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-   -   What Is Justification By Faith ? (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/showthread.php?t=4850)

Scott Hutchinson 06-12-2007 11:30 AM

What Is Justification By Faith ?
 
What is meant by The Terms Being Justified By Faith ?
When does Justfication occur ,and how ?
Where is this found in the Bible ?

Scott Hutchinson 06-12-2007 03:42 PM

Doesn't Anybody have any Biblical answers ?

mfblume 06-12-2007 03:57 PM

Justification by faith is found here:

Quote:

Hab 2:4 KJV Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith.

Rom 1:17 KJV For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

Gal 3:11 KJV But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

Heb 10:38 KJV Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
This is in contrast to Mosaic law which stated the man WHO DOES WORKS OF LAW is not cursed. This made everyone cursed, since no man could obey all the law. Romans 3 witnesses to that by showing from the Old Testament that scriptures concluded how NO ONE was righteous.

There are two roads to justification or righteousness. Law and Faith. Law does not work, since sin is in our flesh and prohbits us from successfully keeping law. Faith is the only one that works.

Justification by faith means we are just and righteous by believing in the work of the cross to wash away our sins and make peace between us and God through that work.

mfblume 06-12-2007 04:27 PM

When it occurs is upon obedience to the Gospel.

Pastor Keith 06-12-2007 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume (Post 152255)
When it occurs is upon obedience to the Gospel.


I would disagree slightly, I believe at the moment of faith the believer is justified, even though he has not obeyed the entirety of the Gospel.

mfblume 06-12-2007 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keith4him (Post 152316)
I would disagree slightly, I believe at the moment of faith the believer is justified, even though he has not obeyed the entirety of the Gospel.

Faith is obedience to the gospel. :)

Sam 06-12-2007 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson (Post 152154)
Doesn't Anybody have any Biblical answers ?

Bro. Bernie Gillespie has teaching about "justification by faith" on his website
http://www.inchristalone.org/

Sam 06-12-2007 06:15 PM

This is from the 2005 edition of the UPC Articles of Faith. I don't know if it reads like this in newer editions. From what I understand, this was pretty much taken from the PCI manual and can be understood to mean that a person is justified (made right with God) at repentance before water and/or Spirit baptism. It was not until 1973 that the words "for the remission of sins" was added to the fundamental doctrine statement. And even when it was added, there were differences of opinion as to the meaning of "for the remission of sins" by those who moved and seconded the resolution. Justification is a term which means different things to different folks. There is diversity here among us on this subject (and some other subjects too).

REPENTANCE

Pardon and forgiveness of sins is obtained by genuine repentance, a confessing
and forsaking of sins. We are justified by faith in the Lord Jesus Christ (Romans 5:1).
John the Baptist preached repentance, Jesus proclaimed it, and the apostles emphasized
it to both Jews and Gentiles (Acts 2:38, 11:18, 17:30).

The word "repentance" means a change of views and purpose, change of heart,
change of mind, change of life, transformation, etc.

Jesus said, "Except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish" (Luke 13:3).

Luke 24:47 says, "And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached
in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem."

J-Roc 06-12-2007 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson (Post 151573)
What is meant by The Terms Being Justified By Faith ?
When does Justfication occur ,and how ?
Where is this found in the Bible ?

It means we are in right standing before God...the righteousness of Christ is imputed to us so that HIS righteousness (not our own) is counted toward us...

...read the book of Romans and you'll learn all about this there.

Sam 06-12-2007 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by J-Roc (Post 152483)
It means we are in right standing before God...the righteousness of Christ is imputed to us so that HIS righteousness (not our own) is counted toward us...

...read the book of Romans and you'll learn all about this there.

good answer

Sam 06-12-2007 06:53 PM

Speaking of justification/salvation/regeneration, recently a Oneness Pentecostal pastor drew a diagram of the tabernacle and pointed to it. He said something like, "If this tabernacle represents Christ, anyone who comes to the brazen altar is in Christ, whether he's gone to the laver or any farther yet or not."

Pastor Keith 06-12-2007 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume (Post 152376)
Faith is obedience to the gospel. :)

I agree, but faith is a process and salvation has many aspects, faith and repentance leading to justification, union with Christ, regeneration, sanctification and glorification follow.

Even the articles of faith of the UPCI says that we are justified at faith.

Scott Hutchinson 06-12-2007 10:00 PM

When people truly repent does God forgive them at repentance or must they wait till baptism in Jesus Name to have their sins washed away ?

J-Roc 06-12-2007 10:25 PM

Yes, the former is correct, Scott.

crakjak 06-12-2007 10:26 PM

Why don't we get to the root of justification: Romans 5:15-16,18 "But the free gift is not like the offense. For if by the one man's offense many died, much more the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abounded to the many"(the same many as died).

"And the gift is not like that which came through the one who sinned. For the judgment which came from one offense resulted in condemnation, but the free gift which came from many offenses resulted in justification.

"Therefore, as though one man's offense judgment came to all men,....even so through one Man's righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life.

Justification is the bringing of man into right standing with God (reconciliation) which was the result of Jesus' paying for the sins of the whole world. Nothing man can or did do was able to accomplish this great work of the Son of God.

J-Roc 06-12-2007 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crakjak (Post 152838)
Why don't we get to the root of justification: Romans 5:15-16,18 "But the free gift is not like the offense. For if by the one man's offense many died, much more the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abounded to the many"(the same many as died).

"And the gift is not like that which came through the one who sinned. For the judgment which came from one offense resulted in condemnation, but the free gift which came from many offenses resulted in justification.

"Therefore, as though one man's offense judgment came to all men,....even so through one Man's righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life.

Justification is the bringing of man into right standing with God (reconciliation) which was the result of Jesus' paying for the sins of the whole world. Nothing man can or did do was able to accomplish this great work of the Son of God.


:rooting:rooting:rooting

Sam 06-12-2007 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson (Post 152777)
When people truly repent does God forgive them at repentance or must they wait till baptism in Jesus Name to have their sins washed away ?

On this forum, we're divided on that.
Some believe forgiveness happens at repentance and remission happens at water baptism.

Others believe forgiveness and remission are the same. Some of them believe that remission/forgiveness happens at repentance and others believe that forgiveness/remission happens at water baptism.

Daniel Alicia had some posts on the various opinions among Oneness Pentecostals as to when justification happened. I think Bro. Bernard and Bro Segraves disagreed on when justification happened. I may be wrong about that.

crakjak 06-12-2007 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by J-Roc (Post 152842)
:rooting:rooting:rooting

:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol

Sam 06-12-2007 10:59 PM

THREE ASPECTS OF SALVATION

1. JUSTIFICATION: This is a judicial term bringing to our minds a courtroom scene. Man, guilty and condemned before God, is acquitted and declared righteous --but is justified.

2. REGENERATION AND ADOPTION: This suggests a household scene. The soul, dead in trespasses and sins, needs a new life, which new life is imparted by a Divine act of regeneration. The person then becomes a child of God and a member of His household.

3. SANCTIFICATION: This suggests a temple scene, for the word is connected primarily with the worship of God. Set right in relation to God's law and born again to a new life, the person is henceforth dedicated to the service of God. Bought with a price, he is no longer his own; he departs not from the temple (figuratively speaking) but serves God day and night (Luke 2:37). He is sanctified by God and self-given to God.

All three of these terms describe the same experience of salvation and all begin with the hearing of the Gospel. They do not necessarily speak of different experiences but rather give us different pictures of the same great experience of being saved. All three of these blessings of grace were procured by the atoning death of Christ and imparted to man by the Holy Ghost. ...

Through justification --man is declared righteous
Through regeneration --man becomes a child of God, a member of the body of Christ, a member of the Kingdom of God
Through sanctification --man becomes a saint.

All of these are necessary for full New Testament Salvation

page 116 of Dividing the Word of Truth, by Ralph V. Reynolds

SDG 06-13-2007 12:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crakjak (Post 152838)
Why don't we get to the root of justification: Romans 5:15-16,18 "But the free gift is not like the offense. For if by the one man's offense many died, much more the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abounded to the many"(the same many as died).

"And the gift is not like that which came through the one who sinned. For the judgment which came from one offense resulted in condemnation, but the free gift which came from many offenses resulted in justification.

"Therefore, as though one man's offense judgment came to all men,....even so through one Man's righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life.

Justification is the bringing of man into right standing with God (reconciliation) which was the result of Jesus' paying for the sins of the whole world. Nothing man can or did do was able to accomplish this great work of the Son of God.

Amen but the sacramentalists would beg to differ

Praxeas 06-13-2007 01:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam (Post 152926)
THREE ASPECTS OF SALVATION

1. JUSTIFICATION: This is a judicial term bringing to our minds a courtroom scene. Man, guilty and condemned before God, is acquitted and declared righteous --but is justified.

2. REGENERATION AND ADOPTION: This suggests a household scene. The soul, dead in trespasses and sins, needs a new life, which new life is imparted by a Divine act of regeneration. The person then becomes a child of God and a member of His household.

3. SANCTIFICATION: This suggests a temple scene, for the word is connected primarily with the worship of God. Set right in relation to God's law and born again to a new life, the person is henceforth dedicated to the service of God. Bought with a price, he is no longer his own; he departs not from the temple (figuratively speaking) but serves God day and night (Luke 2:37). He is sanctified by God and self-given to God.

All three of these terms describe the same experience of salvation and all begin with the hearing of the Gospel. They do not necessarily speak of different experiences but rather give us different pictures of the same great experience of being saved. All three of these blessings of grace were procured by the atoning death of Christ and imparted to man by the Holy Ghost. ...

Through justification --man is declared righteous
Through regeneration --man becomes a child of God, a member of the body of Christ, a member of the Kingdom of God
Through sanctification --man becomes a saint.

All of these are necessary for full New Testament Salvation

page 116 of Dividing the Word of Truth, by Ralph V. Reynolds

Exactly right sir! Justification is not the totality of salvation or the salvation process. It is the beginning. Without which man could not approach God and receive forgiveness

mfblume 06-13-2007 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by J-Roc (Post 152483)
It means we are in right standing before God...the righteousness of Christ is imputed to us so that HIS righteousness (not our own) is counted toward us...

...read the book of Romans and you'll learn all about this there.

Amen and amen! It's a contrast of standing before God on our own merits versus Christ's merits AS US.

Chan 06-13-2007 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam (Post 152926)
THREE ASPECTS OF SALVATION

1. JUSTIFICATION: This is a judicial term bringing to our minds a courtroom scene. Man, guilty and condemned before God, is acquitted and declared righteous --but is justified.

I disagree that man is acquitted. God actually has declared us guilty (as Paul tells us in Romans) but our punishment was borne for us by Christ.

Quote:

2. REGENERATION AND ADOPTION: This suggests a household scene. The soul, dead in trespasses and sins, needs a new life, which new life is imparted by a Divine act of regeneration. The person then becomes a child of God and a member of His household.
The point at which regeneration takes place may be subject to debate. I prefer to put justification and adoption together.

Quote:

3. SANCTIFICATION: This suggests a temple scene, for the word is connected primarily with the worship of God. Set right in relation to God's law and born again to a new life, the person is henceforth dedicated to the service of God. Bought with a price, he is no longer his own; he departs not from the temple (figuratively speaking) but serves God day and night (Luke 2:37). He is sanctified by God and self-given to God.
There are two aspects of sanctification: 1) being set apart by God for His use (a one-time act that occurs at the point of justification) and; 2) the life-long process of conforming to the image of Christ, part of which includes the serving God that you described.

mfblume 06-13-2007 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chan (Post 153453)
I disagree that man is acquitted. God actually has declared us guilty (as Paul tells us in Romans) but our punishment was borne for us by Christ.

That is true. He died AS US.

It reminds me of the saying, "I should have been crucified." That is incorrect. I WAS crucified with Him. That is how God saw it.

Iron_Bladder 06-27-2007 06:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson (Post 151573)
What is meant by The Terms Being Justified By Faith ?
When does Justfication occur ,and how ?
Where is this found in the Bible ?



I think that this question has been extremely poorly phrased, as almost every claimed Christian group, sect and cult claims to teach Justification by faith. The real issue isn’t are we justified by God’s grace through faith, but are we justified by God’s grace through faith ALONE. Allow me to illustrate, Roman Catholics (RC’s) will claim that we’re justified by grace through faith, but the RC Church denies that this is by grace alone! Instead, they claim that the grace of God (i.e. salvation) is mediated to us through the seven sacraments of the RC Church, of which water baptism is one of these channels of grace. This position is known as baptismal regeneration, and it doesn’t claim that water baptism saves us, as if just being baptised in water without faith and repentance can regenerate a person. It teaches that the grace of God is mediated through the rite or sacrament of water baptism. It goes without saying that the most extreme (obey Acts 2:38 or go to hell) Oneness Pentecostal position is also baptismal regenerationist, as a person cannot be saved by grace through faith ALONE, but water baptism is also needed for justification to take place, therefore the grace of God in this most extreme position is mediated though an act (of water baptism) which we have to do ourselves. This adds works to God’s grace and thus equates to salvation or justification not by faith alone, but salvation by God’s grace and via our own works!


((PS, I'm no0w saving posts to my memory stick and writing them at home, I'm particularly pround of the posts which I've written on this thread)).

Iron_Bladder 06-27-2007 06:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keith4him (Post 152676)
I agree, but faith is a process and salvation has many aspects, faith and repentance leading to justification, union with Christ, regeneration, sanctification and glorification follow.

Even the articles of faith of the UPCI says that we are justified at faith.





Almost every false sect and cult teaches the error that we’re justified by faith, most regarding faith as some kind of theological tick list, where just like a woman armed with a shopping list all you have to do to be saved is to do the various things (which you almost have to tick off a list). The UPCI is similar to many other sects in that by teaching justification by faith, they consequently reject the Protestant doctrine of justification by Grace through faith ALONE. Thus by doing this, whilst the UPCI seem to be similar to the Protestant position to the gullible and the untaught, in reality just like the Roman Catholics, the UPCI official position (taking just one illustration) is that Water Baptism is a channel through which the grace of God is given to us. This position is commonly known as Baptismal Regeneration, it doesn’t teach salvation by water baptism alone, but instead regards water baptism as a means by which the grace of God is then given to us as we obey and comply with God’s tick list of commands.

So the UPCI claims that justification is given to us effectively (even if they’ll never admit to it) as some kind of wage, which we earn as we obey a tick list of God’s various commands; repentance, faith, confession, water baptism, tongues, no TV, certain hair cuts, regular tithing and evangelism etc. The God of the UPCI loves us only dependent upon our works for him and not simply dependent upon his work on the cross for us. So the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, the possession of various Spiritual gifts and even being born-again is insufficient for most (if not all) UPCI ministers. For most UPCI ministers will happily condemn tongues speaking, Assemblies of God, Baptist and Anglican people to hell as unsaved, even if they do claim to have been born again, to have been adopted as Children of God and are also indwelt by the Holy Spirit and speak in tongues!

The reason for this hard hearted UPCI position which most if not all UPCI ministers believe is the false doctrine of salvation by faith! For we’re not saved by our own faith, but by God’s grace and that through faith (Ephesians 2:9), why even this true saving faith is given to us by God as a gift (2nd Timothy 2:25) and so we can’t possibly earn it or ever deserve it. Furthermore it’s also given to us whilst we’re still lost in our sins and still unregenerated (Romans 4:1-5). Notice especially Romans 4:5, where we read that God … ‘justifies the ungodly.’ That my friends is true salvation, which is by grace through faith ALONE, it’s this fact which above all else consequently disproves the heresy of salvation by faith. The RC, JW, LDS and UPCI religions all teach a variation on the same theme, namely that God justifies the Godly, as we obey his tick list of various salvation commands. Different cults focus upon different commands and so come up with different tick lists. But they all need to read Romans 4:5, and discover the true God of the Bible, who only ever justifies the ungodly whilst they are still undeserving and still in their sins, without any tick lists whatsoever!



((I think that this is the best post I've written for a long time, I've put a particular amouint of effort into this post and have been blessed with certain discoveries, particularly re Romans 4:5)).


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