things about her before and after:
God never intended for a woman to be a man! Sit down! I’m mad now! He ain’t preachin, he’s mad. God gets mad too. God hates too. Prov 6:16 (reader: These six things doth the Lord hate) Hates. And if God hates ‘em, and if I’m an ambassador of Christ, I hate ‘em. And if God’s message is a message of “I hate these things”-well, his messenger is gonna preach the same message! God hates those things. But this messenger is not preaching it because it’s a message. I hate them too. Because I love God. I love His word. I love His ways.

For starters, this is prooftexting in it's prime.

But more on topic:
If God hates something, I'm sure He is more than capable of taking care of the person or situation, all by Himself.

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

:thumbsup

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

Still boggles the mind that someone would let themselves be spoken to that way, but I suppose the fear is so deep that she most likely even talked to him after the service and personally apologized for her disrespect to God's anointed.

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Was up at 4 this morning thinking.

Sometimes the only thing that seems to make sense to me is Calvary.

It was there, where God's Love was poured out upon our every woe.

In my own experience, vile judgement takes hold of me when the Cross becomes distant.

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

Did the Father die on the cross? :hmmm

(See http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com...ad.php?t=28926 :winkgrin)

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Yep, but she did it more out of politics and in the hope that he would not bash her again later for not going than anything, I think. And she left a couple months later.

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

:thumbsup

I can reach out to people and help them change their ways if they want the help. I can teach them about repentance and tell them God loves them... but there is no way that I can look at someone else and condemn them, when I know Jesus died for them.

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

Luk 18:10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
Luk 18:11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men [are], extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
Luk 18:12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
Luk 18:13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as [his] eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
Luk 18:14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified [rather] than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

Mat 6:14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:
Mat 6:15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Mat 18:32 Then his lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me:
Mat 18:33 Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee?

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

Figured as much. I am sure she entered his office to apologize, he accepted it with a warning and some words about "lessons learned" and to be more careful next time, and as she turned to leave he stared at her butt the whole way......

I am sorry. I have zero respect for guys so full of themselves. They open themselves up to be publicly mocked.

Did she leave this church or Christianity completely?

Re: Do We Have Hatred In Our Hearts?
 

Just the church.

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That is Great!!

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I disagree, Timmy. Not the people, but what is in their hearts.

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Amen, amen!

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Lord, help me to learn this lesson of your infinite love for us.