Restoration?
 

What does this mean? Usually when it comes up it's not in the context of restoring a saint to "sainthood", but rather it's about restoring a man to a position of authority and leadership.

Im not sure the bible ever addresses that topic though. Rather it gives clear guides for who shall be an elder..one of which is being blameless.

Is there biblical precedent for restoring fallen Pastors?

And please, no names in this thread

Re: Restoration?
 

Restoration after what?

Re: Restoration?
 

Fallen pastors is mentioned above. I suppose that's what the original post is asking...

Re: Restoration?
 

Re: Restoration?
 

Good point, Sweet Pea. I think the key to that verse is this: "YE WHICH ARE SPIRITUAL". The unspiritual are the Pharisees of our day who show no interest in restoring the fallen. Their only interest is in the "casting of the stones". I think of the "Holy Wars" of the late 1980s when a certain preacher of a certain Pentecostal denomination was faced with ouster from his denomination and, ultimately, criminal charges and imprisonment for some financial wrong doing. A well known and respected minister of the same group, led the pack of ravenous wolves to see to it that the wrongdoer got his just desserts. No interest to restore the wrongdoer in the spirit of meekness was apparent. From his front door, JS tossed stone after stone at the fallen brother. All the while, a wolf of another color slipped thru his own back door and his ministry was all but torn to shreds. Because JS had sitted himself in the seat of judgement against a fallen brother, he, himself, found himself being judged.

Those that sit in seat of judgement rather than at the mercyseat of restoration show just how "unspiritual" they really are.

Re: Restoration?
 

Surely if David was Prophet, Priest and King, and was restored from adultery, then pastors can be restored.

Jonah was also restored. Some have claimed David was a prophet but was not KNOWN as a prophet in his day. Matters not what he was KNOWN by. It is what God thinks of the situation.

Re: Restoration?
 

Theoretically, yes, we should seek to restore. However, when a man no longer meets the qualifications of a bishop after having fallen, it makes it difficult for him to be restored to the same position. This may not always be the case, though - but there are always natural consequences that no one can change.

Re: Restoration?
 

Excellent words from the other posters on this Thread.

I was telling my wife last night, God is no closer to me today than when I was a child. I remember calling out to the Lord during the crisis years of my family abuse, when I was 13 years old. I was not going to Church, our home was pure chaos, and I was doing some things that I'm sure did not please the Lord. Yet, God felt so close to me during this time.

People need to understand, God is not in this to only be by our sides when we are doing "Good". I believe God is like a true Father; His love and compassion is constantly reaching for us, whether we are on top of the mountain, or are in the deepest valley.

One of the dreadful by-products of Scripture is the galvanization of people. We use the Bible to force men and women underground with their faults because of chasing the dream of being "Blameless". Pastor, Saint, Sinner, it doesn't matter who you are, we are ALL people.

Being in the Ministry myself, this is my experience with those who serve in high places; I have the most difficult time getting other pastors to open up. Fear keeps them from confessing, as "Blameless" hangs over their head like an omen of doom. This is the perfect recipe for turning a man into a Pharisee or a Religious, political machine.

I think we need to let the words of Paul, ring loud and clear; "But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?". How many times have you heard these words come from your Pastor's mouth, talking about himself?

We need to learn from History; Samson, David, Solomon, Peter, Moses, Jacob, Abraham, and the many others who wrote or were talked about in Scripture (we don't know the whole story of others like Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, etc.), they ALL failed, big time! And, we are no different than they were.

There is no such thing as a "Blameless" man. When we understand this, we will be able to restore those who are going through a difficult time in their life.

Re: Restoration?
 

There aren't any buts about this topic according to the scriptures already provided in this thread.

Still, give me an example of a theoretical situation where a Bishop can find himself in where he simply can't be restored.

Re: Restoration?
 

This verse is not speaking to ministers being restored to the Ministry but is speaking of spiritual restoration

Re: Restoration?
 

Why? First of all David never went through a process where he ceased being prophet, priest or king. WHere does the bible say he was removed from any position and later restored? The fact is he was never removed so he was never restored.

Pastors are not Kings or Lords over God's heritage. The Kingship was a carnal position that God did not want to institute. He wanted a theocracy

The restoration process is about healing a person spiritually. As far as healing a Person TO a ministry that involves more IMO. That person needs to regain and restore his trustworthyness

Re: Restoration?
 

Why is "restoration" always about restoring someone to his lofty position of authority and power and not the same "restoration" any saint might go through also?

Re: Restoration?
 

In my opinion... restoration is something that the body has to allow. Local presbyters cannot just re-install a fallen minister over a church body. They cannot take that kind of shock. It could cause too much confusion, anger, and distrust. If the fallen minister serves the body until they begin voicing that they want him in the pulpit again... then they are restoring him. Surely an acting pastor can lead the congregation into this ministry through influence. But ultimately it's up to the church body in question... not denominational or district leadership.

Personally... I think a fallen minister should use his gifts in a more low key ministry like hospital chaplancy, prison ministry, home fellowship groups, house church, neighborhood evangelism and witnessing, etc until the body elevates him on request. I think men underestimate the spiritual damage sin brings. To put them up there too soon is not only dangerous for the church body... but dangerous to the minister needing restoration. He'd quickly become a lightening rod for criticism and lies... if he isn't healed emotionally and is still sore from sin... it can be devestating.

If the man wishes to be restored in any way... let him serve.

Re: Restoration?
 

Not sure what you are asking why about.

All the more reason that people removed should be restored.

Kings were anointed by God whether or not it was God's initial will. And the anointed ministry of a king is on par with anointed ministries of pastors or bishops just because all are anointed.

Trustworthiness is indeed required. It's just that some believe such a ministry cannot be restored.

Re: Restoration?
 

Agree 100%

Re: Restoration?
 

Why insist on putting him back in a position he obviously couldn't handle well in the first place? To whom much is given, much is required.

Re: Restoration?
 

I tend to agree.

Re: Restoration?
 

No scripture so far speaks of restoring someone to a position. They were all about restoring a saint spiritually

Re: Restoration?
 

:thumbsup

Re: Restoration?
 

Restoration to a position of trust and authority, when you betrayed that trust and authority, is another issue than spiritual restoration

Re: Restoration?
 

Maybe I left too much unsaid regarding the restoration of ministry. By no stretch of the imagination did I mean that a minister should automatically be restored to his position. When I think of someone being restored to a pulpit ministry, I firmly believe that there should be a time of proving and regaining trust - and it may not ever be possible for that person to go back to ministry in the same location they were - but I do believe that it is possible. JMHO

Re: Restoration?
 

That's still beside the point. These scriptures all concern spiritual restoration. That is the point to my thread. These verses all relate to saints...not to a class of people in the church who are called "ministers"

These verses simply do not apply to being restored TO a position of authority. They are all about spiritual restoration

I don't see any scriptures addressing that topic

Re: Restoration?
 

I guess I don't understand why you think it can't be a position of authority? It doesn't specifically say it can't. I don't read it that way. If someone has the call of God on their life - can't that be a part of "spiritual restoration"? I don't read it as limiting to saints only. JMHO

Are you having an issue with this particular situation with someone you know? Why are you harping on it?

Re: Restoration?
 

:laffatu:laffatu:happydance

Re: Restoration?
 

Because it doesn't say "If a Pastor falls away, you who are spiritual restore such a one back to their office"

Gal 6:1 Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted.

See? It's not about losing a job. Not about losing a position. It's about sinning and being restored

Re: Restoration?
 

BTW I didn't say it was limited to saints as though a Pastor is not a saint

Re: Restoration?
 

:thumbsup

Re: Restoration?
 

:thumbsup

Re: Restoration?
 

A truly repentant minister would most likely not feel worthy of being restored to a position of authority. I'd imagine the church would have to nearly push him back into leadership... and of course God might bring to pass providential circumstances.

No fallen minister is entitled to restoration with regards to position.

Re: Restoration?
 

So much for grace...

Re: Restoration?
 

It's grace that restores that fallen man spiritually. It's grace that causes a congregation to open their arms and receive him into fellowship again. But grace doesn't mean that one can be restored to a "position" in a church or ministry. Many think they are ENTITLED to get their position back. Not so. Honestly, many need to let go and humbly realize that maybe they aren't the best man for that job. Perhaps God will use them in a parachurch ministry, in charity work, etc. I know of a man who was a pastor (not Apostolic) for many years. He fell into sin and resigned from his position. After being restored spiritually a few talked to him about taking his position back. He declined saying that he wasn't the "right man" for the job. A few years later he was invited to speak at an apologetics conference on a university campus. As it would turn out... doors opened for him to be a major player in campus apologetics and evangelism.

Re: Restoration?
 

It does seem strange that the NT is virtually silent on the subject of ministerial restoration. That may be due to the fact that there is no "One Size Fits ALL" method to restore a fallen minister. Every situation is unique and every situation calls for a unique approach at restoration. And, in many cases, as pointed out by Aquilla, there may be no restoration to a particular ministry. But, the individual can use his or her talents in some other area of ministry.

The area of concern is not in restoring a fallen brother to the ministry, but rather restoring him to a right relationship with the Lord. His call to the ministry was given by the Lord and, in the unfortunate event of a fall, it is really up to the Lord to restore the fallen brother to his previous ministry. Or to move him into some other area of ministry.

Re: Restoration?
 

You know, that's what I thought.

It's funny how we can pick and choose what scriptures mean to fit our fancy.


There's nothing in scripture that states that restoration to a position is not included.

WHY ADD TO THE BIBLE?


Was King David "removed" from office? No.
He was corrected while in office.
If the Old Testament is for our learning, maybe we should learn how to deal with ministers who fall from the ultimate example of leadership failure in the Old Testament.

Re: Restoration?
 

I am glad Jonah and David never heard that in their day, and they were under a lesser covenant than we have. Unless you mean he can come back to his position so long as there is full reconciliation in regards to his spirituality. Then I agree.

You sad, "I think a fallen minister should use his gifts in a more low key ministry like hospital chaplancy, prison ministry, home fellowship groups, house church, neighborhood evangelism and witnessing, etc until the body elevates him on request."

Re: Restoration?
 

:thumbsup Unfortunately too many people don't want to give the Lord their permission for this to happen.

Re: Restoration?
 

:thumbsup

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LOL

There is nothing in scripture that states that restoration to a position of ministry is included.

We can't add to the Bible.

Re: Restoration?
 

A minister is a servant to the body of Christ, not a leader to be restored. If a minister's sin was so serious the body feels uncomfortable, he cannot be restored... even if he is fully restored spiritually. I imagine that if another body desires to have that minister serve them, that's their right to request he do so.

Re: Restoration?
 

Where is Grace ever about getting someone's job back? Where is Grace ever about someone getting their position of authority back?

Grace is about God's relationship to man salvifically

Re: Restoration?
 

When and where does the bible say Jonah lost his paid position of Pastor let alone his unpaid position of prophet?

When and where did David stop being king over Israel for his transgressions.

The bible does not provide such answers. Restoration in terms of what the bible has to say is always a restoration spiritually between God and the man, not a man to his position of authority.

The reason is there are trust issues particularly when someone is in a position of betrayal...ie he cheated on his wife...He cheated on his wife with a church member...he cheated on his wife with the wife of a church member...he stole church funds. That is not a man to God issue. That is a man to church issue

Im not convinced every man that is a Pastor was called or should be a pastor. How they got that position often depends more on the organization of men than the calling of God.