Thoughts?
 

“The chief danger that confronts the coming century will be religion without the Holy Ghost, Christianity without Christ, forgiveness without repentance, salvation without regeneration, politics without God, heaven without hell.”
― William Booth

Re: Thoughts?
 

Times haven’t changed. People always are apt to remove Jesus Christ out of the church. First thing to go is people receiving the Holy Ghost with the initial evidence of tongues.

Re: Thoughts?
 

Re: Thoughts?
 

Really think about that.

Re: Thoughts?
 

There will always be a remanent :).

Re: Thoughts?
 

Is that with or without the preaching of the same? I witnessed many churches along the way that preached the evidence but very rarely saw it actually happen other than the children of the parents. Yes many visitors but seldom if ever did anyone actually get to that point.

Re: Thoughts?
 

I was sitting near Bishop Larry Booker the other night when he said that the first sign of William Branham going backwards was when he began preaching you can get the holy ghost without tongues...

I was also told the Michigan district of a certain one was organization is now questioning when someone recieves the holy ghost. The doctrine being discussed is they receive the hg at baptism.

Re: Thoughts?
 

Sad stuff. I recently had a conversation with Bro Booker about Branham too. He said that he made light of Jesus name baptism right before he was killed. I do know that his followers today do not believe in the initial evidence doctrine at all. Their evidence for HG baptism is whether or not you believe Branham’s message.

I cannot imagine how someone who has received the Holy Ghost baptism would begin questioning when it happens! It further supports my belief that much of “Pentecost” is getting a counterfeit Holy Ghost because they are counterfeiting repentance.

Re: Thoughts?
 

Re: Thoughts?
 

Hey, good to see you keep coming back here man.

Re: Thoughts?
 

My youth pastor told me he thinks there will be a day when some Pentecostals (even Apostolic Pentecostals) fall in love with their worship more than God Himself.

Re: Thoughts?
 

Already there.

Re: Thoughts?
 

Really? I live in Michigan, and never heard tell of this...

Re: Thoughts?
 

Maybe not your organization?

Re: Thoughts?
 

Ok, then what organization questions tongue talking a new birth?

Re: Thoughts?
 

To what century did Mr. Booth refer?

Re: Thoughts?
 

paw? Aafcj? Cooljc? Iafcj?

Re: Thoughts?
 

I would argue that a red flag for someone backsliding on the Truth is the Holy Ghost. The move of the Spirit will weaken in their services, or they'll stop letting the Spirit lead and guide them into all Truths.

They may say that the evidence of baptism with the Holy Ghost isn't always tongues, but can be sometimes, or they might even say that the evidence of "being filled" is tongues, but no longer see being filled as necessity. They may take on a traditional Charismatic slant and say that one gets the Spirit at conversion or water baptism, but subsequent experiences with the Holy Ghost, whether it be the outward evidence of tongues or not, may be referenced as "being filled" or the "falling upon" of the Spirit.

Re: Thoughts?
 

I thought it was women wearing pants??

Re: Thoughts?
 

I think William Booth was a pretty good orator.

I also think he'd be spinning in his grave if he could see what has become of his "Salvation Army".

Re: Thoughts?
 

On the money! Very perceptive man.

Re: Thoughts?
 

Relevant

Re: Thoughts?
 

Pretty relevant.

Re: Thoughts?
 

Yes, just look at all the Christian denominations which teach John 3:8 just means that a Christian demonstrates the Spirit by their behavior. Instead of hearing the voice of the Spirit in every "born again" believer.

But the wonderful thing is this, no matter what agenda ministries may have. People still receive the Holy Ghost infilling with speaking in tongues. The sincere hearted soul will still hear the call of the Shepard. People will speak in other tongues, no matter how many preachers preach against it. :happydance

Re: Thoughts?
 

Hallelujah!

Re: Thoughts?
 

Do you think they will, or already are, going back on the new birth message?

Re: Thoughts?
 

Individuals want to get a crowd. Have the crowd pay a cover charge, and get dressed up Pentecostalish for the visiting preachers. They might get them to the place of stammering lips and tears, but most likely not all the way to home plate. They toss them into the water, say Jesus name over them, just to fill a score card. When the focus is a building with 5 ton a/c units, and well manicured landscaping. A sign that reads the Pentecostals of Dog Patch USA. Then praying them through to the real thing kind of becomes secondary. I see house churches and smaller groups across the world being filled with the fire of the Holy Ghost. Men and women who are more focused on seeing people get the New Birth like the Book of Acts. Not worrying about how much money is coming into the Church's bank account. Or how many new visitors can we get wet this weekend. Only to never ever see them again. Jesus is still able to find hungry souls who want it just like they see it in the Bible. There are still Apostle Pauls, devout Roman Centurions, and Ethiopian Eunuchs out there. They are being told where to find the Peters and Phillips. Jesus is still calling His sheep. His message will always be availible to be preached and heard.

Re: Thoughts?
 

Quite recently the assistant pastor stated that we need to give people time to REPENT, implying that we need to stop trying to get them baptized and stammering.

I whole heartedly agree.

Several years ago I was on a phone call with a friend. He told me an experience his cousin had. She felt pressured to speak in tongues when she was surrounded by people screaming and praying over her. So, what did she do? She pretended to speak in tongues and everyone shouted their hair down.

This is not the way!

Re: Thoughts?
 

Wow. You really don’t like today’s version of a church, man.

Re: Thoughts?
 

From my experience, in our areas most are being told they received it vs actually getting it..

Re: Thoughts?
 

Or maybe they do get it, and instead of allowing them to come to that conclusion on their own, people scream "that's the Holy Ghost" maybe it's better if we let them tell us, or even ask us.

Re: Thoughts?
 

That's a good policy that my first pastor went by but here they are told they got it because they cried,prayed with the crying face, showed emotions, raised their hands etc... most didn't really get it. I'm right there watching.


I've been in tent revivals where ever 40 some people get it and you don't see them the next weekly service. All hype

A well known evangelist was there that does the emotional hyped alter call but no true infillings. He does that he repeat after him and now receive the Holy Ghost stuff.

Re: Thoughts?
 

But I know what's different.
Every few months we would have a three day fast and an all night prayer meeting.
We had outreach, bus ministry, visitation follow up, and home bible studies.
We always had preservice prayer.
We had services where the power of God was very evident, it would seem we were enveloped in a cloud of glory.
It was common for people to receive the Holy Ghost.

Im not seeing this same thing today. I know the ministry of the Holy Ghost is a sovereign move of God and we are not in control. But, is it possibly also because the church can't rise above where the ministry is leading?

Re: Thoughts?
 

:highfive

Re: Thoughts?
 

I never have and never will tell someone "You got the Holy Ghost!" They will know if they did, and they can do the testifying.

Re: Thoughts?
 

It's the best policy to have.

Re: Thoughts?
 

Excuse me?

Re: Thoughts?
 

Amen :thumbsup

Re: Thoughts?
 

:highfive

Re: Thoughts?
 

:highfive