IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim"
 

Is a pregnant rape victim, God's intention? so says Indiana senate candidate Murdock. Romney's only senate endorsement. this looniness paints christians in a bad light. anyone here agree with Murdock? (wouldn't surprise me)

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

I sure don't agree. That is just a horrible statement for anyone to make.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

here is article for skeptics: http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/p...enate/1653745/

how do republicans defend this clown?

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

if God intended the pregnancy, does God intend the rape? let's hear from all the antiabortionists

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

Is God Sovereign?

When we surrender our hurt to His Will, it is His Will to make the hurt into something for our good.


Did God intend Joseph to be betrayed by his brothers and sold into slavery?
Did God intend for Pharoah's first born to die?
Did God intend for Jesus Christ to suffer tortue of the cruelest kind?

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

No, a pregnant rape victim is not God's intention! However, God’s intention is that biology works the way he created it to work. Now, whether conception occurs from love, lust or violent rape, that is not God’s doing, but mankind’s doing. We all know this world has polluted with evil what God intended for good. Of course as Christians we also know that God has a way of taking all of our sin and evil and turning it for good.

I think the point Mr. Murdock was trying to make and the liberal media is trying to spin out of control is simply this; once a life is conceived, first and foremost, we have a moral obligation to recognize that life as a God given, God designed, human life and a spiritual being. No matter how reprehensible its conception, it is NOT a glob of cells or ball of flesh. It is a child who has an eternal God given soul. Once we come to grips with that sobering fact, then maybe we can face the added dilemma. Do we commit further sin by murdering that life? Would it be any “lesser of a sin” than the rape that conceived the life in the first place? I know this is a highly controversial and emotional topic, but let me ask the question; would God not bless that life and use that life regardless of the pain and emotional distress it’s conception brought? Don’t we all have “checkered pasts?” Doesn’t God have a way of transforming us into new creatures and making all things new, regardless of the sin we were born in? Could God give the victim peace of heart and mind as she gives of herself to sacrifice nine months of her life so another family could be blessed with a child they could not conceive on their own? You see, perhaps I’m a clown and perhaps I’m making a horrible statement, but I’m thinking I agree with Mr. Murdock here. God can use a sinful rape and make something good out of it, just like he made something good out of you and of me.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

what about free will? do you mean God is determining evil?

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

1. You misquoted the Senator. He did NOT say "God intended pregnant rape victim" so you shouldn't have placed that in quotes as if it was a direct quote. Here's what he actually said:

"I struggled with it myself for a long time, but I came to realize that life is that gift from God. And, I think, even when life begins in that horrible situation of rape, that it is something that God intended to happen"

MEANING, the LIFE is what God intended or allowed; not the rape.

2. Anyone who isn't Christian will probably not understand the concept or the belief that God can take something evil and turn it to good.
3. Anyone who sees a baby as a blessing, and life as a gift from God will understand the meaning in point #2.
4. Anyone who sees a baby as a burden or a curse will fail to comprehend.

I completely understand what the Senator was saying, and I tend to agree. Again, those who see a pregnancy as a curse will not be able to comprehend WHY it could be good coming from evil.

This is not a misstatement on the part of the Senator; it is a reflection of how different conservative values are from liberal values.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

I don't believe God would ever prompt evil; in this case, rape. However, He certainly could allow conception, and it's sad that so many people see that as "evil" or a curse rather than the blessing it could be.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

the point is wether conception is a natural biological occurrence or something God ordains. murdock says he doesn't mean that God intends rape but pregnancy. if God intended the pregnancy the it follows that God intended the rape. the two occurrences are connected if God intends it. But if rape is the effect of free will and pregnancy the effect of natural bilogical occurrences then Murdock is an idiot.

the question is does god "intend" or ordain conception or is it a natural biological occurrence.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

Nonsense. God can take evil at the hands of man and turn it into good.

"Ye thought evil of me, and God turned it into good, that he should enhance me, as ye see in this present time, and that he should make safe many peoples;" Genesis 50:20, WB

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

Was God evil in hardening Pharoah's heart to the point that his first born would be killed?

He had to know what was happening, what He was allowing, or even what He was doing, right?

God is Sovereign.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

The "Wrath" of God is never evil.
The "Chastisement" of God is never evil.
The "Will" of God is never evil.

God is Just. In giving a woman a miscarrying womb, in commanding the Israelite armies to anhillate their enemies, in forsaking His only begotten Son as He bled and died on a tree, in sending people strong delusions-- God is and will always be Just.


God is Sovereign and He is Just.
I am learning to surrender my hurts to the Sovereignty and Justice of God.
I am a work in progress.

Such is life. Our lives, our country, this hemisphere, this world-- these are all a work in God's Process. The things in life that we perceive to be unimaginably horrible, tragic, and evil are yet a part of God's Process, and thus God's Will.

Who will attempt to hold God accountable?
Who will accuse Him, His Processes and His Will as evil?
Who will judge the Almighty God?

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

Excellent post. :thumbsup

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

I don't think we disagree here, JD.

God doesn't prompt evil; evil is something that is unjust, simplistically. God hardening Pharaoh's heart can be seen as just. God causing a man to rape a woman would be unjust/evil, assuming we are not talking about some sort of judgment befalling her.

I can't think of scenarios in the Bible where God was the cause of evil. Punishment for wrongdoing or disobedience or, in Pharaoh's case, enslaving and mistreating God's chosen people, is just; not evil.

Was it evil for God to punish Korah and his whole family? And Eliab's sons and their "little children" with them? The answer is that what God does is just; it is never evil, because God is sovereign. IMO, the only time God would CAUSE harm to come to a person would be for the purpose of judgment; that is not to be confused with allowing harm, which is the nature of humanity and God seems to rarely interfere with those things perpetrated by humans and their free will (to be evil).

I pretty much agree with you, except that I don't agree with any wording that says God commits evil. If God does something, by definition, it isn't evil. If God allows a woman to conceive from rape, or if He even causes her to conceive from rape, it is Him turning evil into good. It doesn't mean that He caused her to be raped for the purpose of conceiving. It may mean that He allowed conception to ease her pain. Unfortunately, the modern mindset doesn't allow recognizing an unplanned pregnancy in those terms, and that is tragic, IMO.

Saying that God doesn't commit or cause evil is not the same as saying God never allows or causes harm to befall a person. He has in the past and He may again, for various reasons that usually seem closely aligned with either testing a person or judgment.

Psalm 5:4 "For thou art not a God that hath pleasure in wickedness: neither shall evil dwell with thee."

Psalm 18:30 "As for God, his way is perfect:...."

Psalm 145:17 "The Lord is righteous in all his ways, and holy in all his works."

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

I'm glad AFF has it's very own fact checker!! :yourock

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

God ordained a natural biological occurance.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

Come on DM, stop being obtuse. you know the point here is not what Murdoc said at all. The point is to embarres the republican and make him look like an idiot.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

:nod

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

Good thing only Republicans say dumb stuff to keep the media going.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

if that is true then God does not intend pregnancy from rape and the senator is wrong.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

mourdok is running for senator who will vote on supreme court justices, not just a dumb comment to be brushed aside,he has radical beliefs that should reflect on his qualifications to be senator. imho.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

Yup! I think it's worth noting that God's explanation @ 'Pharoah' would be quite different than Pharoah's,
even after the fact. Meaning that God took direct responsibility
in those passages, for P's hard heart;just like He does for your-
-or I guess my is a better way to put it--'hard heart.'

As hard as it is to understand (don't try),
it was God's will that _____ got pregnant
in the manner described, at least put one way.
But this assumes a direct intervention from God,
when I believe that cause and effect (sow/reap)
dictates an outcome, and I might go so far as to say God
can not intervene there (w/o abrogating free will)
(negating? lol, sorry)(which God will not do, your free will
is sacred to God)(which is why you should be so
careful in your speech-I'm herding goats because of mine,
so reader beware)

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

And you, a devoted member of a kingdom, should care less? I'd love to know his opinion on exempting himself and his cronies from the common wile, in direct violation of the constitution. Nah, I really don't.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

Mr. Murdock cannot help himself, he is a Calvinist. Therefore, God intends every event that occurs, and there is a case that can be made for this doctrine.

I believe man's God given measure of freewill, allows for evil, God will eventually redeem all evil, but I just cannot accept Mr. Murdock's premise.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

Well Ms Bratti pretty much said what I was about to... especially the intentional misquote in the thread title.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

D M, Is your point here that a life (soul) conceived in rape is somehow less valuable than others, or that no ones' life has an intention of God?

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

i am saying that God did not intend for a rape victim to get pregnant in opposition to the senate candidate.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

I did not see where he said that. Do you have a quote?

What I saw was where he said "God intended" the beginning of life. Are you of the opinion that God's intent and blessing is on only some human life?

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

Now not ONE of you baby killing liberals will sit here and look into the face of a child conceived and born out of a rape and say "you should have been aborted because God did not intend for you to be born".

You democrats know good and well what the Senator said but you twist his words to mean something that he didn't intend for your own sick political agendas. He was saying EVEN CHILDREN OF RAPE HAVE PURPOSE IN THE SIGHT OF ALL MIGHTY GOD.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

He believes in the sanctity of ALL human life, not just the human life born from consensual sex, oh how radical...:smack

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

IF You VOTE REPUBLICAN YOU ARE VOTING FOR A MAN THAT BELIEVES IT IS OK TO BE A BABY KILLER.

You are a hypocrite if you vote republican. Romney is OK with BABY KILLING if the baby comes from incest. Rape, Incest no difference.

Re: IN Senator, "God Intended Pregnant Rape Victim
 

So the choice is then, by your logic, vote for the guy who would apprehensively allow abortion in extreme cases or vote for the guy who supports at will abortion for anyone who wants it for any reason? Ok. I'll vote for the guy who only allows fo rit in extreme cases.

You (Light) and the rest of your party support the man for POTUS who voted, not believes or thinks but actually voted, to allow babies born from a bothed abortion to just lay and die on a table.

The idea of a child, a newborn baby, being left cold, lonely, helpless, still covered in the blood and fluids of birth, crying out to be held and taken care of, on a table with no person coming to it's aid because it should have been aborted and lying there until it's death. THAT is what the Democrat Party President supported and VOTED for while in Illinois. Letting a living child die a cold, lonely helpless death on a table. And yet you and your kind support the monster.

The fact that you can support him with knowledge of the things he supported indeed makes me question how much you really live that Bible as opposed to just giving it lip service on Sundays. You support a monster who I can only hope faces his maker one day and has to pay dearly for his support of murdering the unborn as well as those born and left to die. And I hope you and yor kind are held accountable by God as well for your supporting and empowering him with your votes.

To clarify, Obama opposed legistaion that would protect babies (the legislation called them fetuses) born from failed abortions after the 26th week. existing legislation protected them after the 29th week. Obama opposed it because he felt it would be an attack on abortion rights for women as given under Roe v Wade. The law he opposed would have mandated that if a baby born after the 26th week form abortion showed signs of life, the doctors would have to give the baby treatment to attamept to keep it alive. Obama didn't want to make abortion any more difficult so I gues she flet those babies should just lay and die on a table.