Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

A while back Elder Ballestero did a series of blog posts on ministerial ethics. They were excellent. This one was especially well written and on point. There is a proper way for various ministries to be funded, and an internet campaign directed at various saints of Apostolic churches is not a proper method.

A few quotes:

"Missionaries who get on Facebook and plead with saints for money are without scruples or ethics. Don’t give to them. Let your pastor guide your giving."

"No evangelist should ever ask for money on Facebook. Don’t be foolish and give to him, no matter if you like him or not."

"How ever it’s done, it’s never done privately between a saint in a church and the missionary."


https://martynballestero.com/2010/08...ing-for-money/

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

Very interesting.

As a retired church treasurer, all fiscal policy related to churches is interesting.

I am asked for donations via Facebook on a regular basis. Usually for short term missionary trips. I see no ethical problem with a teenager or a young adult seeking aid from his Facebook connections.

In my situation, it is the offspring of my college buddies who are asking for the finance. I have supported one of my classmates when she was a short term missionary.

I would be extremely cautious about supporting someone I did not know. Fiscal policy blunders have made many a qualified minister into a fool.

Some ministers do not have any oversight and they manage finances at their local church without any controls. I can see a pastor in this situation frowning on a policy that excludes him from control.

I do no know anything about Rev. Ballestro.

All my comments are totally focused on policy. Not on any person or group.

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

Is it really the pastor's business?

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I agree with SP's post.
I do not mind being solicited by those who I know.
But I will not give to anyone I do not know.

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

I don't see any harm in giving to someone that you know; giving to someone that you don't know is pretty risky IMO.

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Why in the world does a pastor need to "guide your giving"?

Probably good advice, in fact it sounds like the Didache. :heeheehee

It's probably best if done privately between an individual and a missionary, as long as the individual initiates the giving, and the missionary isn't going around soliciting funds like a panhandler.

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

I think it depends on the situation, but I agree with the spirit of what the Elder is saying. Sending a teen from a local ministry on a mission trip is different from committing to fund a long-term minister, their family, and their ministry.


Completely agree. If you are a part of a corporate body of believers, then if you are going to contribute to a missionary, it would be IN ORDER (as opposed to out of order) to follow your Pastor's leading and vision for the corporate body to which you have voluntarily submitted.


This teaching is not any different from the teaching of the past that directed the saints to not give money to televangelists. It was biblically sound then, the concept is still the same with the internet.



There is a right way and a wrong way to do things like this. If you are paying your tithes and offerings faithfully as a member of your local assembly, and you want to donate to, "Save The Starving Africans" or "Bibles For Lithuania", then go for it.

It is much more proper to sponsor a preacher that is affiliated with your local assembly than to sponsor Brother Ralph's sermonizing on the Yangtze-- whether you think you know him or not.


https://martynballestero.com/2010/08...ing-for-money/[/QUOTE]

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

It's possible to be right, express opinion, and even express truth, in the wrong way.

People who call present themselves as Christian ministers of the Gospel should be able to submit to some form of church authority-- something that we have clear Biblical teachings and examples to follow.

People who do not follow the clear Biblical teachings and examples are people that Christians should be wary of following or supporting.

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

I noticed that a missionary on this forum seems to always a bee asking for donations. How do you feel about that?

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*Exactly :highfive.

*We will not be supporting that where I pastor. In fact, we wholeheartedly support both foreign & home missionaries monthly - but only those who are doctrinally sound & ethical.


*See above....& I know many other pastors who feel the same way :ignore.

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

I can't fault someone who desperately wants to feed starving children, whose family is of good reputation among Apostolic brethren.

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

I feel that this thread is a passive aggressive attack

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I always show my needs on facebook as many of my friends ask me to do so including pastors. However I have never taken money without letting the pastor know.

My husband does not tell our people who to give to and who not to give to but I understand that some people can be taken in and give to wrong causes but it is their money....

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

I will continue to give as directed by the Spirit as I am moved by compassion and I have the ability to do so. Man is not the gatekeeper to my giving.

Scripture says to give to anyone that asks.

Furthermore, if Christ directed us to feed and give water to our enemies, give them our cloak as well as our coat, go two miles instead of one, how much more should we do for our friends? Our sisters and brothers in the faith?

Ezekiel 16:49 Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy.

Im all for teaching good stewardship and responsibility and using wisdom and discernment but Im not running to my pastor and asking permission and he doesn't want me doing it either.

Some of yall dont know what its like to watch those you care for and love go without and know that if you only had a bit more, you could help.

Some of you dont know what its like to be trying to save lives and need some extra hands to help pull a kid out from under a rolled over vehicle, gas spilled, cars still on but too damaged to turn it off...any second it could go up in flames, you're trying to be brave and not show how scared you are so the kid doesnt freak...all you need is a couple more people.

Car pulls up...3 big muscle bound guys get out....more than enough! You yell for them to hurry...you already have it planned...they lift and you pull, keeping the patient stable*real story btw before I was even in EMS*

But as they approach they start loudly worrying about snakes in the grass...grass that you ran through without a moments hesitation or concern for your own safety and also start yelling about the smell of gas and talking about explosions which you were trying to keep your patient from thinking about and then to top that off they get distracted by their dog that got loose.

All these things were more concerning to them than saving a life...than someone in pain and suffering and I was too powerless to do anything on my own with the second girl who wasnt pinned.

The anger and frustration was immense and Im a pretty chill dude...but I couldn't understand why the misplacement of priorities. It was so clear to me what was more important in the situation...saving her life was #1 It over rode my fear of deep water filled ditches, tall snake filled grass and possible explosions.

We did get her out finally and got her to safety and I learned a valuable lesson....everybody dont got their priorities in the right place...some people too worried about possible snakes in the grass than saving souls.

Its the same way in the church....got someone putting their life on the line to help others and all the onlookers getting offended at their methods and their desperation of the need standing around judging with their misplaced priorities hoarding up treasures they cant take with them when they cross that old Jordan river but expressing disdain at those who beg for help to reach and feed people.

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

Only cons can answer that!
Cons?????

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

The next time someone says, "The poor you will always have with you..." Be sure to complete the sentence: "Therefore I command you, ‘You shall open wide your hand to your brother, to the needy and to the poor, in your land."

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

Every week, strangers stop at the church asking for handouts. Usually more than once per week.

To separate the wheat from the chaff, all who desire assistance need to apply at the local police department. If they pass the screen, they can ask the churches for assistance. There is a coop of us churches that do it this way and we keep track who gets what, so no one goes from church to church asking for aid.

If a person is given 20 bucks for gas (the usual request) they can only ask once every 6 months.

It may sound harsh, but it works. 90% of those who stop at out church and then are directed to fill out a form at the local police department never show up at the police department.

At the church, we can only provide such aid as is in that specific fund. We do not use general fund dollars for charity. It is hard enough making payroll as it is.

Of course, I am retired. No longer the treasurer.

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

I think it is good that we know what we are supporting. Anyone is welcome here to look over what I do with funds.

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so you let the cops be your gatekeepers to decide who is worthy of help?

So youll help them IF..they dont have a warrent and IF they arent on the sex offender registry for something crazy like steaking, urinating in public or a non contact sex crime or being 18 with a 16 year old gf with angry parents or if they are addicts...maybe they have had bad run ins with the police before and are too scared.

I wouldnt let cops be the gatekeepers of my giving bro.

Imagine if Paul would have said, "Ok....we will help....but first, you need to be interviewed by these Roman soldiers....its ok...if you have nothing to hide you have nothing to be afraid of!"

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

The cops weed out the frauds. The policy is several years old and was designed by the churches involved. It works great.

If you are in need, talking to a cop is not a problem. But those frauds are rather shy :)

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

I have always been blessed for helping others...God has been so good to me...I am very grateful.

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

I completely disagree with Ballestero. Ironically, he uses his blog to promote his daughter's candle business and his daughter in law's CDs. But of course, that's different.

"Let your Pastor guide your giving?" Seriously? I'm not anti-Pastor, but my Pastor does not work my job to obtain my paycheck. With all due respect, what I do with my finances is none of his business. I pay offerings and give to the church and its numerous supporting ministries.

"""No evangelist should ever receive money from saints in the church where he is preaching a revival.

If money somehow makes it to his hand or pocket, he must give that to the local pastor.

If the pastor decides to keep the money or give it back, that is the pastor’s prerogative."""

Ridiculous and unlawful.

There's possibly a reason the saint is giving the money directly to the evangelist in first place. Perhaps if the pastor wasn't misusing offerings, saints wouldn't be bypassing him.

Next, if a saint is giving money directly to an evangelist, it is the same as a restricted offering. The pastor, by law, cannot take that money and decide not to give it to the evangelist. It is not just unethical, it is illegal.

It's incredibly hypocritical of Ballestero to talk about scruples and ethics, but then advise Pastors to take money given directly to Evangelists and decide whether or not to give it back. He has no ethics or scruples, and in fact is breaking the law, if he does this.

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

Yep, that's what Jesus told us to do.

Not.

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

It is very hard for me to be critical of the elder who has seen and done more than I ever have.
I have immense respect for him and his family.
I am even "shade tree" related to the elder through a cousins marriage.
I believe his stance is based on seeing saints give money to con men who just have a sad story or are good talkers.
I have seen this myself and experienced giving to them a few times.
That is what I believe is the basis of his belief.

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

I understand, though he had no issue blasting missionaries, evangelists and pastors as not having scruples or ethics. Likewise I have no issue pointing out the glaring hypocrisy and illegality of his advice.

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widsom and experience is always overruled by scripture.

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There is nothing wrong with vetting who the recipients are of finance under our care. Be that personal funds or a church checking account.

Contemplate these words "Be wise as serpents"

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The Bible gives instructions in the vetting process. Those instructions do not include "background checks by local police."

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How do other churches determine who is the recipient of charity? How is such charity fit into the church budget ? How often can repeat requests be made ?

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So does "Give and it shall be given unto you...." only apply when given to a preacher? Asking for a friend.

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I'm fine with it. She feeds the street kids of Brazil.

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If I was rich, I'd send you a lot of money. What you do is a worth and noble cause

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Do I have to call my Pastor before I drop a dollar in a bucket or donate to some disaster relief or help some homeless guy eat?

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

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As a family, we take care of friends on a very limited basis.

As a church treasurer, we only distributed charity when members donated to that specific fund.

The fiscal policies of the church are determined by the board.

If God gave the church a windfall, we would certainly put that money to work. But churches cannot distribute charity when there is none to give.

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

When you become rich, and If the Lord lays it on your heart, I need Husqvarna 390XP Chainsaw 30" Bar 88cc ;)

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

EV. Benincasa...God can use someone to give you one...are they expensive?

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I would hate for someone to call us every time they wanted to give...we would never get off the phone...the work is big and Brazilians no matter how poor love to give...I have been taken in a few times...but I did not lose my blessing....I gave with a willing heart and a grateful heart. Just as it rains on the just and the unjust sometimes we help both ....even help the thankful and the unthankful....Even Jesus healed 10 lepers one one said thanks...My husband never tells me what to give or who to give too...and of course neither do I tell him who or what...if it is a big something then of course we would talk it over...but an offering to slip into someone's hand...no....

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

They're about 945 to 1100. Depends on what kind of deal you get. But, giving is like getting the Holy Ghost. It has to be Jesus led, and motivated by love. We have some awesome brothers on this forum who reached out to me and asked if I needed anything. Their love and want to be a blessing means more to me than a billion chainsaws. I will be waiting for Prax to get rich. I can't wait to use that Husky!!!! :happydance

Re: Preachers, Facebook and Begging for Money
 

All tbis talk of,"Well what if someone takes advantage?"

So we are to believe that if we give, God will bless.

God never said that if we gave AND the person we gave to was a decent person ans wasnt a scammer.

God blesses us on our willingness to give not what the other person does with the money and the same God that sees our willingness to give, can and will give us more to compensate for those that use it wrongfully.

Did Christ die knowing that some would misuse His gift of salvation and forgiveness?

Yes!

If Christ could lay down His life for me knowing that I would fail Him and others would outright spit on His gift, I can lay down my monetary gifts as well and have peace knowing that yes, not everyone is legit, but God is the judge and He will reward accordingly.


If people want to have the mindset of "I forbid you to give because that money could be used wrongfully...."

Ok, well then lets have open transparency on how the tithes and offerings are used to that pastor doing the forbidding....its only fair that one who sets the standard obeys it and should I not agree with how they are being spent I shouldnt have to give.

See how that works?