Sin away grace?
 

Heard it preached "dont sin away your grace"

Thoughts?

Re: Sin away grace?
 

Where sin doth abound, grace doth much more abound.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

However, there is a place one can get to where sin hardens the person's heart against the grace of God. God's grace is still enough but the person may be turned over to a reprobate mind and not able to respond to the grace of God. The issue is not with God's grace but the condition of the person's heart toward the Grace of God. Many may "turn the grace of God into laciviousness".

Re: Sin away grace?
 

Then God's grace is not enough to save those with a hardened heart.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

Of course! Nor an unbelieving heart. That sin (unbelief) is way too horrible to be forgiven.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

The hardened heart that breaks in repentance God will save

Re: Sin away grace?
 

There is a big difference in saving and saved. If one is not saved then they can never confess in faith they are saved. PERIOD.
Those who are being saved can never confess salvation by grace through faith because it is not finalized until the end. Either your born again of the spirit or your are not, there is no in between.
Jesus did not come to save our flesh, he came to save our spirit from eternal damnation and that he did by removing the penalty of sin. He who became sin for us that we might be saved through him and not ourselves. How plain is the verse when it states, not of yourselves, lest any should boast.
Where is boasting then? is it by the law? I think not but by grace and not yours but Jesus'
No one is perfect, I have never met anyone who is perfect, only those who think they are by the merit of, " I'm trying to live perfect and because of that my faith is counted worthy of salvation. Dear Jesus, people better wake up. Our righteousness in the sight of God is as filthy rags!
Can't get to heaven by the works of the law.[ which is the commandments included] if so the bible states that if that were the case then Jesus has died in vain, for by the works of the law no one was found perfect, that is why God performed the work of Christ and planned it form the beginning.
And therefore since Jesus has come and done the work he has done then God has annulled the old covenant that a new one could be in force.
Paul states clearly that there cannot be two covenants in force at the same time.
The big problem with people is this; If they were to try and live by faith in the new nature which they were supposed have taken on by the spiritual re-birth, they would find out very soon how many of them were not real to begin with.
Some of those who preach righteousness by faith in the blood of Christ and then disregard the receiving of the Holy Ghost with signs following, would really examine themselves and their stance against holiness standards they would find out they aren't right either.
Holiness is part of the new nature Christ gave us. It is also an ongoing non stop process of repenting and continual effort to over come the wrong in our lives which is not like Jesus. It is the nature of the Lord in us and His spirit is in us and we have been made over in his likeness. So, living right is a matter of nature not effort, it should come as easy as rolling off a log, that is, if you are really real in Christ!
If the truth were taught and received concerning who we are in Christ the issue of backsliding would not be an issue. Most people backslide be cause they think God can't forgive them anymore or they don't measure up to the standards of those who are condemning them for their weakness.
Man I shouldn't have got started, I'm sure someone on here will rebuttal this, bring it on I don't care.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

I actually agree with the majority of this thought. God will never NOT forgive a sin or lifestyle but there is most assuredly a point where a human may not WANT God to forgive them anymore. I'm pretty confident that even when this point is reached God will lead and forgive even with the person kicking and screaming -in the same manner Lot was dragged from the city before it was destroyed, but there is probably a crossroads (which is different for every single person and hopefully not easily reached) where God grants the person his wish, and leaves.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

Except blaspheming the Holy Ghost, of course. And unbelief (unless you stop unbelieving), of course. (Could that be said of any sin? That it won't be forgiven until you stop?)

Re: Sin away grace?
 

What exactly is blasphemy of the Holy Ghost? Taking into consideration that jesus is the Holy Ghost since he is the spirit of a departed one and he is the only one which is truly holy.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

This is where the "kicking and screaming" part comes into play. :)

Re: Sin away grace?
 

Beats me.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

It won't be forgiven until there is a change of heart.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

Blasphemy of the Holy Ghost is to speak against or in contradiction to the Holy Ghost. Now since there is only one God who is the father of you all and in you all, then the Holy Ghost is God. To speak against him would be the same as to take a stance against the fact that there is a God and to try and convince others of the same.
This is nothing more than being a practicing atheist. Of course as long as your an atheist you can't find forgiveness for your sin or sins.

There was actually Jews in the times of Christ and the apostolic age of the early church that spoke against the apostles and the doctrines of Christ and the receiving of the Holy Ghost. Those people could not be forgiven for their deeds and their sin because they would not receive the truth and were outside of the grace of God.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

OK. ;)

Re: Sin away grace?
 

Jesus gives time for disciples to bear fruit. If they dont he cuts them off.

Luke 13:7-9

6 He spake also this parable; A certain [man] had a fig tree planted in his vineyard; and he came and sought fruit thereon, and found none.

7 Then said he unto the dresser of his vineyard, Behold, these three years I come seeking fruit on this fig tree, and find none: cut it down; why cumbereth it the ground?

8 And he answering said unto him, Lord, let it alone this year also, till I shall dig about it, and dung [it]:

9 And if it bear fruit, [well]: and if not, [then] after that thou shalt cut it down.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

There must be a lot of fig trees cut down. I think that parable is concerning the covenant that God had currently with Israel one which is about to get cut off because they rejected him as messiah. I have also heard it taught that this parable is about those who the spirit of the Lord deal with but they will not yield to him to be saved.
However I think it's talking about the future of Israel and all the times that God in the past has dealt with her.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

Both Heb. 6 & 10 makes it clear a person can become an apostate.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

GRace abounds toward a humbled heart that is repentant of sin. Not toward a person of a prideful heart.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

Unless the person with the prideful heart doesn't know any better, and who does?

Do you feel like you are a million times as humble as thou art?

Re: Sin away grace?
 

Jas 4:17 Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.

The point is knowledge of which is my point of repentant which would mean has knowledge of as you cannot repent of what you do not know. Your second point has nothing to do with the first.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

How would Jesus expect the unsaved to bear fruit? Cant happen.

On the other hand if this is PERSONAL it agrees with what Jesus taught the Apostles.

1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.

2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every [branch] that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.

4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.

5 I am the vine, ye [are] the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast [them] into the fire, and they are burned.

John 15:1-6

Jesus is looking for fruit. He gives people time but if they dont bring it forth he takes the initiative to cut them off. That seems pretty clear.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

I thought that Austin's words were very good, on this question.

As to my understanding, if you are indeed saved by grace, then sin will not "abound." The grace of God is THAT powerful! He will always make a way for us to escape (1 Corinthians 10:13).

Re: Sin away grace?
 

I thought we were talking about Christians sinning away their salvation?
Your post above is talking about and expressing those who are not in Christ to begin with.
Two things;
One is;
Jesus himself is saying [ You can do nothing within yourself without me.] That should be clear to the christian in regard having any ability to bear fruit, that it is Jesus doing it and not self. So if one fails then it would be the fault of Christ that they failed according to what he just said.
Second;
I have never seen any christian that does not have the fruit the spirit in their life," NEVER " The problem with holier than thou people is they don't look for fruit or they judge others by how much they think they have?
To say that Jesus will cut off those who have come to him by faith is to call Jesus a liar.
John 6:35=39.
And Jesus said unto them;
I am the bread of life' he that cometh to me shall NEVER hunger; and he that believeth on me shall NEVER thirst.
But I say unto you, That you also have seen me, and believe not.
ALL, that the Father giveth me SHALL COME to me; and him that cometh to me I will IN NO WISE "cast out" [ that means cut off and burn ]
For I came down from heaven not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of ALL which HE HATH GIVN me, I should LOSE NOTHING, but should raise it up again at the last day.

To conclude my thought. The bible clearly states that no man can even come to the Lord Jesus unless he first draw him, Jn. 6:44:
Now, are we serving a vain God who with his infinite mind of all future things makes mistakes and draws people just to later throw them in a fire and say, well I gave you a chance and you failed.
Not the living Lord Jesus who sits upon the Throne of Heaven, the one whom I know, that has never forsaken his sheep but with his divine ability has saved them from the up most of evil and destruction.
I don't know about anyone else on here or anywhere, but I was reconciled to the Lord Jesus by his death while I was yet a sinner. It's unfortunate that I had to walk around in this great so called christian nation with all of it's spiritual holy than thou saints with all their supernatural power and not have any of them ever even witness to me in a period of over 23 years.
That's what amazes me about super Christianity! and it's ideologies! How quick it is to condemning someone.
In all those years I could have died and went to hell and all the so-called power saints that passed me every day on the streets and in the stores who never took the time to be in contact with the spirit of Jesus to witness and tell me how much! Jesus really loved me/
It's a good thing I'm not God, because a lot of people would get their wish come true..

Re: Sin away grace?
 

If a saint can loose their salvation, surely it isn't because they didn't do this or that. The issue with sin is that it draws the heart away from God, killing saving faith. Eventually continual sin will harden one against God and His will. Like foreign wives, sin will lead a man away from his faith in God. At this point a man might convince himself that he isn't really cut out to be a Christian and his faith in God and the Bible will die, ending in a state of being apostate. In addition, a man might convince himself that God accepts his sinful ways and remain a religious animal... but void of saving faith. When saving faith has died, when the man no longer desires God... he has severed Himself from the source of all life.

Christianity has only two laws... love God... love your neighbor. For guidance on how to love God and your neighbor... see the Ten Commandments.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

I'm not officially chiming in on this subject but reading the thread title this morning I did think it interesting that the definition of grace to most of us is...

I'll forgive your past... and I'll forgive your present for a while... but you better get your act together. :)

Re: Sin away grace?
 

Like that fellow that said "Go, and sin no more."? ;)

Re: Sin away grace?
 

'cause if you do... I'm gonna ZAP ya.

Several points with your bout of genius here. :)

1. Pre grace... Still under the law... Jesus was still alive. (Pretty good point huh?) :)

2. Should we continue in sin that grace may abound? God forbid. We should all strive to find, learn and walk in the ways of our God. What else are we saved from than our ownselves and the sin that following our own will has led us through?

We have grace. We have forgiveness. But should we just keep sinning because we can? Absolutely not. We should strive to walk a way higher than our own. But when we do fail we have an advocate with the Father.

So there is a difference between a worn out place on the Book of Life where God keeps erasing & rewriting our name and someone wanting "salvation" from the consequences of their sin and yet intend on continuing to embrace and practice that sin with no regard for God's way.

The ways of God are foolishness to them that perish.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

And I thank you very much.
I think any bible scholar can identify with what Paul is trying so hard to tell the new Jewish converts. That the keeping of the law will not perfect you it will only make you religious. Paul is putting forth his best efforts to try and make people see, if you are truly born again by the power of Jesus Christ then you have died and been resurrected by that same power unto newness of life. That simply means you are a new creature even though when you look into your bathroom mirror you look like your old self.
Many years ago my beloved mentor said to me, time and time again in an effort to get me to see the truth outside of the brainwashing that a pentecostal church put there, this one truth.
He said to me often, quit putting that old self in the closet and stop getting up everyday and strapping him onto your back and walking around with him. Take him outside and bury him, because he is dead and no longer exists.
I use to say to him; But if I go down and get drunk and run off with some whore and spend the night I can't possible be still saved. His reply was; if that's what you 'REALLY' want to do then there is a good chance that you might not be saved to begin with.
I struggled with this for a long time until one day by spiritual revelation from Jesus, he showed me the truth. That cost me a lot throughout the years even today. But I know without any doubt where my spirit rests. But most of all, I know what my true nature really is, and should I forget in a time of dispare, then the Holy Ghost is there with me to remind me of who I am in Christ Jesus. It is my prayer to the Lord that everybody could get what I got so they would be at peace with themselves as well as with Jesus and those in their church.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

I can certainly see how God may get tired of granting grace, over and over again. We have to forgive 70 times 7 times, but He never promised to be that forgiving! :lol

And that fellow also gave some examples of His criteria for judging people, and I'm pretty sure He was looking to the future, in the age of "grace". He mentioned believing, a few times (John 3:16, e.g.), but also had some actions (works) in mind, too. E.g., the sheep and the goats will be separated based on whether they did good works, of feeding the hungry, clothing the naked, visiting prisoners, and housing the homeless. If you do, you will be rewarded. If you do not, you will be thrown into the everlasting fire. Matthew 25.

And some works count, and some don't. Prophesying, casting out devils, and certain (unspecified) "wonderful works" don't count. Doing the will of God counts. If you don't do the will of God, and bring forth good fruit, into the fire you go. Matthew 7.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

1 Cor 1:18
For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

1 Cor 1:21
For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
22For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:

23But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;

26For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:

27But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

28And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are

1 Cor 2:14
But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Rom 1
20For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

21Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

22Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

Re: Sin away grace?
 

Whatterya tryin' ta say? :lol

Re: Sin away grace?
 

This thread title sounds like the name of sitcom. "Sin & Grace"

Re: Sin away grace?
 

I believe someone can resist the drawing of the Holy Spirit,which is dangerous because The Holy Spirit may not draw that person again.Today is the day of Salvation.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

Here's a good one: Either you is or you isn't.

Re: Sin away grace?
 

:thumbsup

Re: Sin away grace?
 

There's not enough :thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup 's for that.