Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

Is it me or are pastors nowadays actually more like life coaches and motivational speakers, instead of shepherds of flocks toward spiritual maturity? It's like psychologists rather than real Spritual leaders.

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

It's not just you.

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

Hey, we pay them the 10th to be our spiritual leaders because we are not spiritual enough to have a walk of our own and to speak for ourselves with the one Shepherd.

Bye Sean

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

Dr. Phil kinda?

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

It's more like the congregation viewing the pastor as a lecturer. They listen, but don't participate.

That's it.

That, but also some really aren't guiding in a Spritual manner.

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

Throughout the history of man’s relationship with God, it has been God’s desire to have a close, personal relationship with His creation that is man. It seems He was able to do so with Adam for some time, and Abraham was a friend of God.

However, when the Israelites came out of Egypt God would visit with them, and there was fire and smoke. The power of God scared them, so they told Moses to go up on the mountain and talk to God and come back and tell them what He said.

Later, they told Samuel (because his sons were corrupt) that they wanted a king so they could be like other nations. God said they rejected Him, not Samuel. Today people are still prone to want a priest to communicate with God on their behalf, in spite of the fact that Hebrews is clear that we can go boldly before the throne, and that Jesus is our high Priest and our mediator. It seems that it is our nature to want a go-between to speak to God for us, even today.

I think a true pastor and a wise pastor will teach in such a way that his saints mature to the point that they less dependent on him and more dependent on God. Some saints have to counsel with the pastors over every little thing. It must be frustrating to pastor these kind of saints.

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

Joel Osteen-ish

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

I heard Wayne Huntley say, "There is a movement in the apostolic church to dumb this church down." He is speaking of spiritually.

I have seen, over the years, people becoming uncomfortable and even afraid of following after the Spirit. They want to be more intellectual. And I am not against education. But, as I heard someone say, "The elders need to step up, because we don't have time to relearn all of this - prayer and praise that takes us to a place where Jesus is Lord and Satan is bound. That releases the Spirit in our services and if that doesn't happen, we just look like a bunch of people who dress funny."

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

Amen and amen.

The truth of the matter is, that without the power of God, we ARE a bunch of people that dress funny and act funny. We are in danger of being neo-pharisees.

Some pastors I believe, are insecure. You know, there is a rumor going around that pastors are human beings!! Scandalous I know. Sometimes I halfway believe it.

Insecure pastors can feel threatened by saints that are gifted in different Spiritual gifts. If they lend credibility to the gifts of the Spirit, what if those gifts are used to debunk false doctrine that the pastor/organization teach? This could present a problem.

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

The best pastors are also life coaches.
By this I mean that motivating people to live for God should be a desire of every pastor.
However, I believe I understand the point raised.
And it is a problem in society, as well as the church.
As someone who works with young people, it scares me as to how little they know of what they believe.
And how little they know of the Bible.
And these are saints kids, who have been raised in church their entire life.
The same issue is prevalent in society with very few of our young people (or older people) able to articulate the basic foundations of our country.
Which is why a large portion of the young believe that communism is a viable form of government.
In my opinion, if your pastor has not made you uncomfortable or self-reflective in a few months, you need to examine either your church, or yourself.

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That started a trend and showed people how they can get huge crowds.

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Bingo.

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Right, and started a new doctrine - you don't need the Holy Spirit to be saved, you just need it for empowerment - if you want that, but it isn't necessary.

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It showed you don't need doctrine at all. Just talk about how good people are and never mention sin.

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That’s not new.

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The huge crowds are drawn to it because it’s all about “me.” If sin is mentioned it is in a generic manner. People return for their weekly dose of therapy.

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Is America entering a Religious Dark Ages?

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

Oh, sorry Brother Blume

Is America and Canada entering a Religious Dark Age?

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

I think we entered those days back in the 1930s or 40s. Definitely by the 50s.

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His NAME is Jesus!

The following is my first paste: hope it's my last.

"Did the church ever need to seek permission from the government to be exempt from taxes?
Were churches prior to 1954 taxable? No, churches have never been taxable. To be taxable a
church would first need to be under the jurisdiction, and therefore under the taxing authority, of the
government. The First Amendment clearly places the church outside the jurisdiction of the civil
government: 'Congress shall make NO LAW respecting an establishment of religion, nor
prohibiting the free exercise thereof'."

The Church has always been FREE to preach and teach the gospel that saves:
but the Ministry has sold out to the highest bidder; in essence, the Ministry has
sold out for filthy lucre to become a whore.

Brother Villa

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

Ouch.

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

Give unto Caesar what is Caesar’s.

Or Caesar will send the auditor, who will be none too friendly.

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Why the 50s? You think William Branham’s hokus pokus was one of the starts?

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

His NAME is Jesus1

Caesar can send the auditor only where it is constitutionally allowed: or where
the whore has LEGALLY permitted him to commit fornication with her.

Now that the government has placed its foot in the doorway with the abundant
number of religious organizations, there will come a time when (I might be the
only one believing this on this forum) it will feel justified breaking the Constitution
and persecuting the REAL Church (or what's left of her).

Brother Villa

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

Brother Villa, do you have a house church, or a "church" building?

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

His NAME is Jesus!

I have fellowship with the saints, thank you.

Would you like to comment or state your opinion on the issue at hand. Where do you
stand on the 501(c)3 POST?

Brother Villa

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

You have fellowship with the saints, we all do. But, when asked to define what that actually looks like it is simple. Do you all fellowship in a house, or a "church" building? :)

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

His NAME is Jesus!

One day a denominational pastor asked me a similar question. However:
YES. In a house(s); and in a building(s).


You don't intend to stalk me now, do you? LOL

Now, Would you like to comment or state your opinion on the issue at hand.
Where do you stand on the 501(c)3 post?


Brother Villa

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

Not stalking or even intrapping you with questions. But 501c3 is only one tax exemption. You would be surprised what your rights are in this country. Anyway, my explanation is based on a legitimate answer from you. Houses are buildings, wonderful. Now that we cleared that up, could you tell me if you all only meet in houses, or have what is culturally called a church building?

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

His NAME is Jesus!

NO, I WOULD NOT be surprised.
Why do you think I would be surprised? Is my 8th grade education showing?
Some folks think I went higher than the 9th grade. It's true! But, I guess some
might think I didn't even make it through grade school. Oh, well.

Tell me, did my "legitimate answer" truly come from a legitimate question? Or
did my post offend you: even though I named no names. But let's REALLY
clear that up: do you want to know what I truly believe, or is it that you don't
want to offend me and are just asking in a round-about way? Or could it
be that you believe that the 501(c)3 program is not really there to entice the
Church to eat the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil? Legitimate
does not equate to righteousness. A city, county, state, etc., may legalize
prostitution; however, that does not make prostitution morally acceptable,
or righteous. But I'm sure you know that.

Honest questions deserve honest answers.

Brother Villa

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OK, you don't want to answer me.

Good grief :lol

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Good grief

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

His NAME is Jesus!

YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!

Tell me, did my "legitimate answer" truly come from a legitimate question? Or
did my post offend you: even though I named no names.
But let's REALLY
clear that up:
1) do you want to know what I truly believe, or is it that you don't want to
offend me and are just asking in a round-about way?
2) Or could it be that you believe that the 501(c)3 program is not really there to
entice the Church to eat the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil?
3) Legitimate does not equate to righteousness. A city, county, state, etc., may
legalize prostitution; however, that does not make prostitution morally acceptable,
or righteous.

You KNOW that. So will you give us an answer?

Brother Villa

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

Whatever.

Back to the topic of the forum.

Sorry Elder Blume.

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

Will you contrast the two, so I can see what you mean? Such like:

Pastors do:

1.)
2.)
3.)

Life coaches/motivational speakers do:

A.)
B.)
C.)

Or something similar?

Thanks.

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

Pastors do:

1.) Led by the Spirit and receive revelation of words to minister to congregation.
2.) Rebuke, correct as well as encourage, edify and emphasize spirituality and denial of self and leading of Spirit.
3.) Teach how to overcome sin, satan, the world, our own flesh.
4.) Lead congregation to allow the Spirit of God to live and work through them, and to hear from God, while learning how to put flesh, and what self thinks we should do, out of the way and aside from the guidance of the Spirit.
5.) Operate in supernatural gifts of the Spirit.
6.) Preach the word of God and focus on issues the Word focuses on: Primarily who we are and what we can do based solely on the work of the cross in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ, in ways that cannot be done through an unregenerate soul.
7.) Explain how to be strengthened by the Spirit, with conscious reliance on God's strength solely made possible because of the atonement made by the work of the cross.
8.) Minister in a level and ability that folks without God's Spirit baptism cannot minister.
9.) Focus on glorifying Christ, and perhaps having to suffer for His name's sake.

Life coaches/motivational speakers do:

A.) Focus on psychologically-based encouragement.
B.) Not hear from God or guided by revelation of the Spirit, but by what psychology determines people should hear and learn. Determining from our own wisdom and intellect what to administer.
C.) Entertain the flesh with no presence of God's supernatural work manifested.
D.) Basically, minister to people without the need of the Spirit's inspiration and empowerment, as anyone in secular motivational circles, who might even be atheists, can do.
E.) Focusing on uplifting self.


...Something like that.

Re: Pastors or Life Coaches?
 

50s at the latest. By then the WW2 propaganda was in full swing and we entered the Truman Show. The 30s saw the beginning of the darkening of western man's intellect, IMO. I mean, bank holiday, turn in your gold, half off special, we need to invade Europe, Ford propping up the Soviet military machine....

Sunset in America, now folks are being amazed by the twinkling lights in the sky.

Prior to the 30s it seems there was at least some semblance of rationality in society.