Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?

What first convinced you? Why?

I've been mulling this topic over (apparently for the past 6 years: http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com...ad.php?t=21086 )

I can see it as sacred, I can see it as containing wisdom, I can see it as useful in leading people towards relationship with God, but I just can't see it as perfect.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

Its a fact that the catholic church had a heavy hand in editing what we know as the bible. Matt 28:19, 1 John 5:7 are just a few examples of this.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

I agree with you DG. I honor the Bible but I do not view it as a black and white rule book the way I used to.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

I believe that the Bible is inerrant with relation to the original manuscripts. Issues of translation have caused some misunderstandings down through the centuries regarding some passages. Most are well known to scholars.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

But do we really even have access to the "original" manuscripts?

But beyond that, what is the reason you believe those originals to be inerrant?

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

I believe the originals to be inerrant out of simple faith. I believe that if there is a God, He designed us. And if we can communicate clearly, so can He. Therefore, if He is interested in our souls, He'd communicate with us clearly. Out of all the religions I've studied, Christianity appears to be the most flexible and universal in it's message. So, to me, it makes the most sense that God would speak through the texts held sacred by Christianity. Now, many disagree, and that's fine. But that's my opinion.

As for original manuscripts, no we don't have access to them. However, we do have access to many manuscripts that were copied from them while they were in existence. There is no promise that these are entirely inerrant. However, I believe the primary thrust or purpose of the message as preserved by the Spirit of God. Also, various church fathers quoted enough Scripture that we can be relatively sure that the translations we have are nearly word for word from the originals, accept in a number of known difficult to translate passages.

That's my take on it.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

I believe in the Bible because at 20 years old when I started reading it and took its words PERSONALLY a power or influence came into my life that was not there before. It was so wonderful it kept me ravished to the point of reading it for hours a day.

I remember when I first read about the "higher criticism". It was so horrible of a feeling! Trying to destroy faith in the greatest thing I ever experienced!

The words of Christs literally come alive to those who believe.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

I can prove with facts that the Bible is not perfect. There are numerous flaws and mistakes, and even those on AFF who claim infallibility know this. When I discovered this, my heart was heavy at first because of my dogmatic stance of the past that the Bible was a flawless book of Faith and Truth.

That was many years ago, and I've come to some conclusions about this problem:

1. The Bible was written by men, not G-d. There is no way man can write something that is perfect, period.

2. Man cannot, nor ever could, handle "Perfect Truth". We are imperfect, and we need imperfection to remain balanced, no matter what we are dealing with.

3. The Bible is the "Face of Man". Think about it, men who wrote Scripture were adulterers, idolaters, murderers, whore-mongers, polygamists, heathens, etc. If we are honest, we can use the Bible as a mirror, which will reflect the truth about our entire “flawed” character.

4. There are no remaining Documents that are "Original". This means we rely on copies, and we know what happens when humans begin to copy things such as documents, words, or any other invention on this planet; changes are imminent and unavoidable when copies replace the original.

5. At least with me, I am relieved the Bible is not infallible. G-d, in the mercies we all need, allowed us to create instruction and truth that can lead a man down a path that isn't for everyone, because we are not everyone; we are all unique and different, with multiple needs at separate times. Religion doesn't conform to this, and even the Bible points this out, where those who draw a line in the sand regarding obedience to G-d, are the very ones who were labeled deceitful and called hypocrites.

6. The Bible is tainted with Religion, no matter how hard we try to reject this idea. IMO, this is the greatest flaw with Scripture, as isolated Faith(s) will evolve into a Cult, where lies replace truth about who we really are, thinking they are the only ones who are "Saved".

7. This is the last and most amazing thing to me about this issue; the tentacles of Scripture cross every barrier and belief system available to us. G-d, can meet a man at any crossroad, at any level, and at any stage of life. Young, old, sinner, saved, it doesn't matter, we are all in this story, where mercy MUST reach us in the dire of our needs.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

I believe that the main purpose of the scriptures are to lead us to relationship with Jesus, and the infilling of His spirit. But I believe that they can do that without being inerrant.

I too believe that God wants to communicate with us, but I think He uses many different sources, that are ultimately "translated" through his spirit dwelling inside of us. i.e. He can speak through songs, books, a friend, a Pastor, Nature, a Movie, etc. However, we would never make the assumption that any of those sources are inerrant.

And I think that is my ultimate stumbling block. Many sources may claim to speak for God, and I treat them all with a healthy source of Skepticism.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

depending on the definition of Inerrant.

There are at least 5 different views of inerrancy of the scriptures.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

...because if I believed God inspired His word to people, then He also took it upon Himself to ensure it remain preserved and intact.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

Which are?

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

And a fine job he did! :lol

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

He certainly did!

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

I believe the Bible contains the word of God but I do not believe that the whole book is the word of God.I take into account who is speaking...what is being said and who is it being said to.There are too many instances of proof texting...people taking unrelated or loosly related scriptures and preaching or developing a doctrine out of them and thinking that just because it appears between the leather binder that it applies to us....that would be the *who* it was written to.Yes issues with the translation exists too and I know we could go round and round with that.

Inerrant and infallible.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

I am not sure I have not read the book.

However my view of the scriptures could be called transcendental inerrancy.

I believe the original writings were correct, however later on as people made copies some mistakes were made, but that does not affect the message of God for the transcendental inerrancy view allows for imperfections in the scriptures but the word of God is able to transcend those errors and come to us and save us, despite those imperfections.

That one scripture speaks of one or two demonic possessed individuals does not make a difference, for it is a minor detail that has nothing to do with the main message in that story.
The inconsistencies in the crucifixion of Jesus are irrelevant details, that do not detract from the main story the Bible is trying to tell us.

The flexibility of the transcendental inerrancy view is that it does not worry about such minor differences, but looks at the major points instead as a framework that holds the Bible together.

I believe the Bible has a self-correcting mechanism that allows it to restore itself to a more or less original form. this mechanism is composed of grammatical and syntax rules.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

Yes it is Inerrant and Infallible but those of us who hold the transcendental inerrancy view, do not hold to the doctrine of full inerrancy or full divine preservation.

We believe in a divine preservation of the message of salvation not the precise words, this allow us to ignore any differences in the precise words spoken.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

I agree that God took it upon himself to ensure it remain preserved and intact, but we that hold the transcendental inerrancy view, speak that of the message not of the precise words.
I am quite sure that God foresaw that people would make errors in their copying in the scriptures so he made sure that the main message would come through despites those errors in the texts.

One of the ways he insured his word would be received properly is the rule about 2 or 3 witness for something to be established.

That is why all doctrines need to have at least 2 or 3 clear scriptures before that doctrine can be considered as valid.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

:thumbsup

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

Yep, what he said!

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

:thumbsup

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

I see what you're saying. And there are many places in the Bible where things have been mistranslated. Therefore, I'd say that the translations of the Bible that we have are "inspired" but not entirely inerrant.

God once spoke to me through a secular song once when I was backslidden. Is the song inerrant? Well... for me it was.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvvJ7MYaK8o

It's funny... it still makes me cry after all these years. lol

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

To elevate and magnify anything (other than God Himself) to absolute perfection is to create an equal to God. That equal can be a person, place, or thing. We must be cautious of this. So, I confess that I do believe that the translations of the Bible that we have today are inspired by the Holy Spirit. However, the translations themselves are not entirely inerrant.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

This. Exactly This.

There was a time when I realized that the devotion I had held for the Bible, approached idolatry. I realized that at times I ignored the promptings of the Holy Spirit because what I was hearing didn't match what I had been told the scriptures said.

When I had this Epiphany I was understandably horrified, and I never want to make that mistake again.

Christian Ministers talk so often about the importance of being led by the Holy Spirit, and yet, I feel they send a mixed message at the same time, that it can never be trusted, and only the Bible can be. So I reached a point where I needed to ask myself, Am I following God, or am I following a book claiming to speak for God?

I think it's scary to give up the idea of the Bible as a rule book or instruction manual. (for life, not necessarily salvation). Because we know how infallible, imperfect and easily led astray that we are. I think that was one of my biggest struggles, to trust God to allow and forgive my inevitable mistakes.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

The fact of the matter is there are no "original" manuscripts of the N.T. left. The way we can know that the Lord has "preserved" His word is because there are over 5,000 hand written copies and copies of copies that say the exact same thing in various languages of the world. The Bible was very meticulously copied and preserved by various groups all over the world. The Catholic church only "canonized" the N.T. to make the books the "official" N.T. They did NOT control all of the loose copies that were everywhere in the world. They only controlled a small portion of them and "modified" them before and during the reformation. These are know as the "Latin Vulgate". They are not used as part of the "received text"(5000 plus copies) that was used to give us our KJV of the bible in 1611. The KJV was simple the 1st "legal" English language version to emerge from the reformation.

What I am saying is that the Lord has "preserved" his word to nearly all languages in the world with over 5000 "witnesses" (before the printing press). You and I can trust this "cloud" of witnesses with our very lives.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

If you would like some "real" info on this. There is a website for Dr. Walter Vieth. He gave a lecture called "battle of the Bibles"...you can download this video for free. I highly recommend it if you want "validity" of the Bible.

You can also download for free a video called "The Forbidden Book"(Dr. Craig Lampe)...it is a documentary of how we got the KJV of our Bible....it is a "must" to help us understand how we finally ended up with a Bible in the English language(even through fierce opposition)

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

There is no reason to give up the Bible as a rule book or instruction manual. There are plenty of misspellings in the written laws of the land, do we throw away the law because some of its books have misspellings (errors) I do not think so.

It is precisely because God knows how infallible, imperfect and easily led astray that he gave us the Bible as channel to keep us within the truth.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

Yes there are over 5,000 manuscripts, but every single one of them has human errors of transmission, and that is the beauty of it, for by looking at the overall text, we can pretty much figure out where the scribes fell asleep and made mistakes.

If one text says
Zechariah son of Barachiah
and another says
Zechariah son of Jehoiada

which text are we going to believe?

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

For me, the Bible is largely like "case law". It is a history and examples of the interactions between God and other men during those times and in those contexts. The Bible doesn't address everything. And Christ's teachings sum up everything God was trying to teach them this way:

1.) Love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind, soul, and strength.
2.) Demonstrate your love for God by loving others as yourself.

For the most part, everything else is just filler; there are examples of God making this point over and over and over throughout the biblical narrative.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

For the most part, I agree. However, "translations" have been errant. For example:

Genesis 49:6 (KJV)
O my soul, come not thou into their secret; unto their assembly, mine honour, be not thou united: for in their anger they slew a man, and in their selfwill they digged down a wall.

Most don't realize what is really being said here because it was translated incorrectly by the translators of the King James Bible. It actually reads:

Genesis 49:6 (ESV)
6 Let my soul come not into their council;
O my glory, be not joined to their company.
For in their anger they killed men,
and in their willfulness they hamstrung oxen.

There are passages that are even more difficult to translate.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

I don't believe the Bible was designed to be a rule book or instruction manual. Again, nearly everyone who approaches the Bible with this idea walks away with a different list of rules. Consider all the denominations of Christianity in the world. Consider the varying theologies and Christologies. Consider the differences of standards simply from church to church.

Yes, the Bible is inspired. Yes it guides us and offers examples to us in varying contexts. However, the translations we have today are not completely without error. The Scripture's purpose was ultimately to testify of Christ's identity as Savior, not to be a rule book on how to attain eternal life:

John 5:39
Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

Once you've received the revelation of Christ as Savior and been born again... your relationship with God should become deeply personal. I'm not saying that we should throw out the Bible. What I'm saying is that a living and real relationship with God is far more valuable than gleaning from the dusty history of a people who lived thousands of years ago. These stories are examples of the substance. They are not the substance.

For example, I had a riveting talk with God some time back. Now, up until then... it seemed like I couldn't hear God for myself. So I kept reading the Bible and trying to "decode" (for lack of a better term) it to find out what God was saying to me. Then, one day while deep in contemplation and prayer... God actually spoke to me. I posted it on this forum at the following link:

http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com...02&postcount=1

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

There are people that have dealt with that issue. The thing to do when you find a "questionable" passage is GOOGLE it. Im serious.....there is an explanation that people I call "specialists" that deal with this issue. I called Daniel Seagraves once and Paul Dugas once when I struggled with so called "contradictions"....When I got a computer finally, I found a wealth of info that can save me alot of homework. I dont need to call these poor men anymore!

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

This raises an interesting point. There are many people over the years that have spent a great deal of time digging through and studying scriptures, manuscripts, greek, etc. However, in some of our circles we are essentially taught to ignore what the smart people have said and to rely on a revelation. Some Apostolics/Pentecostals take pride in finding some truth that the educated have missed. I find that a dangerous place when people will ignore scholarly studies and eat up a catch phrase that some fly by night preacher came up with.

Don't misunderstand me. I'm not saying that you need to be something in the world for God to show you something. God will reveal himself to anyone seeking. What I'm saying is that it's a shame that we're so paranoid of being mislead that we'll easily discard what people have spent years studying. That seems to be a proud stance... proud of ignorance?

Truth will stand and we have to be more open to true professionals who devote their life to studying scripture. We don't have to reinvent the wheel everytime we get up to teach or preach.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

I understand completely what you are saying bro. I use to follow "blindly" but after 35 years...im all ears.....However,there are some that are "against" the Bible and publish things that have their bias as we all know too well. When I read that stuff, I find the opposing view before I come to my own conclusion. If not, I would have left my faith in the rear view mirror years ago. I want answers too, but not wrong answers.



I will not let some stranger "steal' my faith without a fight.

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

I can't wait till God writes the New New Testament! :winkgrin

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

He already did by proxy, thru his messengers.

What! you expect the king of the universe to sit down in a chair and grab a quill?

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

Did you count the News in my post?

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

Why not? Would have saved us humans a lot of trouble! :lol

Re: Why do you believe the Bible to be inerrant?
 

Exodus 34.
Seems god did give penmanship (or chiselship?) a worthy try, but those stone tablets are so brittle, and Moses tends to get so angry after climbing down from mountains. So god gave it a second try with new improved commandments, such as not to boil baby goats in their mother's milk, (the 10th commandment) which was maybe a new hot issue in the Desert News.
:heeheehee