Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

Remember the Jeff Arnold "MIRACLE" in Columbia, MS??

See the attached article. Pastor of First United Methodist Church dies in pulpit and is brought back! Guess God is not just exclusive to the UPC!!:thumbsup

http://www.sunherald.com/2011/12/03/...ble-after.html


PASCAGOULA -- The Rev. Jim Fisher of First United Methodist Church of Pascagoula is in stable condition after collapsing at the pulpit during this morning’s service.

Assistant Pastor Sherry Judy said Fisher has been hospitalized and is in stable condition. He is undergoing tests, but it doesn’t appear that he suffered a heart attack or damages to his heart.

A doctor in the congregation and others with medical experience gave emergency aid until paramedics arrived.

“He was out, not breathing, for about 13 minutes,” Judy said, “and suddenly he came to.”

The congregation was praying and applauded when he was taken out of the sanctuary on a gurney.

“We believe we experienced a miracle,” Judy said.


Read more: http://www.sunherald.com/2011/12/03/...#ixzz1fcLCnVw5

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

Tis true. Nor is God exclusive to religious folk. Remember Meatloaf?

http://apostolicfriendsforum.com/sho...light=meatloaf

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz...#ixzz1Ted480ct

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

yep, God considers each one of us "His"

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

In my many years of Christian life, I've learned this valuable lesson:

God is motivated by FAITH!

Anyone, whether they be saint or sinner, whose actions display FAITH in God (in His sight, of course), can, and will receive from Him whatever they petition Him for. But.... one MUST exercise extreme caution in such instances.... for receiving an answer to a petition submitted to God (whether for ourselves or another), is NOT, repeat NOT evidence that one is saved!

My "religious background" began in the Methodist Church. Undoubtedly, there are many good, decent, kind, caring folks who are devout members of this denomination. However, none of these admirable traits of one's character qualifies them for entrance into the eternal kingdom of heaven... this can only be accomplished by obedience to the explicit instructions found written in Acts 2:38.

One simply MUST never consider God's granting of a "miracle," even if it be a restoration to life from what might appear to be a death, as evidence that the individual involved is in "right standing" with God. It is this one thing which gives me the greatest concern in such instances as that which is noted here.

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

And the 1980 US Olympic hockey team?

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

Were Jesus' miracles evidence of anything?

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

I was also thinking of virtually every episode of Baywatch where someone was rescued by one of the super model lifeguards and given CPR until they coughed up some sea water then got up like nothing happened, all too the applause of the onlookers.

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

Yes, Timmy, I'm sure one might conclude a variety of reasons/purposes which they were intended to convey to those that witnessed them.

However, perhaps none [in my opinion] was of greater importance than this - they provided visible, indisputable evidence that He was who He said that He was; the eternal invisible "Spirit" [i.e., God] who had come, as He had promised, to "visit" mankind, and in so doing [by His death & resurrection] cause the plan of redemption which He had devised for the souls of all mankind to be effectuated. Oh! How thankful I am unto Him for that most wondrous of all the "miracles" which He did!

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

Was Arron's rod turning into a snake indisputable proof that God was with him?

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

"With him?" Absolutely, albeit NOT "in" him!

The apostle John, in the gospel account which he was inspired of God to write, advises us that NO man possessed the Spirit as an indwelling Entity in human flesh, that is until after Jesus Christ was glorified (i.e., following His resurrection from the dead) (see John 5:39).

While many holy men of olden times (prior to Christ Jesus' glorification) had the Spirit with them, thereby providing the power which enabled them to perform the miracles which they are credited with having done, the Lord Jesus Christ is the only human being who has ever been endowed with the Spirit without measure. (see II Corinthians 5:19)

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

OK. Then was God also with Pharaoh's magicians?

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

Well, Timmy, the "short" answer would be yes! However, God was "with" them in a much different sense, in that He "allows" evil to prevail, oft-times for the purpose of showing the superiority of His power; as it was with the magicians of Pharaoh and their actions. If you will note, everything that Pharaoh's magicians did was nullified by the actions which were done by God through Moses and Aaron.

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

By "with", I meant in same way He was with Moses and Aaron. The stated purpose of the rod/serpent miracle was to show Pharaoh that God had appeared to them. God had a backup plan, of course. If that didn't work, Moses (or Aaron) was to do the hand-turned-leprous-and-back miracle. Plan C was to be pouring river water onto the ground to be turned into blood.

Well, plan A didn't seem to work (though it may only be because God hardened Pharaoh's heart -- hard to say). Plans B and C seem to have been skipped, in favor of an even better (I guess) plan, and, well, the rest is "history".

Anyway, back to the issue of indisputable proof. How does that work, again? If a miracle is amazing enough, that proves God did it? How amazing is enough? (A rod turning into a snake didn't quite make it. A snake devouring all the bad guys' snakes did. I guess.)

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

but... isn't just about everything concerning Baywatch fake?????

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

Well, "just about" doesn't mean "all". :)

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

Ya coupla things for sure :)

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

LOL

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

Timmy, I am confident that God doesn't need a Plan A, B, C or any other than the one which He devised before the first words of creation were ever spoken, in order that that which He has determined might be accomplished. Thus it isn't that your hypothesis is not only utterly absurd (to say the least), but it evidences the thoughts (i.e., mindset) of one who is (apparently) destitute of understanding the manner in which God does things. I do not state this to belittle, harange, publicly embarrass or humiliate you, but am simply expressing how I understand the meaning or significance of your comments.

Now, with regards to the matter of tendering "indisputable proofs" which serve to evidence God's abilities (i.e., power) to perform or accomplish things which lie beyond the capabilities of finite mortals like you and I.... I am persuaded that God oft-times performs what we might think to be an impossible act, a "miracle" if you will, doing so to make the truth of the matter "unbelievable."

Yes, you read that right! For instance, have you ever witnessed a serpent or an ass speaking as a human being; God speaking from a burning bush which is not being consumed by the flames; a man remaining "alive" in the belly of a whale for 3 whole days before being spewed out upon a beach; or, what is perhaps the greatest "miracle" of all - a lifetime of despicable sinful acts being forever remitted through the seemingly simple act of submission of oneself to immersion in waters and having the baptizer verbally assert that the authority for doing so is by the authority of the "name of the Lord Jesus Christ"?

Such so-called "miracles" as these are simply unbelievable, right? Absolutely... yet they are ALL true! Thus we find that God presents us with the truth by making it, at first glimpse, utterly unbelievable. So what is it, we must ask ourselves, that makes such "miracles" (as well as many others which He has, and does perform) believable? The answer, of course, is pure and simple FAITH, without which it is impossible to please God.

So, concerning the question - what makes the things (i.e., miracles) which God does to be "indisputable" truths? Simply, and only, because I believe it!! That, my friend, is what FAITH truly represents - pure and simple belief of those things which, to my finite mortal mind, would otherwise seem to be "unbelievable!"

I don't suspect that you'll readily accept these musings as truth (albeit I hope that you will).

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

What is my hypothesis that you find absurd? I'm mostly just asking questions, so far. And relating a story we find in the Bible. Didn't think you'd find that absurd. ;)

But now that you have defined "indisputable proof" for me, I definitely have a hypothesis regarding that. To you, indisputable proof is anything that you want to call indisputable truth, on faith. How you choose, I'm not exactly sure, but it seems to be whatever lines up with your interpretation of things in the Bible, for one thing.

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

Oh, and I don't feel humiliated at all. No worries, there! :)

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

The greater miracle is that the methodists now believe in miracles... hee hee....

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

:lol

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

Timmy, one of the greatest privileges that those who are yet ignorant (i.e., destitute of knowledge) regarding the many wondrously indescribable truths of the Bible (& this principle is also applicable to everything one encounters in life), is that they're granted the freedom/liberty to ask questions, albeit many fail to recognize it. I'm glad to learn you are not so inclined, but are willing to publicly express your lack of understanding things pertaining to God by asking questions about such important matters. So it's not what I recognize to be your inherent ignorance of the esoteric principles of God's written word that I find absurd, rather it is that I perceive the manner in which you tender such questions about them to be construed as such also reflects your lack of understanding the consequences of your continued rejection of things which I, and others, express to you for your enlightenment.

Absurd - completely unreasonable, illogical, or inappropriate.

Yes, that's an accurate descriptive word which reflects how I perceive your many corrupt assertions concerning spiritual matters. But because I am also keenly cognizant of the fact that there was a moment in the not too distant past when I was much like you in this regards, I am able to both accept and comprehend (perhaps even better than you might even imagine) why you make the statements which you do.

Unlike you, when a man, to whom I, because of my inherent ignorance, had verbally expressed certain beliefs which were not scripturally sound, informed me that they were amiss, I did not engage him in a debate about the matter. Instead, I recalled the instructions which my Dad gave me while I was yet a young lad - "If you ever encounter a spiritual matter, the answer to which by others you deem to be unacceptable, then pick up the Bible, open it's covers and read. The answer to every question concerning such things are to be found there."

Well, long story shortened - I did that, albeit I was utterly unaware of the manner in which I would determine the answer. I not only read the entire Bible, front to back, several times, but after failing to find that answer I sat down and typed it's every word.... not once, but twice! Yet even after all that the answer I was seeking to find remained elusive. But determined not to give up (knowing that my Dad, who at that time had been dead for many years, would never knowingly lie to me), I persisted.

But what should my next course of action be? Well, I remembered reading that Jesus said there were some things which would not be given without prayer and fasting. Fasting! What did that mean, and how was I to do to accomplish it? Go without food and water for an extended period of time in an effort to prove to God my desire to know the answer? Unbelievable, right? Yes, but true, as I was soon to discover!

And so I began to fast and pray... devoting 72 continuous hours without food or water, and was determined to continue doing so until I received the answer which I sought. And, behold, it came! You see, without even asking for it, while lying atop my bed praying, God gave me the baptism of His Spirit... and I didn't even know what it was when I received it, only learning it's significance when I turned to that same man who had informed me of embracing erroneous beliefs, and he explained it to me by going to that same Bible I had read so often.

You see, Timothy, unlike you, who seems to be so ready to contend with me and others concerning the merits, or truthfulness of the things which God has caused to be written for our enlightenment so that we might learn of that which He requires for reconciliation with Him, I didn't consult with any man for those answers.... I looked to God's written word, when at the beginning I was utterly ignorant of it's great value. At the beginning I, much like yourself, had always believed it's contents to be the surmisings of other mortals like myself.... but oh, how wrong I would soon learn that I had been!

You see, my friend, there were many, many things concerning God and the wondrous "miracles" which He had performed that I, simply stated, entertained serious reservations about their validity. But after encountering Him in such an indescribably powerful manner as I did on that occasion while I lay atop my bed praying, I now know, beyond the shadow of all doubts, that every word in the Bible represents "indisputable" truth! There is an automobile bumper sticker I have which says it best - "God said it and that settles it!" It matters not whether you or I believe that the contents of the Bible are true or not, for our beliefs doesn't change the simple fact that they are that - inerrant truths!

God will never compel one to accept His written word as truth.... that is a personal decision we each must conclude. It is my prayer that you would discontinue the questioning of it's merits, and accept His word as truth, for that is precisely what it is! The search for truth through others means will always end in defeat and despair, but His word is truth!

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

You are apparently not aware that I spent the first 50 years of my life searching and reading the Bible and believing. Will it take another 50 years to finally "get it"?

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

Reminds me of some teachers I had in the past. Of course THEY would have made me type it a hundred times, not just twice.

Perhaps copying it using nothing but a large feather and ink well onto scrolls would have been better?

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

Oh, and by the way, I agree with you in this: if I decide to start believing it, I will start believing it. :thumbsup

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

The fact of the matter, Timmy, is that it need NOT take that long. However, that too is a decision only you can make. Beware though, as these words penned by the great apostle Paul so explicitly assert that there will be those who will be

Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth. (II Timothy 3:7, KJV)

Ever wonder WHY some, although they expend considerable time in reading the Bible, will be unable to come to the knowledge of the truth? Well, let's allow the language of the Bible to provide the answer

Proverbs 1:7
The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.

Proverbs 9:10
The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

Perhaps it is that you've not yet learned what it means to fear God. If so, then I would encourage you to think on this matter. seriously!

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

Which meaning of "fear" are you using, here? Being afraid of, or being respectful of?

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

How about both?

How about just simply being fearful of (the possibility of) having to spend eternity experiencing unrelenting pain and torment in a lake of fire? No food, water, or respite of any kind! What if it is true that this will be the lot of all who reject everything that God has done to make it possible for them to be reconciled to Him? Doesn't the thought of you being compelled to experience such a possibility instill fear in you? It did me! Still does, in fact, which serves to cause me to want to continue to reverence Him, knowing that as long as I do my very best to do that, I shall be honored for it.

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

If I believed in hell, I'd have that fear. My reverence for God may already be "enough", but it's hard to say. You hope you are "doing your very best", and expect to be honored for it. You could be right. Or maybe you should have the fear of being among the many believers to whom Jesus will say "Depart from me".

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

And that, my friend, is a fear which I pray shall always serve to haunt me, for it motivates me to constantly be about the task of endeavoring to serve Him (to the best of my abilities) in accordance to the dictates of His written word!

I am grieved to learn that you apparently do not believe in eternal punishment in a lake of fire for the wicked. Most amazing, indeed!

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

Amazing? Not sure why you'd think that. What reasons are the for believing that God would punish people forever? (Other than the Bible, which, incidentally, also supports other views. Just as crakjak. ;))

Does it make sense to you?

And why should it grieve you that I don't believe it?

Re: Another Pastor Raised from the dead!
 

(BTW, it's official: this thread has now been hijacked! :lol)