Genesis - Who is our image?
 

Genesis 1:26
Then God said, “Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish…

Who is God referring to when he says our?

Genesis 3:22
And the Lord God said, “The man has now become like one of us, knowing good…

Who is God referring to when he says us?

I always just though it was God and the angels.

Since Adam was created in the image of Him that was to come. Rom 5:14. It could be that God, who inhabits all of time, was refferring to Jesus.
In the image of God created he him.

"The image" could also be interpreted as the image of God's attributes.

His emotions. Anger, mercy, love, hatred, justice, compassion and so on.

His eternal existence. The soul will live forever somewhere.

His ability. To create, to destroy, to speak, to think.

Plurality of majesty. "We are not amused."

So basically, we just don't know the answer. :search

I believe that God was speaking to the angels in those passages, even though in Genesis 1:27 it says that God created man in His image and not their image.

I heard it preached that God was speaking to the creation He'd already made. We are made of the dust of the earth, so God wasn't lying when He said 'us' and 'our'.

To me, it's no different than looking at ingredients for a cake and stating to them, 'Let's make our pastor a wonderful cake that he'll enjoy after dinner tonight.'

Simple personification. ;)

I would believe that if the angels had anything to do with it, but they didn't.

The dust of the ground, however, did.

One oldtimer believed this was prophetic of the Lord and the ministry who would make man in God's image through ministry in the church.

The angels need not have actually participated in the work of creating in order for God to say what He said. The dust didn't do anything to create man either and it is a pretty silly thing to say if you take your objection to the angels on the basis that they didn't have anything to do with creating and apply it to the dirt: "God said to the dirt, let us make man in our image." The dirt didn't "do" anything and, thus, did not assist God in creating man.

Chan, do you understand what 'personification' is? Have you ever talked to an inanimate object?

I think it's simple to understand that God was drawing in the dirt and made the statement, "Let us make man", and He did, using the dirt He spoke to.

It's no different than an artist looking at his tools and speaking to them about making a masterpiece. Sure, he's the artist, but without his tools he's nothing more than just a man.

God spoke to the dirt, yet He made man. Angels had nothing to do with it, but the dirt certainly did, cause without it, you would be made of cow dung instead, perhaps.

I have never, at least not intentionally, talked to an inanimate object.

If I saw an artist talking to his tools I'd think he had a few screws loose. Are you suggesting that God is nothing without the dust of the ground?

God did not speak to the dirt!!!!!

Angels

Angels were present though and angels might have also had a similiar nature to God being spirits themselves.

This is a good point.

So the dirt helped God create? Why could not God speak to the angels in the same way you say he spoke to dirt?

I am quoting an article by Jason Dulle

Directly following God's use of plural pronouns in verse twenty-six it is said that "God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him...." (Genesis 2:27 italics mine) Clearly it was one image in which man was created. He was not created in two or more images.

It appears that God was speaking to angels in these passages. The grammar of these verses support this view. The grammar of Genesis 1:26 is as follows: God (plural)2 said (third person masculine singular), Let us make (first person common plural) man (singular masculine noun) in our image ("image" is a first person common plural suffix), after our likeness ("likeness" is a feminine singular noun with a first person common plural suffix)."3 The plural pronouns "us" and "our" must be referring to someone other than God because the verb used in connection with "God" is singular. If God was speaking to Himself in a plural form, or performing self-talk as some say, the pronouns would also need to be singular to modify the verb. Because they are not plural, God was truly speaking to someone else.

The very fact that God uses singular pronouns when speaking of Himself in thousands of cases causes us to question why He chose to use plural pronouns in this passage and in the other three I mentioned earlier. In the verses preceding Genesis 1:26 which speak of the creative acts of God, singular pronouns are used exclusively in reference to God, and in verse twenty-six a singular verb is used. There must be some reason for this peculiar usage in these passages. In verse twenty-six two plural pronouns and a plural verb are used in connection with God. This change in usage indicates that God is now including others in His address.

The only beings created at this point were the angels, so it seems best to understand angels to be the recipients of God's address. The Jews have always believed that angels were the ones being adressed by God in these verses. We know that the angels were present at creation (Job 38:4, 7), so it is very possible that God was speaking to them. He addressed the angels in a courteous manner, acknowledging that they too had an image like His. God created man in the image of Himself, an image shared by the angels also.

Two objections might occur at this point: 1. How could angels be said to have an image or likeness to God?; 2. How could angels help God create man?

In response to the first objection, it seems best to see the "image" in which man was created to be one of moral, spiritual, intellectual, and emotional qualities rather than any physical qualities or similarities. God and angels both possess all of these attributes that men have. Sometimes we view angels as android beings created by God that have no choice but to serve Him in holiness and righteousness, being emotionless, and have no way of thinking for themselves. This is an unbiblical view. Peter said angels are interested in the activities of the church when he said concerning the gospel being preached with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven, "which things the angels desire to look into" (I Peter 1:12).

We see from this verse that angels do have a will of their own by the fact that they desire to look into these things. God does not command them to do this, but they have a desire to do so. This indicates that angels have an emotional spectrum and intellectual independence. They have spiritual qualities in that they worship God and moral qualities in that they choose to stay pure.4
Regarding the second objection, angels did not participate in any way with the creation of man, but they did participate in some way in the making of man. The Hebrew word translated "make" in Genesis 1:26 is asah. The Hebrew word meaning "create" is bara. Angels do not have the power to create anything, but might have shared in the making of man from the dust of the ground. Vine's comparison and contrast of the two Hebrew words is helpful here:

In <Gen. 1:26-27>...`asah must mean creation from nothing, since it is used as a synonym for bara'. The text reads, "Let us make [`asah] man in our image, after our likeness.... So God created [bara'] man in his own image...." Similarly, <Gen. 2:4> states: "These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created [bara'], in the day that the Lord God made [`asah] the earth and the heavens." Finally, <Gen. 5:1> equates the two as follows: "In the day that God created [bara'] man, in the likeness of God made [`asah] he him." The unusual juxtaposition of bara' and `asah in <Gen. 2:3> refers to the totality of creation, which God had "created" by "making."
It is unwarranted to overly refine the meaning of `asah to suggest that it means creation from something, as opposed to creation from nothing. Only context can determine its special nuance. It can mean either, depending upon the situation.5

That the creation consisted of creating and making can be seen in Genesis 2:3-4: "And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created [bara] and made [asah]. These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created [bara], in the day that the LORD God made [asah] the earth and the heavens." The TWOT is also helpful here.

The significant interchange between the words bara "create" and asah is of great interest. The word bara carries the thought of the initiation of the object involved. It always connotes what only God can do and frequently emphasizes the absolute newness of the object created. The word asah is much broader in scope, connoting primarily the fashioning of the object with little concern for special nuances.
The use of bara in the opening statement of the account of creation seems to carry the implication that the physical phenomena came into existence at that time and had no previous existence in the form in which they were created by divine flat. The use of asah may simply connote the act of fashioning the objects involved in the whole creative process.
The word asah is also used elsewhere in Scripture to describe aspects of the creative work of God (Psa 86:9; Psa 95:5; Psa 96:5).6

It might be best to understand the creation of man in a two-fold manner. He was both made and created. He was made (asah) in that his body came from the dust of the ground (earth). The earth was already created by God, so Adam was made from a substance which was already created. He might be said to have been created (bara) in that "God breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and He [Adam] became a living soul" (Genesis 2:7). The life invested into the body was a creation of God; a creation which the angels could not participate in.

Because angels could not actually create man, it might be wondered why God even bothered speaking to them concerning man. The reason might be two-fold. First of all, God might have addressed them in a courteous manner because of their intimate presence at this amazing time. Secondly, He addressed them to declare His intentions of making man in their image as well as His: a moral, spiritual, intellectual, and emotional image. After God allowed the angels to participate in the making of man, He created in him a living soul which possessed this image of God and of the angels.

The angels participation in the making of man might be compared to the manner in which believers work miracles. Jesus said, "Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils: freely ye have received, freely give" (Matthew 10:8). This does not mean that we have the power in and of ourselves to work miracles, even though Jesus spoke these things in the imperative as though it was our responsibility to see that they come about. Although we are to do these things, we do them by relying on the power and will of God. Just as we do not actually work miracles apart from God, neither could the angels actually make man apart from the power and will of God.

Genesis 3:22
Genesis 3:22 has a similar grammatical structure to that of Genesis 1:26: "God (plural) said (third person masculine singular), Behold, the man is become as one of us (first person common plural), to know good and evil."7 Here again we see a singular verb being used with plural pronouns.
Thus far we know that those to whom God spoke had an image that was like His, and could be considered to be enough like God to the extent that He could say, "Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil." It might be argued that angels do not know the difference between good and evil, or that at least before the fall of man they didn't know the difference. Again, this type of response is based off of the idea that angels are holy androids with no will of their own.



If angels could not sin, then Lucifer and the other multitudes of angels that rebelled against God could have never actually done so. God would have had to have made them rebel against Him. Angels knew the difference between good and evil before man ever sinned. This knowledge was just as much a part of their nature as it was God's. They did not have to commit evil to know evil, just as God never had to commit evil to know the difference between evil and good.


In support of the idea that God addressed His angels in this passage, notice that immediately after man's disobedience and sin God evicted them from the Garden of Eden and stationed cherubims at the east end of the Garden to block its entrance from man. Angelic activity surrounded God's new creation. That God was addressing angels in Genesis 3:22 flows with the rest of the context, not being hindered by it whatsoever.
http://www.apostolic.net/biblicalstudies/usandour.htm

And the Lord said to the angels who ministered before Him, who had been created in the second day of the creation of the world, Let us make man in Our image, in Our likeness; and let them rule over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl which are in the atmosphere of heaven, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every reptile creeping upon the earth. And the Lord created man in His Likeness: [JERUSALEM. And the Word of the Lord created man in His likeness, in the likeness of the presence of the Lord He created him, the male and his yoke-fellow He created them.] In the image of the Lord He created him, with two hundred and forty and eight members, with three hundred and sixty and five nerves, and overlaid them with skin, and filled it with flesh and blood. Male and female in their bodies He created them. And He blessed them, and the Lord said to them, Increase and multiply, and fill the earth with sons and daughters, and prevail over it, in its possessions; and have dominion over the fish of the sea and over the fowl of the earth. Targum Jonathan

And the Lord said, Let us make Man in Our image, as Our likeness; and shall have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the heavens, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every reptile which moveth upon the earth. And the Lord created the Adam in His image, in the image of the Lord He created him; male and female He created them. And the Lord blessed them, and said to them, spread abroad, and become many, and fill the earth, and be strong upon it; and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the heavens, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. Targum Onkelos

Somehow, I find that hard to believe. LOL!

Most people don't talk to inanimate objects when people are around.

Not sure where you got that.

You were there? How do you know? He spoke to a lot of inanimate objects and they did what He bid them do.

But they were merely stand-bys. They had nothing to do with creating man.

The dirt did, however, and it only makes sense that He was speaking to the dirt when making man.

I know this is another subject but in reference to only angels being created, who was Cain referring to in Genesis 4:13 when he told the Lord that whoever finds him would kill him.

I like to think God was talking to the angels. I wonder if there were some dispute between God and Satan that said the angels that left with Satan couldn't help it because of how they were created so God decided to make us after God's likeness and maybe some angelic likeness to prove that we CAN live for God? That may be some extra-biblical thinking on my part, but I have wondered it.

The angels are made neither in the image nor the likeness of God. However, we are made in the image and likeness of both God and dust of the ground.

Angels weren't the only beings present. All the animals and God's other creations were there too, but I don't think He was speaking to them. ;)

The angels didn't help God create anything, but the dirt did. See, when God speaks to something, it does what He tells it to do, even if it won't do the same for us.

So yes, I believe the dirt went where God wanted it to.

Ever try and make something from dirt? I bet you won't get much cooperation!

Sadly, there is no timeline during those first few verses, but I think it would be interesting to know how old Cain and Abel were when Cain did his evil deed.

I speculate that several years, even hundreds had passed at that time and there were several people already on the earth that would kill him, knowing what he'd done to their brother/uncle.

DO you not suppose that God, who inhabits all of time at once, could have breathed a prophetic utterance to the son? As i mentioned earlier In

Rom 5:14
14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.

Adam was created in the image of Jesus (God manifest in the flesh)

As far as God was concerned Jesus was slain before the foundation of the world

Rev 13:8
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

God calls those things that are not as though they are.

Rom 4:17
17(As it is written, I have made thee a father of many nations,) before him whom he believed, even God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were.

They are not, as far as we are concerned, but to God it is in existence

These are some of my thoughts on the subject. Although i suppose that no one really knows except for God.:hanky

It has always been my understanding that when Moses was inspired of God to record the words of Genesis 1:26-27, he (Moses) was stating, in essence, that God was "counselling" with Himself. Is this not what the apostle Paul conveyed when he penned the words of Ephesians 1:11, wherein he (Paul) implied that God "...worketh ALL things after the counsel of his own will"?

How often do we "counsel" with our will before we undertake to do something? I know that I perhaps expend more time in "counselling" with myself PRIOR to doing things, than I sometimes expend in performing that which I was about to do.

This understanding seems to be more plausible, for me at least, than all of the others I have heard or read about.

That is another angle that i have heard before, and i agree that is likely very possible. I kind of like how the view that i stated brings in the fact that God made all things by the son. It kind of answers that question at the same time.

For what it's worth.:rolleyes2

I have also heard that explanation and believe it to be plausible.

Dirt had nothing to do with creating God either. Dirt does not create. Angels were standbys....BTW

Did you read the article? maybe they did not just stand by. There are two words used. One means create, something only God can do and the other means make. like to make something from what already exists. We make things all the time.

Angels were there and God could have been informing them. Please read the article

You say that....Im waiting for you to prove it.

Scripture that says we are made in the image of dirt....it does not say that. Scriptures say we were made in HIS image.

That may be true however that is a non-sequitor. It really has no bearing on whether God could have been speaking to angels...did you read the article yet?

The hebrew grammar has God speaking to someone other than himself

I read it and he seems to be making suppositions just like everyone else who wasn't there that day. The angels do nothing of their own will. That happened once and we know the results. I don't see anywhere in scripture where God commanded the angels to help at all with creation...not any part of it.

And I said nothing about the dirt creating God or anything else. However, God spoke on several occasions to inanimate objects and they obeyed His command. IE: fig tree

You want me to prove something that you also cannot prove on the reverse?

We are also made from the dust of the ground. Is God made from dust? No, but we can be made in His image AS WELL AS the dust of the ground, and scripture says that we are both.

Someone or something? Are you sure?

The grammar indicates that another being is present? Got proof of that?

The Angels themselves were made in Gods image. We know this because he was an Angel himself.

15: And he blessed Joseph, and said, God, before whom my fathers Abraham and Isaac did walk, the God which fed me all my life long unto this day,
16: The Angel which redeemed me from all evil, bless the lads; and let my name be named on them, and the name of my fathers Abraham and Isaac; and let them grow into a multitude in the midst of the earth. Gen. 48:15-16

So YHWH and Angels had the same image.

God looked like a man to Ezekiel:

26: And above the firmament that was over their heads was the likeness of a throne, as the appearance of a sapphire stone: and upon the likeness of the throne was the likeness as the appearance of a man above upon it. Ezekiel 1:26

Angels looked like men to Daniel:

21: Yea, whiles I was speaking in prayer, even the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, touched me about the time of the evening oblation. Dan. 9:21

Gabriel is the same Angel which came to the virgin Mary with the news of Christs birth. Daniel called him a man.

So God and Angels though they are spirit beings have a form that looks like men.

We are made in their image and likeness.

When God said Let us make man to the Angels he said it to them out of COURTESY.

Like I would say to my family "lets get a pizza". We would go to Pizza Hut and then I would actually get the pizza. Same deal.

But your artist apparently does when he doesn't think people are watching.



I'm sorry you can't tell the difference between a question (which is what I asked) and a conclusion (which you're accusing me of drawing). My question (you really should learn what a question is) was what I asked in response to your statement, "It's no different than an artist looking at his tools and speaking to them about making a masterpiece. Sure, he's the artist, but without his tools he's nothing more than just a man."


God did not speak to inanimate objects during the Creation, He spoke them into existence.

They didn't have to actually participate in the work of creating in order for God to speak to them. Notice that Genesis 1:27 says that God created in His image.

This is utter silliness! You claim God was speaking to the dirt?????? What role did dirt (an inanimate substance) have to do with the act of God creating man? Just because dirt was the inanimate substance out of which God created man doesn't make dirt a participant (something only animate beings can be) in that or any aspect of Creation. The Bible doesn't say that God spoke to the dirt and out popped man, it says that God formed man from the dust of the ground - pretty much the way a potter forms something out of clay.

DIRT IS AN INANIMATE SUBSTANCE!!!! It is incapable of cooperation or otherwise participate in the work God did. It cannot "go" anywhere, it must be moved by an external force. God did not speak to the dirt when He created Adam, God merely formed Adam from the dust of the ground. God didn't say to the dirt, "form a man."

Along these lines I have always thought that he was referring to himself (the invisible spirit) and the future manifestation of Jesus Christ.

We are made in the image of the invisible because we are possess (and indeed are) an invisible spirit.

We are made in the image of the man Jesus Christ in that we are mortal, flesh & bone with visible arms, legs etc.

He does indeed speak of what will be as though it was and who would we be (as mankind) to dream that, after 4000 years of history God created his only begotten son in the image of man rather than having initially creating man in the image of his only begotten son.