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-   -   Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wives (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/showthread.php?t=48165)

n david 07-02-2015 10:56 AM

Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wives
 
Who didn't see this coming? I just posted in a different thread this morning that Polygamy would be the next to be allowed.

Quote:

A Montana man said Wednesday that he was inspired by last week's U.S. Supreme Court decision legalizing gay marriage to apply for a marriage license so that he can legally wed his second wife.

Nathan Collier and his wives Victoria and Christine applied at the Yellowstone County Courthouse in Billings on Tuesday in an attempt to legitimize their polygamous marriage. Montana, like all 50 states, outlaws bigamy — holding multiple marriage licenses — but Collier said he plans to sue if the application is denied.

"It's about marriage equality," Collier told The Associated Press Wednesday. "You can't have this without polygamy."
Quote:

Chief Justice John Roberts said in his dissent that people in polygamous relationships could make the same legal argument that not having the opportunity to marry disrespects and subordinates them
And thank you, SCOTUS fools.



Source Link

n david 07-02-2015 11:00 AM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Collier said he sent an email asking the ACLU of Montana to represent him in a possible lawsuit. ACLU legal director Jim Taylor said he has not seen the request.

Taylor said he has no opinion on Collier's claims, though the Supreme Court decision on gay marriage "is about something very different."
:lol ACLU is in a pickle. IIRC, they were the one's who pushed the "#LoveWins" hashtag. Well, what about it, Taylor? Will #LoveWin again?

smh

Fionn mac Cumh 07-02-2015 11:17 AM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by n david (Post 1381478)
Who didn't see this coming? I just posted in a different thread this morning that Polygamy would be the next to be allowed.





And thank you, SCOTUS fools.



Source Link

You ever read the bible? Read it sometime. Polygamy is every where in the bible. That being said, who cares? As long as its between two consenting adults, the govt, and you, need to mind their own business and worry about your own bedroom.

Bowas 07-02-2015 11:50 AM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Fionn mac Cumh (Post 1381485)
You ever read the bible? Read it sometime. Polygamy is every where in the bible. That being said, who cares? As long as its between two consenting adults, the govt, and you, need to mind their own business and worry about your own bedroom.

So is slavery. That said, I do not think there are any positive references to polygamy in the New Testament, in fact I read about the husband of one wife.
The one wife concept is designed by God as He only has one wife, never two or more.

Godsdrummer 07-02-2015 11:55 AM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Fionn mac Cumh (Post 1381485)
You ever read the bible? Read it sometime. Polygamy is every where in the bible. That being said, who cares? As long as its between two consenting adults, the govt, and you, need to mind their own business and worry about your own bedroom.

I am amazed at the statements made by Christians since this SC ruling. People need to take the words of Paul to Timothy, to "study to show yourself approved that you not be ashamed".

Polygamy is a sin? Wow, what next? What gets me is with all the "read the bible in a year" programs, people still do not see the error of most of their teachings. Simply because they have been so indoctrinated with a fear of hell if they don't obey what they preacher tells them, that they don't see what is right before their eyes.

n david 07-02-2015 11:55 AM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Fionn mac Cumh (Post 1381485)
You ever read the bible? Read it sometime. Polygamy is every where in the bible. That being said, who cares? As long as its between two consenting adults, the govt, and you, need to mind their own business and worry about your own bedroom.

:dogpat

good samaritan 07-02-2015 12:03 PM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer (Post 1381489)
I am amazed at the statements made by Christians since this SC ruling. People need to take the words of Paul to Timothy, to "study to show yourself approved that you not be ashamed".

Polygamy is a sin? Wow, what next? What gets me is with all the "read the bible in a year" programs, people still do not see the error of most of their teachings. Simply because they have been so indoctrinated with a fear of hell if they don't obey what they preacher tells them, that they don't see what is right before their eyes.

:yourock

Bowas 07-03-2015 08:24 AM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Fionn mac Cumh (Post 1381485)
You ever read the bible? Read it sometime. Polygamy is every where in the bible. That being said, who cares? As long as its between two consenting adults, the govt, and you, need to mind their own business and worry about your own bedroom.

You are aware that these "consenting adults" are attacking, coercing and attempting to force through lawsuits, those that do not allow them to do whatever they want in the privacy of their own bedrooms by suing them out of existence?
It a good bumper sticker slogan but not based in how things are panning out.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2015...ong-christian/

good samaritan 07-03-2015 08:45 AM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Fionn mac Cumh (Post 1381485)
You ever read the bible? Read it sometime. Polygamy is every where in the bible. That being said, who cares? As long as its between two consenting adults, the govt, and you, need to mind their own business and worry about your own bedroom.

You seem to care enough to place your objection about this issue? If all this stuff continues it will affect you and me. That is why I care. I don't want my children to hear another version of right and wrong. Yes I have taught them right, but I still know it will be a hardship on them to continue in it with all the world going another way.

good samaritan 07-03-2015 08:47 AM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Fionn mac Cumh (Post 1381485)
You ever read the bible? Read it sometime. Polygamy is every where in the bible. That being said, who cares? As long as its between two consenting adults, the govt, and you, need to mind their own business and worry about your own bedroom.

Are you a Christian?

Monterrey 07-04-2015 05:03 PM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Apparently they have never been around polygamists, mass perversion.

Aquila 07-06-2015 07:31 AM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
The only prohibition to "polygamy" in the NT is found with regards to elders/overseers and deacons/servants:
1 Timothy 3:2
A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;

1 Timothy 3:12
Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
We also see a reference in Titus regarding elders/overseers:
Titus 1:6
If any be blameless, the husband of one wife, having faithful children not accused of riot or unruly.
I believe that this is because God's perfect will is monogamy. It should be noted that as the church expanded into foreign lands where polygamy was legal, men with multiple wives were welcomed into the church, as were their wives and children. However, these men were prohibited from serving in leadership and were encouraged to teach their children to live monogamously.

So, the church has never really condemned polygamists as being outside of the scope of the Gospel. They are just unable to serve in ministry. Monogamy was to be introduced as a philosophy for the next generation. Monogamy reflecting one Lord and one faith (church).

Aquila 07-06-2015 07:34 AM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
And regarding all these "lawsuits". Paul admonished the church with regards to going before the civil courts of this world:
1 Corinthians 6:1-8 King James Version (KJV)
6 Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints?
2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?
4 If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.
5 I speak to your shame. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren?
6 But brother goeth to law with brother, and that before the unbelievers.
7 Now therefore there is utterly a fault among you, because ye go to law one with another. Why do ye not rather take wrong? why do ye not rather suffer yourselves to be defrauded?
8 Nay, ye do wrong, and defraud, and that your brethren.
Christians shouldn't be a party to lawsuits or any proceedings that would involve going before the unbelieving courts of this world.

Fionn mac Cumh 07-06-2015 09:02 AM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by good samaritan (Post 1381663)
Are you a Christian?

Yes. Does that give me the right to stick my nose in everyone's love life?

good samaritan 07-06-2015 09:47 AM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Fionn mac Cumh (Post 1381981)
Yes. Does that give me the right to stick my nose in everyone's love life?

Just wondering.

Aquila 07-06-2015 02:06 PM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
This Bible verse absolutely blows away any notion of polygamy:
Matthew 6:24
No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other.
:toofunny

deacon blues 07-16-2015 05:24 AM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Matthew 19:4-8

Haven’t you read,” he replied, “that at the beginning the Creator ‘made them male and female,’ and said, ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh’? So they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let no one separate.”

NO WHERE in Scripture does polygamy work well. Jealousy, betrayal, immorality, incest, infidelity, rape, prostitution, lies, deception, etc all fill the stories of those characters in the Bible who practiced such.

It's a sin.

Monterrey 07-17-2015 10:57 AM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by deacon blues (Post 1383728)
Matthew 19:4-8

Haven’t you read,” he replied, “that at the beginning the Creator ‘made them male and female,’ and said, ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh’? So they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let no one separate.”

NO WHERE in Scripture does polygamy work well. Jealousy, betrayal, immorality, incest, infidelity, rape, prostitution, lies, deception, etc all fill the stories of those characters in the Bible who practiced such.

It's a sin.

Absolutely.

Bowas 07-17-2015 06:35 PM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by deacon blues (Post 1383728)
Matthew 19:4-8

Haven’t you read,” he replied, “that at the beginning the Creator ‘made them male and female,’ and said, ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh’? So they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let no one separate.”

NO WHERE in Scripture does polygamy work well. Jealousy, betrayal, immorality, incest, infidelity, rape, prostitution, lies, deception, etc all fill the stories of those characters in the Bible who practiced such.

It's a sin.

And as God set forth the pattern, He has only had one bride at a time.

Monterrey 07-19-2015 08:26 AM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bowas (Post 1383880)
And as God set forth the pattern, He has only had one bride at a time.

So has He had more than one bride?

Just curious.

Aquila 07-21-2015 02:55 PM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
1 Attachment(s)
Please note, women were essentially "property" in the OT. When it comes to "biblical marriage", I've always found this chart interesting:

Aquila 07-21-2015 03:05 PM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
It should be noted that the Roman Empire banned polygamy before the time of Christ. So, monogamy was the ideal in NT times by virtue of Roman law. There were pockets of polygamy tolerated within Jewish Palestine. But the Roman authorities didn't permit it for Roman citizens.

Evang.Benincasa 07-21-2015 03:07 PM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquila (Post 1381967)
The only prohibition to "polygamy" in the NT is found with regards to elders/overseers and deacons/servants:
1 Timothy 3:2
A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;

1 Timothy 3:12
Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
We also see a reference in Titus regarding elders/overseers:
Titus 1:6
If any be blameless, the husband of one wife, having faithful children not accused of riot or unruly.
I believe that this is because God's perfect will is monogamy. It should be noted that as the church expanded into foreign lands where polygamy was legal, men with multiple wives were welcomed into the church, as were their wives and children. However, these men were prohibited from serving in leadership and were encouraged to teach their children to live monogamously.

So, the church has never really condemned polygamists as being outside of the scope of the Gospel. They are just unable to serve in ministry. Monogamy was to be introduced as a philosophy for the next generation. Monogamy reflecting one Lord and one faith (church).

Husband of one wife meant the ministry had to be married, not only married but have children.

Evang.Benincasa 07-21-2015 03:08 PM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquila (Post 1384378)
It should be noted that the Roman Empire banned polygamy before the time of Christ. So, monogamy was the ideal in NT times by virtue of Roman law. There were pockets of polygamy tolerated within Jewish Palestine. But the Roman authorities didn't permit it for Roman citizens.

You are contradicting your teaching. If Paul is admonishing that ministers only have one wife, and the Roman law prohibited polygamy, why wouldn't Paul a Roman citizen understand that there was no other way for these people under Roman law to behave?

Aquila 07-23-2015 07:08 AM

Re: Marriage Equality for Billings, MT Man, Two Wi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa (Post 1384381)
You are contradicting your teaching. If Paul is admonishing that ministers only have one wife, and the Roman law prohibited polygamy, why wouldn't Paul a Roman citizen understand that there was no other way for these people under Roman law to behave?

Those in Judea were often a troublesome bunch. There were pockets of Jewish men who had more than one wife. The Romans looked at this like it was barbaric and primitive. No doubt, Paul's admonishment for leaders in the church to be monogamous was to not only reflect the spiritual realities of Christ and His bride (singular) but it no doubt brought a stronger witness to the Roman world than polygamy would have.


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