New Bar at Gound Zero
 

Someone said on Fox or Glen Beck today, that if the muslims are allowed to build a mosque at ground zero in NY, he was going to open a bar next door for gay muslims called" Suspicious Packages" or "The Turban Cowboy" I about died laughing, only in America ! Someone then suggested "Ramadan" Hilarious !!!!!

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

Whoever suggested that may get killed by our "peace loving Muslim brothers"

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

I have the ad!

http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w...buryMuslim.jpg

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

:ursofunny:ursofunny

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

The finally posted the interview at Foxnews.com.

My favorite name is You-Mecca-Me-Hot.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

The english language has to be the only language in the world that is this much fun.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

http://www.examiner.com/x-15870-Popu...-Mosque-wvideo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_mj3...layer_embedded

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

That is hilarious!

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

Hilare...

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

According to my friends who actually live in NYC, putting a bar next to the center probably isn't as weird as it sounds. I've never been to NY, but it's my understanding that it's exceedingly crowded and all sorts of stuff that we wouldn't consider as coexisting next to each other does in NY. Which is why I love the wide-open spaces of the American West.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

That would make sense, that any inch of space in NYC is not wasted. They probably have very interesting combinations of shops together.

BTW is your friend apart of a coalition against the building of the masque? I am really hoping they fight this thing tooth and nail.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

Interesting photo of the Punjabi people who for the most part are not Muslims but practice Sikhism.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

The women in that photo are dressed much the same as Christians in India-

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

No, he's an attorney who believes that any legal attempt to stop the mosque is doomed to fail under the Religious Land Use and Institutionalized Persons Act (RLUIPA). Interestingly enough, the same people who are against the mosque have had no problems in the past with churches using the RLUIPA to overcome challenges to church expansions, renovations, etc.

He also lives in Manhattan and personally has no problem with it.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

I don't think the issue is a masque being built, it is the fact that is being constructed at ground zero and it's opening is 9/11/11, the ten year anniversary of 9/11.

I am taken a back a little that he has no problem with it-amazing.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

It's actually not AT Ground Zero. It is two blocks away. And there's already an adult club and other not-so-savory enterprises closer.

I'm not surprised my friend isn't opposed; he's lived in NYC most of his adult life and was there on 9/11. He doesn't blame the entire Muslim religion for the acts of a few terrorist nutballs--most of whom were citizens of America's good ally, Saudi Arabia.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

American Muslims were killed in the attacks also. Why shouldn't they be able to build a mosque/cultural center close to ground zero to commemorate all who were lost?

No group should be discriminated against simply because of their religion.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

2 blocks away is rather close, and you answered my question your friend will not be opposing the construction of this muslim site.

As far as the rest of your comments, I guess it would be better to talk to him directly than to debate in 3rd person. It's hard to tell if you are speaking for him or yourself.

It doesn't matter if you or whoever doesn't blame the other muslims. That is not the point. It is the proximity that is disturbing. They don't seem to mind that Americans are bothered and hurt over their actions. If it is really not an act (the construction of their mosque) that is anyway in related to 9/11 then instead of being 2 blocks away why not 2 or 3 miles away and why on earth is their planned opening on 9/11/11 if the 2 events are in no way related?

Of course my question are rhetorical and do not need to answer-thank you.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

1. They have over 100 mosques in NYC already.

2. It would be located in too close proximity to Ground Zero and it offends the sensibilities of 52% of NYC residents as per recent polling. 31% are in favor and that would be the more liberal Manhattan residents -1, 629,054 pop.

3. As Newt Gingrich has pointed out - "There should be no mosque near Ground Zero in New York so long as there are no churches or synagogues in Saudi Arabia. The time for double standards that allow Islamists to behave aggressively toward us while they demand our weakness and submission is over." http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/...-mosque/60244/

4. If claiming to want relationship building and healing - why build in an area that offends the sensibilities of the majority and why spend $100 million to do the offending?

5. Where is the funding coming from? Rauf says not from foreign sources, but he tells a London newspaper a different story - "And Rauf is rather vague about where the estimated $100 million is coming from to build this 13-story tower. The imam said the money would be raised here. But he told a London newspaper that Muslim nations would also fund this project." http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local...-99967009.html

6. Why call it the Cordoba House, initially, and then say you are not alluding to the Caliphate of Cordoba, which we know, "The rule of the Caliphate is known as the heyday of Muslim presence in the Iberian peninsula." Caliphate of Córdoba - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caliphate_of_C%C3%B3rdoba

7. Why change the name to Park51 after the uproar over "Cordoba House"? “Cordoba,” in Islamic symbolic terms, means Islamic rule in the West. http://lonestartimes.squawkboxnoise.com/?p=3081

Just a few of the concerns with the NYC Cordoba Mosque.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

Another concern would be "Sharia Law" which does not allow for separation of church and state.

Let's see what is happening in Minnesota:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0vIt...layer_embedded

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

Pressing did you know they did the same thing in Barcelona Spain after the terrorist bombing? They built a mosque in the same proximity-

They recently were seeking to put a large Mosque near the 2012 London Olympic games and they shut down-
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/com...cle7055771.ece

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

What relevance does that have?
So we should stymie religious freedom if a slight majority wants to? I'll remember that when the "War on Christmas" starts again, lol.

I don't understand this line of reasoning. Because another country does not allow as much freedom of religion as we do, we should follow that countries lead? Do you know how ridiculous that sounds?
Well, they are probably spending $100 million, because, I don't know, it might cost that much to build a cultural center in downtown New York? Moderate Muslims did not bring down the towers, they are hurting along with their fellow Americans. I can see why they would want a center to congregate and build bridges close to the site of the attack.

They have already said that they are going to weed out contributions very closely, as to not allow anyone on the government's watch list to contribute, and not accept support from persons with anti-American views or agendas:
http://www.nydailynews.com/opinions/...bref=obnetwork

I believe Mayor Bloomberg said it best:

"People say, well, you know, 'Do they have the money? Can they raise the money? Where does it come from?' " the mayor said Friday on his WOR-AM radio show with John Gambling.

"I don't know, and government shouldn't -- do you really want every time they pass the basket in your church and you throw a buck in, they run over and say, 'Okay, now, you know, where do you come from? Who are your parents? Where'd you get this money?'
http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/...omes_from.html

They obviously realized the name would draw even more controversy, and decided to change it to something less inflammatory. Good idea on their part.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

Yes, I did. Liberals don't want to listen to it.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

I am shocked- we should be outraged. But instead I am reading those siding with those who would like to destroy us, and take away our religious freedoms.

They are abusing our freedoms to push their beliefs, they do not have any tolerance for what we believe they have agenda that they are not ashamed to push on us.

Anyway, I am getting stirred up here.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

Uhhh, that it's not like they aren't already in the city. So, why build another in a place that is offensive to the majority of Americans. There are not enough so-called moderates speaking out against so-called radical Islam.

Uhhhh, because there was intentional murder that took place two blocks away and part of one of the airplanes landed in the Burlington Coat Factory. The building was also on the table for a landmark status.

There is historical significance that is being overlooked. Daniel Badger, who was the architect for this building, already has a number of buildings that have been given landmark status.

311 Broadway was given landmark status (January 2010) because the Landmark Commission said that there were very few Italian Renaissance, palazzo-style buildings left in the city. The fact is that BOTH buildings are Italian Renaissance, palazzo-style architecture and they are in the same neighborhood. So, why is one being granted landmark statues and the other is not?

According to the landmarks commission, the building has historical, architectural and cultural significance.

* It is an example of New York’s cast-iron architecture, built in 1857 in the Italian Renaissance style, to house a prominent Manhattan shipping firm. The building is like many of the store and loft structures that dominated the dry goods warehouse districts of Lower Manhattan. It was used between 1911 and 1925 as the headquarters of Merck & Company, the pharmeceuticals giant. It was later converted into a discount clothing store.
* The five-story building’s storefront is comprised of a cast iron Corinthian colonnade.

Yet, they still voted it not a landmark. Hmmmmmm....

The Fort Hood shooter was being advised by the imam of a small Falls Church VA mosque who has since fled the country and calls for jihad and death to Americans from overseas. Two other 9-11 killers also were engaged with this mosque. We had two other 9-11 killers coming out of a mosque in Los Angeles. So, that just makes for suspicion.

Germany has just closed a mosque because of terrorist ties.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...ryId=129091973

LOL! Uh, right, dude. LOL!


My article above shows Rauf LYING about where he is getting his funding.

Bloomberg's poll ratings have dropped under 50% to 49% for the first time in 5 years.

Yes, it was a good idea. We sure don't want to hide in the plain sight, do we? LOL!

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

Yes, Liz. They know that they can use our freedom to subjugate us to theirs.

I met a young woman from Turkey about 18 years ago at the Galleria in Houston. She said, "You Americans don't understand. You are losing your freedom by your freedom." Chilling words and none so true!

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

Good thoughts. It is thoughts like this that people will not like. I don't mind it.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

So because there are other spots to congregate, this religious center should not be built? Do you extend that to all religions, or just Muslim? At what number does there become too many of one religious center, and who gets to decide that?

Come on, that is a weak argument.

They are Americans, they were attacked also.

Not too hard to find out why it was not designated a landmark, if you care to look it up.
"The Landmarks commissioners, appointed by Bloomberg, said the 152-year-old Park Place building was not worth preserving because the architect is unknown and many similar cast-iron buildings are already protected in TriBeCa’s historic districts. “It does not really stand out,” said Frederick Bland, a commissioner. Bland and others added that they were also swayed by the fact that local preservation groups did not fight to save the building.
“The actions, or inactions, of these watchdogs of historic resources spoke loudly to me,” Bland said."

http://dnainfo.com/20100803/downtown...g-this-morning

Has nothing do with this mosque or it's backers.
When this future mosque has ties to the terrorist community, I will call for it to be closed down also.


I don't see in your article where he said he was exclusively getting money from the states or not and not from Muslim countries. Not a lie.
Has nothing to do with this.


You call for religious freedom, yet you want to suppress their religious freedom. It seems very hypocritical.

Stop with the fear-mongering and scare tactics, and you will see that the facts do not support the outrage.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

Lol, they are not pushing their freedom, they are Americans. Their freedoms are the same as ours. They are simply using the same freedom of religion that any American has.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

The majority of Americans are offended by the location. If you want to claim relationship building - why build in a location that offends. Bottom line!!! :pullhair

What a bunch of hooey!!!

http://www.nyc-architecture.com/SOH/SOH030.htm

It still raises suspicions and it was a very BOLD move on their part to name it Cordoba House. They knew what they were doing, even though, you want to be asleep in the day. LOL! That was totally intentional.

We can agree on, at least, something! :thumbsup

The article SAID that he told us one thing and a London paper something entirely different. Hello!!!

In THIS LOCATION it is not hypocritical. Go build the dang thing somewhere else! :girlytantrum

Stop being to stinking liberal AND blind as a bat! Good grief!! LOL! :girlytantrum

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

So your argument is that if the majority of Americans are offended by something, we should discriminate and not let that offense happen? Strong stance to take there, PO.

Hey, I am just going by what the actual Landmarks Preservation Commission said. You seemed to think it was suspicious, I was just telling you the facts.

If that is a strong religious term for them, it makes sense for them to want to incorporate that. The same way tons of churches have the terms Jesus, God, or or religious terms. Should those not be allowed because it might offend someone?

It was a good move on their part to come up with something less inflammatory. Good for them.


But your article did not say that he was getting funding exclusively from non-Muslim sources. Ever thought that he could be getting funding from here and from Muslim countries? He never said it was an either or situation, as far as I know.
It is hypocritical. They are Americans, they have the same freedoms and rights that all of us have. To keep them from exercising their religious freedoms is hypocritical to the utmost.
Has nothing to do with political parties. It has to do with not allowing religious discrimination and you not letting fear and unfounded suspicions control your emotions.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

Do we live in same country?? Where have you been the last 9yrs?

In schools the muslim community is seeking(some have succeed) to have us observe their holidays, set aside a day just for Islam to be taught-
http://humanrights.change.org/blog/v..._new_york_city

They are not using the same freedom of religion like anyone else, there is no other religion making the demands they have been making-for example demanding of the observance of Sharia Law, which some are obliging to.

http://newsflavor.com/opinions/obama...aw-on-america/

Are you unaware of what is going on in Europe and how the muslim religion is having a major influence on their laws?

I think you are somewhat ignorant on the topic-

And in reality, they will be the ones laughing-Lol.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

Are you serious?! I think you are pulling our leg, you can not be this out of touch with reality.

Dude people died- are you that calloused?

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

That was a very nice article, demonstrating how peaceable the majority of Muslims are in promoting their views. Thanks for the good read.

As far as observing Muslim holidays and teaching Muslim teachings, almost all religious parties want to promote their ideas and beliefs. They would be a sorry religious group if they did not. As long as all religious parties can be heard equally, I see no issue with it.

Stop spreading false information. There is no evidence that Harold Koh ever promoted our Judicial system favoring Sharia Law. To say he did is blatant deception, since there is no evidence he did. Even the link you provided said there is no way to tell if he said that or not.
I am aware of the riots that France has had in regards to Muslim youth, and other European countries. We have not seen that here with any religion, and we more than likely won't. We have freedom of religion here, and it helps keep any religion organization keep from feeling marginalized or persecuted.

When even hints of it happening here occurs, then I will get concerned. Until then, I will not let fear of what might happen run my life.

i think you are somewhat an alarmist on the topic.

I try to look at things in a reasonable, common sense manner, and try not to get all that excited over non-issues. Helps me enjoy my life immensely. I would recommend the approach.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

No pulling of the leg here. At the risk of using an extreme analogy here: At one point, the majority of Americans were okay with slavery. Did that make it acceptable?

Even if the majority does not like it, religious discrimination is still religious discrimination. Every year this board has multiple threads come Christmas time on how there is a war on Christmas, how Christians and Christmas are being religiously discriminated against. Same concept here.

Dude, Muslim Americans died there also. Muslim American families were directly affected by it. People from all walks of life died there, not just Christians. Christians don't have the market on grief from these attacks. They affected ALL Americans, regardless of beliefs, and ALL Americans should all be able to grieve, work it out and deal with it however they legally want to.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

If the people who are building the ground zero mosque cared about improving Islam’s image they would have taken their mosque elsewhere.

Most importantly, the imam, Reisal Abdul Rauf, has many ties that should be under suspicion and investigated. He is a prominent member of the group that helped sponsor the pro-Palestinian activists who clashed violently with the Israeli commandos, at sea, back in June.

Refuses to call Hamas and Hezbollah terrorist organizations. Blamed 9-11 on Americans.

He is a key figure with a Malaysian-based Perdana Global Peace Organization, which is the single largest donor to the Free Gaza Movement. Perdana was the key organizer of the six-ship flotilla that tried to break Israel's blockade of the Hamas-run Gaza Strip.

Another thing is that the Commission voted on this without sufficient input from the community as it was in the middle of summer when most people were away. That knew it and plunged ahead.

Totally bogus. Daniel Badger already has some buildings that have been given landmark status because there are few Italian Renaissance, palazzo-style buildings left in the city. This is something they were looking to preserve. They knew who the architect was. He was also known for his famous foundry, Architectural Ironworks. What a bunch of hooey!

Not the same thing as using the name of God, Jesus, etc.. It is an inflammatory and calculated reference of war and conquest. And yes, we could look at the Spanish Inquisition, but the fact is, the Roman Catholics later condemned the Inquisition because it violated modern standards of justice. Even though not condemned during the Middle Ages, they did put an end to it. The Muslims have not stopped their "jihad" activities from the beginning.

And as I stated earlier, there are not enough so-called moderate Muslims standing up and speaking out against this extremism for the American people to believe there actually is moderation in Islam or at the root when you go further.

For instance, there is the "quiet jihad" which is something even more important to understand, i.e., Sharia Finance - "Interest Free Loans". It is growing worldwide and is not really an issue about the way the loans are structured, but that they are structured under Sharia Law. AIG has taken on this form of Sharia Law. There is also a requirement, in the Sharia Finance, to "cleanse" the "haram" (filth) from the "infidels: (non Muslims) by donating a portion of the interest made to Zakat (charity). No one knows what charities the money supports.

Even though some of the Shariah laws seem to show kindness, upon further study you come upon issues such as stoning, beheadings, amputations, and honor killings as being also part of Shariah.

He SAID that he would NOT be obtaining funding from the Middle East. He tells the London newspaper that he will be getting his funding from the Middle East. Is there something you are not understanding here - obviously? He tells us one thing and the Middle East something else. That actually has a term and it is called Taqiyya. 1,400 years this term has been used as a means of concealment, allowed in order to protect Islam. It has been used to confuse the enemy. Denying there is a jihad at all is one tactic - lie - Taqiyya.

It is not political nor religious discrimination when you claim to be building and healing and are only dividing. It is not hypocrisy when you are uncertain as to the background and activities of the people involved. We don't even know who the board members on this project are. Please, stop using our freedom to cause us to lose it! Next thing you know, you will say it's religious freedom to marry a goat!

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

Please, show us some of these "ties".

Pat Buchanan blamed 9/11 on us also, saying it was a "direct consequence of the United States meddling in an area of the world where we do not belong and where we are not wanted. We were attacked because we were on Saudi sacred soil and we are so-called repressing the Iraqis and we're supporting Israel and all the rest of it."

Should he be viewed as having terrorist ties and being a terrorist sympathizer as well?
"LPC Chairman Bob Tierney and other commissioners also noted that Community Board 1 and City Councilwoman Margaret Chin, who represents lower Manhattan, did not think the building ought to be protected."

"“It’s akin to the guardrail on the highway where a fatality occurred,” said Christopher Moore, a commissioner, who grew emotional while discussing his memories of 9/11. “The guardrail is not preserved.”

Bland and others added that they were also swayed by the fact that local preservation groups did not fight to save the building.
“The actions, or inactions, of these watchdogs of historic resources spoke loudly to me,” Bland said."

Doesn't sound like there was a lot of public support for saving them. You may not agree with them, but that does not make it suspicious. It just means the deciding committee had different views than you.
Of course it is not the same thing to you. It is to them, however.

Who are you to judge that there are enough moderate Muslims standing up, and who are you to judge where they can and cannot stand up?

Sounds like fear-mongering to me, and is a wild tangent to this conversation.
Newsflash, the Bible has some interesting laws in it also.

WHERE did he say he would not be getting funding from the Middle East? Your article says: " The imam said the money would be raised here. But he told a London newspaper that Muslim nations would also fund this project."

Your article does NOT quote him as saying he would not obtain funding from Muslim countries.
He is not doing that. He is not dividing. He is simply exercising his American religious rights. You are the one who is scared and having knee-jerk reactions. You are the one dividing. He has done nothing wrong.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

I've listed some of his ties already. I won't spent more time because you don't really care.

No, Buchanan wouldn't be because he doesn't skirt the issue and will flat out say that Hamas and Hezbollah are terrorist organizations. We don't get that from Rauf. When posed the question, Rauf tells Aaron Klein at WABC radio, "Look, I'm not a politician. The issue of terrorism is a very complex question." LOL! Right, Rauf!

Let's see, we have the landing gear from one of the planes that crashed at the Twin Towers breaking off, going through the roof of the Burlington building, crashing all the way to the basement and Moore equates that to, merely, "a guardrail on the highway where a fatality occurred." I'm sure you could ask the families of the 3,000 they lost at Twin Towers whether that was rather insulting.

They could have named it anything else, but they didn't. It does have significance, whether you want to see or agree with it or not.

An observant citizen, I have the right to question it.

Facts are scary things. And this is the creeping in of Sharia that you want to, willingly, overlook. You can't refute it.

Nice try. The NT brings us to a position and place of redemption and restoration. A change from the OT laws, which have been done away. Don't you wish Islam would do the same? They have no provision for it.

Uh, let's try that again. I'll walk you through it - Raul says that the funding for the Cordoba mosque will come from "here", i.e. America. He then tells a London paper that Muslim nations would ALSO fund this project. If you missed that, I suggest a reading comprehension course. And please study, Taqiyya. It means - liar, liar, pants on fire. :D

The majority of Americans do not agree with you. And, obviously, you haven't looked into this any further than you wanting to argue for the sake of arguing, which is your normal MO. So, we've come to the end of our little discussion being at an impasse.

Re: New Bar at Gound Zero
 

You have not provided facts on any of his ties. You have listed what YOU thought, but no facts. Still waiting on those.

Apparently there was not enough support to save it. What else was the committee supposed to do?
Um, they did name it something else. Park 51.

But you are not questioning. You are saying they should not be allowed to peaceably assemble somewhere in a religious manner. That is unconstitutional.
You have given me nothing to refute. Again, your own opinions.

Yeah, I just needed to fill a bulletin point. lol

Where did he say he would NOT be receiving funding from the Middle East? Certainly not in the article you provided. The article YOU provided said he would fund it from here, AS WELL as the Middle East. No lies there. Simply two places that funding would be coming from.


Again, since the majority of Americans disagree with something, we should ignore the Constitution? A strong stance to take there.