Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

A Church In Exile

Then yesterday, coverage about a Hillsong press conference came out, indicating that the global evangelical enterprise is triangulating on homosexuality, particularly about whether it should publicly hold what the Bible teaches in light of culture’s rapid change on the subject.

http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/fir...hurch-in-exile

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

Unofficial Transcript of Q&A between NYT and Brian Houston

Source Link

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

I can't say I'm surprised.

And for those of us who have criticized Joel Olsteen for his avoidance of standing for what the Bible says, we should be equally critical of Brian Houston's statement.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

I think he will find a way to be faithful to the Word while being compassionate to those caught in the grip of this deception.

When I read his statements, that is what I get. He knows what the Word says and he knows about the realities of this sin-ravaged world.

The Church does need to find a way to reach all sinners.

A simple statement, "All gays are going to hell" may ring of truth, but it lacks the love and compassion that God has for a world for whom He sacrificed His Only Son.

Besides, Hillsong is still connected to the A/G sister organization in Australia. Neither they or the A/G are about to be unfaithful to the Word.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

Agreed. Hillsong made some nice music but never seems to have left the starting line when it comes to truth and holiness.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

Not everyone is going to want what God has to offer. That is why it is best to preach the Word - laying out the truth and not acting like a politician, in that, you might lose your position if you speak the truth.

It is proven that children need boundaries. Adults need boundaries as well. God sets boundaries. That is not ever going to change.

When people are in darkness, the light feels intrusive to them.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

The world will be reached through love.

The truth of God's Word must be presented in a way that is loving.

Love TRUMPS truth, at least according to the Bible, within the boundaries of the Bible.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

Here is that darkness and light colliding.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

The world is reached through love, but I recall to your memory King Agrippa - hearing truth, he rejects it. Judas walked with truth and ended up hanging from a tree.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

Awe....#LOVEWINS!

But wait, did you just claim that "Love TRUMPS truth?"

Wow, yeah you did. smh

Jesus never said, "I am the way, the love and the life." No, He said, "I am the way, the TRUTH and the life."

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

Hillsong is a corporation which has recently expanded its brand into two major US metro's --- L.A. and N.Y. As such, they will do what's best for the Hillsong brand, not the Gospel.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

:thumbsup

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

Truth is offensive ...... to those who are bound by error!

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

Amen!! Very true!

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

Altho at this point no one should say "Hillsong is for gay". The article does not say that. It could HOPEFULLY just be what he said. They are taking time to know how to present the Christian message to the sodomite movement.

CNN interview with Carl Lentz, Hillsong NYC's Pastor.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hh9LiOwVj6E#t=75

No, I wouldn't say Hillsong is turning homosexual. IMO it's worse... they're refusing to take any kind of stand. And, as was mentioned, if they continue this way it could cause other churches to do the same.

Carl is trying to be cool and mysterious about it, but when you line his words up with the Bible, it doesn't line up.

Really disappointed in what I've read and seen in the interview, but again, not surprised. It's all about the brand now.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

Sounds bad.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

I just watched the video. Horrible.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

"He [the Wicked One] will use every kind of evil deception to fool those on their way to destruction, because they refuse to love and accept the truth that would save them. So God will cause them to be greatly deceived, and they will believe these lies. Then they will be condemned for enjoying evil rather than believing the truth." (2 Thess 2:10-12 NLT)

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

By definition what is love. Love to many is an emotion of affection that often goes away. If I judged my love for my family by having affectionate feelings I would be a sorry husband and father. Most of the time in life I am stressed with the day to day things, although I have plenty of those affectionate moments, that is not love. Love is a heart-written contract that I am going to do what's best for the other person.

We do come as we are, but we don't leave the same. This video looked to me that people were building Jesus around their lives. Instead of building their life around Jesus. People want to be fornicators, drunkards, murderers and they want to be accepted the way they are.

To love this world we live in we should declare the truth to it. We should pray and ask God for a burden that would cause us to reach out into another person's life. I will love through truth. I believe the boom of homosexuality is a mark of the end. When God withdraws Himself homosexuality is often a result. While God is still drawing I want to declare the truth the world. Jesus is the truth and He is the word. If people really want relationship with Jesus they are going to know him through his word. (bible study and obedience)

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

:thumbsup

I think y'all are used to the OP movement where people preach against everything specifically.

These churches preach against sin but never get specific. And there's nothing wrong with being compassionate.

It's like some of you want them to scream, "You're going to hell because you're gay."
That is not the gospel.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

Paul was very specific in his catalogs of sin (Ro 1:24-31; 1Cor 6:9-10; Gal 5:19-21), and had no problem telling others that if they engaged in these behaviors, they would not inherit the Kingdom of God.

I believe it IS necessary to be specific when preaching about sin (without being lewd, of course), because people need to know what is acceptable behavior to God and what is not. And to be specific, we need not look any further than to Paul's writings (above).

Yes, we preach in love, but love does not dilute the message. On at least two occasions we know Jesus himself had compassion on individuals (Jn 5:14; 8:11), but then followed up with the statement "go and sin no more!".

Paul was very specific in his writings to churches.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

Megachurches that don't adapt won't be mega much longer. That's not a commentary on whether Hillson is right or wrong, nor whether you guys are right or wrong, about the issue of homosexuality, nor the "correct" way to deal with and preach about it. I'm just saying.

In 2013, the Hillsong College Student Handbook removed Homosexuality from a list of sexual sins. Where it used to have "premarital sex, pornography, adultery and homosexuality" listed, now it has "premarital sex, pornography and adultery."

I agree there's nothing wrong with being compassionate. And I'm not looking for them to scream gays are going to hell.

What I do expect every Bible-believing Christian to do, especially those who claim to be Pentecostal, is to make a stand when asked a simple question. Don't try to be coy or hipster or mysterious about what you believe based on the Bible.

But again, Hillsong Church is a brand. They are a massive organization which makes well over $100 Million dollars a year. They will do what's best for the brand. And if that means using the excuse that society's changed, so the Bible is somehow behind the times and the church should be influenced by the times and society instead of the other way around....then that's what they'll do.

Right. Sooner or later something has to give. Either you change the message for the brand or you trade popularity for the truth.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

The churches in Jerusalem, Antioch and other places were mega-mega churches with thousands of members without compromising the truth.

compromising the truth will only temporarily elevate your church numbers but in the long run you will have less real believers in the church.

Jesus said to make disciples not members of the church.

Jesus said few are the ones that find the narrow way.
God is not into quantity but into quality.

no compromise will mean a church with less members but far more committed disciples.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

If you aren't specific about sin how do you know sin is? Salvation comes through Jesus Christ and obedience to the faith we have in Him. I believe most churches teach that you will go to hell without Jesus and specific sins that are named are not meant to offend. The goal is to get people to acknowledge their sins and turn to Him. The problem is that most people don't want to be responsible enough to acknowledge their sins and repent of them.

If we are participating in fornication (generic word for sexual sin) along with any other sinful acts and think we are part of the body of Christ, then we are mistaken. It is true we are saved by grace, but the same grace that keeps us from hell will also give us authority over the vices we have in this life. There is no such thing as a homosexual christian only a christian.

There may be Christians who struggle with homosexual desires, but they aren't homosexuals. Sin is the activity and not the desire. We should never ostracize someone for their desires but we should pray for them and support them as long as they are not condoning the sinful lifestyle.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

There's no such thing as a gay Christian. There's EX gays that are Christian, just like there are EX liars, Ex adulters, and EX whatever the sin, just name it, that are Christians.

1Co 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,

1Co 6:10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

6:11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

:thumbsup

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

Thanks. Amazing how one can be a "Christian" and live un-repented in a life style the Bible defines as an abomination, but it's consider OK "because they really have no choice". Then the preacher is a bad guy to even mention it or expect the person to stop sinning.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

"I refuse to let another human being or a media moment dictate how we approach it (homosexuality)."

This is an example of his wisdom and pastoral compassion.

"Prosperity for us is simply knowing Jesus and having a right to repent from a sinful life and cling to that cross every day."

This shows he hasn't forgotten what's paramount.

I think we need to give this brother a chance before declaring him and his organization to be not faithful to the Cause and Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

Can a sinner attend your church Sunday in and Sunday out and still feel loved for however long it takes for GOD to get a hold of their life and do the work that only HE can do on the inside of that sinner?

Do you skin a fish before or after you catch the fish?

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

Let's say you are the Pastor and a transgendered married person and their spouse dares to darken the door of your sanctuary.

How would you reach that person and their family with the Gospel of Christ?

Would they even feel welcome to visit your church?

Would they feel welcome to regularly attend your church?

What would you REQUIRE of them before baptizing them?

What would you REQUIRE of them after they have spoken in tongues?


For this situation, the woman is a woman and the man is a transgendered person who was born a woman but is now living her life as a him. They have one adopted child.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

You are the Pastor of a church in Yazoo City, Mississippi for 15 years. The Lord calls you to New York City to pastor.

Would your style and (if I may use the word) tactics change to better suit your new battleground?

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

"I believe the writings of Paul are clear on this subject."-in the article above.

He should've at the least made that statement during that press conference.

Mr. Houston needs to consistently be ready to take a stand for what he believes (even in regard to what falls under the category of sin) and own it. It can be done in a kind respectful manner, yet to the point.

Re: Hillsong shifts on Homosexuality
 

Well said.