Some standing here
 

It just seems mighty strange that the preterists think this passage is speaking of the 2nd coming of our Lord Jesus, when not a single one of the living disciples/Apostles mentioned viewing His 2nd coming in any of their writings.

Matt 16:28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.






Could they have pre-occupied?

Could they have been complacent?

Could they have died, not seeing the 2nd coming, making our Lord a liar?


It would be silly to not mention such an event, being the spiritual founders of the church.:nod

Re: Some standing here
 

Sean, this presents a bigger problem to you rather than to us.

Please explain your view!

Did Christ lie or did some there see the Coming of the Lord in His kingdom?

You tell us.

Re: Some standing here
 

Reconcile it in your mind Sean. This is one of the texts that pagans use to try to say that Jesus was a liar.

And they are true, from a dispee point of view.

Jesus spoke truth, but now you must figure out how.

Re: Some standing here
 

Nope they did not miss it as a matter of fact they wrote about the coming of God quite frequently, as emanate. So emanate that Paul had to warn people against those that were teaching that it already happened.

I wonder how people would believe in that day and time that Christ second coming had already happened, if it was going to happen like futurist teach?

Yet they did see that day, for it was Christ very teaching of the subject, that saved every Christian living around Jerusalem and Judea when Christ brought his judgement on the disbelieving Jew in 70ad.

Re: Some standing here
 

i do get his point though, and that used to bother me, until i saw that it would not appear to witnesses as "Christ's Second Coming," wherein they were naturally looking for Christ to come with a crown. It is easy to compare this lack of knowledge with the similar lack of ability to see Christ among themselves as He walked the earth, or with other occluded beliefs. We certainly have enough testimony of believers' inability to see Christ standing right in front of them.

Re: Some standing here
 

:thumbsup

Perspective must play a part in the way we read scripture. We seem to get the idea that the majority of the nation rejected Christ. Yet it was the minority (religious leaders) that rejected him. The masses gathered everywhere he went, proven by the fact that thousands gathered to hear him teach. Good grief 8000 were added to the church in the first two days and then daily they added to the church those that would be saved. For the first several years the only ones that were added were Jews. Gentiles were not added until the gospel had first gone to every Jew and even half Jew (the Samaritans) and then and only then did God allow the gospel to go to the Gentiles, and the Gentiles were added to the church they did not replace the church.
These are things dispies fail to recognize, they would have us to believe that the nation as a whole rejected Christ and that the church was and always will be a Gentile church until such a time as all Gentiles have come in. But the fact is, it is quite the opposite.
I don't know dispies must think that God is going to resurrect every Jew that has died in the last 2000 years at a second coming of Christ in order to fulfill the way they read Paul's words in Romans, "all Israel will be saved". Disregarding the fact that there is not one scripture to back that idea up.

Re: Some standing here
 

Folks quit reading to soon they saw the kingdom in preview in chapter 17. Peter refers to this in his epistle.

Re: Some standing here
 

Re: Some standing here
 

It's amazing to me how you are able to take what would take me several paragraphs to say and put it all into one or two simple but clear sentences.

Thank you, elder.

:thumbsup :highfive

Re: Some standing here
 

Yes very well said. :thumbsup

Re: Some standing here
 

(Regarding Matt. 16:28 AND 27)


Does the word "Assuredly" or "Truly" or "Verily" not have any purpose at all, zilch zero, in that verse?

It sholy do!

The word "Verily" means back up one verse, and read them together. Jesus would not say "Assuredly", and then separate the 2 verses by 2000 years.






And to say "most of you folks are going to die over the next 6 days, but some of you standing here won't". You have got to be kidding.



Again, we cannot remove the word "assuredly", and it's purpose for being spoken, and squeeze in 2000 years instead.


The word is there to connect the 2 verses. It means "of a truth I tell you", or "trust me when I tell you...
The Greek:
https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang...ngs=G281&t=KJV

Re: Some standing here
 

Okay my preterist compadres....I want some info on WHO saw the 2nd coming please.

Jesus said there were some standing there that would see His 2nd coming?

Is there a side book from the 1st century that was not accepted somewhere?

Anything?

Howbout Josephus?, Did God annoint him in some incorporated Apostolic writings to write about the 2nd coming, but not the disciples?

If such a majestic sight as Jesus described happened....WHO SAW IT???

WHO WROTE ABOUT IT???

Re: Some standing here
 

yes, i am not finding that either--but note the Apostles who spoke with Christ without realizing it. More than once. Note the many Jews, versed in the Scriptures, looking for a Messiah, who did not recognize Jesus. So i see a possible reflection there, when considering 70 ad.

Re: Some standing here
 

Uhhhhhhhh...uhhhhhhh ... Huh?
Didn't you read what bro Epley said?
Sorry new here but, woah.
Me thinks, some don't think.
These verse don't have nothing to do with the 2nd coming bruh.

Re: Some standing here
 

And that ain't no pretirizm either.
Please no offense.
I'm out

Re: Some standing here
 

Jesus was telling them that they wouldn't die within eight days?

Also Jesus was telling them the Kingdom would appear within eight days?

I guess some people aren't Dispensationalists anymore? :heeheehee

Luke 9:27-35

But I tell you of a truth, there be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the kingdom of God. And it came to pass about an eight days after these sayings, he took Peter and John and James, and went up into a mountain to pray. And as he prayed, the fashion of his countenance was altered, and his raiment was white and glistering.And, behold, there talked with him two men, which were Moses and Elias: Who appeared in glory, and spake of his decease which he should accomplish at Jerusalem.But Peter and they that were with him were heavy with sleep: and when they were awake, they saw his glory, and the two men that stood with him. And it came to pass, as they departed from him, Peter said unto Jesus, Master, it is good for us to be here: and let us make three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias: not knowing what he said. While he thus spake, there came a cloud, and overshadowed them: and they feared as they entered into the cloud.And there came a voice out of the cloud, saying, This is my beloved Son: hear him.

Re: Some standing here
 

And it sure ain't Dispensationalism. :)

Re: Some standing here
 

This is just one commentary which agrees with you. ;)

Pulpit Commentary

Verse 28. - This verse has always been a crux to commentators, who cannot decide what is the event to which it refers. Many, taking it in connection with the preceding announcement, refer it exclusively to the day of judgment; but this idea is not compatible with Christ's assertion that some present shall see it ere they die. Nor can it refer to Christ's resurrection and ascension, and the mission of the Holy Ghost, which took place only half a year after this time, and the prediction of which so short a time before could not have been introduced in the terms here used. Other expositors, and some of great name, agree that the event to which Christ alludes is his transfiguration narrated in the next chapter. But there are insuperable objections to this view. How could Christ assert in the most solemn manner, Verily, I say unto you, that some of his hearers would tire to witness an event which was to occur only a week hence? Nor is it likely that he would thus publicly announce a transaction which was strictly private, seen only by three chosen witnesses, who were further charged not to reveal the vision till the Son of man was risen from the dead. The Lord had been telling of the final judgment; he now announces, with the formula used by him to present some revelation of Divine truth, that there was to be a coming of the Son of man at no very distant date. This advent is doubtless the destruction of Jerusalem, which, as it occurred only some forty years after this time, some of his auditors, apostles and the multitude, would live to behold. This great event was a type of the second advent, the two being closely connected by Christ himself (see ch. 24.). There is some truth in all the views that have obtained concerning this passage: "The prophecy unfolded itself by degrees; it has put forth buds and blossoms, but it will not be in its full bloom of accomplishment till the great day" (Wordsworth). There was some display of Christ's kingdom at the Transfiguration; another at his resurrection, and the events consequent thereupon; but the great one was when the overthrow of Jerusalem and its temple made way for the full establishment and development of the gospel, putting an end to the first dispensation. Some standing (of them that stand) here. Among the apostles St. John certainly survived the destruction of Jerusalem. There seems to be no recondite meaning in the term "standing," as if it signified "remaining steadfastly by me, adhering to my side;" as, taste of death is merely a periphrasis for "die," and has not the sense of tasting the bitterness of death, experiencing its sting. It appears to have been originally a metaphor derived from a nauseous draught, which every one must drain. Coming in his kingdom. Not "into his kingdom," but in the power and glory that appertain to his kingdom. Not that he will personally appear, but his mystical presence will be seen by its effects, the judgment on the Jewish nation, the establishment of a spiritual, yet visible kingdom in the place of the old covenant. There may be a similar allusion in Christ's words about St. John, "If I will that he tarry till I come" (John 21:23), and "This generation shall not pass till all these things be fulfilled" (Matthew 24:34) - where the dissolution of the Jewish polity is the event signified.

Re: Some standing here
 

Josephus didn't even know who built the temple. :heeheehee

Re: Some standing here
 

Again.....



Originally Posted by Sean View Post
It just seems mighty strange that the preterists think this passage is speaking of the 2nd coming of our Lord Jesus, when not a single one of the living disciples/Apostles mentioned viewing His 2nd coming in any of their writings.

Matt 16:28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.






Could they have pre-occupied?

Could they have been complacent?

Could they have died, not seeing the 2nd coming, making our Lord a liar?


It would be silly to not mention such an event, being the spiritual founders of the church.



Okay my preterist compadres....I want some info on WHO saw the 2nd coming please.

Jesus said there were some standing there that would see His 2nd coming?

Is there a side book from the 1st century that was not accepted somewhere?

Anything?

Howbout Josephus?, Did God annoint him in some incorporated Apostolic writings to write about the 2nd coming, but not the disciples?

If such a majestic sight as Jesus described happened....WHO SAW IT???

WHO WROTE ABOUT IT???





I am speaking of eye witness accounts of His so-called 2nd coming....Any at all?

Re: Some standing here
 

They saw everything else(death, burial, resurrection, ascension, Holy Ghost outpouring and recorded it accurately)....


Why no record of His 2nd coming with these writers?

Re: Some standing here
 

Why no record of the 2nd coming from the 1st century church Fathers either?

Re: Some standing here
 

Why do folks 2000 years later, believe He returned a 2nd time, when the Apostles/disciples of the 1st century did not even believe He returned?

Re: Some standing here
 

Oh ok, I must be wrong then.
Thank you for showing me this.:groan

Please don't disrespect Kupuna Epley.

Re: Some standing here
 

You might want to spend more time on here for a while, more than 4 lifetime posts, before you go to making ridiculous accusations like that last line.

Re: Some standing here
 

Nobody said that. Nobody said that is what Jesus said. (By nobody I mean nobody in my circles...)

Re: Some standing here
 

It seems to me that Jesus was speaking of His ascension to the Right Hand of God, which parallels nicely with Daniel, when the Son of Man is presented before the Ancient of Days, and is given a kingdom that fills the earth.

Note that the word "coming" in Greek can also mean "arrive", or "go". So, with their own eyes, the ones who lived long enough to see it, were present on the Mount of Olives, just as He said some of them would be.

The transfiguration then, did serve as a preview (not a fulfillment) of the ascension to receive the kingdom, in which, once ascended, Christ was glorified (just as He temporarily was when the Father transfigured Him in front of Peter, James, and John).

Re: Some standing here
 

http://bible.com/1/heb.10.36-37.kjv For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise. For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry.

Re: Some standing here
 

http://bible.com/1/jas.5.8.kjv Be ye also patient; stablish your hearts: for the coming of the Lord draweth nigh.

Re: Some standing here
 

http://bible.com/1/jas.5.7.kjv Be patient therefore, brethren, unto the coming of the Lord. Behold, the husbandman waiteth for the precious fruit of the earth, and hath long patience for it, until he receive the early and latter rain.

Re: Some standing here
 

http://bible.com/1/2pe.3.11-12.kjv Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

Re: Some standing here
 

Re: Some standing here
 

What world perished in Noah's flood?

You said you didn't know? Maybe you asked your pastor, Elder Google?

Want to give it another shot?

What world perished? :lol

Re: Some standing here
 

Elder Epley is your grandfather?

Re: Some standing here
 

Revelation 22:12 And, behold, I come sometime after 2,000 years; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must come to pass in over 2,000 years from now; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John, but will not be relevant until over 2,000 years are completed :

Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is far off in the distant future.

Re: Some standing here
 

Kupuna,
This is no light word or title. The respect of a grandparent is heavy, But the respect of Kupuna goes beyond this.

"Throughout Hawai'i, this Hawaiian word is widely understood to mean elder, grandparent or an older person. What is less recognized is the fact that the word has at least three distinct, but related meanings. First, a kupuna is an honored elder who has acquired enough life experience to become a family and community leader. The term has been stated to be the embodiment of natural respect . . . . a practitioner of aloha (love), pono (righteousness), malama (caring), and spirituality. In ancient times, they were teachers and caretakers of grandchildren and that bond was especially strong. Even today, the kupuna is expected to speak out and help make decisions on important issues for both the family and the community"

I think S.Epley has earned this respect.

Re: Some standing here
 

Elder Epley is my friend, but I don't see him as my grandfather. :)

Re: Some standing here
 

Maybe Noah's flood over the earth was only "spiritually destroyed", like the Jews of 1 Peter 3 that "spiritually melted"?....LOL

Re: Some standing here
 

hmm, i think that was the physical destruction, and perhaps the spiritual comes second?

Re: Some standing here
 

Obvious the planet suffered catastrophic damage in the flood, but the planet wasn't annihilated into oblivion, so I think the text is referring to the general term kosmos meaning an orderly arrangement, most often translated as world.

Therefore the orderly arrangement of the first 6 days of creation was destroyed in the flood.