Does your church have discernment?
 

Does your church have discernment? If I walked into a service with the intent of, say, faking a repentance at the altar, complete with "tongues", would your ushers swing me around and toss me out before I even had the chance? Or would they at least interrupt my fake tongues?

I've considered actually doing something like this. I'd announce here on AFF that I will show up at one of your churches with $100 in my pocket, which I would gladly hand over to the person who identified me as a fake, when I went to the altar and before I left it. You'd have to tap me on the shoulder and say "You are fake. Get out of this church and never come back." If and only if you said those words I would keep up the act as I walk out the building, with escort, and then and only then hand over the hundred bucks.

That would be easy for someone with discernment. If I could affort it, I'd make it even more interesting, with $1000 or more! But the real danger, of course, is that you falsely identify someone else as me. That poor guy would probably be devastated. Might even fall into despair. And that is why I will never pull this prank.

Other pranks, maybe. But not this one.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

(Another problem is that some of you have seen my picture on Facebook. :lol)

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

I don't know who you are, have never seen your picture.... but your game is not a game I'd want to participate in, sorry.

However, discernment is a noteworthy subject that we do need to discuss. People need to be aware that as long as there is a genuine experience, there is also a counterfeit one. Perhaps if the subject were understood more fully, someone WOULD recognize you, should you or anyone else put this deceitful game into action.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

I have seen people come into the church, come to the altar, raise their hands, and speak in tongues in a moment or two, and then leave the church, and you'd never see them again. Was that a true, genuine experience, or just a fleeting emotional thing that wasn't the real deal?

There is no hard and fast rule to discernment, Timmy. However, I do believe we can be led by the Spirit that in each situation can lead us to understand if a person has made a true and genuine commitment to follow the Lord, and turn their life over to Him. Only the Lord himself knows the true condition of a heart, but we can be led by the Spirit to respond to people, just as Peter responded to Simon the Sorcerer here in
Acts 8:18-24:

18 And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles' hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money,

19 Saying, Give me also this power, that on whomsoever I lay hands, he may receive the Holy Ghost.

20 But Peter said unto him, Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money.

21 Thou hast neither part nor lot in this matter: for thy heart is not right in the sight of God.

22 Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee.

23 For I perceive that thou art in the gall of bitterness, and in the bond of iniquity.

24 Then answered Simon, and said, Pray ye to the Lord for me, that none of these things which ye have spoken come upon me.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

I would never do this, because I would be afraid of being struck dead by God Himself.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

People who believe in discernment would not fear this "deceitful" game. Though I prefer to think of it as a test. ;)

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Discernment comes from the Spirit. God doesn't always give his people discernment. Joshua 9 is one example. But we are instructed to know the wolves by their works. Matthew 7:15-20

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Yes, people who believe that God gets mad about such things would be afraid of that. I'm not afraid. I wonder, do people who believe God might strike people dead for doing certain things know of any cases of God striking, say, a child molester dead? Has God ever struck a bank robber dead? An adulterer? Did he strike Saddam Hussein dead? Hitler?

But yes, it does seem that the examples we have in the Bible are only when a "man of God" is insulted or disobeyed, or someone lied about how much they gave to the church, or something. Even the Bible doesn't record God getting that angry about things like rape or murder, as I recall.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

For that matter, has God ever stuck someone dead for faking tongues?

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Not only that but we don't always react because we discern something. There have been time where I have dealt with someone that I discerned their intentions and other times I discerned it and left it alone and let God deal with it.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Ananias and Sapphira comes to mind in the book of Acts:

5 Now a man named Ananias, together with his wife Sapphira, also sold a piece of property. 2 With his wife’s full knowledge he kept back part of the money for himself, but brought the rest and put it at the apostles’ feet.

3 Then Peter said, “Ananias, how is it that Satan has so filled your heart that you have lied to the Holy Spirit and have kept for yourself some of the money you received for the land? 4 Didn’t it belong to you before it was sold? And after it was sold, wasn’t the money at your disposal? What made you think of doing such a thing? You have not lied just to human beings but to God.”

5 When Ananias heard this, he fell down and died. And great fear seized all who heard what had happened. 6 Then some young men came forward, wrapped up his body, and carried him out and buried him.

7 About three hours later his wife came in, not knowing what had happened. 8 Peter asked her, “Tell me, is this the price you and Ananias got for the land?”

“Yes,” she said, “that is the price.”

9 Peter said to her, “How could you conspire to test the Spirit of the Lord? Listen! The feet of the men who buried your husband are at the door, and they will carry you out also.”

10 At that moment she fell down at his feet and died. Then the young men came in and, finding her dead, carried her out and buried her beside her husband. 11 Great fear seized the whole church and all who heard about these events.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Yes, I had that fear-inducing event in mind when I posted. Fear is a good motivator, I suppose. (Not working with me, unfortunately. You have to believe in it to be afraid of it.)

Any modern examples?

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Timmy, when I was a child, I didn't live in fear, but I feared that if I didn't obey my parents, I would be chastised. There are consequences to pay whether it be now or later. God is more merciful than humans are and we are blessed.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Timmy,

Since I don't attend church, how about you come to my house and act like that. I'll say "You're a fake!" and you can give me $100 bucks. Do you want my address?? :)

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Sister this is so true! I would rather place my life in the hands of an angry God than a human anytime.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

I wouldn't want to be in either. An angry God can do much much worse to you than any human can.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

He is just and His anger would be righteous. I can't see His face but I can trust His heart towards me.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

The time will come when God will pour out his wrath upon mankind, and from the looks of things, it may be sooner than we know. I can not imagine Sodom and Gomorrah being any worse than what we see today. I will not test God no matter what.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Its "discerning OF spirits"

Timmy yes if you have a devil and someone has that gift in operation, they will know you have a spirit.

The gift of discernment, if someone has it, does not make someone all knowing.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

I don't know any humans that are less merciful than God, as depicted in the Bible.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Have you ever had the Holy Ghost Timmy?

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

I'm discerning that you're possessed by a spirit named "stupid."


Sincerely,
Jacob's Ladder

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

:ursofunny


:clap


YOU are right onnnnnnnnnn..........

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Believed I did. Didn't help much.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Says the guy with mouths where his eyes belong. :lol

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Bump

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

I didn't say it did. Do you think that discernment works only for discovering a devil in someone?

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Are you a doubting Thomas, or a none believer?

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

By the way, there is a passage that talks about determining whether a "spirit" is from God or not. I don't think it is referring literally and exclusively to devils that are, perhaps, occupying a person. 1 John 4 starts with that warning, then says the reason you should try spirits is that there are many false prophets. Not all false prophets are demon-possessed, are they?

Now, in the context of pranks, I seriously doubt that a prankster fake prophet would be struck dumb would be unable to pass the test given in 1 John 4. Ask him if he "confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God". If he says "yes", do you have to accept him as a genuine prophet? I wouldn't, if I were you! :winkgrin

P.S. I am not saying that this passage refers to the gift of discerning of spirits. I'm just sayin'.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Timmy it's not "discernment".

It's discerning OF SPIRITS. So IF you have that gift, you'll be able to discern spirits.

It's not "discernment" as if you can know everything and not everyone at a church has it and not every church has someone that has it.

So in other words, it's not "The gift of knowing if someone is faking tongues"

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Context, Timmy..:dogpat

1Jn 1 is not about discerning of spirits but TESTING the words of prophets

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Okie dokie.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

It is trying spirits, as stated in the scripture, and as I pointed out. I even went on to say, in my PS, that I was not talking about the gift of discerning of spirits.

Sigh.

P.S. The scripture does not mention testing words, BTW. I guess you mean 1 John 4 (not 1)?

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

If a church dosnt have someone operating in all the gifts then I suggest they lock the doors, shut off the power and sell the property because they are not a church with proper Biblical leadership!

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Right on! :D

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Read the context..it's about trying the words of those claiming to be prophets and those that say they are from God

1Jn 4:1 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world.
1Jn 4:2 By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God,
1Jn 4:3 and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you heard was coming and now is in the world already.
1Jn 4:4 Little children, you are from God and have overcome them, for he who is in you is greater than he who is in the world.
1Jn 4:5 They are from the world; therefore they speak from the world, and the world listens to them.
1Jn 4:6 We are from God. Whoever knows God listens to us; whoever is not from God does not listen to us. By this we know the Spirit of truth and the spirit of error.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Wow...how tolerant of you.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Christ's words were spirit or pneuma (John 6:63). All words, in this sense, are "spirit". Not in the sense of being an actual literal spirit, but according to their nature as intangible, life-producing agents of the mind, they function similarly.

Therefore, in 1 John 4, we see a relationship between trying the spirits and false prophets, because prophets, false or otherwise, make themselves known through speaking.

So when one tries the spirits, they are putting the words of the "prophet" to the test. Out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks, so when the words are weighed and if found wanting, one can know the heart of their speaker to be false; thus showing that as a false prophet, their spirit/pneuma is out of line with God's.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Okie dokie.

Re: Does your church have discernment?
 

Now, to answer the original question:

No one's church has discernment.

God discerns and through His Spirit, causes people to understand what HE (no one else) discerned about any particular situation, person, or etc.

It is according to His will, but His will can be frustrated by inattentive, carnal people not interested in cultivating a sensitivity to His guidance and direction.

God may try to warn and help His people out but they may be too lazy, spiritually fat, and un-disciplined to care. If so, God just may not will His Spirit to grant any discernment to anyone in the local assembly as an act of punishment for being in such a state to begin with.