An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Israel
 

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

I am hearing what the author of this article is saying, but where is the balance of the fact that Palestinian leaders have consistently sabotaged peace agreements? Ehud Barak offered Arafat 98% of the land the Palestinians demanded in 2000 and he wouldn't sign. The innocent people, man on the street types suffer because the leaders of the PA have been and continue to be abysmally corrupt. They won't even acknowledge Israel's right to exist. Not even when it's a condition for peace talks. Checkpoints are necessary as well as the wall because of decades of terrorist attacks on their innocent civilians.

The Arabs/Muslims coalesced together in 1948 to prevent Israel from forming as a nation. They threatened to finish what Hitler started. Arabs/Muslims who are citizens of the nation of Israel love far better lives than any other Arab/Muslim nation in the world.

If the Jordanians and others are so concerned for their Arab/Muslim brothers, why aren't they willing to absorb the Palestinians into their populations? They don't want them. The Arabs fight amongst themselves. They are tribal and hate each other with as much vitriol as they have for Jews.

Blaming Israel for the awful conditions of the Palestinians is old and tired. Israel isn't perfect, nor are the Jewish people, but Israel is a much better nation than any of her neighbors in the Middle East and elsewhere.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

hmm. yes, Arabs hardly need much help to disagree. But it is hard to visit Israel and not see an apartheid state. There are even young Jewish groups stirring for change there now, though, which is amazing considering the stigma they are under. What with the growing boycott--which is much more active in Europe and Africa--cutting into their exports now, by 15% in the last year, the tide seems to be turning.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

You have visited Israel?
And saw an apartheid state?
Can you give some relevant examples?

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

wow, where to start. Any Palestinian land title is considered worthless, and they are not allowed to improve their property. It kind of goes downhill from there.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

Can you start with answering questions 1 & 2?
And on the land titles question, can you be more specific?
What do you mean by "palestinian land titles"?

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

Just doing some quick research found this little nugget.
link
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_land_laws
snippet
Palestinian land laws refer to ownership of land under the Palestinian Authority (PA). These laws prohibit Palestinians from selling Palestinian-owned lands to "any man or judicial body corporation of Israeli citizenship, living in Israel or acting on its behalf."[1][2][3] These land laws were originally enacted during the Jordanian occupation of the West Bank (1948–1967). Land sales to Israelis are considered treason by the Palestinians because they threaten the founding of a future state and to "halt the spread of moral, political and security corruption".[4] Palestinians who sell land to Israelis can be sentenced to death, although death penalties are seldom carried out; a death sentence has to be approved by the Palestinian Authority President.[2][4][5][6][7]

Now who is practicing apartheid?

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

ya, that may be a law on some paper somewhere, but it does not reflect reality. No one recognizes PA land titles, and of course Israel is not the victim here by any stretch of anyone's imagination, except possibly in the news. No Palestinian has ever sold or wanted to sell their land to...anyone, really, even another Arab. Many are coerced into it via debt, which has been going on for a long time now.
well, yes, and yes. And Palestine land titles were hereditary under Turkish rule, which basically translates to 'the state can come take it whenever they want.'

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

pretty fringe, i think, but there are some ultra-orthodox, Zionists, that are pretty disagreeable to...pretty much everyone else, lol.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

I have an open letter to the idiots that have come to the moronic conclusion that there is some moral equivalence between what Israel does to protect itself and what the palistinianss are doing.

here it is.

stop being stupid.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

i started reading and decided i was reading an idiot trying to pretend to be objective.


bottom line, Israel has made offer after offer that would have lead to both peace and a Palestinian state.

Israel has been met with violence war and peace process sabotage by the very leaders they negotiated with.

THIS is all that matters.

if the Palestinians stopped attacking Israel, committed to peace with Israel and stopped sending their 8 year olds to summer camp to learn how to kill JEWS, they would get a nation for themselves.

if Israel, decided to lay down their arms and live at peace at all cost, they would all DIE.


That is the difference. That is WHY Israel is an armed camp and that is why the Palestinians live the way they do.

Period.

End of story.

the person who wrote the article disgusts me.

no, i am NOT a Christian Zionist

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

apparently the article is working :lol

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

Israel is a terrorist state just as much as Palestine is. They continually sabotage any peace efforts with their aggressive settlement policies. They do to the Arabs, what we did to the Native Americans. Give them land. Make treaties. Only to break those treaties and start settling in their land that we gave them. Not to mention what they do to non european jews like the Ethiopian Jews, who are actual semetic jews.. I do not support the Godless terrorist regime that is modern Israel. They arent the Jews of the bible. They are not God's chosen people. They wouldnt do half the stuff they do if their big brother America wasnt watching their back. benjamin netanyahu is nothing but a war monger. Where are the WMDs Benny? He used the same Iraq rhetoric to try and drum up war with Iran. Glad Obama had the foresight to tell him no.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

Israel is far from blameless. Israel is not the victim here.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

you better believe this, if I had been under threat of death for 50 stiniking years, with ever single nation around me committed to my destruction, I too would be FAR from blameless.


the Palistinian authority has a document that guides them. that document calls for the utter destruction of Israel as a nation. period. end of story.


and YOU want Israel to play nice?

that's stupid.

What Israel ought to do is get a bunch a bulldozers and push gaza into the sea.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

working? because it angers me that some idiot decides to be a liar and pretend to be some objective and knowledgeable "honest broker" for the express purpose of getting people to hate on Israel?

working... if by working, you mean if I actually saw the person who wrote that I would call them a liar to their face. then yea. it worked.


if by "worked" convinced me to listen to a moron?

not on your life.

Israel wants to live in peace.
Palistine wants to kill every single citizen of the nation of Israel.


that's the simple facts.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

here is some more truth for you terrorist lovers.


Hamas sets up a rocket base in a HOSPITAL
When Israel tries to stop them, you people start squealing about how Iseal (gasp) fired guns at a hospital!

Forget the fact that it is against the Geneva Conventions to use a HOSPITAL to launch military operations!

Hamas goes to a school, grabs a bunch of kids, then uses them as human shields to fire on Israelis. You people get all hot and botherd that the Israelis killed a kid!

Forget the fact that its against the Geneva Conventions to use kids as human shields.

this thread offends me. it offends me because its a lie.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

Also lets forget all of the Geneva Conventions that Israel has broken.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

You are blind. Thats not a lie. Israel is not acting in self defense. They are the agressor far more than the Palestinians. You being offended at the truth offends me. How can religious people support this godless nation of Israel?

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

Ferd probably thinks the Islamic world hates us for our freedoms and not our war for oil policies in the middle east.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

fmc - how many times have the Arab countries attacked Israel.
With the express purpose of wiping it off the map.
And how many still state today that they wish it was wiped off the map.
It is hard to negotiate with those who do not even acknowledge your right to exist.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

How many times has Israel made a treaty only to start settlements in the land they gave to the Palestinians?

Again, I said neither is blameless. Neither is acting in self defense. Both are terrorists.

People need to stop acting like its a salvation issue to support these fake jews that in power in Israel.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

Ferd has read enough of the Koran to understand that what is going on in the Islamic world isn't about hate or what we have done.

its about what they want.... you and me dead or converted.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

No treaty between Israel and the Palestinians has held longer than it took the Palestinians to go home and launch an attack.

you can talk settlements all you want. but at the end of the day, Palestine would be a nation if they decided to live at peace. they refuse.

Israel on the other hand would cease to exist if they decided to simply stop fighting... they refuse.

ive picked my side. its the side with the good guys. period. no room for discussion.

and no. I don't think a nation being attacked is required to protect some silly set of rights of those attacking them.

we fire bombed Dresden. It should be instructive.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

that's just the silliest thing ive ever heard. ive been there. not as some Christian tourist. I was there during a war as an American military person.

Israeli aggression is justified.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

they haven't. unless you are a believer of Solon.com and other idiot leftist trash.

you cant violate the Geneva Conventions, while in the middle of defending yourself from people violating the Geneva Conventions.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

I am offended that you are offended by my being offended.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

Can you give me more info on the "treaties" that Israel has broken?
I googled it and found some sites that accused them of breaking ceasefires, (of which I am doubtful), but did not find any treaties that were broken.
Not saying they did not, just could not find them.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

the feeling you come away with is of nice, open people (to me) who are also quite warlike--i mean the Israelis here--and largely the same impression from Palestinians, all living in a police state.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

I don't pick sides between the wanna-be Caliphate and the wanna-be Sanhedrin. I'd prefer we - as a nation - kept out of foreign entanglements.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

who decided that Israel had the right to become a state? The Brits?

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

oops!

lol

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

ya, the League of Nations, i guess. There's a pretty good argument that that is all the LoN ever did, and likely what they were formed for.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

You guys need to work on your history.

The General Assembly of the UN voted for it in 1947.
link
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Israel
snippets
On 29 November 1947, in Resolution 181 (II), the General Assembly adopted the majority report of UNSCOP, but with slight modifications.[104] The Plan also called for the British to allow "substantial" Jewish migration by 1 February 1948.[105]

Neither Britain nor the UN Security Council took any action to implement the resolution and Britain continued detaining Jews attempting to enter Palestine. Concerned that partition would severely damage Anglo-Arab relations, Britain denied UN representatives access to Palestine during the period between the adoption of Resolution 181 (II) and the termination of the British Mandate.[106] The British withdrawal was finally completed in May 1948. However, Britain continued to hold Jews of "fighting age" and their families on Cyprus until March 1949.[107]


Basically the British did all they could to help the Arabs defeat the Jews, when they pulled out.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

ok, so UNSCOP, whatever, like this is substantially any different?

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

shaz - different than what?

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

different than the League of Nations, or any other group of officials earnestly seeking mankind's best good.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

shaz - I believe that facts matter.
You stated "ya, the League of Nations, i guess. There's a pretty good argument that that is all the LoN ever did, and likely what they were formed for. "
This was incorrect.
There is somewhat more legitimacy to something passed by the UN as opposed to the LoN.
Since the UN is still an active organization.

Re: An open letter to Evangelical supporters of Is
 

ok, i think they are fundamentally the same, but you are right. I forget what it was that the LoN did, they did serve some purpose, which i guess i misremembered.