Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/12/05.../?intcmp=hpbt1

The ISIS-inspired female terrorist in the recent mass killings in San Bernardino, Calif., reportedly entered the country on a so-called “fiancé visa” that listed a false or at least inaccurate foreign home address.

The woman, Tashfeen Malik, listed an address in her home country of Pakistan. This summer, she received her Green Card, which allows immigrants to legally live and work in the United States, according to ABC News.

The Department of Homeland Security did not respond Saturday to a Fox News request for comment.

The issue raises questions about the vetting process for immigrants amid growing concerns that Middle East terrorists could be slipping into the country.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

I believe that Isis will use the immigrant situation in the middle east to flood their "holy warriors" all over the globe.

We are better off helping them in their land, than bringing them here and taking a chance.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

This guy is warning us to open our eyes to the times we live in.....right here in the good ol' USA...

http://shoebat.com/

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

If you have a weak stomach, dont watch this...



http://shoebat.com/every-five-minute...ristian-lives/

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Sean, so these are my brothers and sisters in Christ, but the Baptists down the street are deceived children of satan and on their way to hell?

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Only when they are getting killed by Muslims.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Many of these images do not show the death of Christians as I recognize them from other videos I have watched.

But if these people are not born of the water and the Spirit, as Apostolics present, then is it a situation of satan's children killing satan's children?

Should I help these so-called christians live another day so that they can spread their false doctrines?

When these people die, according to Apostolic doctrine, the only place they can go is hell. Apostolic doctrine demands this! There is NO GRACE for the believer in the Trinity! NONE AT ALL-- according to current 21st century American Apostolic doctrine.

So, if I provide help for them, it won't be because they are Christians because they are not saved and can't be Christian.

If I help them, it will be because they are human and it is in my means to help them.

However, there are millions of humans suffering over there-- all of them going to the same hell because none of them believe and practice the form of gospel as presented by 21st century American Apostolics.

If the Apostolics are right, I should save my money, pray for my immediate family instead, let satan's children kill satan's children, and pray for Jesus to hurry up and return.


Can't anyone else see that the form of gospel presented by Oneness Pentecostals absolutely prohibits anyone else who calls on the Name of the Lord from being saved?

It is IMPOSSIBLE for anyone who isn't baptized in Name of Jesus, or Lord Jesus, or Lord Jesus Christ, or whatever other variation-- IMPOSSIBLE for them to be saved! If they don't speak in tongues, they don't have the Holy Ghost inside them and they MUST BE LOST according to Oneness Pentecostal doctrine!

So helping them would be the same as helping a Muslim and the same as helping a Baptist and the same as helping a Trinitarian Pentecostal-- they are all lost and going to the same hell anyway-- that is according to 21st century American Apostolic teachings.

They aren't brothers. Any appeal to help them will then appeal to helping them as humans, but like I asked, with countless millions of humans needing help, what makes these people special?

In order to be consistent as an Apostolic, the answer can only be, "nothing".

They are not brothers. They are not sisters. They are not any more special than any other third world citizen that needs my help.

In order to be consistent as an Apostolic, until they are baptized our way and until they speak in tongues, they are not saved, not born again, not Christians and ultimately, not special in a world with countless millions who are suffering and lost.

Do I believe this way? Nope, but it is why I can't be Apostolic.

I need consistency.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Over 2,000 years of history, countless MILLIONS of lives changed and inspired by FAITH in the Son of the Living God, all of them dead and BURNING in hell because they never spoke in tongues, BURNING for an eternity because they weren't baptized as we present they should be baptized.

Millions in these modern times, confessing faith in the Lord and striving to live the life their biblical faith professes-- on their way to hell because our doctrine precludes everyone but us from salvation.

satan's children are gonna kill and be killed, if in deed they are satan's children.

I might as well save my cash for my church's building fund!

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

A number that no man could number...

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

That is baloney, I am an Apostolic and I do not teach what you are saying.

We do not condemn all other Christians to hell or say they are not really saved.

Just because we teach baptism in the name of Jesus does not mean that we automatically condemn all Trinitarians to Hell.

you are just blowing a whole lot of crazy smoke, you need to quit smoking that stuff from Mexico.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Nope. There is NO WAY for anyone who doesn't follow 21st century American Apostolic doctrine to be saved, according to 21st century American Apostolic doctrine.

Examine your doctrines and examine orthodox Christianity. If you're right, then you're really, really right AND the vast majority of all that the world has ever known of Christendom is in hell and burning with Genghis Khan, Emperor Nero, and Saddam Hussein.

If you're wrong, you're really, really wrong and it will only be by the Grace of God that the Apostolics will join the Baptists, Coptics, and Eastern Orthodox in that great number that no man can number.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

The Bible can number cubits in various situations, but it can't number the number of people who follow 21st century American Apostolic doctrine. Since Azusa, there must be multiplied trillions of believers in the Oneness of God, who have been baptized with the Name of Jesus somehow expressed over them, who have spoke in tongues, who wear no facial hair, make up and etc...

More than a google of them, because you can number a google.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

You are deeply mistaken for not all Apostolics are UPCI, what you are saying is irrelevant to me and to many other of us Apostolics who are not UPCI.

Me thinks you are confusing and mixing many different issues. :foottap

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Wait a minute JD...I have NEVER said any professing Christians are going to hell(except for preterists):nod


I have told folks the martyrs will be judged according to their works, and what a way to go...as a professing Christian!

You must be born again to see or experience the kingdom of God within you. That is all the Bible allows me to teach.

Everyone else will be judged according to their works.

God will judge them as He wishes, and rightly.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Rev. 14:9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,

10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:

11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them.




J.D., I dont think these multitudes to die for God will be born again saints, just believing saints.

The Church is raptured(the Holy Ghost and all born again saints taken out of the way) at this point and the ones left behind, refusing the MARK are considered saints.


2 Thessalonians 2:7
“For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.”

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

The whole passage...




3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?

6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

What happened to the third shooter? I was listening to Joe Pags the evening it all went down. He specifically said 'police have reported two shooters down, one in custody'. Where'd the third shooter go?

Why did Carly Fiorini say on air that according to the news reports the ATF said one of the rifles used had been purchased for a police department and she asked 'how did a rifle bought for a police department end up with these guys?'

Why do the photos of the vehicle not match each other, as if the vehicle was photographed in several different locations?

Why were the two dead perps in handcuffs? Who handcuffs dead people?

How coincidental is it that the location of the shooting was holding active shooter drills every month prior to this event?

How coincidental that an active shooter drill was in progress at the same time as the shooting, right down the road? A person 'on the scene' texted that 'Oh, the drill has started'.

Why were the media allowed in the suspects' apartment within two days of the event? Over 100 reporters were let into a major crime scene? So much for basic forensics 101. Why is that in all these horrible incidents there is never any realistic forensic crime scene analysis done, and all the crime scenes get destroyed (forensically) almost immediately? As in 9-11, Sandy Hook, the Batman Theater shooting, this... etc etc etc

Why is the female suspect's name spelled 'Farook' when people who speak Arabic translate the /k/ sound as 'Q' in Latin letters? (for example, don't Muslims write 'Quran' and not 'Koran'?) Why was her identification badge released via media photo footage have the word 'Reveune' instead of 'Revenue'? What state agency makes such a goofy mistake on their id badges? And if the badge was fake, was possible reason would this woman have for possessing such a stupid-cheap low budget fake ID?

Where's the third shooter?

Why did a Fox news reporter use the term 'actors' on air to refer to the suspects?

Why do the police claim they were taking fire from the suspects' vehicle when all the photos of the SUV show its windows rolled up (albeit damaged by police gunfire)? Who shoots rifles out of an SUV with the windows rolled up?

Why were the suspects identified as wearing 'combat gear' and body armor, but the body shown on the ground next to the SUV looks like a possible woman in a miniskirt and tank top with high heels?

Where's all the blood in the photos? There is a big red splotch on the ground next to the SUV but it doesn't look like blood (too red) and isn't in position to have been put there by a body being dragged from the vehicle. And where are the blood streaks?

Why are there some reports about the two suspects being found in the SUV already shot to death and handcuffed and stuffed BEHIND the BACK seat? Who shot them? Who handcuffed them? Who stuffed them behind the back seat? Who are these people anyway?

Where's the third shooter?

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Did ANYONE read the topic?

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

http://www.vocativ.com/underworld/cr...ooter-ft-hood/

Did she? I didn't see those News reports.

Show me. How do they not match?

I only saw 1 cuffed. They don't go over and check a pulse first. Cuff first then check

Not at all. Active shooters are becoming normal and the Police want to be prepared.

Once a month? Good odds.

FBI says they got what they needed.

The theater and Sandy hook were destroyed? Immediately? Prove it

It's not. Her name is Tashfeen Malik

His is being reported as Syed Farooq or Farook, both. Why is that important?

Show me. I looked.

See above

For reals? I hear that all the time

noun
1.a person who acts in stage plays, motion pictures, television broadcasts, etc.
2.a person who does something; participant.

He opened the door and fired? Note, I don't know for sure they fired first. Police may have just went "shoot to kill", but his body was lying on the ground away from the vehicle and the door was opened.

She changed clothes.

She was shot dead in the car. She bled out there. Her dead body was inside for a long time

From who?

Police

Nobody. Didn't happen

See above

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

yup. Generally speaking, quite accurate. You may define "Apostolic" for yourself though, i think; you don't have to accept anyone else's definition.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Get real, this is AFF! lol

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Brother...wow. I watched this LIVE...the News choppers reported the body was several feet away from the car, as though he ran or was dragged. Your pictures don't show the body because they have it blocked out.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Those aren't different locations. Those are different angles and times of day.

It's really sad to see intelligent people fall for these cut and paste jobs.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Praxeas, we don't know if she came to America radicalized or not. We don't know for sure.

I just read where the father of the husband said plainly that over time, his son came to agree with IS. Maybe he radicalized her. Maybe they radicalized each other.

However, I don't think anyone knows if this event was due in part to a vetting failure.

I say in part because even if there was a vetting failure, she could have chose to not do what she did. To make the statement, "the 14 victims in San Bernardino would be alive today if she was never let into our country in the first place," is impossible to prove or disprove.

With this logic, then we must blame the Bush Administration for 9-11, the Clinton Administration for the Embassy bombings in Tanzania and Nairobi, and Reagan for Beiruit.

There is ALWAYS something America could have done differently, always a tidbit of knowledge that could have been analyzed differently...

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

politics and religion--they go together :lol

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Who are the Apostolics that look at Trinitarians as their brothers and sisters in Christ and plan on worshipping God for an eternity right next to them?

Who are the Apostolics that teach and preach you must be born again of the water and the Spirit, but if you believe and confess, you're still saved?

Who are the Apostolics who believe that water baptism saves you and but you can be saved before you are baptized?

Who are these doctrinally inconsistent Apostolics?

You don't get it.

The very nature of 21st century American Apostolic doctrine condemns all others to hell because they are the only ones who present their form of the gospel.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

I'm sorry, but JD, did you once attend First Pentecostal Gulag?

Dude why are you even here posting on an Apostolic forum if you hold such a low opinion of us and our churches?

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

whether she did or didn't is not the point...our vetting process has huge holes.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

JD has a wrong impression of us Apostolics.

Yes there might be a few apostolics who condemn anyone not in their church or denomination as totally lost without any hope of salvation, but that is not the belief of the majority of the Apostolics.

I for once do hold out hope that Trinitarians will also make it to heaven, I really hope they do, but I am not dogmatic about it either way.

I also know for sure that many of my apostolic brethren also hope that the Trinitarians will also be admitted into heaven.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

I am not sure.

Maybe the UPCI has under gone more change than I thought! You guys are acting like my characterization of Apostolics is not the norm. I knew that to be the norm growing up in the Way of the Cross, through most my time in the Corps with the UPCI, through my time in the Guard, living in various parts of the country with the UPCI, through my deployments-- most Apostolics are not mean about it to non-Apostolics, but they definitely didn't fellowship Trinitarians as their saved brothers and sisters.

I know at my last Apostolic church, Trinitarians were considered lost by the congregants that would ask me questions and try to paint me in a corner over it.

I know my Dad's organization does not consider those "three-god folks" as saved (usually meant as a reference to COGIC). I also heard from others about the Baptists and Methodists, "those folks don't live nothing anyway!"

Is it different now? Do Apostolics now preach that Trinitarians will be in Heaven too?

If the Oneness Pentecostal view of salvation has changed, I didn't know and I apologize for the mischaracterization.

When did it change?

Does Elder Epley know about the change?

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Did you ever live in any of the Carolina's as an Apostolic?

How about Alabama or Maryland?

West Virginia?

Florida?

Surely, I can't be that far off in what I have said, otherwise I will apologize.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

I've heard the "big name" Apostolic preachers in person with my own ears.

I've gone to many Apostolic conferences (mainly east of the Mississippi and south of Philly).

I've spoken with some Apostolic Pastors in private, in different parts of the country, where I have visited and where I have lived.

I know what they say, what they tell the congregation. They're usually consistent.

They leave no room at all and honestly, they really can't-- not if they really believe what they preach.

I really don't think I am mischaracterizing Apostolics. I think you guys haven't given much thought to the fact that if the Apostolics are right in all they present, then it is really next to impossible for anyone else to be right too.

Seriously, explain how anyone else could be saved, who's not Apostolic.

If I am mischaracterizing the Apostolics, show me in scripture how others are saved without obeying Acts 2:38 as presented in Apostolic circles.

I am not afraid to admit when I am wrong.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

No, you are right, generally speaking. Does that mean that there are not many humble, awesome OPs in even the most dogmatic of churches? Of course not. But cliches do not evolve out of thin air. "Us 4 and no more."

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

JD are Muslims, Jews, Roman Catholics, Eastern Orthodox, and Mormons saved?
If not, why and if yes why?

Also why are you bringing up Elder Epley?

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

Did he have to attend congregations in those states in order to be Apostolic?

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

So, allow me to ask this question again? Why do you post on an Apostolic forum when you hold so much contempt for us and our churches?

Looking for converts? ;)

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

i find no contempt in his post; i don't think any was intended.

Re: Vetting failure led to terrorism?
 

hey OP, you suggest hundreds of millions of bloodthirsty Muslims are slobbering for your blood; witness how many Muslims have ever caused you any harm, or even the least bit of trouble.

OP- "Well, that isn't the point. Just look at the news."

Hey Ahmed, have any Christians ever darkened your door?

Ahmed- "Lol, you are kidding, right? I'm evacuating right now, because the Israelis have pulled up all my olive trees, and my cousin got drone bombed this morning, and we are now starving. I don't know if these oppressors are Christians, but i know who finances Israel, and i know where drone bombs come from, and they are telling me that all Muslims are lost, which is why I'm a terrorist."