Trojan Horse
 

In the following message BH Clendennen (AG) states that "prayer talk" was the Trojan Horse that the denominations used to infiltrate the church. They say "we're like you" but want the church to become like them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjqOoy4EcCs

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"We didn't change the horse. He changed us, and we called it revival."

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That was a awesome message.

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Yes. There are many messages of his posted. He has passed. Never heard anyone preach like this in the AG.

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What is the AG stand for? I know he's not Assembly of God.

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He was Assembly of God until his passing. The church he founded in Beaumont, Tx is still in the AG.

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Man that dude spoke it straight to be a Trinitarian. I was wondering get was saying some Trinitarian lingo but strong on holiness.

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Heard a few of his messages, what a great speaker.

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A memorial of the AG's past. Sad.

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He is one of my listen too's on my way to work, along with some Holiness preachers Apostolic preachers and other Assembly of God preachers.

The AG is not dead! For every money pastor and preacher there in three more who are unknown, they are pouring out there souls and have not forgotten the old paths.

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Experiences are subjective. Visited AG's in the past. They were all like mini mega churches.

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I visited an AssemblyofGods in Washington state years ago. Was told "Revival is happening, people come from 100 miles away to this church!" the place was packed, about 200 people.

Dead as doornails. My daughter asked me "Are you sure this is a Pentecostal church?" I've seen more moving of the Spirit in a Baptist church than that place.

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Lol

IDK, i'm quiet. You will barely hear me sing. I may clap or raise my hands. Not likely to hear me speak in tongues... unless it's one of those rare moments where I'm bent over an altar, tongues coming forth kinda loud and authoritatively, if that's a word.. and there's like contractions in the belly. Weird. But it's happened a few times. NO BIBLE FOR IT. I'M NOT ENDORSING AN EXTRA BIBLICAL EXPERIENCE. just stating my experience.

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Actually, wouldn't like to attend a church If everyone was quiet like me. That would be boring. lol

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:happydance

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The best trinitarian message I ever heard, hands down. He said some real stuff, and he was stuck in the charismatic movement. What he said should really resonate with Apostolic's. What he was warning of had taken over their movement and ruined it. And then you got Apostolic's after this has happened that they have the Judgement of God upon their movement (at least that what David Wilkerson said of why he left the AOG) Trying to do the same exact thing!
Longing after destruction and judgement is all that amounts to.

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I heard it in a sermon I just listened to but here's the best I can find in article form.
https://truedsicernment.com/2008/07/...adly-unheeded/

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At 31:20, he references (Charles) Parham and his time evangelizing Galveston, TX.

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Not far from San Antonio where he was arrested in 1907 for "the commission of an unnatural offense" along with his 22 year old co-defendant J.J. Jourdan. CP denied the charges and claimed he was framed.

Whether he was framed or it was true it does seem to mark the great decline of his ministry and influence in the early Pentecostal movement.

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My cousin was once attending an Assembly of God church. Her and I were talking one day and the fact came up that the AG predominantly aligns itself with Pentecostalism. She hadn't the slightest idea the church she was going to fell under the Pentecostal umbrella. I remember her telling me that she had never heard anyone speaking in tongues, shouting, dancing in the aisles, or crying before the Lord at the altar. Not saying these things cannot happen in churches that are not set-aside as purposely Pentecostal, but that's generally what we get the tag for.

She no longer goes to this church. Why? I don't know. Maybe she heard someone quietly speak in a tongue or two and she bailed. She's not one that's too open to the gifts or any supernatural Spirit-filled walk with Christ.

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Good message.

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There are RCC churches that do all of that.

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That right there really hit hard.

Like, ouch. Wake up church!

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I listened to this message and I don't believe it ever really registered with me that this brother was Trinitarian. Naturally, I know he was, but I tried not to let it blur my thinking of his message.

This was a very good message, and a very needed one in the Pentecostal church. I know Bro Clendennen was primarily speaking to churches inside the Assemblies of God, but I couldn't help but think of our Apostolic brothers and sisters while listening to this sermon. There are so many of them that are gradually walking away from this marvelous Truth, and they know better. They've compromised.

That horse he's talking about has done a number on the Pentecostal church as a whole, and it's tackling the Apostolic church now with all it's got. So many seem to have already given over to that counterfeit move of God, and it's quenched what they once had.

Lord Jesus, help us all.

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Thank you.

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Are you a trinitarian?

I didn't know.

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Not at all. I haven't been Trinitarian for close to five years. :)

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Then he ain't your brother :happydance

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"He may be your cousin, but he's not your brother" [if he doesn't have the Name.] Johnny James :thumbsup

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could be..could be..

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Acts 1:16 KJV
Men and brethren, this scripture must needs have been fulfilled, which the Holy Ghost by the mouth of David spake before concerning Judas, which was guide to them that took Jesus.

Who was Peter calling brethren here?

Acts 3:17 KJV
And now, brethren, I wot that through ignorance ye did it , as did also your rulers.

Who are these brethren?

Acts 13:26 KJV
Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent.

What about these brethren?

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Brethren in Abraham. I guess all men could be our brethren through the first Adam, but not all men are our brethren after the second Adam.

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Leviticus 19:17-18 KJV
Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him. [18] Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the Lord .

Here brother and neighbour are used interchangeably, because an Israelite's neighbour would most likely be a kinsman ("brother"). But notice:

Luke 10:27-29 KJV
And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself. [28] And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live. [29] But he, willing to justify himself, said unto Jesus, And who is my neighbour?

Jesus' answer was the famous Good Samaritan parable.

One's brethren are one's kinsmen, near and far:

Deuteronomy 23:7 KJV
Thou shalt not abhor an Edomite; for he is thy brother: thou shalt not abhor an Egyptian; because thou wast a stranger in his land.

Brethren is therefore a term used for one's family members, one's kinsmen and related near ethnicities (nations), and there is also a more restricted usage by which is meant a fellow member of the household of God:

Matthew 12:49-50 KJV
And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren! [50] For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

I cannot find a specific instance of "not thy brother" or "not my brother" in the Bible. Perhaps I missed one? Those who aren't your brethren are by definition strangers or foreignors. I do not see where the apostles made an effort to let people know "you ain't my brother". Especially in regards to a person who professes that Jesus is the Christ.

An interesting passage is this one:

2 Thessalonians 3:6,14-15 KJV
Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us. [14] And if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed. [15] Yet count him not as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother.

Those who refuse to obey apostolic doctrine are to be excommunicated and shunned, yet still referred to as "brother(s)".

I think, rather than looking for reasons to tell someone we are not their brethren, we should focus on common ground as a means of teaching them the way of God more perfectly. Paul and Peter seemed to use that approach with both Jews and Gentiles. I seriously doubt Mr Clennendan (sp?) or whatever his name is someone who hates Jesus and wants to squash the message of the cross. Is he correct in all things? No. Are you? Or me? If we think ourselves to be complete in doctrine, faith, and practice, then maybe we should extend a little common courtesy to others who might be a bit behind the curve.

I am so glad that when I first met an apostolic I wasn't told "you aren't my brother because you don't understand Oneness theology". Just saying.

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At the same time, let me be clear I am NOT AT ALL proposing some ecumenical "let's all get along and ignore doctrinal differences" nonsense. You can be my brother and still split hell wide open because of your heresies and sins. (Speaking of "you" in a general sense.)

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I’m sorry BROTHER, but I don’t think Paul was talking about the New Birth message or the Godhead when he spoke of a brother walking disorderly. He was speaking of the holiness lifestyle. Just as he told the Corinthian church not to keep company with any man who is called a brother and is a fornicator.

To be fair, I don’t think it’s wise to go around telling trinitarians “you’re not my brother”, either. However, it is a false statement to say that they are our brethren in Christ. It is the New Birth that makes us sons and daughters, children of God. It is the New Birth that makes us of God and joint heirs with Christ, and indeed joint heirs with each other. It is the light of truth that enables us to have fellowship one with the other, as his blood cleanses is from all sin. We are in the same kingdom with trinitarians, not adopted into the same family of God, and not heirs of the same promise.

Of course, it would, in most cases be fruitless (even damaging) to tell a trinitarian “hey! You’re not my brother!” However, I have seen far too many Apostolics calling trinitarians brother that later denied the essentiality of the Jesus name message affirmed that trinitarians are apart of the Kingdom of God. Mr. Clendenen seems like a sincere man, a good man. His message affected me. He is not my brother, and if I had the opportunity to talk to him I would attempt to use wisdom to expound the truth to him.

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I’ve never told a trinitarian they were not my brother, but I’d gladly correct any Apostolic who referred to trinitarians as their brethren.